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Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
Myths Over Miami could have easily been published by somebody in the WoD.

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Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
Wow, I got my hands on a copy of the original Clanbook Gangrel and drat but they used to be The Gypsy Clan (also gently caress the Ravnos). Also:

Clanbook: Gangrel posted:

CJ: (in a pseudo street-rap staccato)
They call me CJ, and it was 50 years back
a bitch named Mikki took my blood and gave it back
I thought I was sick, I felt so queasy and green,
I felt myself hooked on something I never seen

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
I wrote this about Vampire: the Masquerade awhile back, might as well repost it here.

Shadow of the Vampire features John Malkovitch as F.W. Murnau, following him as he makes his unauthorized adaptation of Dracula, Nosferatu. Looking to make his film as realistic as possible, Murnau goes out and finds himself a real vampire, Max Schreck, played by Willem Dafoe. But Schreck’s been away from his humanity too long, and his self-control isn’t what it might be. If you’ve ever wanted to see a low-Humanity vampire struggling to interact with human beings, this film’s got you covered.

If you’re in the mood for some violence and one of the best vampire movies out there, check out Near Dark, with Bill Paxton, Lance Henrikson, and Jeanette Goldstein all fresh from appearing in Aliens. A traveling pack of vicious vampires roams the American Southwest in a succession of stolen vehicles, committing a string of murders while trying to integrate their newest recruit. The ending’s a bit of a copout, but if you’d like to see a nomadic Sabbat pack at work, you might as well go to one of the primary inspirations for the Sabbat.

I think it gets called out in one of the tabletop books, but The Godfather is the Vampire: the Masquerade movie. That scene at the very beginning, with the singing and dancing and partying of the wedding going on outside while behind closed doors potentially deadly business is being transacted? That's a Camarilla gathering if I've ever seen one. And the whole rest of the film? It's about an underworld of hierarchical secret organizations of people who covertly influence society and occasionally kill and die over their position in it. It's about loyalty and betrayal, about love and hate, and about wanting to do the right thing but being steered by forces not entirely within your control but not entirely out of your control either. See it because The Godfather is Vampire as all get out, or just see it because it's one of the best films of all time.

Blade does something that's a staple of Masquerade but which doesn't show up in a lot of vampire movies- the notion of the vampire Illuminati, pulling strings behind the scenes. Boardrooms of pale men who don't remember mortality versus a group of young, cosmopolitan vampires who want to overthrow them in the name of a dark god? Archives of information hidden behind innocent fronts? Human beings sworn to the service of vampires in hopes of being turned? A secret vampire mythology complete with its own system of prophecies? drat, yes.

Not all vampires live in boardrooms and move effortlessly among the kine- some just struggle to get by. Night Junkies is the Thin-Blood experience in a nutshell, as a desperate vampire moves through some grimy, incredibly seedy parts of London’s underbelly while beginning to suspect that the serial killer stalking London is him. For most of the Kindred, the Embrace comes with some pretty significant bonuses- sure, you’re losing a lot, but you’re also gaining quite a bit. For the desperate Thin-Blooded, well, not so much.

I can hear you laughing already, but watch a few episodes of Downton Abbey and check out the way the post-Edwardian class structure is acted out and enforced both by the Crawleys and their fellow aristocrats upstairs and the servants below. It’s not just the aristocrats enforcing the class structure- some of the servants are as ardent supporters of it as their counterparts upstairs could ever be. Replace “aristocrats” with “Elders” and “servants” with “neonates and ancilla” and you’ve got the social structure the Camarilla tries to enforce- one in which the younger Kindred are respectful, subservient, and know their place.

Lost Boys is one of those instant classics. I’ve heard people say it’s the Sabbat, I’ve seen people say it’s a gang of Brujah. Maybe it’s just about the fear of watching your kids grow up into somebody other than who you tried to raise. Heck, maybe it’s just a reminder that hunters are out there and if your characters aren’t careful, it’s not just their own necks they’re risking. And if nothing else, it’s got “Cry Little Sister”, so that’s good, too.

Se7en has no overtly supernatural elements, but every last inch of it captures the feel of the World of Darkness. The world is grey and ugly, full of people who are sick inside and out, and the only man with a solution for it is himself a violent, vicious serial killer. What sort of horrors does the awfulness of living in the World of Darkness spawn in your game? In your city? In your character?

