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Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make
Btw, for those wondering when the next update is coming; it's probably going to be a bit longer for two reason:

1) College starts again this Monday for me.

2) I'm in the middle of replaying Gen 2 in order to finalize the route. I found out about this tidbit on Serenes Forest...

hanhann posted:

[Letting a green, neutral castle doesn't drop your rank in] this case. It is Green -> Red -> Blue, so you gain 1 more castle [by recruiting Johan and then capturing Johalva's castle before getting the other castle]. The Sophara and Isaac are both Blue this time, while they're always 1 Blue and 1 Green every other time.

You can get the extra Blue Lenster in Chapter 7 by using the same strategy.
Free 1000 extra gold for all units.

I didn't realize it was possible to do that without decreasing the Tactics rank; but, sure enough, I've seen some AAAA runs on Nico Nico do exactly that. And while this didn't end up changing any of my strategies...it did give me a scare. So I'm making sure I don't have to retcon anything again. So keep at it with the discussions on gameplay balance and all that! Be as off-topic as you want; I practically LIVE for that stuff :) .

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Onmi
Jul 12, 2013

If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

BenRGamer posted:

Honestly, I disagree, at least for a sizable fraction of the FE Fanbase.

The AI only has to kill a unit to win.

That's a... what he meant. The battle they have to win is the one where they kill your unit.


Junpei posted:

How about skills that give passive benefits (buffs to Hit, Evade, Crit. Evade, Crit, etc.) when at full HP? What if the enemy had versions of Fates's personal skills, like Chivalry, Pragmatic or Rose's Thorns?

When I get home I'll show some of the Boss skills that I'm using because I typically include that stuff. Or bonuses to that leaders specific unit type (Pegasus gain increased Damage for example, for an Ilian commander)

EDIT: Here's an example of my boss skills


Their skills come their personalities and thus provide bonuses to their troops, while having a bonus of their own.

Onmi fucked around with this message at 12:59 on Jan 8, 2017

DMW45
Oct 29, 2011

Come into my parlor~
Said the spider to the fly~

Onmi posted:

That's a... what he meant. The battle they have to win is the one where they kill your unit.

Eh, hard to tell at a glance what they mean by 'battle' whether it's the entire match or what.

Still, once they put casual in there (after restarting a few times) I jumped all over that.

Thinking about it, I'm surprised they haven't added in the opposite, an extra mode that auto-game overs you if you lose a unit, since that's also a way people play it.

Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make
By the way, Onmi; you mentioned that no one boss unit is ever going to be a hard fight without being overly gimmicky and stuff, right? So out of curiosity, what did you do for Idoun? Do you believe it would be possible to make an "army vs. boss" fight by turning it into this kind of fight here?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51Qz7IAxoW4

That way you wouldn't have one target to hit, you'd have three, in addition to whoever else spawned.

Fionordequester fucked around with this message at 03:17 on Jan 9, 2017

Onmi
Jul 12, 2013

If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Fionordequester posted:

By the way, Onmi; you mentioned that no one boss unit is ever going to be a hard fight without being overly gimmicky and stuff, right? So out of curiosity, what did you do for Idoun? Do you believe it would be possible to make an "army vs. boss" fight by turning it into this kind of fight here?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51Qz7IAxoW4

I mean yeah it can work like that, but even that for Fire Emblem is strange, since it removes the Weapon Triangle and other mechanics for monster stuff.

As for what I did?



I took inspiration from Advance Wars

Ephraim225
Oct 28, 2010

Onmi posted:

I mean yeah it can work like that, but even that for Fire Emblem is strange, since it removes the Weapon Triangle and other mechanics for monster stuff.

As for what I did?



I took inspiration from Advance Wars

I will support this only if Idoun is given the ability to fire a giant meteor every ten turns or so that damages everything it hits.

Onmi
Jul 12, 2013

If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Ephraim225 posted:

I will support this only if Idoun is given the ability to fire a giant meteor every ten turns or so that damages everything it hits.

AoE isn't a known quantity, but I can certainly give her a bombardment ability, I could give her the old Eclipse "Reduce enemy HP to 1" but then I'd make it so she went last in the turn order. So there's no "Oh you got reduced to 1 HP from full. Eat poo poo." reset moments.

