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Buttmeister posted:I typed up a long post but then I lost it, here's the condensed version of it:
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Jun 13, 2015 20:32
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Alright, you two saying that has motivated me to do it. I know it doesn't seem like much, but I am out of work (and not in a bad way) with nothing to do half the drat time. I should also mention I am a perfectionist (and not in a good way) with my code. Expect to see things break because I think its right. Expect to see me fix said things in inexplicable manors that even i cant explain. I am shooting for a playable build by the end of next month. Don't mark my words.
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Jun 13, 2015 20:46
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Buttmeister posted:Don't mark my words. Too late bud, ya got a month.
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Jun 13, 2015 20:52
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Buttmeister posted:Alright, you two saying that has motivated me to do it. I know it doesn't seem like much, but I am out of work (and not in a bad way) with nothing to do half the drat time. I should also mention I am a perfectionist (and not in a good way) with my code. Expect to see things break because I think its right. Expect to see me fix said things in inexplicable manors that even i cant explain. I am shooting for a playable build by the end of next month. Don't mark my words. How much of a reproduction will it be, are we talking different clothes for different jobs, the whole hog? You really could have something here on a DayZ to Arma level if you are planning on really going deep with the faithfulness to the original. I know many have been hankering for a 3d SS13 and this engine is actually perfect for it (block based vs tile based, detailed destructions, etc). Does the engine support decals? Definitely going to need poo.
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Jun 13, 2015 22:08
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Do the thing and I'd definitely give it a shot because it sounds fun.
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Jun 13, 2015 22:12
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I hope that the planet surfaces aren't shallow, I really want to go get my planet cracking on. Nothing can go wrong with this!
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Jun 13, 2015 23:21
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Justin Tyme posted:How much of a reproduction will it be, are we talking different clothes for different jobs, the whole hog? You really could have something here on a DayZ to Arma level if you are planning on really going deep with the faithfulness to the original. I know many have been hankering for a 3d SS13 and this engine is actually perfect for it (block based vs tile based, detailed destructions, etc). The engine is so perfect it even has the required awful netcode! Really hope the devs get on that, it's holding back the game's potential a lot. SS13 mod is going to be so great
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Jun 13, 2015 23:49
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Buttmeister posted:I typed up a long post but then I lost it, here's the condensed version of it: Advice for not being Flowerchild: don't layer your mod in contempt for the original devs and deliberately break compatibility with other popular mods. Advice for not being Greg: don't constantly "balance" the game by making things take hours longer to make. Advice for making an SS13 mod: send Literally Kermit a PM, he and a couple other goons have been working on a SS13 map and accompanying mods. Team up and get this sucker ready. 
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Jun 13, 2015 23:53
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BillyJoeBob posted:I hope that the planet surfaces aren't shallow, I really want to go get my planet cracking on. I doubt they will be, just because people are gonna mine the poo poo out of them just to try and build underground bases. Splode wanted to know about my ship designs, and I'm trying to make something a size smaller (ie; not quite so laggy) than the Avalon so I took some pictures as I went.  The basic important parts are laid out and connected (hangar, thrusters, gravity cannon). I'll generally fudge the rest of the interior as I go.   A quick bit of measuring plugged into a pixel circle generator gives the frame.   Then you just take the width of each segment and generate a circle of that for the outer layer. I'm not happy with the way the front turned out, so I'll probably raise it and flatten it a little like the Avalon's. Once I've got it right I'll go round under the hull and slap a second inner-layer of armor around it. Moddington posted:Advice for not being Flowerchild: don't layer your mod in contempt for the original devs and deliberately break compatibility with other popular mods. Yeah, Kermit's gonna lose his goddamn mind at this  .
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Jun 14, 2015 03:46
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Neddy Seagoon posted:I doubt they will be, just because people are gonna mine the poo poo out of them just to try and build underground bases. It's weird that when I try using 2:1 and 3:1 slope blocks it looks awful compared to what you're doing there with just 1:1 slope blocks.
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Jun 14, 2015 04:46
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Spookydonut posted:It's weird that when I try using 2:1 and 3:1 slope blocks it looks awful compared to what you're doing there with just 1:1 slope blocks. It's probably possible to do it with the 2:1 blocks, but I can't make anything circular look decent with them either.  I was considering moving the the cannon up a bit, but it turned out looking fine.    With a bit of paint and more than a few guns you have the exterior of your submarine-esque starship.
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Jun 14, 2015 09:46
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Cool! Thanks for that, good to see your process.