Hmm, since I wrote that I saw this interview with MRH where he talks about how seeing The Lost Boys with Stewart Wieck was the original inspiration for V:tM.

Also a bunch of the players in my LARP are undergrads whose reference pools are significantly later than mine; I referenced Interview With the Vampire while talking a player through deciding how her character felt about Humanity, saying that Lestat and Louis are effective illustrations of two very different approaches, and discovered she hadn't heard of it. So I guess no matter how obvious it sounds, that's a good one, too.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Kavak posted:

I just remembered this less than serious but still appropriate take on Awakening:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WznBZhCFWWg

Huh, I didn't realize he was using his first name now.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
The sky is where bombs fall from. The sky is where drones and satellites watch you from. The sky is where chemtrails poison you from. The sky is where dragons and rocs and the like swoop down from.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GbpUcAI86MY

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
So I've been running the local Masquerade LARP for about a year now, and I'm working up a survey to collect feedback on how I'm doing. I've got the following questions:

1. What is your overall feeling about [game]?
3. What's the best experience you've had playing in [game]?
4. What's your worst experience you've had at [game]?
5. How do you feel about the level of attention you get from the Storyteller during the game?
6. How do you feel about the level of attention you get from the Storyteller between games?

Any ideas for other questions I should be asking?

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Kibner posted:

Maybe ask about the place you play at. Is the schedule good?

Are there any small but essential tasks that you do/don't like?

What is the most appealing characteristic of this LARP?

Which event was the most memorable?

Is there something that you would want this LARP to add or focus on more?

Thank you.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
So basically it would've been like a giant-rear end LARP only a million times worse.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

RocknRollaAyatollah posted:

World of Darkness Online had nothing to actually do with the World of Darkness other than vampires and some clan names. It was pretty much the WoD version of Shadowrun for the XBox 360.

Well, that's insofar as World of Darkness Online could be said to be or have anything- it was really never anything at all beyond a super-early tech demo.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

RocknRollaAyatollah posted:

When it wrapped, they had an early alpha client and had active testing for employees and family.

The leaks mentioned before didn't happen until after the project was canned. The project was canned because they pumped money and resources into that thing for 5 years and didn't get poo poo back, not because of the leaks.

I'm not saying the leaks had anything to do with it, I'm saying they didn't produce anything worth producing in half a loving decade.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
I'm entirely okay with the City Gangrel swapping in Obfuscate for Fortitude; urban survival via blending in rather than just being tougher than everything else? Sure, makes sense. The lack of Animalism, though? Dumb. Celerity? Dumb. Animalism, Obfuscate, Protean, that I'm fine with. The invisible blender just sucks.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
That level of Mytherceria that's just Spirit's Touch except you actually eat the psychic residue and nobody else can Spirit's Touch the item afterward is pretty cool. I'd be cool with it replacing Spirit's Touch- introduces an abusable trust sort of thing.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

neaden posted:

Lucious Soulban is still the greatest WoD author name of all time.

I remember watching Serial Experiments Lain, going "what the gently caress did I just watch?" (which seems to be the most common reaction), and then buying a guide to the series mostly on the strength of it being by Lucian Soulban and Bruce Baugh. It, uh, didn't help as much as I thought it might.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

SunAndSpring posted:

You don't seem to understand.


Attorney at Funk posted:

A shame. You seemed an honest man.

If these are Lain quotes they're over my head, I saw the series once in like 2002.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Daeren posted:

That explains the two Night Horrors books, three Bloodline books, and two Ancients books :v:

I thought the explanation for the Bloodline books was Requiem players viewing them the way D&D players view Prestige Classes.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
Eddy Webb did a Reddit AMA.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Mimir posted:

A children's magazine commonly found in waiting rooms at dentists' offices.

But that's not important.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
How do you pronounce chiminage?

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Mors Rattus posted:

You don't, because it's a silly word. I suggest things like 'sacrifice' or 'bargain' instead. Chiminage is an obsolete Franco-English word for a toll paid on a forest road.

White wolf! :orks:

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Mors Rattus posted:

Chiminage is like two steps above Vitae, Celerity and Auspex, by rights of having extra syllables, sounding super goofy even in comparison and being equally well-served by the term 'sacrifice' which is really quite a nice little word.

(Metis is about on par with Chiminage though, perhaps worse. Don't use Metis.)

