Job Truniht posted:

The otaku thing is an actual problem in Japan that's going to take out the rest of its population within a few generations.

platedlizard posted:

I've been away from D&D for awhile, is Mr. Cow there a gimmick or is he genuinely insane?

Job Truniht posted:

hrm yes I wonder if that has anything to do with China and India

CowOnCrack posted:

This is what the critic does and always has done. The extreme has the power to illuminate the general.

quote:

All tools, no matter how powerful, are just tools. It was never the tool that was evil. If used wisely such a tool could be of great benefit. The trouble is the area of life the tool operates in. I have to believe it is impossible for such a tool to not change how we think profoundly, for Good or Evil. That means we MUST think about what it is doing.

quote:

I relate to women just fine. I've grown up with and have been mentored by some wonderful role models that are women. I can tell in my life that women in general look up to me and see me as an example, not to mention attractive. In terms of being obsessed or resentful, that's just the experience of romantic love. I have had it two times in my life and both times with excessive respect for the other person, and have negotiated total rejection in the face of impossibly frustrating emotional dishonesty and immaturity. It's how women relate to me and men like me that is the issue. This person was struggling to maintain some delusion of a friendship after I had been very clear about my feelings and she was already in a relationship. She was completely unable to set an emotional boundary because she was ultimately fighting with basic biological reality. She wants me around and my support and yadda yadda yadda, but never 'that way, that way, that way'. She has no proper conception of her relationship to the opposite sex, and literally invents the delusion that I'm being disrespectful or harassing her. No wonder the suffering was so incredibly bad for both people and she finally imploded, resulting in my respectful self-exile. Massive walls of societally-conditioned delusions can be the only culprit in such silliness and self-denial.

Job Truniht posted:

The otaku thing is an actual problem in Japan that's going to take out the rest of its population within a few generations.

CowOnCrack posted:

I relate to women just fine. I've grown up with and have been mentored by some wonderful role models that are women. I can tell in my life that women in general look up to me and see me as an example, not to mention attractive. In terms of being obsessed or resentful, that's just the experience of romantic love. I have had it two times in my life and both times with excessive respect for the other person, and have negotiated total rejection in the face of impossibly frustrating emotional dishonesty and immaturity. It's how women relate to me and men like me that is the issue. This person was struggling to maintain some delusion of a friendship after I had been very clear about my feelings and she was already in a relationship. She was completely unable to set an emotional boundary because she was ultimately fighting with basic biological reality. She wants me around and my support and yadda yadda yadda, but never 'that way, that way, that way'. She has no proper conception of her relationship to the opposite sex, and literally invents the delusion that I'm being disrespectful or harassing her. No wonder the suffering was so incredibly bad for both people and she finally imploded, resulting in my respectful self-exile. Massive walls of societally-conditioned delusions can be the only culprit in such silliness and self-denial.

Helsing posted:

Japan isn't a model for the rest of the world and even within Japan it's very dangerous to take a contemporary trend and assume it will continue indefinitely. Societies move in strange ways and trends often reverse themselves or move in sharply new directions.

Having a none-trivial part of the population feeling profoundly alienated from society at large is a problem in many societies but there's no indication that otaku's or their equivalents are going to crowd out the rest of us. Plenty of people continue to enjoy vibrant and active social lives.

Kajeesus posted:

Nobody's accusing you of harassment based on her account. Nobody here has even heard her account, though I am sure it would be illuminating. It's pretty obvious from your own account that you are completely incapable of understanding social boundaries, dealing with rejection or having meaningful friendships.

Helsing posted:

No it doesn't. You're just trying to avoid responding to the fact that societies with high rates of marriage have suffered from worse economic conditions and worse political leadership than our society does.

quote:

Your personal anecdotes are not a substitute for having some actual evidence to support the sweeping claims you're making about society.

quote:

We have thought about it. We're giving couples, and in particular women, the ability to choose the conditions under which they reproduce, resulting in fewer unwanted children.

Stop smelling your own farts for a second and actually provide some reasons that anyone should take your warnings seriously. I dare you to come up with an argument that isn't entirely founded on very untrustworthy sounding personal anecdotes.

quote:

You clearly do not relate to women just fine.

Kajeesus posted:

Nobody's accusing you of harassment based on her account. Nobody here has even heard her account, though I am sure it would be illuminating. It's pretty obvious from your own account that you are completely incapable of understanding social boundaries, dealing with rejection or having meaningful friendships.

CowOnCrack posted:

If a woman has sex with a man she is consenting to wanting children by biological (and moral) necessity. If there are men or women who have been brainwashed to do this without wanting children, here comes the end. I'm ready.