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Jun 14, 2015 13:33
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Job system is (kinda) done! So far I have roles and set spawns in a static world for Engineers with a certain loadout/inventory and Miners with a certain loadout/inventory! They just kinda...plop down in the world and there isn't really anything stopping from doing the others job. I'm going to try and see if I can set ones action speed in, say for example Mining, to .5 and the others to 1.5 (purely for proof of concept, nothings final so don't bitch at me about balance). Any suggestions on how to make power generation more than just "take uranium, put uranium in magical nuclear generator"?
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Jun 15, 2015 21:41
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Heat and radioactive waste comes to mind. How does SS13 handle it?
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Jun 15, 2015 21:52
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If rotors weren't prone to random explosions on multiplayer I'd say make whatever generator you use into a gigantic spinning monstrosity. Hell if its a ss13 map use them anyway. Think the gravity drive from event horizon but with random thrusters firing off jets of flame into the air. Use a script so you can't use any reactors if the spinning ball of firey death stops moving. Emergency batteries and solar only without it.
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Jun 15, 2015 22:44
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HardDisk posted:Heat and radioactive waste comes to mind. How does SS13 handle it? Currently, the station powers itself through a thermal differential engine. You have two loops, hot and cold, with the actual generator in between. Hot loop has a combustion chamber, and cold loop is open to space(yes, everyone knows that's an unrealistic model for cooling pipes, but frankly there's nothing in game that would make more sense). The way it works is you put gas into each of the loops, pump gas into the combustion chamber and start a fire. The hot loop heats up and the cold loop cools down, and temperature and pressure differential is what causes the turbine in the middle to spin and generate power. If you want easy mode, there's also some furnaces attached to the hot loop. Shove coal/weed/living screaming assistants into the furnaces and light them to raise the hot loop temperature to a modest, safe level and use that for a much more controlled burn. Where it gets complicated is that there's a few different gases that can be used in both loops. Plasma is by far the most thermally conductive, but it also expands and contracts the most, and in the presence of oxygen and heat, will ignite. CO2 and... I think N2O are also present and will work, but are really far less efficient/safer in every area. I mention pressure, because as we know, hot gasses expand, and cold gasses contract. For the most efficient engine, not only must the temperatures between the loops be as vastly different as possible, the pressures must be relatively equal. Too much pressure, and the pipes burst. Too little, and nothing flows through the pipes. This can lead to some interesting juggling, where you have to vent the hot loop constantly and inject gas into the cold loop to keep things moving along. In the newer maps, we're supposed to be getting some kind of weird laser-fusion-sort-of thing that I have no idea how it works. For the purposes of this mod though, you'd probably be best off tracking the type of gas in each loop, the temperature, and the pressure. Set up the engine more like a nuclear reactor. Make the combustion chamber into a heat vessel, with uranium to heat the hot loop, and water to keep it from overheating and bursting the pipes. mod in plasma gas(or use oxygen. "Plasma" in ss13 is just a magical science gas that's very volatile), add in a UI to inject exact amount of it into modded in pipes. Cold loop could still run to space. Use existing battery backups to start hot/cold loop gas pumps, which circulate the gas at various speeds through the pipes, and bingo: working engine with ability to overheat and go boom. Bonus points if you mod in engine sentience beyond certain power levels and special effects that a grumpy engine will do. neogeo0823 fucked around with this message at 02:08 on Jun 16, 2015 |
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Jun 16, 2015 02:05
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Splode posted:Cool! Thanks for that, good to see your process.  Here, go blow something up.  Buttmeister posted:Job system is (kinda) done! So far I have roles and set spawns in a static world for Engineers with a certain loadout/inventory and Miners with a certain loadout/inventory! They just kinda...plop down in the world and there isn't really anything stopping from doing the others job. I'm going to try and see if I can set ones action speed in, say for example Mining, to .5 and the others to 1.5 (purely for proof of concept, nothings final so don't bitch at me about balance). Any suggestions on how to make power generation more than just "take uranium, put uranium in magical nuclear generator"? I wouldn't bother about classes or balance like that. SS13 certainly doesn't, and nothing stops people from doing other jobs. It's a lot better for it, really. Something you might want to check out, if you haven't already, is Sektan's Spawn Points.
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Jun 16, 2015 15:42
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Neddy Seagoon posted:
Yeah part of the fun in ss13 is having to do somebody else's job for them, and neglecting to do your own as a result. Classes only really affect access and starting gear, both of which go out the window after five minutes of game time.