Metis makes me want to go back in time and scream "DON'T loving DO THAT" into MRH's ear while he's asleep.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Kavak posted:

How did that happen?

Metis was the username of the poster who commissioned swap.avi, over the protests of virtually everybody.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Tezzor posted:

Remove non-resource merits from the game imo

Screw that, Medium for everybody. The Shroud is all but down, go hog wild!

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

MonsieurChoc posted:

I guess the White Wolf writers really like that scene with the maggots in Lost Boys.

According to MRH, seeing Lost Boys with Stewart Wieck was the inspiration for making V:tM, so it's not entirely inappropriate.

I actually really like the "convince somebody that something scary is true" power. That's a neat one.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
So what are we talking about, some kind of Call of Cthulhu thing where a hilariously powerful offense is easy to acquire and adequate defense really isn't?

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Luminous Obscurity posted:

I asked in the comments, but just so everyone here is fully aware.

Using Forces to Shield someone from gravity means just that.

You can turn off gravity at two dots. :getin:

Shield somebody from chemical bonds, watch them dissolve.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Little_wh0re posted:

I actually like darklings and do like that write up. But "I'm willing to make the hard choices others won't" sounds like an arrow/batman kinda line

It's a very WoD archetype.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Little_wh0re posted:

In my experience of gaming the hard choice tends to be being more moral, not less.

This is also why Mummy: the Resurrection was poo poo.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
Why is it Mage specifically that always inspires the fifty-page rules arguments? Are the mechanics that vague?

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
This weekend most of my players swore up and down OOC that their characters would never commit murder and had never killed anybody. This group includes several people playing elders.

Additionally, I found this in the coordinator report:

quote:

Domain census and recruiting new members: Several new players are interested in Werewolf, and intend to form a pack. A few are possibly interested in Vampire but are put off by the competitive atmosphere.

...maybe I should just cancel game and hold Diplomacy sessions until they acquire a taste for backstabbing.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Hipster Occultist posted:

Maybe introduce some NPC's that start loving them over?

I mean I dunno, this is such a weird problem to have with a vampire game.

My operating theory is that they're nice people OOC and that they don't want to be mean to each other IC. Which I guess is better than them being dicks IC and having it bleed into OOC (I knew a guy back in 2000 or so who quit LARPing, saying that being a manipulative jerk was starting to bleed into his actual personality and he felt it wasn't healthy for him to keep playing), but it makes the game a bit off from what we're ostensibly going for. It does raise the question of why you're playing Vampire if you want to be Lawful Good, but right now my plan is to scour their backgrounds for things I can dangle in front of them that multiple players will want and only one can have.

There's also a part of me that suspects a lot of the younger players view all RPGs through the lens of D&D/Pathfinder and can't imagine why they would be expected to work against other members of the party (where "the party" = "the Camarilla"), but I can't exactly assign them five-page papers on how the Camarilla has a level of disregard for the welfare of its individual members that the Hierarchy of Stygia would raise an eyebrow at.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

This was always my experience with D&D- I'd get invited to play and told to bring a character, show up with a Dwarven Cleric or something, and everybody is half-dragon or half-celestial [class from some sourcebook I've never heard of].

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Loomer posted:

Man, the official forums have a lot of people who think the Setites and Baali are completely redundant.

Slaves of the Aeons, all of them!

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
Banality is too central to CtD to fix it without making a completely different game.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

paradoxGentleman posted:

I'd like to say that it's a well made, more thoughtful book would outsell what the CtD fans are willing to pay for the anniversary version, but the truth is that I am not sure how many of them there are out there, nor how much are they willing to pay for this game.

On an unrelated note, what does AUG stand for?

Awkward, Ugly, and Gross. It's a PYF thread.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
Is there anything other than system issues preventing neatly excising C:tD and dropping Lost into the OWOD in its place?

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Covok posted:

I know I am no expert on the subject, but it doesn't really make sense to do so. I mean, what's the point of doing a C:tD 20th Anniversary Edition if it's actually just C:tL especially considering C:tL 2nd Edition is on its way?

Edit: Anyone know the best place to look for WoD games? Like, SA doesn't seem to have a lot so what's the best community to find games, if anyone knows?