Ephraim225
Oct 28, 2010

Onmi posted:

AoE isn't a known quantity, but I can certainly give her a bombardment ability, I could give her the old Eclipse "Reduce enemy HP to 1" but then I'd make it so she went last in the turn order. So there's no "Oh you got reduced to 1 HP from full. Eat poo poo." reset moments.

Sturm's Meteor Strike in AW can't kill anything so this is actually a really good idea.

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015
Probation
Can't post for 11 years!
A FE6 hack? Please tell me you upped Roy's growths and caps.

rannum
Nov 3, 2012

Onmi posted:

I mean yeah it can work like that, but even that for Fire Emblem is strange, since it removes the Weapon Triangle and other mechanics for monster stuff.

As for what I did?

[[snip]

I took inspiration from Advance Wars

please tell me this won't take as long as AW1's final map does. That was a great map idea that felt like it took three eternities to finish.

also just want to say I've seen your assorted posts over several FE threads and your hack seems really interesting, pretty excited for whenever it gets finished. Going back to the "every FE is someone's first FE" discussion in relation to difficulty I also appreciate that you didn't just go with the assumption of "this is for super players" that most romhacks do.

and while i'm dumping praise, may as well turn it to the actual LP and say it's been pretty enjoyable. Fion you're so aggressively up beat about everything and its nice that you never let it die. & Super skilled play is always a treat.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

I dont see any room for reinforcements and what made the final map of advance wars bog down was that it chokepointed ground units so you had 4 armies fighting over an area of 9-12 tiles, 3 of which were player controlled and tripping over each other. If omni doesn't have stuff spawning in, the chokepoints break significantly easier, leading to a better rate of progress.

Dr Pepper
Feb 4, 2012

Don't like it? well...

Junpei posted:

A FE6 hack? Please tell me you upped Roy's growths and caps.

Roy's growth rates aren't bad. It's his awful, awful promotion time that makes him bad.

Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make

rannum posted:

Fion you're so aggressively up beat about everything and its nice that you never let it die. & Super skilled play is always a treat.

Aw...do you mean that I sometimes get some flak for what I say in things like the Yu-Gi-Oh thread, or that I'm somewhat self-depreciating in how I refer to myself? Either way, I'm grateful for your compliment :) .

Dr Pepper posted:

Roy's growth rates aren't bad. It's his awful, awful promotion time that makes him bad.

Indeed; the other thing, though, that sticks out to me, is that it seems like the game designers couldn't decide on how competent they wanted Roy to be. If you look at his stance in his battle sprite (which his movements are janky, awkward, and don't look like they have much power behind them), the way he's characterized in some of his supports, and the fact that he was originally even YOUNGER than he ended up in the final game...you get the sense that the game designers wanted him to be some sort of underdog. Like, they INTENTIONALLY made him a weaker unit to make him feel more like an underdog. And if that's really what they were going for, then his stats and late promotion time make perfect sense...

...

And yet, he comes off as the complete opposite in the actual story. He always exudes a sense of confidence, a keen intellect, and a force of will that's extremely uncommon for someone who's only 15. It's to the point where HE'S the one who's often lecturing Merlinus, when it really should be the other way around. So I'm wondering if his late promotion and weak base stats were on purpose, and the writers were originally going to make him feel more like an underdog before changing their mind?

Fionordequester fucked around with this message at 06:45 on Jan 12, 2017

Last Celebration
Mar 30, 2010

Fionordequester posted:

Aw...do you mean that I sometimes get some flak for what I say in things like the Yu-Gi-Oh thread, or that I'm somewhat self-depreciating in how I refer to myself? Either way, I'm grateful for your compliment :) .


Indeed; the other thing, though, that sticks out to me, is that it seems like the game designers couldn't decide on how competent they wanted Roy to be. If you look at his stance in his battle sprite (which his movements are janky, awkward, and don't look like they have much power behind them), the way he's characterized in some of his supports, and the fact that he was originally even YOUNGER than he ended up in the final game...you get the sense that the game designers wanted him to be some sort of underdog. Like, they INTENTIONALLY made him a weaker unit to make him feel more like an underdog. And if that's really what they were going for, then his stats and late promotion time make perfect sense...

...

And yet, he comes off as the complete opposite in the actual story. He always exudes a sense of confidence, a keen intellect, and a force of will that's extremely uncommon for someone who's only 15. It's to the point where HE'S the one who's often lecturing Merlinus, when it really should be the other way around. So I'm wondering if his late promotion and weak base stats were on purpose, and the writers were originally going to make him feel more like an underdog before changing their mind?

