Making Comics: Howling into the void three times a week.

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > Creative Convention > Making Comics: Howling into the void three times a week.

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

That lighting is so lovely.

# ¿ May 25, 2015 13:17

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# ¿ Apr 30, 2024 06:33

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Remember that whole idea that somehow people would figure out a way to monetize internet content into a living wage?
Yeah didn't happen

# ¿ May 27, 2015 21:15

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Finally watched Stripped yesterday. It was a real shock to the system for me, in a good way. For the last few years I've been kind of frustrated and confused about how I want to make comics. I don't relate to most comic books--I've never been into the superhero/mainstream comics, but I also have liked very few of the indie graphic novels I've read, even when they're unimaginably beautiful. Even when I know they're good, they don't typically "hit me where I live."

I don't know why, but I'm just a comic strip person. I can read someone's graphic novel that is a masterwork of layout, color, story, whatever -- and it won't give me as much of a warm fuzzy feeling as a dumb stupid four-panel Peanuts comic from 1962. When I did my last comic, I spent a while thinking that it would be a vertical-format graphic novel type comic, because the story was self-contained and scripted from the beginning. But after about 15 pages or so, I realized I needed to switch it to horizontal Sunday comic layout, because that's just the format I relate to. The webcomics I like most are the ones that have the newspaper strip model.

Maybe it's stupid but it helps me to sort through the different branches of the medium. It explained for me why I've had such awful writer's block this past year: I'd been trying to write for a genre that I don't really connect with. Then this morning I revisited a strip that I started in high school and wrote 3 weeks worth of material for rebooting it. :unsmith:

# ¿ May 31, 2015 15:51

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Here's the first page of the thing I've been working on. I'm planning to put it up tomorrow.

# ¿ Jun 6, 2015 23:04

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

The site's up now: http://www.atthezoocomic.com

# ¿ Jun 8, 2015 17:24

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

That smells of spec work. It's sort of a gray area because webcomic artists routinely give away their work online anyway, but it's still "SUBMIT FOR CONTEST! $$$" and that kind of poo poo is most frequently predatory and awful.

# ¿ Jun 9, 2015 18:10

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Junko posted:

LINE's last winner seems really excited about the webtoon format. Hopefully he gets around to writing that essay as to why. I heard that the webcomics/webtoons ecosystem is different in Korea, where LINE's stuff is based, and that there are films and tv series based off some webtoons.

That is encouraging. Typically the idea of an "art contest" sets off alarm bells to me, but as long as people are already creating the work, I guess it's good for them to have a place to submit it for wider recognition. :shrug:

# ¿ Jun 10, 2015 17:02

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

I haven't been keeping up too much on some of this stuff -- are there online communities or other places where it would be appropriate to promote my new comic? For my last one I did Project Wonderful ads and got a fair amount of traffic that way from other comics. However that was 3-4 years ago, and I think there might be more adblocking now than there was back then on average.

I self-host the comic and have a dedicated Tumblr where I post each strip with relevant tags. Is there anything in the social-media-verse that I should be aware of?

# ¿ Jul 5, 2015 15:36

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

GreatJob posted:

Tweeter

John Liver posted:

Twooter

Hmm, OK. I have a Twitter for my artwork and such and I've been tweeting the comics as they are posted. What is the protocol for the #webcomicchat hashtag? Do I tag comic posts with that on a particular day? I don't want to spam people but I don't want to miss out on an appropriate opportunity.

# ¿ Jul 5, 2015 21:15

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

FactsAreUseless posted:

Hand-lettering is awesome, hand-letter every day. And only color in watercolors. And don't put your comic on the internet. And actually just go be an art teacher in Ohio.

This but serious.

Not everyone agrees with this dogma, but please hand-letter your comics. Fonts suck. They never kern right and they always look crappy. If you work digitally, you can use type as a guide to help you keep your lettering neat.

# ¿ Jul 7, 2015 14:02

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

edit: Content. This page is going up tomorrow morning--

neonnoodle fucked around with this message at 22:59 on Jul 11, 2015

# ¿ Jul 11, 2015 19:51

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Doctor_Fruitbat posted:

Make a fursona, obviously.

# ¿ Jul 12, 2015 20:24

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Yes to InDesign. You can probably get by with an older version like CS4 or even CS2, which is downloadable as a kind of grey-market legacyware.

# ¿ Aug 6, 2015 13:24

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Tapastic doesn't seem to like my comic because it's horizontal and not vertical.

# ¿ Aug 14, 2015 16:34

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Kruxy posted:

What's the learning curve on a wacom? Like how long does it take before you don't feel like a stupid scrawling baby with poo poo motor skills.

I have this super old second-hand Intuos GD wacom, and while it works just fine, it's frustrating as hell to actually draw on cause my hand doesn't go where I want it to go. I can rough out body forms just fine, but the moment I start inking, I can't follow the lines that are there.

While I could do everything in traditional media with pencils and inking and be much happier with the result, I don't have any way to scan in 14x17 inch bristol board and everyone wants digital anyway.

