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Is it me or did the good books recommendations get dropped from the (HUEG) op?
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Apr 9, 2015 14:44
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I'm just going to post this link to an article that I think is great inspriation to any nWoD game: http://www.sott.net/article/229112-John-Keel-and-His-Adventures-into-Unreality It was in the previous thread, and I think it's pretty core to understanding the differences between the two Worlds of Darkness: "Belief is the Enemy"
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Apr 10, 2015 05:29
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Luminous Obscurity posted:So we now know the complete list of Dark Eras. I broke it down and sorted them by gameline. The ones marked with asterisks are getting dedicated expansions (as opposed to expansions that just add another line). Aside from the lack of Devil in the White City Vampire and Blitz Innocents, this is a pretty goddamn amazing list.
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Apr 10, 2015 15:11
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Dave Brookshaw posted:Also, I thought it was pretty clear that Kuei-Jin aren't the same sort of monster as western Kindred viewed through a cultural filter, they're Risen. As in the minor Crow-alike splat from Wraith. Wait, what did they do? Are all my V:tES Laibon decks invalid now?
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Apr 11, 2015 05:49
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Loomer posted:Introduced some new African bloodlines (and/or completely distinct creatures that happen to share the common traits of generation, etc): Wait, that's new stuff, new stuff is cool! It's just, I actually liked the Laibon stuff and was afraid they'd unmade it.
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Apr 11, 2015 06:25
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*Sigh* Remember early nWoD, where fiction was either really creepy mysterious stuff with no explanations (like the original God-Machine thing) or Greg Stolze being great? And then it devolved into grimdark "everyone dies horribly and no one wins and BvD" stuff? And now it's back to oWoD level of terrible? Edit: Why can't we just have more stuff like the Horror Recognition Gudie? That was pretty much the best non-Greg Stolze whitewolf fiction book.
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Apr 13, 2015 03:04
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Loomer posted:Time is a flat circle. At least we'll always have Wraith, which was probably the most consistenyl high quality line of the Olde Waurlde. Even it'S gmpcs were pretty good (like whatsisface wandering aroudn the world to find this girl he saw once to say sorry he didn't save har).
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Apr 13, 2015 04:01
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The Assamite and Malkavian revised clanbooks were pretty great, so I guess I'll stay with those instead.
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Apr 13, 2015 06:47
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That's the thing that really bugs me about Beast, really. Even fi the game ends up good, it just feels like there's a lot of more interesting things Onyx Path could have done before slightly-different-changeling. Like, I can propably brainstorm half a dozen ideas in five minutes: - Aliens - Dopplegangers - Mad Scientists (a better take than the Genius fangame) - Deep Ones/other hybrids with lovecraftian horrors - Mutants/escaped experiments - Time and/or Dimension travelers (sliders meet Continuum: roleplaying in the yet, I guess) - Bug people, why not - Abbott and Costello
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Apr 14, 2015 15:49
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Effectronica posted:-Where's the personal horror? All those counters are terrible. I guess I'll give you the bug people one? I mean, I was just throwing random ideas I thought of in under 5 minutes, this wasn't a serious pitch or anything. I will still answer you, though. - How is X-Files/Mothman Prophecies not instantly horror? It was a major inspiration for the nWoD core, as well as howing up in sidebars over multiple gamelines since. Making that into a stand-alone game would be cool and easy. - Shapeshifting monsters that copy/replace people. How is that not a sure hit? As well as continuing the classic mosnter checklist of the WoD. - No. Not at all. Unless you're thinking of Ascension, in which case I clearly wasn't talking aboutt he oWoD. - Different themes and atmospheres, really different core concept. The similarities would be cosmetic at best. - That's a stupid question. The story of someone turning or being turned into something strange and horrifying is like super basic horror. - Thousand different ways, really. That's the moment I got less serious anyway, Broken Rooms already does it pretty well so there's no need for a WoD version. - That's the one I'm giving you. - Heh.