I don't mean have C20 be Lost, I mean is there anything about Lost that would interfere with just dropping it into the OWOD and pretending Dreaming never happened.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
One of the things I like the most about the OWOD is the very 90's sense of impending doom- history is leading up to something big and bad and it's coming soon. You get that any time there's a big, round number (like 2000, say) coming up, and all of the OWOD games except Wraith have it, and Wraith goes out on a bang that destroys the major structure of the setting anyway. Requiem has much better politics, but it's missing that sense of desperation and doom that Masquerade at its best had.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Kurieg posted:

You do realize that Brucato is basically the patron saint of "Magic and Faeries are Real" in the Old World of Darkness and any rule that makes mages less powerful probably didn't come from him, right?

Dan Ackroyd:Ghostbusters::Phil Brucato:OWoD


Kurieg posted:

Werewolf's anti-science stuff is also something of a relic of 1st edition, mostly because 1st edition Werewolf put forth the idea that any level of human development beyond hunter/gatherer society is inherently evil. While at the same time having all the werewolf tribes pull off ridiculously out of character schemes and backstabbing machinations that would make a Ventrue blush.

The best part about the Technocracy and Werewolf is that the Technocracy is for some reason in deep with Pentex, because they're the bad guys, right? Ditto the Sabbat, despite the Wyrm being exactly the sort of thing the Sabbat burns people alive for being involved with.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Kurieg posted:

That was back before they had really worked out that the Weaver could, itself, be an enemy without actually meaning the Wyrm wasn't an enemy anymore. I think the idea of having two enemy factions might have popped poor MR*H's brain.

I think the thing with the sabbat is more that almost everything the Sabbat does empowers the Wyrm, so they're aligned with the Wyrm whether they are aware of it or not. It's still better than the few 1st ed werewolf books that have the Sabbat and the Garou chumming around and sharing information like it ain't no thing.

The real issue is that it implies that a) the Camarilla aren't just as bad from a human perspective (they're basically a cancer gnawing away at the heart of human civilization and as the most powerful vampire faction are responsible for a lot of human misery) and b) the Sabbat are bad guys to the Camarilla's good guys, which is... seriously not right.

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Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

MonsieurChoc posted:

The thing with the Technocracy vs Traditions is that people bring in all kinds of assumptions from outside the game and then argue really passionately about what they think is true instead of what the books say. This gets worse as the line goes on and fan misunderstanding and retcons and genuine improvements all mix together to make a giant mess.

Here's how things go: In the beginning, people didn't really know poo poo about magic. They all had their own theories and cultural teachings and applied them to magic and lived the life of stereotypical mages of their culture. That was simply how things were. If you're a Medicine Man, you do Medicine. No one was in control, no one knew that they were shaping reality through their belief. The time where the Traditions where in command that a lot of Mage fans like to argue about never occurred. The Mythic Ages of the early books were revealed to be complete bullshit by Sorcerer's Crusade and Dark Ages.

The Order of Reason changed everything. They were the first to really grasp what they were really doing and decide to use their cosmic powers to make the world a better place. They also immediately hosed it up by attacking the guys who held different beliefs rather than demons and vampires. It makes sense: it's a very human reaction. You don't like the guys from the rival company, but you loving loathe marketing. But when people say the Order of Reason started good, they're kinda wrong: from the beginning it was a really flawed organization, who wanted to impose their religion (One God For Everyone is right there in their philosophy) and then proceeded to help the Western world conquer and exploit the poo poo out of everything else. They then became the Technocracy as they slowly purged the good elements from their group (the Craft-Masons, etc.) and became the embodiment of western hegemony and Capitalism. So it's normal that a lot of people identify with the Technocracy: they're a dark mirror of us.

The other misconception about the Technocracy is that they don't do science. Science as we know it doesn't really exist in the WoD. It's all belief and manipulation of reality. The whole "fighting against the evils of drinking water" is a completely nonsensical argument within the framework of Ascension. The Etherites do science: they have a peer-reviewed magazine, they study the science of reality manipulation, they try to figure out how all the cosmology work and repeat experiments. The Hermetics kind of also do that in their own mystical way. The Technocracy doesn't do that: it decides what it wants to be true, and then murders or brainwash their way to that outcome.

Edit: Beaten because I took too long to write.

Really instead of phrasing it as "The Technocracy does magic but they think it's science" it's more accurate to say that the nine systems the Traditions call magic and the five systems the Technocracy calls science are all ways of approaching whatever you'd call the underlying thing they're actually doing.

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