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Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

Groogy posted:

Aw I was too late to the name suggestion party. My suggestion would have been:

Crusader Kings II: Beware of the Kira-Kithan, they are without honor!

Kara-Khitai. I remember my AOE2 strongly.

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Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

verbal enema posted:

I'm tribal Sunni Ghana in the 1066 start is there a reason I'm not seeing as to why it says the mosque in my personal demense is of wrong holder type?

Because you're still tribal.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

LolitaSama posted:

Has anyone here tried out the lord of the rings mod here : http://www.moddb.com/mods/ck2-middle-earth-project

How different is it from the regular game? Can you play like one or two hobbits, or an 8 man fellowship?

The 'questline' is controlled by events-it's perfectly possible to derail things, either as an appropriate character(Aragorn suddenly decides to take it himself, for instance) or an outsider paying for a hunt for the Ring and claiming it. Of course, if Sauron gets it, everyone's hosed, and everyone will try to band together as best they can to deal with it.

Many places are 'wilderness' and need reclaiming via a colonisation chain. Pay money, get events, hope you get lucky.

Many races are playable, but not everything's entirely working for everyone. Note that races can have absolutely massive combat effectiveness, but are also hamstrung by various modifiers. Orcs have terrible morale, for instance, or Dwarves and Elves and Trolls are insanely powerful but have awful troop recovery.

There's lots of interesting things that are possible.

I will note that it's been about a year since I've been able to play it, since it lost compatibility with 'Way of Life'.

Bloodly fucked around with this message at 18:46 on Jul 10, 2015

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
I wonder how long it'll be before there's an 'everyone nomad' mod like the 'everyone tribal' mod?

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
If there is now, with all the changes and things, a way to let females do SOMETHING besides be useless, or if people are working on ways to un-hardcode that, it'd be nice.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
Also, any Tribals you gain after the initial switch can be converted to your preferred holding type immediately, if/once their religion matches yours. Note however in this case that new holdings will only be added if it's the capital province of the duchy.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

RonJeremysBalzac posted:

"Fixed a bug that made Hellenic Pagan religion available in the Ruler Designer."

But, why?

God knows. It was only accessible via Designer in the first place.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

Sindai posted:

It's not supported for actual play and they don't want people using it and then complaining about bugs with it.

This way if people want it they have to use a mod and they'll complain to the modders instead.

If that were the case they'd have cut out the African provices outright, as they have a similar lack.

...So I'm a little bitter about that lack.

Bloodly fucked around with this message at 18:32 on Aug 12, 2015

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

DStecks posted:

Isn't the whole conceit of Sunset Invasion that for some reason the Aztecs are as or more technologically advanced than Europe, which is why they show up in Europe at all? So it would only make sense for them to be feudal, because otherwise they'd still be in Mexico.

The conceit is that they captured and reverse-engineered the Viking ships that went over there.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
And it's still 851. I can't imagine the economy of a Merchant Republic of that size. To say nothing of it's retinues. And the Silk Road too. Gods.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

quote:

Also also, tributaries are OP as poo poo, and awesome for gaining tons of prestige and gold.

You wanna explain why? I'm missing it.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

SeaTard posted:

Groogy will probably change it, but this is what you get right now:

  • 200 prestige and 40% of income from the target
  • They join in on all your wars
  • All your tribal/nomadic vassals get 5 years of +20 opinion (stacking) This is what really makes it go from nice to holy gently caress OP.
  • This lasts until you or they die

Once you get a couple of them going, you can just sit back and watch the swarm conquer everything. When you're playing a tribe, the extra money helps immensely for creating titles. You can stay relatively small but punch way above your weight. Obviously works best if you start with a young ruler, but all you really need are the first couple to then keep everyone around you perma-tributaries. Oh, and they are more likely to accept diplo-vassalization if they are a tributary, so you can then add them to the fold if you want.

The bolded: do these still apply if there's a religion/culture mismatch? Are they forced to accept?

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
And then Merchant Republics screw everything up because they can hold both castles and cities with no penalty-feudals get a harsh penalty to holding income and levies for something of wrong type. Muslims may also hold Temples, so you can potentially get the whole trifecta without penalty. But players don't like Temples as holdings. Not enough troops, not enough income. Peaceful rulers, though. Can't even make kingdoms on their own anymore-they're specifically forbidden. Theocracies are things you make inland, I guess, if you so choose.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
Setting the potential start date to 1(Crusader Kings 2/common/defines.txt) is minorly interesting. The Papacy comes into existance in 42AD. Byzantine Empire(as something with a playable character) shows up at something like 200, A few Zoroastrians(The lord of Kartli) are about as far back as 50AD. Pictland has someone about back to 210. Ireland(Specifically, the duchy of Munster) becomes a thing in 369.
Nomads don't exist at all that far back.