CommieGIR posted:

Oh, you missed that thread

CowOnCrack posted:

Nobody's doing a thing. I am now doing that thing.

Gems like this breathe fire and life into my soul.

Radbot posted:

Take a subsistence farmer who owns their land and is able to relax in the off season, strip them of their property, and put them into a sweatshop. Boom, we just lifted that guy out of poverty, technically.

Miltank posted:

ProbablyPossibly?

Kajeesus posted:

Why, what happened? She show up?he

CommieGIR posted:

He made a thread where he tried to explain how what happened was not stalking while the story made it sound EXACTLY like stalking and harassment.

CowOnCrack posted:

I am not talking about economic or political considerations in my assessments. They don't concern me in the least. Pay attention.

quote:

I'm sorry you so devalue the personal experience of someone wiser than you. I admit that if you are looking for empirical evidence you can turn to someone better than me. In any case, empirical evidence forever lags behind reality and is not an absolute source of knowledge. The only absolute source of knowledge is divine revelation from God.

quote:

Who the gently caress is we? You and the brainwashed collective of automata? If a woman has sex with a man she is consenting to wanting children by biological (and moral) necessity. If there are men or women who have been brainwashed to do this without wanting children, here comes the end. I'm ready.

quote:

The fact that children could ever be 'unwanted' is horrifying. If you don't want children yet, do not have sex. We are all under a terrific delusion. Please take a poo poo all over me because I'm a man who wants a family and children and has abstained his whole life until that happens. A guy who NEEDS a family and children to be happy. But who the gently caress cares about me anymore? Obviously not horny brainwashed idiots like you. The Lord is my shepherd and he will prepare a table against those who trouble me.

quote:

You clearly do not know me or my relationships. My mother is a triple-board certified ER doctor (with a masters in public health, and a degree in tropical medicine, she always makes sure to add) with a ferocious temperament who raised me in the ways of female power. My greatest spiritual mentor in life is a female conductor from the middle east. I have seen things come too far in one direction and seek to argue them back into balance for the well being of all of us. Either you take my word about my life and my experiences or you prioritize your own biases against me. I don't care.

Helsing posted:

So when you claimed that the current generation is "taking out loans against the future generation in the form of debt on the scale of trillions of dollars through entitlements, " we aren't supposed to interpret this as an economic problem?


As the Proverb says: "Give instruction to a wise man, and he will be yet wiser."

My first instruction to you, o wise man, would be to reread Philippians 2:3-11 or Ephesians 4:2 and pray upon whether your comportment here is consistent with those passages.


A woman who intentionally takes a pill containing estrogen and progesterone so that she can prevent ovulation is clearly not consenting to children when she has sex. Ditto for condoms.


"Horny idiots"? I think you had better also read Ephesians 4:31-32 before God preps a table for you. And since you can't stop grumbling about all the wrongs done to you, perhaps also read Philippians 2:14.


This is the same mother who you feel did not want you or care for you adequately?

CowOnCrack posted:

I didn't write her emails after she told me not to contact her. That's why I wrote the essay - in order to reach out to her indirectly when she became frightened of me. This is exactly because I agreed to no email contact with her. The purpose of the essay was to end up in her hands so we could complete the semester and it worked beautifully. I'm proud of my work. She actually didn't refer to the essay as harassment and I believe her point of view of me harassing her was more or less diffused when we met with our professor together. It's just the lingering tension between us that led her supervisor to give us both that pamphlet to protect each other, but the timing and the nature of that had an enormous negative effect on me and caused me to feel betrayed by her right before my last and most important final. Later I learned there was no formal complaint, but the trauma of that experience on top of the 10 months of everything else that happened was truly loving massive and nearly broke me in half. It's a miracle I got out of that emotional warzone and I've never been closer to God in my life.


Yes it is. She admitted to me she twice that she has some kind of disorder in parsing romantic messages. It didn't fully come through the first time, but somehow admitting it to me in person and discussing her relationship to her boyfriend in person helped me get it the second time and let my feelings go. It's when she then went back on that claim and accused me of harassment that I lost my temper with her and wrote the essay to reach her indirectly. When that worked I thought everything was fine until I got a sexual harassment pamphlet which I later found out was a defensive measure by the school to protect both of us, not a formal complaint. The school apologized for the bad timing and the seeming one-sidedness in how it made me felt. That ended the issue and there's been no further developments.