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Apr 14, 2015 17:44
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paradoxGentleman posted:What's not to like about Genius: The Transgression? It has a shadowy organization that secretly controlled humanity's progress for centuries! And one of their factions consists of exporers/knight errants types that used to explore jungles and now explore the space/time continuum! And the Martian Empire! Well, that's the thing, really. Those things are cool... in the oWoD. They don't really fit with the tone of the nWoD. Shadowy organisation that control everything go very much against the central core of the setting. A mad scientist game more in line with the nWoD would be more about playing people like the original Frankenstein or the Invisible Man: a man who, through his madness, managed to create one or two terrible inventions and use them for their own purposes. Any kind of mad scientist conspiracies would look a lot more like The Cheiron Group or the Ordo Dracul than the Technocracy. That, to me, is the core of the nWoD: every answer only leads to more questions, no one is in charge, no matter how powerful or how much you know there will always be soemthing that will leave you completely baffled and scared, no one is safe, no one can be safe. Effectronica posted:Okay, but you were talking like they would be gamelines, which in the World of Darkness we live in are about playing the monster. So with that in mind. - Sure, I'd be down with that. But a good gameline could also be done about playing the Aliens. Considering how creative WW/OPP got with some of their source material, there's plenty of possibilities. - Why isn't it there? This wouldn't even be the first gameline where you play as something that was never human (Promethean and Demon come to mind). - Nope, not at all. Awakening doesn't touch on this even slightly. - I dunno what to tell you. There isn't really any aspect of body horror/evil in the blood/etc. in Werewolf. It's much more about the Hunt. - The only nWoD game with any gothic aspect in it is Vampire: the Requiem. And Promethean a bit too, I guess. Everything else is free to be any kind of horror it wants to be. Demon isn't gothic at all, for example. As such, this is a completely invalid argument and I can't really argue with it. I mean, it's just completely beside the subject, so I don't have a way of engaging with it.
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Apr 14, 2015 18:15
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BzwxJ-M_M0
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Apr 14, 2015 18:21
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Crion posted:I'm not sure how productive the distinction is, because you can play a serial killer easily and completely in-theme in every game except arguably Mage. Killing people refills your mana bar.
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Apr 14, 2015 18:45
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Effectronica posted:Promethean and Demon are almost entirely about the tension between human and monster, because the goal of the Pilgrimage and the day-to-day survival of the Demon depend on being convincingly human. So how is it different? How is one version ok and not another? Effectronica posted:I see mad-scientist-as-protagonist as being about the horrors done out of arrogance and cold distance from the rest of humanity, which is pretty much in line with what Awakening is about. What do you see it as? That's a really really reductionist of both what Awakening is about and what the horror interpretaion of Mad Scientists is. I'm gonna stop here, because it's getting really weird how you want random two word pitches to fit to this convuled and reductionist view of the WoD you have. We've also veered way off the original point I was mking, which is that there'S plenty of more interesting material OPP could have done isntead of the weird mishmash of CHangeling and Slasher that seems to be Beast.
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Apr 14, 2015 19:09
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Effectronica posted:????? Well, that's the thing, isn't it? There isn't an interpretation or anything else yet. What I did was post half a dozen random ideas I thoguht could be more interesting than beast. They cannot, by their very natur,e stand up to scrutiny: there is nothing there yet. Any question you ask of me can be answered the same way: "If I was actually doing it, I'd address that". Furthermore, it seems to me as if most of your questions turn around a somewhat reductionist view of the nWoD where everything must fit within the narrow framework established by Vampire: the Requiem, which I disagree with. I don't see Demon as being about the tension between Man and Monster at all. Neither is Hunter, for that matter.
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Apr 14, 2015 19:32
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Effectronica posted:What about your interpretation of mad-scientist-as-protagonist, which you said is much less restrictive than the one I propose. Well, ok, let's talk about Mad Science. Hubris is only one of the many themes explored in fiction with the Mad Scientists. It's certainly one of the big ones. Science "going too far" and creating an out of control mosnter or plague or something like that. This doesn't really intersect with Mage though: Mage hubris is about finding out ancient secrets that should have remained buried, abusing your inherent powers, thinking yourself a god, etc. It's a very magical thing. It's very mystical, religious, spiritual. Mad Science is instead political, sociological. Mad Scientist Game should be about bitterness. Betrayal. Mad Scientists are motivated by revenge, are disillusioned with the world that rejected them, wanted to change the world but were betrayed by their ideals, etc. Negative emotions dominate, and Mas Scientists are especially bad at handling them. It's hard to put into words. Mage hubris is wanting to reign in heaven. Mad Science hubris is thinking if you ran the world using your supercomputer then there would be no more poverty.
