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Republican Vampire posted:Some people got let go, but the only real huge departure was the studio head, who left cuz he thought that Square was too conservative and gutless. I take it the guy who came up with the title was also a casualty.
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Apr 8, 2015 22:12
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Anatharon posted:I wonder if THIS game will end with the statue of liberty raid. It's super dated the shooting mechanics are painfully bad for a lot of the game and now just kind of ugly Still a great influential game tho
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Apr 8, 2015 22:26
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ZenVulgarity posted:It's super dated the shooting mechanics are painfully bad for a lot of the game and now just kind of ugly Eh, it isn't as ugly as first gen console 3D. The gunplay felt fine to me, but I did little of that.
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Apr 8, 2015 22:58
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Anatharon posted:Eh, it isn't as ugly as first gen console 3D. The gunplay felt fine to me, but I did little of that. The crossbow was my jam.
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Apr 8, 2015 23:16
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Drifter posted:DX1 was a great game, but it wouldn't hold up now. Let nostalgia be its gilded grave. It holds up perfectly fine and it's a much better game than 3.
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Apr 8, 2015 23:19
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Anatharon posted:I take it the guy who came up with the title was also a casualty. They're both really lovely titles. As a Canadian, I blame it on the fact that many of the execs are francophones. They've got a history of being tone-deaf about English names for things. am0kgonzo posted:It holds up perfectly fine and it's a much better game than 3. Many parts of it were garbage at the time it was released though. It's a game you enjoy in spite of most of the design decisions and where a lot of the fun comes from how badly the developers hosed up.
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Apr 8, 2015 23:19
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Republican Vampire posted:They're both really lovely titles. As a Canadian, I blame it on the fact that many of the execs are francophones. They've got a history of being tone-deaf about English names for things. Yeah I know, I'm surrounded by francophones. You ruined my joke though. 
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Apr 8, 2015 23:23
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Apr 8, 2015 23:29
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Republican Vampire posted:Many parts of it were garbage at the time it was released though. It's a game you enjoy in spite of most of the design decisions and where a lot of the fun comes from how badly the developers hosed up. I don't agree with any of this. Good day sir.
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Apr 8, 2015 23:29
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Anatharon posted:Yeah I know, I'm surrounded by francophones. You ruined my joke though. Your joke is a casualty of the continual resentment all Canadians feel towards Quebec. I'm from Alberta. It's like our best thing. am0kgonzo posted:I don't agree with any of this. Good day sir. It's true though. The skill system alone is laughable trash and Deus Ex's appeal has more to do with poo poo like LAM Climbing, sequence breaking, and the way that their inability to scope and manage a team led to so much effort being put on details and weird little side areas rather than making sure that, say, Every level from Vandenberg on wasn't complete trash recycled from an even shittier version of the game. People who love Deus Ex, and I love Deus Ex, love it because it's this kind of beautiful fuckup that we can play in the wreckage of. The newer games are never going to be that. But they can be fun to play and they can be better designed than the original.
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Apr 8, 2015 23:39
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quote:Jensen is part of a covert, goverment-sponsored task force called Task Force 29, a new bracnh of Interpol, to combat a new breed of terrorism Oh so you're working for Proto-UNATCO. Also if they're sticking to the timeline laid out in DX1, the big loving earthquake that sank most of Southern California occurs within a year of Mankind Divided, and the NSF emerges shortly there after
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Apr 8, 2015 23:52
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Biomod improves DX1 tenfold and Revision is ~supposedly~ coming out soon, which mainly looks good from a mapping perspective. DX is still a great game and a much better one with mods, even if some of its qualities are overstated by nostalgic goony goons (myself included) a lot of the time. The jank totally is part of the appeal, but that's because it unintentionally embraces player freedom even more than they intended. It's also really, really cheesy and pulpy, even by the standards of a medium that's the embodiment of pulp, but that works to its advantage when the polygonal charicatures involved in an indulgent "every conspiracy ever is real" story say stuff that's surprisingly smart (even if it's through voice acting that's bad-yet-consistently-sincere). The setting, pacing and mechanics are also a lot more grounded and low-key than the plot would usually call for. It's the weird sense of contrast in every facet that makes that game work imho. On the topic of modern DX, something I'd love for them to do, even though it's unlikely, is really focus on dialogue as an approach to most situations. The randomized bit with Wayne wasn't flawless, but the idea of needing to pay attention and get a reading on someone to get what you want... Well, it's pretty sociopathic, but it's a more understated kind of sociopathy compared to the other displays you can indulge in, and ties into some thematic bits when you get into social augs. It's always been an interesting pacifistic idea for games like these to let you talk your way out of most situations, it's just really difficult to implement and stay consistent with, both because of VO/animation costs and because of the nightmare it is to write out dialogue trees with actual variable consequence.