You're the one willfully misinterpreting me and discarding my point of view because you're interested in bullying me and labeling me a creep. The most likely explanation is this person has legitimate difficulties in this area which is not my problem and she needs to take responsibility as best as she is able, just like I take responsibility for my 50%. Bipolar disorder has a symptom called hypersexuality actually, which can be thought of as hyperromanticism. I can get overblown romantic feelings and they can progress way too far for my own good, but that doesn't mean they don't have legitimate grounds. Combine that with whatever this girl struggles with, and you have a really unstable concoction. Like attracts like I guess. But it's a two-way street every time and you are just obsessed with defending her for some reason.

If anything you come off as an anti-feminist and misogynist. It's like you deny women have any agency or responsibility at all for understanding romantic contexts and that they are incapable of managing their own feelings. Couldn't be that she led me on willfully or without knowing or that I actually cared about her, must be that I'm a creep, lol.


I did, as soon as I sensed something was off about her. That is when she talked about problems she's had in the past that were exactly like her situation with me. I saved all the emails and included my point of view and gave it to her, the school, and eventually everyone in our singing group to defend my own reputation instead of file a complaint against her. A complaint may have gotten her fired or expelled, but I showed compassion for her and she reciprocated by not formally complaining against me. It may also be that the school protected me because they saw her disordered nature was causing me immense grief and that it was certainly two-sided. It ended up being very helpful that I did that. The gesture of giving it to her in order to help her understand my point of view was yet one more risky and compassionate did I thing to respect and understand this individual, and that's because we did have a strong friendship for nearly two years. Risking my reputation and telling her about my condition were yet two more risks that I took, and both of these things could have been used against me. I'm confident that being so forward and helpful is what clearly absolved me of any wrongdoing (other than having hurt feelings and struggling with them) and in the end allowed me to walk away from the situation with my head held high.

Can you imagine how I felt? I fall totally in love with someone in a perfectly logical progression of being friends for 1.25 years and then 10 months of confusion, and I'm left trying to chew on the answer that she's aromantic or something and either just doesn't get it or is willfully deceitful and wicked (or some conflicted combination of both, most likely). It could be autism or something like that, but she appears very high-functioning and she never admitted a clear diagnosis to me or an explanation of how exactly that diagnosis works in these situations. After sharing my condition with her, she said she is no stranger to mental illness and and it causing problems with friendships, and she mentioned having difficulty parsing romantic cues and that she invents the meaning behind words. She said mentioned though hat she wasn't willing to share her diagnosis with anyone yet, not even close friends, and still hasn't shared it with me. This is a situation that she has had with at least 2 other close friends. She admitted to me in person that she constantly gets accused of leading men on, and thus admitted partial responsibility. Because it could be a thought disorder, it's obviously extremely hard for someone like her to understand why she has to assume 'responsibility' for her condition, but the simple fact is she does.

Those other guys attacked her and blamed her for it and her relationships turned abusive, and all did was write her a sincerely motivated email of advice, and then an essay when she became frightened of me. Then I had the strength to work with her as much as I was able, despite the titanic levels of stress and my own mental health falling apart. I don't see how I could have possibly done any better for her than I did. I think it's impossible for me not to get angry at her at least somewhat, because I simply cannot truly understand her. My feelings felt totally legitimate and real, and she appears like nothing but a callous bitch just like she did to those other men. But I've made far more of an effort to understand her and took far more risks and made far more sacrifices than anyone else ever has for her because I cared for her and we had such a strong friendship. But even if she has some kind of condition or disorder, at the end of the day she must learn to take her share of what happened because she wasn't forward with me about it and it caused catastrophic damage over a period of 2 years because I had no idea she doesn't engage in romance or whatever. The fact that she had a boyfriend actually made it worse because that implies she does participate in romance - it was only later that it became clear her relationship is unusual in nature and is more of a long-term friendly partnership than a real romantic relationship.

I had idea about any of this poo poo when I was her friend for 2 years and for 10 months of that period was falling in love with her. People must take responsibility for themselves and that includes their disorders. I do think that she has become somewhat jaded and has developed the behavior of absolving herself and blaming men, and in that way is sort of an emotional predator. No matter how much I care about her and what her disorders are, doing what she did was incredibly loving hurtful to me after all I've done for her. Accusing me of harassment, after I had been nothing but a blessing in her life as a friend? It's such an enormous slap in the face it's truly my faith and spirituality that gets me through this poo poo. No man is strong enough to endure that and not plot revenge, so I put it in the hands of the Lord. I have to live with the reality that she may never forgive me after all I've done for her and even want to be my friend, simply because she cannot understand and refuses to make the effort or take a shred of the blame. It's an unfinished story, a book with pages forever not turned, a case forever not closed, and it has the potential to haunt me forever. I hope we can forgive each other some day but obviously that will take a poo poo load of time and in the meantime I will put it in God's capable hands.