Eh, I think they just didn't "get" proper promotion times yet, they screwed up Leif in FE5 too and Hector has a tendency to ram the level cap (the only reason Eliwood doesn't in EHM/ENM is because he's aggressively mediocre).

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015
Probation
Can't post for 11 years!

Dr Pepper posted:

Roy's growth rates aren't bad. It's his awful, awful promotion time that makes him bad.

Well, the 25 cap across the board doesn't help. And his growths are consistently mediocre across the board (He's essentially Eliwood, with 5% taken off his Strength, Speed and Skill growths and all three 5%'s, adding up to 15%, put into his Luck growth. He's not good is what I'm saying.

Dr Pepper
Feb 4, 2012

Don't like it? well...

They're servicable.

Roy will do his job of taking thrones while being tough enough not to be a liability.

At least until he doesn't promote and is dead weight for most of the second half of the game.

vilkacis
Feb 16, 2011

How dare you ingrates talk like that about our lord and saviour Roy? You're all dead to me :colbert:









(Your death quotes were lame, too.)

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



vilkacis posted:

How dare you ingrates talk like that about our lord and saviour Roy? You're all dead to me :colbert:









(Your death quotes were lame, too.)

As I'm required to make a speech about how lame Roy is in the second-to-last mission, I merely have a retreat quote.

(It's "Roy sucks, and also I am leaving because I am wounded but still alive.", by the way. You were right. It's pretty bad.)

galagazombie
Oct 31, 2011

A silly little mouse!

Last Celebration posted:

Eh, I think they just didn't "get" proper promotion times yet, they screwed up Leif in FE5 too and Hector has a tendency to ram the level cap (the only reason Eliwood doesn't in EHM/ENM is because he's aggressively mediocre).

To be fair, a lot of the problem with Hector reaching the level cap so soon isn't so much a bad promotion time as it being Hector is so good a unit people overuse him and end up feeding him an irresponsibly high share of the exp. If he got to promote any sooner most players would have him at 20/20 before they beat Lyn mode.

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015
Probation
Can't post for 11 years!

Dr Pepper posted:

They're servicable.

Roy will do his job of taking thrones while being tough enough not to be a liability.

At least until he doesn't promote and is dead weight for most of the second half of the game.

The Sword of Seals does help. By the standards of FE4's legendary weapons it might not be anything special, but by the standards of FE6's legendary weapons it's totally broken. Remember Ragnell? Ike's super-awesome infinite use sword? Well start with its base stats and effects. Now add 15 Hit. And 5 Crit. And +5 Res from equipping it. And make it so that you can burn one use to have Roy recover 30 HP.

Last Celebration
Mar 30, 2010

galagazombie posted:

To be fair, a lot of the problem with Hector reaching the level cap so soon isn't so much a bad promotion time as it being Hector is so good a unit people overuse him and end up feeding him an irresponsibly high share of the exp. If he got to promote any sooner most players would have him at 20/20 before they beat Lyn mode.

Eh, part of it is that he's your one good axe user until Dart's Strength/Speed growths start kicking in, and also your second tank, and a Rapier Axe is really, really, REALLY loving good for a lot of reasons, but a lot of your guys are promoting at that point anyway. Eliwood is pretty outclassed by Raven as far as direct comparisons go (but that's partially Raven being scary good with great bases even on Normal), but Hector's utility is singular since he's your only Axe tank, so it's not a surprise that he ends up overleveled, since axes are a real good tank weapon compared to spears (WTA against spears, neutral to other axes, WTD against swords which have the worst might and weakest users).

Paused
Oct 24, 2010

Junpei posted:

The Sword of Seals does help. By the standards of FE4's legendary weapons it might not be anything special, but by the standards of FE6's legendary weapons it's totally broken. Remember Ragnell? Ike's super-awesome infinite use sword? Well start with its base stats and effects. Now add 15 Hit. And 5 Crit. And +5 Res from equipping it. And make it so that you can burn one use to have Roy recover 30 HP.

Strong against Dragons too right? I forget if the number of dragons post SoS is in the hundreds or thousands?

Dr Pepper
Feb 4, 2012

Don't like it? well...

I think it's like, three stages left once Roy promotes and you get the Binding Blade, two of which are nothing but dragons..