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Jun 17, 2015 02:54
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Patch Time!quote:Summary I want to quote two of the best bits from that, because holy poo poo. quote:This is always a question of FUN vs REALITY. I can imagine that many players would like to have real life-sized planets, but for the sake of gameplay, time, and engine possibilities we decided to use a 30-50 km diameter for planets and an 8-10 km diameter for moons. Yes, some generated planets could have 0-3 moons accompanying them. quote:To simulate the day and night cycles we decided to rotate the sun around the planets/ world. The user will be able to configure the day duration from 1 minute to 24 hours or disable the rotation to keep the current static sun. Live out your Kerbal dreams .Neddy Seagoon fucked around with this message at 03:41 on Jun 19, 2015 |
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Jun 19, 2015 03:36
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And we have a special treat for you today - a blog post by Dusan Andras, the man behind the planets:
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if i cant carve a chunk of that moon off and send it hurtling into someone's
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Jun 19, 2015 05:58
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If we get the ability drop parts or whole moons onto planets then we're going to need a copy of the Majora's Mask moon in the workshop and make it all the better.
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Jun 19, 2015 06:56
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bitcoin bastard posted:if i cant carve a chunk of that moon off and send it hurtling into someone's Pretty sure they'll be stationary like asteroids  . Besides, why break off a chunk when you can de-orbit the whole goddamn moon?
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Jun 19, 2015 07:28
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Yeah I doubt planets and moons will actually move. Also to deorbit a chunk of moon would take stupid amounts of thrust/energy. I'm interested to know how the gravity will affect ships, will you be able to orbit? Also what happens when gravity tries to accelerate you beyond ship speed limits?
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Jun 19, 2015 08:37
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I've updated my corvette a bit. I can't guarantee it's 100% because I'm half asleep and have probably forgotten to set something or other up, but it's here as a world file since I'm too lazy to figure out which mods it requires and set them up on its Workshop page. I'm living out of one in a survival world at the moment so that's something, I guess.
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Jun 19, 2015 12:08
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Spookydonut posted:Yeah I doubt planets and moons will actually move. Also to deorbit a chunk of moon would take stupid amounts of thrust/energy. I'm interested to know how the gravity will affect ships, will you be able to orbit? I presume that's why the sun will be orbiting around the planets and not the other way around - giving the impression of a day/night cycle by moving the light source around rather than having to calculate the orbits of the planets themselves.
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Jun 19, 2015 12:29
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rossmum posted:I've updated my corvette a bit. I can't guarantee it's 100% because I'm half asleep and have probably forgotten to set something or other up, but it's here as a world file since I'm too lazy to figure out which mods it requires and set them up on its Workshop page. I'm living out of one in a survival world at the moment so that's something, I guess. Adding it to the Goon Creations list, just because it needs more entries. Also a hotfix dropped earlier; quote:EDIT 06/19/2015:
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Jun 19, 2015 17:12
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After several false starts at a new design of my own, I've gone back to my half-baked project of converting GotLag's exploration ships into a destroyer. This time I actually chopped them together to make the ship slightly larger, and totally gutted the interior to give myself room to work with. It's turning out pretty well so far, just needs some finishing touches (and some real punch, to make it worth of the title).
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Jun 20, 2015 16:05
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Drake_263 posted:I presume that's why the sun will be orbiting around the planets and not the other way around - giving the impression of a day/night cycle by moving the light source around rather than having to calculate the orbits of the planets themselves. I'd say that's more simulation of planet rotation for a day/night cycle, orbital path doesn't determine that.
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Jun 20, 2015 20:34
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So, if a dedicated survival server is having spasms where FPS is dropping to single digits, objects occasionally go flying across space with the lightest of bumps (only to a second or two later, return to where they were), and your inability to grind/weld anything in the game world, followed by a very large perceived delay when trying to interact with objects, is it a mod problem or something? Me and some buddies run such a server, and while going through it at first, we thought the problem was solar arrays, updating... whatever they do every five seconds or so and consequently, sending some pretty enormous packets to the server en-masse. When we turned off solar concentrators and took down all the solar arrays, the problem seemed to get better... only to get aggravated later after I disabled and brought in a Military Transporter to near our base. I can't really give any details, because I'm not the server owner. But everyone who plays on it seems to have this idea that maybe the server is "corrupted" or something, which seems a little silly to me since it will still boot up and we can still fly around on it and stuff, but there's just something in there causing some insane lag. If we could figure out what's causing said lag, we could remove it and everything would be better! I think. Are there any problematic mods that we, on a survival server, should absolutely not run? We didn't have anything special loaded; some of the biggest ones I can think of were XL and Azimuth(?) thrusters, and the mega small block pack. Will building very large ships cause problems with servers? Is there some sort of tool or mod that makes multiplayer better, or at *least* gives you a bit more data on what everything is doing in the server? Thank you. PS: It is almost assuredly not a server box problem: the server runs on a dedicated rig that, from what I understand, has a good internet connection with great upstream, is very well-cooled and runs *only* this single dedicated server. Last time I asked about it, the administrator said the server was absolutely fine in all regards, but a single core was working a lot harder than the other ones, because apparently Space Engineers does not support multicores. OSad fucked around with this message at 23:45 on Jun 20, 2015 |
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Jun 20, 2015 23:41
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Spookydonut posted:I'd say that's more simulation of planet rotation for a day/night cycle, orbital path doesn't determine that. Pretty much exactly what I was going for, I'm just pants at explaining things. Bottom line being that as cool as it'd be for planets and moons to orbit eachother 'realistically', the thought of Keen's netcode moving around whole freaking planets makes me twitch.
