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Really dumb goddamn question from a civvie: My background is predominately in history ( have a master's), and it seems that even though I love teaching, it's either teach in a public school around DC for poo poo money, or be an adjunct for poo poo money and no job security. I've been kicking around the possibility of, like everyone else around DC, latching on to that federal teat. My master's/PhD work (one year, advisor and I didn't see eye to eye) concentrated on counter-insurgency in Revolutionary France, and it's kind of stuck with me, so I've been looking at junior analyst jobs, but since an MA in history isn't worth dick, is it worth it to go and get an MA degree in intelligence/analysis? Or is this field so overloaded with gross former staff-sergeants that I'd be better off working retail?
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Jun 8, 2015 00:22
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It's worth it if you can get a CIA/DIA/FBI/OSI/NCIS/CID/NGA/DHS/NSA/NRO/NASIC/DEA analyst internship to get your foot in the door. Other then that, I don't have much to add.
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Jun 8, 2015 02:02
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Navy SWO program.
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Jun 8, 2015 03:48
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USMC open contract
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Jun 8, 2015 04:37
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Dingleberry posted:Navy SWO program. We've got enough loving history majors already thank you very much.
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Jun 8, 2015 06:05
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Deathy McDeath posted:USMC open contract
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Jun 8, 2015 06:26
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Dingleberry posted:Navy SWO program. Real talk, when I went to a career fair a while back, this brand new o-1 was there pitching being a naval officer to him. I was nice but gave him the, "haha I spent 6 years in the marines so naahhhh. Plus I have this gently caress off huge leg sleeve and you guys won't let me in." His response? "Oh we can waiver that... have you heard about Surface Warfare Officers? I think you'd make a great candidate. It probably doesn't sound that exciting after being in the marines, but it's actually pretty neat." I walked away.
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Jun 8, 2015 10:12
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It's nice work if you can get it. Unfortunately, whatever you choose to do a masters in means jack poo poo, and you are going to be competing for hires against prior service dudes who likely already have a TS/SCI on file and have parlayed their tinnitus and lower back pain into a ten point preference for federal hires. If you know someone who can guide you through the process and provide introductions, go ahead and take a swing, but have a back up plan, and don't throw money at an "intelligence" masters.
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Jun 8, 2015 10:15
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Dead Reckoning posted:It's nice work if you can get it. Unfortunately, whatever you choose to do a masters in means jack poo poo, and you are going to be competing for hires against prior service dudes who likely already have a TS/SCI on file and have parlayed their tinnitus and lower back pain into a ten point preference for federal hires. If you know someone who can guide you through the process and provide introductions, go ahead and take a swing, but have a back up plan, and don't throw money at an "intelligence" masters. That's the part I'm still mulling over, and why I wanted to run it past GiP than, say, the academic thread in ask/tell. I'm eyeballing an International Relations MA degree program that has a specialty in international security studies from a well regarded university, so it's not an online only GI-Bill farm from what I can tell. There's also a ten week "analyst bootcamp", but I'm betting even money it's hilariously sketchy.
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Jun 8, 2015 19:22
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Yeah, gently caress that. Save your cash for something like a GIS cert that will actually show you have worth for agencies.
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Jun 8, 2015 19:35
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BlueDiablo posted:That's the part I'm still mulling over, and why I wanted to run it past GiP than, say, the academic thread in ask/tell. I'm eyeballing an International Relations MA degree program that has a specialty in international security studies from a well regarded university, so it's not an online only GI-Bill farm from what I can tell. There's also a ten week "analyst bootcamp", but I'm betting even money it's hilariously sketchy. There's a bunch of brick and mortar schools with substantial online graduate programs. I think I know which school you're talking about if it's an online MA, there's only a few that do an online International Relations MA.