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Apr 14, 2015 19:46
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I'm not explaining myself really well, if that's what you get of what I'm saying. Awakening is a game of Gnostic horror. The world is a lie, assholes are in charge, and the few who can see beyond the lie (Mages) are often petty assholes. That's where you get the Hubris of new Mage, when Mages start thinking that they by virtue of being Awakened they know better and are better and can do what they want. This is represented through the Seers, through the extremists in the Pentacle Orders, through Wisdom and throguh Paradox. This isn't the only thing in Mage, there's a lot of stuff aboutt he horror of the Lie, the Abyss, the way Mages are driven to seek mysteries and answers even if it kills them, etc. That'S not the way most of Mad Scientist work in fiction, though. Usually, they're loners, driven by an emotion (generally revenge or an ideal) and single-minded. You can certainly have Mages act like that, but that's not the norm nor does it fit. By the very nature of Awakening magic, which is paradox prone, impermanent, comes from the Supernal Realmsand cannot be analyze din a scientific manner, it's almost impossible to do a cliché Mad Science story. This isn't a mark against Mage, focusing more on magic and magicians instead of Ascension's kitchen sink approach was a good idea. To simply say that Mad Science is doable with Mage because they share a very broad theme (Hubris, meaning extreme pride or arrogance, usually of teh self-defeating kind) is kind of missing the point. Since Vampire also has a lot of Hubris in ther,e might as well cancel Mage and say it's all doable in Requiem. A much better comparison for what I'm thinking of when I say Mad Scientist are the Demiurges from Promethean.
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Apr 14, 2015 19:59
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Mors Rattus posted:You do realize you'll never, ever see an nWoD game that isn't mystical and occult, right? Even science and technology are vehicles for mysticism in the nWoD. See also: the God Machine, Demon. That's not what I'm saying, though. I was simply saying that Mage is not a game of Mad Science. Like, that's it. I'm not trying to define what Mage is. I'm not trying to defend Genius or say that OPP should make it's own Mad Science game right loving now. Here's how this whole thing has been going: ME: Beast is nowhere near the most interesting idea OPP could have done. Here's a bunch or one-word ideas I came up with in five minutes. EFFECTRONICA: Mad Science has been done with mage. ME: Huh, no. EFFECTRONICA: Mad Science has hubris in it and so does Mage, therefore they are the same. ME: No, not really. Even if they share one theme, they wouldn't really treat them the same way. And even then both Mage and random Mad Science game would be about mroe than that. OTHERS: You don't get Mage or Hubris. ME: What the gently caress does that even have to do with the argument I was making?
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Apr 14, 2015 20:04
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What is so hard to understand about "A theoritical game that does not exist about Mad Scientist would be different both Tonally and Thematically from Mage: the Awakening even if there is someoverlap, especially when it comes to Hubris"? I mean if we follow this logic all nWoD games except Vampire should be burned because you can do their themes with Vampires.
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Apr 14, 2015 20:11
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Gilok posted:Mad scientists exist now only as camp comedy tropes or supporting characters in something more interesting. There is nothing there to support a game line or even a story that isn't either comedic(intentionally or unintentionally) or literally Frankenstein. That's the only good counter-argument so far, so I guess you win by default.
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Apr 14, 2015 20:19
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WINNERSH TRIANGLE posted:ONLY SEVERAL HUNDRED YEARS AGO, THE NEWLY CREATED SECRET DEADLY GANGSTER COMPUTER GOD earnestly began its’ TOP SECRET OVER- ALL PLAN of world-wide FRANKENSTEIN LIVING DEATH SLAVERY, to explore and control the entire UNIVERSE. The Gangster Computer God concocted and even named its’ OWN IDEAL COMMUNIST WORLD ORDER, namely the murder incorporated organized crime deadly gangsterism impunistic world-wide military uniformed mongrel federalism, COMMUNIST TOTALITARIANISM.  This is why I love the new World of Darkness.
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Apr 14, 2015 20:28
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMqxNPsfN50 What's he building in there?
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Apr 14, 2015 21:25
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I always quote Sailor Moon when I play Werewolf, old or new. My fellow players usually throw erasers at me (also known as "the blame"), but I know in my heart that I am right.
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Apr 15, 2015 04:38
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Pope Guilty posted:So I've been running the local Masquerade LARP for about a year now, and I'm working up a survey to collect feedback on how I'm doing. I've got the following questions: Which pet NPC of the Storyteller do you want to kill the most?
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Apr 16, 2015 13:23
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Night10194 posted:What about the loving World of Darkness says 'MMO'? I dunno, the Secret World is pretty WoD-ish, and it's the best single player MMORPG out there.