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Jun 21, 2015 01:55
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Drake_263 posted:Pretty much exactly what I was going for, I'm just pants at explaining things. Bottom line being that as cool as it'd be for planets and moons to orbit eachother 'realistically', the thought of Keen's netcode moving around whole freaking planets makes me twitch. Good news! Programmable waypoints means that you can make it happen yourself by building a Death Star and telling it to circle the planet of your choice! I don't even want to think about the sort of lag a ship that size would create 
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Jun 21, 2015 02:04
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OSad posted:So, if a dedicated survival server is having spasms where FPS is dropping to single digits, objects occasionally go flying across space with the lightest of bumps (only to a second or two later, return to where they were), and your inability to grind/weld anything in the game world, followed by a very large perceived delay when trying to interact with objects, is it a mod problem or something? Doubleposting, but the main issue is that Space Engineers is far from optimized; there're memory leaks, the netcode was coded by a drunken Belarussian monkey and is being held together with baling wire and hopeful thinking, and that's not factoring in high-load sectors - as you build or bring in more ships and stations into a given area, the zone gets heavier for the server and the players' computers to process. Basically what's happening is that the combined load of memory leaks taking up more and more processing power from the computers involved and your general area getting more resource-intensive, things are getting slower to process. Coupled with network lag, it's easy for items to end up in a desynced state where you have two computers trying to convince the server that a given object is in two different spots, compounded by the server probably placing it somewhere else. The game can't figure out where the ship should really be and it ends up twitching and flickering between states until the physics engine glitches and launches the offending object into a more or less random direction (and then one of the computers goes 'hey, that should be here', and it reappears where it started..). Also, when the server's loaded enough, it starts slowing down physics calculations to try and keep stuff from exploding, which makes everything slow down to a crawl. In your case, you took out the solar arrays and that brought down server load just enough to make the lag more tolerable - then you added in the cargo ship you captured and that was more load in your area. If you move away (say, 10, 20km away) from your base you'll notice things speed up as the things you left behind get stored instead of being actively loaded in your reality bubble. And yes, things aren't helped at all by SE not supporting multicore processors. Anyhow, besides waiting for Keen to get an actually functioning build of the netcode out, there's little you can do besides keep your area clean and 'simple' - grinding up or moving unused ships further away, for example, and simplifying your designs. Mobile ships use up more computing power than immobile stations, and simple armor blocks use up less computing power than blocks that actually -do- something. Unfinished blocks take up more processing power than finished blocks (mostly because there's no display culling and scaffolds have more triangles than simple cubes) so finishing up any projects can make things easier for you. The server settings also have the 'number of floating objects' and 'automatic cleanup' toggles for performance - the former limits the amount of floating pickupable objects (like floating chunks of ore and components) that can be in existence at a time, the other makes 'garbage' like severed blocks and simple wreckages disappear if there aren't any players around them for a while. Rebooting the server regularly can also help - like I said, there are memory leaks, and if you're got a 24/7 dedicated server running, it's going to end up taking shitloads of resources just to handle the 'trash data' left by the memory leaks. Rebooting will clear up the crud from your RAM and give you a little performance boost, at least until the leaks compound again.