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Jun 8, 2015 19:56
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Whip Slagcheek posted:There's a bunch of brick and mortar schools with substantial online graduate programs. I think I know which school you're talking about if it's an online MA, there's only a few that do an online International Relations MA. ERAU is the only one I know of and I hear that school went from respectable private school to GI Bill Diploma Mill in the last 6 years or so
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Jun 8, 2015 20:03
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Booblord Zagats posted:ERAU is the only one I know of and I hear that school went from respectable private school to GI Bill Diploma Mill in the last 6 years or so Georgetown has one that's really good. I looked into it but went with another school. They call it emergency management, but the curriculum is very similar to an international program. Also American University does an Int'l Relations online program. Whip Slagcheek fucked around with this message at 20:18 on Jun 8, 2015 |
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Jun 8, 2015 20:15
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The one I was looking at was at George Washington. Nothing against online courses, I just personally prefer in person courses when possible. I'm also poking around for certification stuff (which GWU just stopped doing, apparently), but it's all very much in the initial sounding phase and I'm trying to avoid stumbling into a dead end on account of me being a civvy.
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Jun 8, 2015 21:36
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I just started the GIS cert at GW three weeks ago, and their website's still up. I'd contact the Geography department directly. GW's good at getting internships, I'd do that. INR over at state has intro analyst slots that open up every spring for the fall and following spring, so I'd look at that. NSA and DIA have a bit of a foothold here and have a lot of stuff that opens up, but it's not as regular. Enjoy your long rear end metro/MARC/VRE ride, foggy bottom's unaffordable unless you want to live in a closet with 14 others.
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Jun 8, 2015 23:10
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Dead Reckoning posted:It's nice work if you can get it. Unfortunately, whatever you choose to do a masters in means jack poo poo, and you are going to be competing for hires against prior service dudes who likely already have a TS/SCI on file and have parlayed their tinnitus and lower back pain into a ten point preference for federal hires. If you know someone who can guide you through the process and provide introductions, go ahead and take a swing, but have a back up plan, and don't throw money at an "intelligence" masters. So the first part of this is incorrect. Their are two pay systems in federal service, all the Intel jobs are under the GG system. Their is no vet preference or Injured vet points for GG positions. That being said if someone has prior experience from their military service or already has their clearance from some other job, yea you have to compete with that. Holy poo poo do not go get a intelligence masters. The government runs its own schools and training houses that they will send you too, some of which issue formal degrees. I have actually overheard some hiring authority's say that depending on the program, a intell masters can be a determent because this isn't really a job you can learn how to do besides OTJ Training. Be good at writing, and be a generally smart individual. No one has a lot of billets at the moment but theirs always job postings in the big six. I swear to god if you get a job in my office I will literally be leading a cabal of history majors. I will end myself. EDIT: also depending on where you apply delete this thread.
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Jun 10, 2015 15:22
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You should enlist
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Jun 11, 2015 02:57
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Deathy McDeath posted:USMC open contract As an Army Recruiter, I have to admit we dont have much to offer you that compares to this stellar program, do it.
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Jun 11, 2015 03:03
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AcidRonin posted:So the first part of this is incorrect. Their are two pay systems in federal service, all the Intel jobs are under the GG system. Their is no vet preference or Injured vet points for GG positions. That being said if someone has prior experience from their military service or already has their clearance from some other job, yea you have to compete with that. A few people pointed me to the "intelligence boot camp" thing from here http://atichcd.org/ but I'm 90% sure that it's just an easy way to flush 10k down the drain, but the flip side is that you leave with a top secret clearance. The MA I was looking at is more or less under International Relations, but with a concentration specifically in secuity/intelligence concerns, for clarification. And so far, thanks for the advice everyone. Although the USMC recruiter said I was too fat and weird for the corps, but I'd fit in just fine with the linguistics crowd 
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Jun 12, 2015 03:32
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BlueDiablo posted:A few people pointed me to the "intelligence boot camp" thing from here http://atichcd.org/ but I'm 90% sure that it's just an easy way to flush 10k down the drain, but the flip side is that you leave with a top secret clearance. Actually, this post made me think about something else. You don't need to share a bunch of info, but you CAN get a TS clearance right? Any issues with criminal background, crippling debt, significant ties to foreign countries (not sure if they look into living abroad or not), etc? Supposedly they can be pretty tough. I had a sergeant who was slotted to be our company's intel liason in Afghanistan and got declined TS because he had too much debt. The dude was a total douche so it made me lol pretty hard.
