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CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
I still like monarchies more than republics. But gently caress republics really.

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CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

They are rather tedious to deal with for not much benefit

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
I however do like that favors make it easier to call bigger allies into offensive wars. Before you needed either luck or them declaring on you for that stuff.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

Bort Bortles posted:

Fuckkkkk I wasnt posting about it because I was hoping Paradox would not realize that you could Threaten War while in a regency.

I cant believe that this is not a thing yet.



I wonder where Charles the Hammer is so he can tell us we are all wrong about our opinions about the patch/corruption/ect al

You all are wrong except that stuff about westernization, that is bullshit. Corruption is mostly cool.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

The weight of your expectations are killing me :(.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

Elman posted:

And there's the "Conquer X" missions where you gotta annex the provinces, you can't just feed them to your vassal.

The mission system could use some tweaking.

Feeding them to your vassals isn't conquering them :colbert:

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

Fuligin posted:

Looks cool. Y'all are some chicken littles.

Took you this long

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
So that means you still start at full penalty for non Europeans?

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
The term feature bloat has lost all meaning to me from reading various paradox threads.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
I understood the first time you posted it.

Also everything is busywork as it too is a loosely defined term.

Edit: I guess if you want details sailors is fine, it does need some balancing but the fact boats were unlimited was dumb. Corruption is bad and also needs balancing but I don't think it's fixable. Neither are feature bloat.

CharlestheHammer fucked around with this message at 08:01 on Jul 23, 2016

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
There is only one feature I would call bad so maybe you just don't like EU itself anymore????

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
I disagree with the first but agree with the second.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
Eu is kind of built around loving over non Europeans arbitrarily so that isn't new.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

Dreissi posted:

I mean, the whole game is kind of engineered to drive the world towards what happened in real life - Europe basically dominating the planet. This isn't a 4x game and different starts are not equivalent or fair.

Yeah that is the problem, it pushes a narrative which isn't historical nor fun to play.

They do seem to be trying to fix it but it could end up like divine wind and no one wants that.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

PleasingFungus posted:

Divine Wind, the expansion that produced the most ridiculously powerful non-western nations in the series?

All I remembering is it made Hordes a chore to actually play.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
How did you lose Athens?

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
I have played Byzantium like ten times but that is because I find their start really hard without unnecessary waiting. Usually.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
It's a long process but it eats diplo points only and who gives a gently caress about those. Also it is insanely easy to get to 190. So the ten year timer is your only obstacle.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
As someone who doesn't play Euros much nah.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
The key to an easy Byzantium victory is restart until Poland and Hungary aren't rivals and Poland rivals the ottos. Ally with both and wait. They will attack you or ten years later use your favors to launch an assault yourself. You still might lose as the AI is dumb but it's your best shot.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

Wafflecopper posted:

You'd need more than 10 years if you're going to use favours, you won't be getting them at 1/year with Hungary and Poland as tiny Byzantium. The guide I linked says to promise land if the Ottos don't invade you first.

That works sometimes but not always. Poland usually doesn't have a border to get land. Though I am usually able to hit them at the ten year mark, maybe a year later.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
One game is a terrible sample size to judge a system.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
So wait how does embracing work as a non Euro? Pump development?

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
Napoleon was right

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
Yeah institutions make it an actual game rather than some weird historical simulator that still never got even close.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

PleasingFungus posted:

My feeling is that the process of reversing history and getting/staying technologically on par with the Europeans, as a non-European, should be hard. It should feel like an accomplishment - otherwise, what's the difference between playing as a european nation and a non-european other than your colour on the map?

Old 'westernization' certainly wasn't historical, but it accomplished the goal of being a difficult, draining process. I actually haven't played with the new expansion yet (:sweatdrop:), but it sounds like it's just dumping a bunch of development into one province and then paying a bunch of cash. A tax on non-Europeans, but not a threat in the way that westernization events & revolt risk could be. That's not very exciting to me, and of course it doesn't seem exceptionally historical either.

I'd love to be wrong on this. Someone tell me why/how institutions are more exciting than the old westernization process - is there more fun to be had with it than "mash the develop button as Korea and steal all the institutions before Europe gets them"?

Before you has to cripple yourself to westernize. Know you can actually play the game. It's not hard to improve from westernizing, as the old method was the worst.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
There is a fair point that the AI has no idea how to use the new mechanic but they didn't use the old one either so it's a wash on that front.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

Enjoy posted:

Cool, what defines where institutions spawn? Is it mostly province development?

Depends on the institution. They are also kind of self explanatory.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
It's....not hard. It's two button clicks

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
Oh my god

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
I have literally never cared because it's such a non thing I have never even thought about it

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

awesmoe posted:

his point is that it's significantly worse than it used to be, and he used a slightly exaggerated example to show how.

It's better actually, having a free CB against half the world was dumb.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

Fister Roboto posted:

It's really cool every time you barge into the thread to tell everyone that you don't care about something and everyone who does is wrong.

If you stopped being wrong it would go a long way to fixing that.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

Eej posted:

I'm the guy who fabricates every province I want cause I wanna get that -10% warscore cost/-10% core creation cost/-10% autonomy.

Hey might as well, unless you need to conquer something right now there is no reason not too.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
It also has a cut off date and honestly most of the rest of the religious tree isn't very good.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

Yashichi posted:

It works right up until January 1, 1821, and the rest of the ideas are solid, and taking the group gives you tons of stability events for free.

I thought it stopped after 1650? Heretics stick to the end.

Free stability is nice but not that great

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
Huh I couldn't use it in my last game were I went religious.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
I always just used an alliance with Hungary and Poland.

It's much slower but much easier. Might need rerolls for optimum rivals.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
Overextension will loving murder you with that strat.

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CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
Oh no

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