Blades in the Dark: A bunch of hacks

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Blades in the Dark: A bunch of hacks

homullus: Mar 27, 2009

If I had known the rules would be changing this many times and going this far from what was available in the KS, I wouldn't have backed it.

# ¿ Nov 2, 2015 15:30

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# ¿ May 5, 2024 18:48

homullus: Mar 27, 2009

Kai Tave posted:

I mean some people can and do Kickstarters that either hit or, in some rare cases, beat their estimated deadlines but they're pretty much in the minority. In the specific case of John Harper and Blades in the Dark it seems kind of weird to play the "well his game was late by a year" card when he's been steadily revising and revamping the game during that time period which isn't usually what people object to when a Kickstarter goes late as opposed to the more common "drops all communication with everyone, does nothing, makes excuses" approach.

The game he is releasing is different from where it started, which is something people object to with Kickstarter.

# ¿ Feb 17, 2017 03:25

homullus: Mar 27, 2009

Kai Tave posted:

It's really not though.

I mean I know where you're going to try to go with this but Blades in the Dark as it stands now is recognizable as a game that sprung from Blades in the Dark as it originally started. This isn't like that video game that was showing off gifs of some Hyper Light Drifter-style fast-paced 2D actiony top down game and then after funding closed said "actually we're going to make a 3D game with a completely different artstyle and gameplay, thanks for the money." Consolidating the skill list, tweaking playbooks, and adjusting how some rules work doesn't constitute some gross bait-and-switch maneuver, and while I'm currently too lazy to go archive digging to check I'm pretty sure that Harper did say that the game as presented in early drafts wasn't 100% set in stone, but nonetheless what was promised was a narrative-driven game of criminal gangs doing crimes in not-Duskwall with clocks and playbooks and an approach that eschews drawn-out planning in favor of simply diving into heists with minimal fuss and that's precisely what was delivered.

And this is all without even touching on the fact that a lot of these changes were probably at the very least nudged along by the ongoing open playtesting which he encouraged people to do, so at every step of the way backers were given an avenue to provide Harper with feedback and were regularly provided with updated versions of the game as time went along, meaning that nothing was sprung on anyone out of nowhere and if Harper had decided to go and do something really completely stupid that everybody hated I imagine there would have been a big outcry about it but I don't recall any serious blowups coming out of the Blades G+ or Kickstarter page. There's always going to be a non-zero number of people who are unhappy that a thing changed, but in this particular case I feel confident going on on the limb that says that way more people are at worst neutral and at best positive about the final product.

I get it. To you, it does not constitute "enough change" to be different, the super-extended dance mix playtesting is a positive overall, and missing your ship date by a year isn't that big a deal. I hope you can see that such thresholds are arbitrary (see the Ship of Theseus), and the lack of blowup on G+ is not very meaningful, since many people do not actively participate in G+ gaming communities. It doesn't require archive digging to see what he said; it's still on the KS campaign page:

quote:

The game is very close to finished. The design has been playtested and refined for the past 26 months and about half of the book is written. The design style and layout templates are done. What remains is a chunk of explanatory writing and lots and lots of art and map-making.

I expect there will be tweaks and changes as you all start playing the Quick Start, which I'm very excited about. I will remain transparent about the process -- keeping you informed of revisions and progress as I go along.

The part in bold supports my point that people had reason to expect it to be 1) on time, and 2) the same. Two years of playtesting!...before the year of playtesting that made him overhaul it multiple times. If you're not inferring from the results that the game wasn't as done as he said, or that at the least the playtesting was not done beyond a very small group, I don't know what to say. The part in italics is the allowance you alluded to, and confirms that he was up front from the beginning about the possibility of it being altered. So I guess if you want to lean back in your chair, thumbs behind your lapels, with a self-satisfied smile about how right you are that people have no reason to be annoyed, ok, but I think it's reasonable to find fault with the Kickstarting of this game or be happy with the Kickstarting of this game..

# ¿ Feb 17, 2017 04:39

homullus: Mar 27, 2009

dwarf74 posted:

I backed for hardcover, and I'd rather it be good than be on time, within reason. A year ain't so bad when I'm still waiting on project dark.

Good vs. on time is a false dilemma, though, as is "I'd rather have it be one year late than have it be Far West late." There is no reason not to expect somebody to produce something good and on time, especially when they tell you it is mostly done -- "it just needs explanatory text and lots of art" -- and that it has 26 months of testing behind it before launching the KS. I too am relieved that it won't be a pile of crap and am excited for the hardcover version, but a year overdue for is bad, full stop. Four years overdue is even worse, but that doesn't make a year overdue not bad.

# ¿ Feb 17, 2017 21:57

homullus: Mar 27, 2009

admanb posted:

Clearly we will have to buy copies of the standard edition to carry around so the special edition can stay undamaged.

(I'm honestly considering doing this.)

Do the kids these days not have to make book covers for their grade school textbooks anymore?

# ¿ Jun 9, 2017 15:19

homullus: Mar 27, 2009

dwarf74 posted:

Hah! I haven't thought about doing that in years. Great idea.

...now I just need to find some brown paper bags...

I searched the internet to reassure myself that this isn't some bizarre thing that people have completely forgotten, and found non-grocery-bag options, such as felt and plastic, here.

# ¿ Jun 9, 2017 15:31

homullus: Mar 27, 2009

Serf posted:

Copperhead County just got into Early Access.

I've read the beta version of the game, and it looks pretty cool. Basically this hack is about playing as modern day criminals pulling off heists and building a reputation in a fictionalized Tennessee county, but it can be used for games all over the New South or really any rural area in modern America. It has 6 playbooks and 3 crew types, all of which are pretty interesting, and it has modified rules for relieving stress that are tied into the amount of cash you can spend and lowered action rating maxes to 3 for a grittier feel. Also the richer you get the more heat you pull down from the feds, so you have to be careful about how you amass and spend cash. Overall it's a neat little hack and costs $10 to get in on the EA version (but the beta rules are still free and are pretty darn complete), with that also getting you the full version when it releases.

growing up in a rural area will finally be good for something . . . on a much, much smaller scale than I ever imagined

# ¿ Apr 30, 2018 19:44

homullus: Mar 27, 2009

This reminds me of that time he Kickstarted a game called "Blades in the Dark" and touted its extensive playtesting, then changed a whole bunch of stuff in the game when he actually did playtesting.

# ¿ May 12, 2018 14:13

homullus: Mar 27, 2009

Has anyone already done all the work of hacking Scum & Villainy into Star Wars? I have the opportunity to introduce a couple newcomers to RPGs and one is a huuuuuge Star Wars fan. I know I will get a lot more buy-in if everything I hand her is Star Warsy. I'm thinking especially of the charts for coming up with missions on the fly, ship and sector names, the basic setting stuff baked into the book. I know I could do it myself, but if somebody else has . . . well, that saves me a lot of work.

# ¿ Dec 4, 2018 00:12

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# ¿ May 5, 2024 18:48

homullus: Mar 27, 2009

JesterOfAmerica posted:

All you have to do is change names, out of the box S&V works excellently for star wars

Yes. I am not enough of a Star Wars nerd to complete the charts and decide on ships and systems and factions without research. I don't want to spend that time if somebody has already done it. Like I said in the post you just replied to, "setting stuff." I know the game will work fine mechanically.

# ¿ Dec 4, 2018 03:36

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