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Jun 12, 2015 07:35
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I had a TS/SCI and one of my old duties used to be getting dudes their TS/SCI clearances. It really isn't that bad as long as you are open and honest about everything. You can have prior convictions with a history of hard drug abuse and still get a clearance as long as it is all in the past and you don't try to lie or hide it. As far as debt unless it is an absolutely massive amount you generally won't be denied as long as you are making an effort to pay it back and setup a payment plan.
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Jun 12, 2015 07:46
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Here's a good resource to see where you stand or just general lol'ness. http://www.dod.mil/dodgc/doha/industrial/2015.html
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Jun 12, 2015 09:27
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xaarman posted:Here's a good resource to see where you stand or just general lol'ness. This poo poo is always drat good reading. Keep it bookmarked for when I need a laugh.
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Jun 12, 2015 09:45
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Here are a few fun ones:quote:Applicant engaged in a long-distance extramarital affair with a friend�s wife for more than 20 years. However, the Department of Defense is aware of the affair because Applicant listed it on his Questionnaire for National Security Positions; the affair is over; and Applicant told his wife about the affair. Clearance is granted. quote:In September 2013 Applicant was convicted of two felonies, which occurred when he shot his son during a physical altercation. He pled guilty to the charges. He remains on supervised probation until 2017. His family and community are aware of his personal conduct, reducing his vulnerability to exploitation. Criminal conduct security concerns are not mitigated. Personal conduct security concerns are mitigated. Eligibility for access to classified information is denied. quote:Applicant is 27 years old. From 2007 to 2010, while attending college, he used marijuana with varying frequency. He has not used illegal drugs since 2010 and does not intend to in the future. He completed two security clearance applications in 2011 and intentionally failed to disclose his drug use. He lied to a government investigator in January 2012 when he denied prior drug use. He did not disclose his past drug use until he was confronted with the facts. Applicant mitigated the security concerns under Guideline H, drug involvement, but failed to mitigate the Guideline E, personal conduct, security concerns. Clearance is denied. That guy would have gotten his clearance if he didn't lie about the past drug use. quote:Applicant is 40 years old. While serving as a police officer, both on-duty in uniform and off-duty, he engaged in sexual intercourse on four occasions with prostitutes. Applicant failed to mitigate the security concerns under Guideline E, personal conduct, and Guideline D, sexual behavior. Clearance is denied. http://www.dod.mil/dodgc/doha/industrial/14-02059.h1.pdf posted:Applicant owes approximately $105,000 in delinquent debt, including almost $75,000 in child support. He is on probation after serving three years in prison for attempting to commit illegal sexual contact, enticing a minor by computer, and violating a condition of release in July 2008. Clearance is denied. That last one is worth reading the whole decision. Dude is about enlisted as you can get.
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Jun 12, 2015 10:29
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BlueDiablo posted:is that you leave with a top secret clearance. Yea I have never heard of this program and I have no idea how an educational program is legally conferring clearances on people. It has a plug from NASIC but air force intelligence people are worse than Hitler. That makes no sense to me because your not supposed to have one unless it's relevant to your job. Worry about getting qualified for the job you want rather than. A clearence. If you get the job the agency handles that. Also yea make sure you are drug free/able to get a clearence. RE: Clearence denial chat, I end most briefings with a Selection From The Book Of Fail
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Jun 12, 2015 15:52
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xaarman posted:Here's a good resource to see where you stand or just general lol'ness. That site is magic. The funny thing is they tend to be fairly forgiving if you're honest. quote:ase Number: 14-04757.h1 Edit well there goes my productivity for the day. Marshal Prolapse fucked around with this message at 16:37 on Jun 12, 2015 |
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Jun 12, 2015 16:22
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gfanikf posted:That site is magic. The funny thing is they tend to be fairly forgiving if you're honest. I think what we have learned from this is that GiP and the Foreign Service thread need to collab together on a thread about awesome security clearance denials
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Jun 13, 2015 00:14
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If you have the experience (but somehow not the clearance) then 10k for a TS isn't a bad deal if you can swing it. I guess. There's a lot of jobs that are looking for an active clearance first, and relevant skills second.
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Jun 13, 2015 00:39
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Work as an intel officer can open up some nice doors contracting in the intelligence world down the line. Do 4 years, ad or reserves then get the gently caress out and make some serious dough. Since you're so loving old and have a degree, don't enlist. Or enlist then post about your hilarious life picking up garbage left outside your dorm room by some 18 year old poo poo head that out ranks you.