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Jun 21, 2015 02:11
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Drake_263 posted:Anyhow, besides waiting for Keen to get an actually functioning build of the netcode out, there's little you can do besides keep your area clean and 'simple' - grinding up or moving unused ships further away, for example, and simplifying your designs. Mobile ships use up more computing power than immobile stations, and simple armor blocks use up less computing power than blocks that actually -do- something. Unfinished blocks take up more processing power than finished blocks (mostly because there's no display culling and scaffolds have more triangles than simple cubes) so finishing up any projects can make things easier for you. The server settings also have the 'number of floating objects' and 'automatic cleanup' toggles for performance - the former limits the amount of floating pickupable objects (like floating chunks of ore and components) that can be in existence at a time, the other makes 'garbage' like severed blocks and simple wreckages disappear if there aren't any players around them for a while. I see. Thank you very much. Last time I checked, we did have quite a few captured NPC ships just sitting there waiting to be deconned, right next to our little construction area next to some unfinished ships. Might be worth it to move those to their own little dedicated scrapyard 10 kilometers out or so.
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Jun 21, 2015 02:50
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Another thing that helps Dedicated Servers a LOT is either a) lowering the number of Floating Objects allowed (it's like the 4th or 5th entry on the right hand side of the DS startup menu) or b) Using SEToolbox (which is free and updates regularly, btw) to manually remove all the Floating objects from the server from time to time. My friends and I have been running a DS since about October, and the sim speed (Shift+F11) usually hovers somewhere around .8 while we're playing, but once there are many Floating objects present, it bogs down to .5 or so. But like Drake said above, we're eagerly anticipating an update to the Multiplayer code, since it's pretty terrible at the moment.
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Jun 21, 2015 04:15
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Finally gotten off my rear end to try and make a proper starfighter and not just bigass capital ships.    It's a modular starfighter, using the Avalon's manufacturer welders to mount pods using internal projectors. Once it's done with them, just drop'em in the dismantler. I've only made the two pods so far, but the rest'll probably be just more weapons and an FTL pod for long-range flight. Also going to try and make a set of cosmetic mountable wings just for flying over planets in style.
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Jun 21, 2015 04:34
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rossmum posted:After several false starts at a new design of my own, I've gone back to my half-baked project of converting GotLag's exploration ships into a destroyer. This time I actually chopped them together to make the ship slightly larger, and totally gutted the interior to give myself room to work with. It's turning out pretty well so far, just needs some finishing touches (and some real punch, to make it worth of the title). I like this. I'm doing something similar just scaled up a bit (one additional deck, about 60 meters longer). It's still something of a drone carrier but also has an internal hanger. I was going to build in a 3D printer but I can't find the room for it.
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Jun 21, 2015 05:35
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The only thing this game is missing for me is a proper... I don't know, sense of purpose in Survival Mode. Enemies, Threats (beyond very predictable comets), A Goal of Some Kind. That's really all I'm waiting for right now.
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Jun 21, 2015 06:56
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Neddy, I can't help but feel your ships' agility and power/resource efficiency would benefit heavily from taking the all-or-nothing armour theory from treaty battleships and applying it to them
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Jun 21, 2015 07:36
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rossmum posted:Neddy, I can't help but feel your ships' agility and power/resource efficiency would benefit heavily from taking the all-or-nothing armour theory from treaty battleships and applying it to them They're designed as more like Battlestar-ish mobile fortresses than maneuvering warships, with the idea that approaching one from any direction is meant to be a worry rather than having to rotate just to bring one set of guns to bear to keep something hostile at bay. The important bits have more armor anyway, it's just that everything has at least three layers deep, on-average, protecting it on the Avalon and two layers on the Beluga. If you need to go do something quickly, that's what the FTL-equipped subcraft are for. Plus I kinda like the idea that the onboard FTL's are for shock-and-awe as much as travel. Nothing says "I surrender" like an bigass battleship just appearing out of nowhere with a shitload of guns trained. Neddy Seagoon fucked around with this message at 07:56 on Jun 21, 2015 |
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Jun 21, 2015 07:51
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OSad posted:I see. Thank you very much. Last time I checked, we did have quite a few captured NPC ships just sitting there waiting to be deconned, right next to our little construction area next to some unfinished ships. Might be worth it to move those to their own little dedicated scrapyard 10 kilometers out or so. That'd absolutely do it. Another option I like to do is plonk down a 'station' of a single starting block, attach a merge block to that, and then just start fusing ships to it. Mobile ships use up more powrer than immobile stations, so the idea is to just fuse all those loose ships into a single massive stationary 'space hulk'. It also makes it much easier to deconstruct and salvage them since once the ship is a part of the station, any sections mof it that get severed are physically unable to float away even if they wanted to. Still probably best to set up a designated junkyard somewhere a bit away from your main base. Bonus points if you make a dedicated Junkyard Dawg patrol drone.
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Jun 21, 2015 09:55
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