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Apr 8, 2015 23:52
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Republican Vampire posted:
Right, except like 99% of people who play the game will never do that.
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Apr 8, 2015 23:56
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quote:-No plan for Human Revolution saves to carry over, but Eidos is planning for a franchise now, want to expand further after HR's success Aww dammit. That would be great.
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Apr 8, 2015 23:57
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You might say that whether or not Deus Ex is a good game has left... mankind divided
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Apr 9, 2015 00:01
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Republican Vampire posted:It's true though. The skill system alone is laughable trash Republican Vampire posted:and Deus Ex's appeal has more to do with poo poo like LAM Climbing, sequence breaking Republican Vampire posted:so much effort being put on details and weird little side areas Republican Vampire posted:rather than making sure that, say, Every level from Vandenberg on wasn't complete trash recycled from an even shittier version of the game. Republican Vampire posted:People who love Deus Ex, and I love Deus Ex, love it because it's this kind of beautiful fuckup that we can play in the wreckage of. The newer games are never going to be that. But they can be fun to play and they can be better designed than the original. Can't speak for other people, but I loved Deus Ex because of the reactivity, because I like cyberpunk, the different ways you can tackle most problems and so on. Not because of some "haha its so bad its good" thing.
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Apr 9, 2015 00:03
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Please have a 2015 release date
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Apr 9, 2015 00:04
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Bolow posted:Oh so you're working for Proto-UNATCO. UNATCO and Interpol were actually working together in Europe around the time that this game is set. I'm at least expecting Manderley to turn up. Anatharon posted:Right, except like 99% of people who play the game will never do that. Really? Because I think most people going into that game virgin are going to sequence break. A lot of them are going to get their minds blown by tiny bits of reactivity and then just kind of slog through the terrible levels. Maybe they won't lam climb, but it's hard to deny that stuff like that isn't part of the game's cult appeal when the game's cult appeal is embodied by stuff like the Nameless Mod that directly comments on it. I really don't get what's controversial about saying this. Warren Spector's said most of the same poo poo when talking about why Invisible War didn't work.
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Apr 9, 2015 00:07
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Republican Vampire posted:I really don't get what's controversial about saying this "This game that people think is really good, is, really bad, really." If you want to go into a game's thread and talk about why it's bad that's fine, but don't act confused when people disagree.
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Apr 9, 2015 00:12
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Anatharon posted:"This game that people think is really good, is, really bad, really." I don't think it's bad. I think that it's badly designed and that that's part of why it's good. It's badly designed in a way that lets players who are willing to put in the work discover all kinds of treasures and have all sorts of fun. That's basically an established genre on PC with highlights like Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines and E.Y.E. Divine Cybermancy. But imitating that is impossible and attributing genius to it is a mistake.
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Apr 9, 2015 00:15
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John Liver posted:Aww dammit. That would be great. Nobody needs to have a savegaem roll over into the new game. There's only three different path options that would matter, really, aside from the ending, and people would still know what those other optional outcomes were. Nothing you did in HR shaped the outcome of the world at large within that game world.
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Apr 9, 2015 00:21
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Red Suit posted:Please have a 2015 release date Haha, good one.