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Jun 13, 2015 00:52
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elite_garbage_man posted:enlist then post about your hilarious life
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Jun 13, 2015 01:42
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You should enlist for an SCI job and lie like a rug on the application. It'll end up fantastic.
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Jun 13, 2015 10:23
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USMC503 posted:Actually, this post made me think about something else. He wasn't denied because had too much debt unless it was truly an absurd amount. He was probably denied for something related to it...it was held by foreign interests, it was from a casino, he lied about it, that sort of thing. Many many people with a TS have tens of thousands of dollars in debt (not counting real estate).
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Jun 13, 2015 14:59
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elite_garbage_man posted:Or enlist then post about your hilarious life Confirming, this is the only correct option. Choose a job that has nothing to do with your education and previous professional experience for maximum laughs. For bonus points be dumb and gay enough to believe in our retard country.
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Jun 13, 2015 16:43
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maffew buildings posted:Confirming, this is the only correct option. Choose a job that has nothing to do with your education and previous professional experience for maximum laughs. For bonus points be dumb and gay enough to believe in our retard country. Enlist in the marines become a 0681 and scream about CAC Cards all day long semper fi. EDIT: Retire and open a used car dealership outside of Quatntico and every Memorial Day drive around Stafford yelling at families for BBQing. AcidRonin fucked around with this message at 22:28 on Jun 13, 2015 |
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Jun 13, 2015 22:24
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Godholio posted:He wasn't denied because had too much debt unless it was truly an absurd amount. He was probably denied for something related to it...it was held by foreign interests, it was from a casino, he lied about it, that sort of thing. Many many people with a TS have tens of thousands of dollars in debt (not counting real estate). Well he was a loving tool that thought he was a lot smarter than he was, so I'm betting either casino or lied. Possibly both. Either that or that was the reason he told his buddies because the reality was more embarrassing. That is a very valid option too.
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Jun 14, 2015 01:48
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AcidRonin posted:Enlist in the marines become a 0681 and scream about CAC Cards all day long semper fi. Don't enlist in the marines and then complain about MyPay on GiP.
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Jun 14, 2015 11:44
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Vasudus posted:If you have the experience (but somehow not the clearance) then 10k for a TS isn't a bad deal if you can swing it. I guess. There's a lot of jobs that are looking for an active clearance first, and relevant skills second. Also the difference between doing a job and doing the exact same job but with a clearance is like $30k year pay increase just because of supply and demand. BlueDiablo posted:My master's/PhD work (one year, advisor and I didn't see eye to eye) concentrated on counter-insurgency in Revolutionary France, and it's kind of stuck with me, so I've been looking at junior analyst jobs, but since an MA in history isn't worth dick, is it worth it to go and get an MA degree in intelligence/analysis? Or is this field so overloaded with gross former staff-sergeants that I'd be better off working retail? 3 letter government agencies just require a degree, it can literally be anything since they'll provide training. On the other hand, civilian contracting firms for said agencies might require that degree to be relevant to the job field you're applying for. Private sector jobs also usually look for "security experience", which is pretty vague, but it can also it could also include your PHD if part of the work you did was analysis for security reasons.
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Jun 14, 2015 20:30
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I fit the OPs situation to a T, except I never got my MA in history despite taking some courses towards it and hemming and hawing about whether or not I wanted to actually go through with getting it. Thanks to this thread, I came to the realization that I'm an idiot and completely forgot about GIS (worked with it very very briefly when I was interning with FEMA). Gonna start looking at certificate programs for that, because it beats the gently caress outta my original plan of, get a MA in history and maybe teach but for poo poo pay.
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Jun 14, 2015 21:56
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Whip Slagcheek fucked around with this message at 01:44 on Aug 27, 2015 |
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Jun 14, 2015 22:17
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Handsome Ralph posted:I fit the OPs situation to a T, except I never got my MA in history despite taking some courses towards it and hemming and hawing about whether or not I wanted to actually go through with getting it. This is a good idea, because you'd be competing against phds for those adjunct jobs. My local community college's history adjunct staff is about 3/4 phds.
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Jun 15, 2015 00:34
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