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Apr 17, 2015 05:56
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Zombiejack posted:Also not convinced that people devolving sexless genderless predators of humanity getting their own Canal street is the right image for catering to homosexuals or anyone else for that matter Everybody got access to Thaumaturgy with Blood Magic and Blood Sacrifice. Good books, well-written, but kind of a nightmare balance-wise.
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Apr 17, 2015 14:52
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I Am Just a Box posted:Satyros Phil is developing oMage 20th Anniversary Edition, so he certainly counts post-name-change anyway. I remember he worked on Orpheus, one of WW's best gameline. At elast, one of the msot consistently good one. Then again, it was sort-of a continuation of Wraith, and Wraith was pretty great too. Maybe WW just has a knack for writing stuff about Ghosts? 
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Apr 18, 2015 04:38
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The contest one was really good.
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Apr 19, 2015 02:28
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Kurieg posted:1E werewolf as printed read to me as "Everyone wants to kill you because you were born. This is all your fault. If you fail in your duty other people will show up and kill you. Good luck" which didn't exactly leave me wanting to explore the nuances of where to go from there. I dunno man, this sounds pretty great for a tense game of creepy stuff. I played in only one Frosaken game (sadly), it was basically run that way, and it was loving amazing.
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Apr 21, 2015 05:12
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Kurieg posted:As a werewolf though, you usually weren't supposed to be the one being creeped out. Why not?
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Apr 21, 2015 05:40
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Then it becomes The Wire with spirits. Still awesome.
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Apr 21, 2015 05:54
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Effectronica posted:The Conspiracies, minus the one from the Werewoof book and the Ascending Ones, are all great and thematic. There's something of a disconnect with the Compacts, more. MAn, the Ascending Ones are loving great. Drug-dealers and criminals who use their illicit activities to fund the Hunt, what's not to love?
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Apr 21, 2015 20:48
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DOCTOR ZIMBARDO posted:There should be a game of TFV characters who are the judge, clerk, prosecutor, and the single court-appointed defense attorney of the ultra-secret United States Court of Appeals for the Fourteenth Circuit. There's the Barrett Comission.
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Apr 21, 2015 21:55
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Zombiejack posted:Between Scarecrow ministry members, Gentry, Slashers, Beasts, Predator Kings and pretty much any Vampire with a lovely attitude are their any actual human serial killers in WoD? Some guy who hates women because he was locked in a basement as a boy? Scarecrow Ministry aren't really serial killers,t hough. They're supposed to make you believe in serial killers and be extra scared and extra careful so that you're safe from them. Which is a really cool idea for a faction, I think.
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Apr 21, 2015 23:41
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I liked the idea that the masters of TFV are patriotic monsters who are 100% behind TFV and fighting for America. It's just so nWoD. edit: Like the Texan rear end in a top hat in that Requiem NPC book!
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Apr 22, 2015 00:31
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Stallion Cabana posted:no; The Dark Mother exists with the God Machine, not instead of. Demons are a completely different thing due to their connection to it, and thus aren't Siblings to them; everything else is, Mages kind of are but not entirely. You're supposed to, I think, take the Beast book as correct here that all the other creatures are descendents of one of The Dark Mother's other children; each of the 5 Beast Splats is an individual child, which is where the 'Big Sibling' comes from; they're basically every other splat's Aunt or Uncle. Sounds like a really lame creation myth, though. I way prefer First Edition nWoD's tone of "we have no loving clue".
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Apr 22, 2015 04:58
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Omnicrom posted:Honestly this was why I never really jumped aboard the God Machine train, I liked that there wasn't a lot in the way of truly codified setting stuff. I love the God-Machine stuff because of the way it manages to set almost nothing in stone despite being about God and Angels. It expanded on this thing that had been in the original core way back when, contradicted or left unanswered stuff from other settings (like the Principle in Promethean), and I feel you could have the God-Machine show up and go "Well, we really can't tell if it's really God or just a really powerful spirit." in most games. But I can totally understand if you feel it gave away too much.
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Apr 22, 2015 05:27
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More and more, I think I'll stick with the first edition of the nWoD and use the second edition books as optional rules, like Mirrors or Armory Reloaded.
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Apr 23, 2015 20:22
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It was kind of neat how the early games had the snobby super old words used by the high-class monsters to give themselves a veneer of culture and the street language of the common folks, even if what they came up with was soemtimes hilariously bad. It fit with the whole Punk thing they were going for.
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Apr 24, 2015 05:38
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| # ¿ May 6, 2024 03:43 |
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I want it to be more like Persona.
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Apr 24, 2015 11:14
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