She's a tragic figure, but maybe my point of view will help her someday in a future friendship. I'm just a hapless Bipolar romantic who got too heavily invested in this unusual person. It sucks, but I'll get over it and I don't care in the least what the loving internet thinks about it. I just thought I'd share it because it's a fascinating story as well as a profound learning experience that helped me understand relationships and my own beliefs and you all can take it or leave it.

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

CowOnCrack posted:

And the reason for the end of the world will be: the birth control pill.

Satan's greatest weapon! So subtle, so effective. Now no one can even remember that there are children and a future generation that we are (were, too late oops) beholden to and life isn't about their awesomeness and happiness and passion and blibbidy blah blah. Bye bye Earth. God himself will now have to invade because the sins of the world are boiling over.

Baudolino posted:

If civilization ends it will be because of a collective decison to stop breeding.

Kajeesus posted:

Why, what happened? She show up?


Your seem committed to discrediting her, as delusional, when nobody is judging you based on things she said.

You're being judged based on your description of events, which clearly paints you as in the wrong.

Helsing posted:

So when you claimed that the current generation is "taking out loans against the future generation in the form of debt on the scale of trillions of dollars through entitlements, " we aren't supposed to interpret this as an economic problem?

quote:

As the Proverb says: "Give instruction to a wise man, and he will be yet wiser."

My first instruction to you, o wise man, would be to reread Philippians 2:3-11 or Ephesians 4:2 and pray upon whether your comportment here is consistent with those passages.

quote:

A woman who intentionally takes a pill containing estrogen and progesterone so that she can prevent ovulation is clearly not consenting to children when she has sex. Ditto for condoms.

quote:

"Horny idiots"? I think you had better also read Ephesians 4:31-32 before God preps a table for you. And since you can't stop grumbling about all the wrongs done to you, perhaps also read Philippians 2:14.

quote:

This is the same mother who you feel did not want you or care for you adequately?

Rodatose posted:

probably forgetting about that green area. s'okay, lots of people do

CommieGIR posted:

FYI: Here is the human time bomb that is CowOnCrack

CowOnCrack posted:

Hey, I didn't know aromanticism was a thing. Can't blame a guy for trying with the woman of his dreams.

Here are tips for all you aromantic women out there:

1) I recommend against discussing your relationship with others, or if you do, be very mindful about what might appear to outside listeners as a problem. Things that you believe are 'cute' or easily forgivable may appear to others as warning signs. People in mature relationships do not discuss such issues with anyone but their partner, or perhaps wise council in private. Perhaps its best to not discuss it all and keep your relationship on a need to know basis.

2) I recommend being very responsible for your own needs and not leaning on the help of male friends for anything. I personally do not help anyone with any expectation of anything in return, but when help is expected from me that goes beyond what seems reasonable, even my feelings may become confused.

3) I recommend against talking about your relationship on Facebook or anything pertaining to a relationship status change. I know I'm going against the grain here, but I feel it is very unwise because you do not know how it will affect those reading. When you opted to include your boyfriend in the category of "family", this was incredibly confusing to me. My impression up to that point was that yes he was your boyfriend, but maybe there were problems. I invite you to imagine what someone might feel like if they discovered they had fallen in love with a married woman while under that impression. This is the kind of thing that might invite suicidal thinking in some people (for my part, I didn't feel that bad, but I felt very foolish, hurt, and confused.)

4) Continue to be mindful of the company you keep. By choosing to attend this music school and surrounding yourself with caring and loving people, you have insulated yourself from the kind of people who would take advantage of you. Doing what you are doing will protect you from sleaze balls and scumbags. Even still, there are plenty of men in this world in nearly every location who would not necessarily respect the integrity of your relationship. Even my brother told me I should just ask you out. Also, as long as you are not married, there are some respectful individuals who would even fall in love with you on that kind of basis if they perceived dissatisfaction. But at least if that happens, respectful individuals will seek to not make a problem for you (my case).

5) If this ever does happen to you in the future, if I were you I would be very forward about that key difference - your asexuality. Do not be afraid, embarrassed, or ashamed to discuss it. Also, do not expect the problem to resolve itself so quickly. If someone tells you how they feel, even if they are very respectful and sincere, 10-20 seconds of diplomacy is just the beginning of working through such an issue. Romantic feelings, you must understand, are extremely powerful forces for everyone on a regular basis, except certain people like yourself. They would expect at least one conversation, if not several, to go through how things happened and why they feel the way they do. What you have to understand also though is that in this sort of situation, it is very, very difficult for the person interested in you to come up and talk with you about it. They may be frightened or anxious. Fortunately, you are very kind, compassionate, and logical, and if you were very forward in addressing their concerns then that is your best chance of avoiding an ordeal.