Mercs are basically un-hireable; their numbers and upkeep are too huge.

Effectively it's 'shattered world'-everywhere there's no one, it creates random guys.

Bloodly fucked around with this message at 08:31 on Sep 1, 2015

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
3 to 1 odds against, with numbers that low, and you win? That's oddly impressive. Do you remember what your forces were?

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
Eh? I see no mention of the console being used initially. So why mention it?

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
Except that post came after


Larry Parrish posted:

First off by not using the console like a bitch.

When the post he was talking about :


SlothfulCobra posted:

Trying to save Sicily and southern Italy is just giving me so much trouble. I lost everything to a Jihad. The Seljuks took it all, and I got shunted out into the half of Sardinia that I fought so hard for, and my ruler died, leaving nothing but a regency for his daughter, I figured that was pretty much game over, and I married the princess off to the prince of Castille, figuring that I could just ride out the regency and then jump into his head, that would work for roleplay purposes. The game wouldn't even let me have that, some loser from an obscure branch of the lineage pulled some weird takeover, kicking my last heir off the throne before she even had the chance to properly sit on it.

:sigh:

So I loaded up the next save after that, and I jumped into Castille, and that was okay, I guess, I managed to make some decent headway on conquering muslims here and there, even though Galicia kept poaching my vassals somehow. I figured I could reconquer that pointless northern half of Sardinia to reclaim some kind of contiguity with my last royal line, when I notice that the jerk who deposed my heir died, and he left his daughter in a regency, and since she wasn't old enough to have kids, her heir was...my wife, the one true heir to the de Hauteville family. That's a straightforward assassination opportunity if I've ever seen one. So I start a plot to kill her, and of course it took forever for it to finally land, and in that time the Pope launched a reconquista of Sicily, which gave the usurper all the land that I lost to the jihad, making it an even more attractive target for inheritance.

But of course, the plot took forever to take affect, even with over 200% power, and during that time I had to watch from afar as my old kingdom of Sicily steadily lost land to the HRE. When my wife finally did inherit the kingdom back, the Byzantines declared holy war upon her (somehow they had flopped over into Islam when I wasn't looking), and there was nothing I could do to help her fend off their attack, especially with the holy orders busy somewhere else. Now half the Kingdom of Sicily has been taken by the HRE and the Byzantines, and when eventually Sicily and Castille are united in their single heir, there'll still be nothing I can do to stand up against the two empires. :gonk: Even if I go back to plan B and bugger off to Spain, the HRE's going to come get me eventually. It's a monster, it's gobbled up half of Europe now, and France is too falling apart to provide any real buffer.

Basically, tl;dr how do you stand up to either of the empires?

didn't mention the console at all.

Again, I ask, why bring it up?

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
I say 'they used to' from brief personal experience. But then, I'm also wondering where the siege events went.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

Jedit posted:

Would you mind explaining how to nomad? Because I have no idea. I can't hold territory, I can't raise levies, I can't make money and I can't win wars.

You use and abuse your Horde-effectively a retinue/merc force all of your own, controlled from the Retinue page. You start with 500 dudes, mostly cavalry. Buy up cheap forces to bulk yourself up(There are initial choices that cost Prestige in both cost and maintenance rather than Gold). Use that to raid and take land(Remember you have things like County Conquest, so there's always SOMETHING to take). Use the Population and thus Manpower you get from taking such land to bulk the horde further. Start with weak tribes. You really don't need levies much, if at all. The hardest part is the start, because you have so little.

Money's a pain to raise, in truth. It's dependant on unused Pop/Manpower and the upgrades in your capital. Certainly, you want to pillage places for instant gold and tech and to get Pop and Manpower, but holding them also means you get max taxes out of them regardless of what they think of you.

Thanks to you being mostly Cavalry you can punch well, WELL above your weight.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

FutonForensic posted:

Getting a little bored of Europe. I hope a game like this comes out with a Civ-style map randomizer. That's a pretty rational feature, I think.

You'd love it till the first time or 10 you end up with nothing but islands.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
You can designate an heir. Make sure you've done so?