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Apr 9, 2015 00:26
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Bolow posted:Oh so you're working for Proto-UNATCO. Hopefully we can stay with them the whole game this time 
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Apr 9, 2015 00:29
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Republican Vampire posted:UNATCO and Interpol were actually working together in Europe around the time that this game is set. I'm at least expecting Manderley to turn up. My current pet theory is that you inadvertently jump start the NSF rebellion. Bonus points if the massive quake that takes out half of California is actually some super weapon you set off or fail to stop
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Apr 9, 2015 00:30
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Republican Vampire posted:
I'm not the biggest fan of the original in the world, and I certainly see that its a bit rough around the edges, but I've never seen this sort of sentiment before. People like it because of its open ended gameplay and surprisingly in depth plot and world (Edit; for an FPS in 2000 I guess I should say), not because its the video-game version of the Room. khwarezm fucked around with this message at 00:34 on Apr 9, 2015 |
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Apr 9, 2015 00:31
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khwarezm posted:I'm not the biggest fan of the original in the world, and I certainly see that its a bit rough around the edges, but I've never seen this sort of sentiment before. People like it because of its open ended gameplay and surprisingly in depth plot and world, not because its the video-game version of the Room. That's not really the comparison I'd go for. The Room is Kitsch. Deus Ex is more of a happy accident. There's not really the same sense of irony there. It's more that the things about the game which worked were accidents which in many ways took attention from more conventionally important things. Hence the VTM:B comparison, and referencing Spector's confession that they had no idea what in the game had worked for people. Deus Ex was a happy accident. The attention paid to some parts of it was part of that. Even the dressed down aesthetic that a lot of people pointed to when the first Human Revolution screens came out was just a side effect of not being able to put enough detail into the textures. Bolow posted:My current pet theory is that you inadvertently jump start the NSF rebellion. Bonus points if the massive quake that takes out half of California is actually some super weapon you set off or fail to stop The NSF's already around in HR though. They turn up in emails and news stories in the Detroit hub, under the name New Sons of Freedom.
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Apr 9, 2015 00:36
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Republican Vampire posted:The NSF's already around in HR though. They turn up in emails and news stories in the Detroit hub, under the name New Sons of Freedom. I know that but the NSF proper and the insurrection is spurred on by the quake and the US Govt being more and more authoritarian
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Apr 9, 2015 00:39
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I could've sworn that they started off as something like the Northwest Succesion Front and want to split off because they were basically northern Confederates.
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Apr 9, 2015 00:41
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Bolow posted:I know that but the NSF proper and the insurrection is spurred on by the quake and the US Govt being more and more authoritarian Well, one of the articles suggested that we'd be seeing the history of the first game and that we'd see how Denton/The Public were lied to. So I could totally see that happening. Especially since the ghettos for Augs are totally a good run-up to how every city in Deus Ex 1 is walled off into discrete districts. Anatharon posted:I could've sworn that they started off as something like the Northwest Succesion Front and want to split off because they were basically northern Confederates. Yeah. They were founded as the Northwest Secessionist Forces but they joined up with secessionists in Utah, Nevada, Texas and the remains of California. The government quashed the goal of secession, but they became a national movement after the government passed some hardcore gun control measures in the 2040s.
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Apr 9, 2015 00:44
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Republican Vampire posted:That's not really the comparison I'd go for. The Room is Kitsch. Deus Ex is more of a happy accident. There's not really the same sense of irony there. It's more that the things about the game which worked were accidents which in many ways took attention from more conventionally important things. Hence the VTM:B comparison, and referencing Spector's confession that they had no idea what in the game had worked for people. Deus Ex was a happy accident. The attention paid to some parts of it was part of that. Even the dressed down aesthetic that a lot of people pointed to when the first Human Revolution screens came out was just a side effect of not being able to put enough detail into the textures. Well to be fair that kind of disastrously convoluted and unsure development is really common among videogames, even today. If you even go back to Doom and especially Quake their production was often a mess, the importance of the plot, the setting and how the whole thing would work mechanically was up in the air for ages and the end product was weirdly cobbled together (note the strange enemy diversity in Quake, medieval knights to hell demons to space marines with no explanation). Today you still get stuff like New Vegas, as well as Human revolution itself, fabulous games but clearly missing huge chunks of intended content such most of Hengsha or anything particularly interesting on the Strip.The dodgyness of Deus Ex's endgame content is really not that exceptional in videogame terms, to be honest I was kind of impressed that they kept a generally high level of quality going on so long before it all starts breaking down, it is a really, really long drat game (if want a truly awful ending failure then imho System Shock 2 really takes the cake). So I don't think I can agree with the idea that it all came together as an accident, the basic principals of an open variety of ways to approach any situation remain constant and are well provided for, I think the levels (and there are a lot of them) are clearly designed with this in mind throughout while the plot and characters remain coherent throughout, I've played tons of games with much worse pacing and payoffs. Anatharon posted:I could've sworn that they started off as something like the Northwest Succesion Front and want to split off because they were basically northern Confederates.  ). They seem to be a similar from what information is available, their original appeal is with the 'Gubmint-gonna-take-my-guns-UN-Illuminati-run-the-White-House-we-should-secede-for-realsies-this-time ' crowd, and the Human Revolution NSF predates the DX1 NSF by a few years so its likely they morphed into the other one between games, we might see what happened with this game.