6) It may be that you want to avoid male friends entirely, because of the potential for these issues to develop. I wouldn't necessarily be that pessimistic myself - I think if you practice mindfulness and are more forward about your differences, you will be OK. But you might consider it.

7) Consider marriage - there is a reason why married couples have a wedding band on their finger. It's a signal to everyone - "I am taken". Only the most awful human beings in the world would stoop as low as to pursue a married woman and these sorts are very rare.

CowOnCrack posted:

It is not the decisions of the mass of people that mattered for the sins of the previous generation. Instead is the prevailing attitude of the powerful and the influence of their ideas that was devastating. It was their choices that suppressed and doomed us all.

CowOnCrack posted:

My mother is a triple-board certified ER doctor (with a masters in public health, and a degree in tropical medicine, she always makes sure to add) with a ferocious temperament who raised me in the ways of female power.

Rodatose posted:

Darkrenown posted:

That your mother is a doctor makes your story from the previous thread about her not taking meds for being super depressed, making you poorly cooked meals that give you food poisoning, and getting mad at you if you mentioned her unsafe cooking to her all the more horrifying.

CowOnCrack posted:

I'm in the process of trying to escape my broken family life at all costs. I realize now through a series of painful experiences that its completely up to me. Oh, and also my church has been super cool for the most part.

Baudolino posted:

But a spiritual cancer from within, now that could very well end us. It`s not even about the sex or reproduction it`s all about the lack of a higher purpose which encourages nihilistic hedonism in the first world at the expense of everyone else. As long we invent som new bullshit to imbue our lifes with fake meaning we will be fine.

Kajeesus posted:

COC, I have only one question for you. DId the lady in question ever claim to have sent you intentional romantic signals? Did she ever, verbally, communicate any kind of interest? I know explicit statements are only 7% of communication or whatever, but I'm curious.

CowOnCrack posted:

Moral problem. Paying for luxuries now with money from your children's pockets is a massive moral catastrophe.

quote:

Thank you for referring to the Word of God in rebuking me. I should deal with you in a more humble manner, but I'm constantly assaulted for sharing my personal experiences. I come to view this entire internet board as threatening and that risks treating everyone in a similar manner - as they've treated me.

quote:

My argument is that this habit of children avoidance is incredibly harmful from a moral point of view. I am arguing that what I said before is a moral necessity. I don't disagree with this argument, I disagree with the woman's choice. She should not have sex at all. All sex outside of marriage is an abomination.

"Marriage is to be held in honor among all, and the marriage bed is to be undefiled, for fornicators and adulterers God will judge."
-Hebrews 14:4

quote:

Such tools have created an attitude of fornication. The reason why fornication is a sin is because it is sex without the context of marriage and children. Such a thing debases us because this is the entire purpose of sex. It risks changing our attitudes about everything in ways that I don't think I could fully comprehend even if I devoted a lifetime to study. However, I wouldn't need to do this to know it is wrong. That is because the Word of God is authoritative.

quote:

Let me attempt to construct an argument. Why do we do what we do in life? Is it for ourselves? For the entirety of humanity until the 20th century, the answer was our families as children and our own families as adults. That is now changing. We have had now one full generation in the developed world that has lived for themselves and the results have practically doomed us. I see this as the result of succumbing to lust and abandoning our reproductive duties. Without our own family to love us and keep us grounded and accountable, we can so easily become monsters (both men and women.) Without our own family, we are working towards ends that are like to be foolish and unwise because we are accountable only to ourselves (or to God). This is the only fair alternative - to be celibate and live for God. That way one can devote your life to providing wisdom for God's people.

The selfish unbeliever who does not know a family is a sure force for destruction and misery.

quote:

It's good to know I'm speaking with another Biblical literalist. I've never met another one on here. Speaking from one man of God to another is a totally different experience than a hostile generation of pagans. As long as we refer to the Word of God as our center I can stay level with you. This doesn't mean I won't be passionate. I'd rather be passionate than lukewarm.


Yes. She cared more about her marriage and work life than me. Although to her credit, she is a Christian and a believer, and therefore was far better off than most at doing the right thing. She was my first spiritual mentor. She however was incapable of disciplining us and also, mothers are incapable of a certain kind of discipline. My father was and still is an unbeliever. He did not discipline his children and it led to their ruin. Grace without Truth annihilates children. The Lord is now my shepherd.

"Whoever spares the rod hates his son, but he who loves him is diligent to discipline him."
-Proverbs 13:24