How long did it take before you all felt comfortable drawing on a tablet.

Over 10 years and I still don't :smith:

I've gone back to doing most of everything in traditional media and scanning.

# ¿ Aug 24, 2015 21:25

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

I have MS5 standard and it's stuttering and freezing a lot for me on Windows 10. This happens even when I'm working on a horizontal four-panel comic strip with a single layer. :confused:

# ¿ Sep 25, 2015 14:51

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Cool, I'll give that a try. Thanks!

# ¿ Sep 25, 2015 17:56

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

idonotlikepeas posted:

I went to that yesterday, and I have to second that; it was a lot of fun. Got a nice signed Octopus Pie collection out of it, too.

All of the above including signed Octopus Pie. I tabled there a few years ago and will table there next year when my year 1 collection is done...

# ¿ Oct 18, 2015 22:08

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

# ¿ Oct 19, 2015 02:37

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

EMU

neonnoodle fucked around with this message at 14:18 on Oct 26, 2015

# ¿ Oct 24, 2015 23:14

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

GreatJob posted:

There's something kinda personal and anectodal about this comic. It seems like a real zookeeper's experience.

Thanks. I'm getting a lot of followers who identify themselves on their Tumblr profiles as zookeepers, zookeepers in training, veterinarians/vet techs, etc. So I guess they see something in it they relate to. It's a nice feeling.

# ¿ Oct 26, 2015 14:19

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Oh my god. Those are wonderful.

# ¿ Nov 4, 2015 19:54

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

It's a somewhat esoteric viewpoint, but I think Lynda Barry's comics curriculum is really good for getting from zero to something. Draftsmanship isn't really discussed, it's more about writing from an authentic personal voice and learning how to translate that into panels. Some of the work that comes out of her class is refreshingly sincere.

# ¿ Nov 17, 2015 13:19

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Also not specific to comics, but Composition by Arthur Wesley Dow is a life-changing book. It's short, it's great, it's in the public domain. :thumbsup:

# ¿ Jan 1, 2016 14:50

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

One thing I did in coloring my comic was to load a golden-age CMYK swatch set into MS5 and use that limited palette, plus spot black. No screentones. The limitation makes for some interesting and helpful constraints that keep the colors somewhat harmonious and also keeps me from spending a zillion hours on tweaking colors.

# ¿ Jan 6, 2016 22:57

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Subscribed.

# ¿ Jan 17, 2016 12:47

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Scribblehatch posted:

I've used Project Wonderful twice now.

I'm beginning to rule it out.

Thousands of unique views can result in 8 clicks total.

With google ads as I know it, you pay a dime for each click. And that may actually be more economical.

Same here, I've given up on it. It made sense in the pre-adblock days, but lately I figure that most of the target audience for webcomics is more likely to have an adblocker installed. In 2011 the first time I did PW ads, I got a ton of traffic from them. I set up a nearly identical campaign for my new comic and got bupkes. Facebook ads weren't much better. I wouldn't trust any major ad provider because everything I've seen and read suggests that click fraud is rampant.

I'm pretty sure that ITYOOL 2016, the only way you get randos to read your comic is by way of direct shares on social media platforms, either through tagging or by referrals/shoutouts from people with tons of followers.

# ¿ Jan 17, 2016 18:42

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Scribblehatch posted:

Youtube adblock, I fully understand. I use it myself. That poo poo saves you time in your life. But innocuous little banners? I don't get it. D: Even my editor has it. I would not have found my EDITOR, someone who loves the comic, by casting out a net. How bleak!

Shout outs and word of mouth seems like an extreme matter of luck. Because nevermind how randos find you; How did those busy creators find you? People who made it this far by using Project Wonderful, have no idea what to tell this newer fold. This problem, sure only to get worse, is no person's fault. But you also can't force camaraderie. So what's to be done?

I think... there need to be more reviewers? I dunno, that'd be a good start. Maybe.

I use an ad-blocker because without it I can barely do anything on the internet. For one thing, you could approach someone on a site and ask them to host an ad for you for a $/time agreement instead of CPC. This used to be the way it worked before all the awful targeted ads and ad network poo poo. I'm hearing a lot of people online urging more sites to revert to self-hosted ads. Those will typically not be caught up in adblockers, but you have to look around to find good sites to host you.

You're right that word of mouth is a game of luck. It's also a game of networking and a delicate balance between self-promotion and not being obnoxious. I'm not saying it's a solved problem or that it's fair. It's the same issue in every single form of media -- the people who got big in the past (regardless of timescales) always had it easier than the newer generation. The field gets crowded and what you have to do to get noticed gets trickier. There are no guarantees. Unfortunately I'm fairly convinced that these days we all have to just work diligently without any expectation or assumption that anyone besides a few friends or fans will ever care one iota. Do it for yourself and no one else, or do it for a friend or family member who reads and likes what you do. poo poo does happen and some people do get "discovered," it's true, but some people also win the lottery.