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Apr 9, 2015 01:10
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khwarezm posted:Well to be fair that kind of disastrously convoluted and unsure development is really common among videogames, even today. If you even go back to Doom and especially Quake their production was often a mess, the importance of the plot, the setting and how the whole thing would work mechanically was up in the air for ages and the end product was weirdly cobbled together (note the strange enemy diversity in Quake, medieval knights to hell demons to space marines with no explanation). Today you still get stuff like New Vegas, as well as Human revolution itself, fabulous games but clearly missing huge chunks of intended content such most of Hengsha or anything particularly interesting on the Strip.The dodgyness of Deus Ex's endgame content is really not that exceptional in videogame terms, to be honest I was kind of impressed that they kept a generally high level of quality going on so long before it all starts breaking down, it is a really, really long drat game (if want a truly awful ending failure then imho System Shock 2 really takes the cake). So I don't think I can agree with the idea that it all came together as an accident, the basic principals of an open variety of ways to approach any situation remain constant and are well provided for, I think the levels (and there are a lot of them) are clearly designed with this in mind throughout while the plot and characters remain coherent throughout, I've played tons of games with much worse pacing and payoffs. It'd categorize them differently though. The recent examples are all games that exclude things because they want a strong core. When the developers are scoping the game, they cut large swaths of side content, which is why New Vegas doesn't h ave much east of the Colorado or why Human Revolution is lacking multiple hubs that were originally planned. But those sacrifices are on the altar of coherent mechanics and a strong MQ path. Deus Ex is different, in my opinion, because it sacrifices the main quest for the side content. A lot of the level design is bad, but that's okay because you find these fun pockets. A lot of the quest design is incredibly primitive, but that's okay because you wind up in these knots where a lot of love and attention went into something that honestly isn't that memorable. It's like Fallout 2, where something miraculous arose from poor project management.
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Apr 9, 2015 01:17
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Mankind divided sounds like a fatality in the new mortal kombat, in stores next week. Preorder now for GORO Seriously though HR was neat and the visuals look p good in the new one. I'm excited.
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Apr 9, 2015 02:21
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I am so excited about this, Human Revolution was fantastic outside of the boss fights. Do we know anything about what happened to any of the Sarif industry dudes? I really liked all of them.
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Apr 9, 2015 02:38
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Caidin posted:I am so excited about this, Human Revolution was fantastic outside of the boss fights.
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Apr 9, 2015 02:44
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Accordion Man posted:They've hinted that Malik didn't survive the Belltower ambush. Preorder cancled. Judging from the trailer and Adam floating in what I'd guess is the ruins of Panchaea they probably killed David too.
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Apr 9, 2015 02:54
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Caidin posted:Preorder cancled. It was destroyed in every ending because it is doomed to collapse and kill everyone inside without Hyron. That's why the post-credits sequence always features Page and Everett talking about salvaging bits from the ocean floor to build Morpheus. And it's been outright said that Malik isn't in the game not because she died but because they don't want ot say what happened either way. Which sucks because, like I said in the other thread, the best predictor of whether or not a Deus Ex game is good is how interesting and cool the pilot is.
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Apr 9, 2015 03:01
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Caidin posted:Do we know anything about what happened to any of the Sarif industry dudes? I really liked all of them. Me too, me too. I feel like it's kind of hard to reconcile David Sarif with DX1, though, so I guess I can kind of understand why they'd do it - especially with the whole "the Golden Age is over" stuff. Maybe we'll run into Pritchard.
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Apr 9, 2015 03:05
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Saw the trailer today, it's less nonsensical and schizophrenic than the Icarus trailer and with better looking action. Was almost like a very, very short movie, or maybe the trailer to a short movie. I am hyped.
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Apr 9, 2015 03:48
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Ok guys so I'm gonna take full credit for this game here. Last month Square ran a poll asking what games you were playing from both Sqaure and other devs. At the end they asked what game from Square do you want the most, to which I answered "Deus Ex Rising: Revengeance." Square probably wouldn't have made this game if I had not told them to do so. You're welcome 
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Apr 9, 2015 03:56
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DoctorStrangelove posted:Ok guys so I'm gonna take full credit for this game here. Last month Square ran a poll asking what games you were playing from both Sqaure and other devs. At the end they asked what game from Square do you want the most, to which I answered "Deus Ex Rising: Revengeance." Square probably wouldn't have made this game if I had not told them to do so. Nice man, thanks 
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Apr 9, 2015 03:57
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