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

quote:

ETA: Well this is unusual. My horde was just inherited by my son the doge, so now there's a merchant republic stretching from the Aral Sea to the Mediterranean. Is there some way to undo this, turn my character back into a nomad, or am I just going to have to learn to love building trade posts?

Not by default, though of course there's a mod to allow you to turn Nomad at your own will:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=483273828

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

Deceitful Penguin posted:

That's some sort of amazing that is.

I'm trying to think of an adequately dumb analogy for this and it's not working. Cripes.

oh my loving god they want to lock down the wiki to "illegal users of our mods"

i dont even

That's...distressing. I used to be a member, but when the account changes went through and when their forums changed, I didn't keep up. It's kinda annoying. It was frustrating enough making the hop to Steam from Gamersgate.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

FreudianSlippers posted:

Playing as Mali and I'm disappointed that Mansa Musa, who may have been one of the richest men of all time, is only sort of rich in the game when he should obviously start with at least 4000 gold. Managed to take over Mauritania but I need to get an entire other kingdom before I can become an empire which sort of sucks.

How hard would it be to add a unique building for Mali, "Malian gold mine" or some such that gives ludicrous gold? Hmm. Lock it to that region or have him put them everywhere? Decisions, decisions...

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
Yes. It's a random event of the feast.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

Elias_Maluco posted:

Pretty much this. Besides, there is also the 10% limit, so if you make a huge kingdom merchant republic vassal, you wont be able to make even a regular republic after that.

IMHO the 10% limit is enough to prevent those kind of exploits, no need to spoil my fun of making Frisia a merchant republic.

The limit for Merchant Republics is on Feudal vassals. You can make as many Republics as you wish if you are one, same as you can make as many Feudal vassals as you like if you are one.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
Possibly. It depends on whether you want to actually keep the land for yourself or not. You can always hand it off to the Pope if you want.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

Trogdos! posted:

Hey Groogy, wanna tell us what the CK2 DLC codenamed "Zeus" is about? :bigtran:

They're going to allow you more detail on how you set up your provinces and the happiness of your people.

By porting in Master of Olympus:Zeus.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
The risk is that you make them outright ineffectual. Their aggression means nothing if they've got no teeth.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=573078666&searchtext=

Take a bug, make it a mod. Huh.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

skipThings posted:

that's fine :glomp:

someone tell me how to enjoy CK2 despite that lovely "well your dad died, no more war", poo poo

Keep going. You make it sound like it occurs often. It does not.

Besides which, it goes both ways. Want to stop a war against you or someone else? Plot to kill them.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

BravestOfTheLamps posted:

Yeah, they're amateurs. Evrerybody knows that you're supposed to just add it non-chalantly into your massive total conversion mod, like with Game of Thrones and Birthright.

Birthright? Someone's porting The Gorgon's Alliance?

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

A disturbingly sick horse, all things considered. Why's his/her health in the crapper? Weren't you treating him/her right?

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

DrSunshine posted:

Why would a council ever vote to abolish its own power?

'Emergency powers for the duration of the crisis'. What that crisis would be, who can say?

Goes back to Rome: the dictators got given their extreme powers for the duration, and willingly handed it back. Probably because it was too much work. Only later did it get truly seized, and even then there were bribes and things to keep peopel sweet and loyal. Though at this point I think I'm making things up...

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

quote:

but for instance Republics are completely hard coded all over the place to rely on men.

Why was it done so?

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

Maximum Tomfoolery posted:

What the gently caress are you doing, France?



Trying desperately to survive as a thing?

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

Rodyle posted:

playable landed republics and theocracies god drat it

I have to ask: Medieval trade cities. Land based Republics. Were they a thing? I am dumb and uncertain of this, despite the fact I know the Silk Road was a thing and cities of course grew from places to stop and resupply which brought people and so on. I forget, however, if 'land-based versions of Merchant Republics' were a thing.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
That should probably add odds of giving you paranoid somehow. More killing gives you more negatives. That's...that's just being overly dickish for no good reason. You're also lowering the odds that they'll stand for you later.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

Deceitful Penguin posted:

Look at all these non-Island living scrubs that don't realize Island supremacy

On the one hand, it's the ultimate defensive advantage; anyone attacking you will need to bring massive amounts of men to overcome the landing penalties. On the other, advancing your interests from there is also a problem.

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Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
It's kind of something you have to deal with-the early game is very slow. Raiding helps now, that that's a thing. Build what you can for money, when you can.

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