# ¿ Jan 17, 2016 19:50

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

RasterPunk posted:

stuff

There is a whole Internet out there of original webcomics that have rabid fan followings and are completely original. Complaining that you are somehow compelled to make fanart or memes to get noticed is like the comics equivalent of complaining that women only want to date macho assholes.

You don't have to make fanart. You just have to make comics that blow people's minds. It's an extremely competitive landscape for attention. The cultural marketplace has become globalized. Back in the 20th century, it was possible for a middling cartoonist to make a pretty nice living by making a Mutt & Jeff knockoff for a town newspaper. In the age of the Internet, that is no longer an option. The options are:

be loving amazing by truly world-class standards. Examples: Lackadaisy or Power Nap.
tap into an existing subculture or fandom that has not been served already. In the early days it was gamer culture with Penny Arcade, PvP, etc. Now that market segment is tapped out. You could make an argument that Hark A Vagrant! is for liberal arts people, and xkcd and Saturday Morning Breakfast Cereal for math/sciencey people.
make something uniquely charming. This is the place where you have the widest berth. It's also the place where skill matters the least. For example, Dinosaur Comics, Hyperbole and a Half, A Softer World. None of these are conventionally "good" in terms of art. But they have a certain something that people like. Sometimes that's just being really personal and sincere.
work hard and get better gradually and slowly accumulate fans over the course of at least a decade. Examples include Questionable Content (which I hate but is worth using as an example here), KC Green's stuff, Gunnerkrigg Court, all the stuff that Spike/Iron Circus have put out. A.K.A., paying your dues.

Don't publish your work and solicit feedback on it in the same place. Find a venue for critiques and workshop it there before/during/after you publish. But if nobody gives you feedback/critiques, the strong likelihood is that you haven't done anything that is distinctive enough for people to want to take the time and energy to help you push it one step further. It takes energy and work to help someone out with feedback. There's probably been enough RPG-ish comic creation in the last 15 years to last the world 100 lifetimes. If your work in a style/genre/subject matter that's already had a ton of great work, what does yours bring to the table? What makes it interesting?

You ask, How am I supposed to know if my work is good or bad if it doesn't even exist? The answer is that you have to learn how to evaluate your own work. You cannot be dependent on others to hold your hand through the process of growing as an artist. It can be helpful to get a good critique. Sometimes someone will point out something you didn't notice or suggest something helpful. But the bulk of the work is going to be done by you getting really brutally honest with yourself about how your work measures up with the stuff you consider to be your "role models."

neonnoodle fucked around with this message at 20:19 on Jan 21, 2016

# ¿ Jan 21, 2016 20:17

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Is it tanglefoot? Cause I love that poo poo and I don't think I will ever care if it launches.

# ¿ Jan 23, 2016 21:32

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

These are loving great and you should feel great

# ¿ Feb 10, 2016 01:30

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

smallmouth posted:

Does anyone do their inking in Illustrator?

The comic Decrypting Rita is done entirely in Illustrator, I believe. The creator doesn't post here but I kinda wish she did and she's super friendly if you email her.

# ¿ Feb 15, 2016 02:13

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

kefkafloyd posted:

But even the most famous renaissance artists did bible fan art to make ends meet.

loving LOL. I'm stealing that, thanks.

MICE is kind of fanart heavy and I find the audience skews kind of young. That's fine by me because I do very kid-friendly work, but I can imagine it being less comfortable for edgier cartoonists. Then again, it's also a very queer-friendly con also, so :iiam:

.

By contrast the Rhode Island indie comic con I went to last year was amazing, it was all artsy RISD folk with much more mature work.

# ¿ Feb 18, 2016 03:46

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

My comic is the featured debut on GoComics.com today! :dance:

EDIT: http://www.gocomics.com/at-the-zoo

And a shoutout to forums poster Mister Beeg for giving me some advice about submitting to them.

neonnoodle fucked around with this message at 14:20 on Mar 21, 2016

# ¿ Mar 21, 2016 14:05

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Avshalom where have you been with this poo poo? Seriously if you posted this stuff one tenth of the time that you drunkposted you would be QUEEN OF THREAD.

# ¿ Apr 7, 2016 14:03

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Space-Bird posted:

This owns. Thank you for bringing it to our attention.

# ¿ Jun 8, 2016 18:50

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

If you want help setting up your stuff for print, I will volunteer for this project. Please PM me or email me at sa.neonnoodle@gmail.com if you're interested.

# ¿ Jun 15, 2016 03:36

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Also look up Frank Santoro's comics composition notebook and blog posts. There's some strong examples of grid-based comic page design based on rectangular armatures, similar to the approaches used by artists during the Renaissance.

# ¿ Jun 18, 2016 19:26

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# ¿ Apr 30, 2024 06:33

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Even with a very high DPI, a big determinant of scan quality has to do with the CCD/optics of the scanner. My scanner can scan at a very high DPI, but it still blows out the higher value ranges.

# ¿ Sep 2, 2016 13:53

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