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015
Probation
Can't post for 11 years!
One thing I don't like about FE AI is how easily it's distracted from it's intended goal in places where defense is the objective. Like this:

:hist101: : Okay guys, we have a good tactical formation there. The long-range tome will be hurting them from afar while we protect the healers. With our good ruler's leadership and the river to slow them down, we shall prevail in the long run. Any questions, soldiers?
:geno: : Captain, there's someone standing on the other side of the river. She's calling us armored chickens.
:hist101: : After her!!
:geno: : What about our healers?
:hist101: : Get them as close to the action as you can!

galagazombie
Oct 31, 2011

A silly little mouse!

Last Celebration posted:

Eh, part of it is that he's your one good axe user until Dart's Strength/Speed growths start kicking in, and also your second tank, and a Rapier Axe is really, really, REALLY loving good for a lot of reasons, but a lot of your guys are promoting at that point anyway. Eliwood is pretty outclassed by Raven as far as direct comparisons go (but that's partially Raven being scary good with great bases even on Normal), but Hector's utility is singular since he's your only Axe tank, so it's not a surprise that he ends up overleveled, since axes are a real good tank weapon compared to spears (WTA against spears, neutral to other axes, WTD against swords which have the worst might and weakest users).

That's kinda my point, he does so many things so well and so much better than your other options that it'd be foolish to not shove exp down his gullet till he bursts.

Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make

galagazombie posted:

That's kinda my point, he does so many things so well and so much better than your other options that it'd be foolish to not shove exp down his gullet till he bursts.

Rather like Sigurd that way, actually.

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015
Probation
Can't post for 11 years!
Okay, I was just thinking of who the best candidate for Nihil from Alec would be. Anyone who has it is guaranteed to be immune to criticals, which is nice, but the person who actually would get the most mileage out of it would actually Fee, of all people. While it would be decent on any other mounted unit, horse effectiveness is limited to certain weapons only. Pegasi, however, are universally weak to Bows, which is a pretty major problem. Nihil would allow Fee to go up and poke Archers/Bow Knights in the face with safety.

Too bad this pairing leaves Ced incredibly mediocre. C'est la vie...

I'd like to mention FE4 Binary, a rebalancing hack that does a lot to make a lot more pairings viable (classes having new weapon ranks making inheritance easier, multiple promotion options to give mediocre characters new tricks, cool new weapons that can turn the tides against the increased difficulty), but one of the coolest things is that Minor bloods can use holy weapons! Albeit with halved stat boosts, but you can do some cool poo poo with it. You can obtain the Helswath, Valflame and Mjolnir, and give it to (Joha- siblings and Lex's kids/Azel's kids/Arthur and Teeny)! Lief can dual-wield the Tyrfing and Gae Bolg! Holyn can pair with Aira so that their kids can use the Balmung awesomely!

Plus it fixes some of the more... eyebrow-raising decisions. Anyone can double and crit! The Pursuit and Critical skills just make it easier to do so. Nihil works like it does in the Radiance games, nullifying enemy skills. Sol/Luna/Astra can be used by anyone, not foot-based sword users!

Last Celebration
Mar 30, 2010
Everyone not doubling is kind of dumb since it just makes some units inferior, and even the game knows it otherwise Leif and Altenna wouldn't get it on promotion, but not critting without Critical pretty okay since, well, crits probably shouldn't be a thing without the skill or Killer weapons anyway.

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015
Probation
Can't post for 11 years!
So... The Fire Emblem Direct just happened, and four games were anounced:

-Fire Emblem Warriors, a Warriors game with FE characters for the Switch
-Fire Emblem Heroes, a mobile game
-Fire Emblem 15, but not much was revealed
-Fire Emblem Echoes: Shadows of Valentia, a remake of FE2 on the 3DS

... I think I died and went to heaven. This looks great...

rannum
Nov 3, 2012

Junpei posted:

So... The Fire Emblem Direct just happened, and four games were anounced:

-Fire Emblem Warriors, a Warriors game with FE characters for the Switch
-Fire Emblem Heroes, a mobile game
-Fire Emblem 15, but not much was revealed
-Fire Emblem Echoes: Shadows of Valentia, a remake of FE2 on the 3DS

... I think I died and went to heaven. This looks great...

Echoes is likely considered 15 in the same way the FE1 & 3 remakes are 11 & 12.

also you can vote on the Heroes website from any characters from any game in the series (ANY character, it's absurd) including FE4 so hey if you want to vote for your favorite guy t oget a fancy new outfit artwork character now's the time.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



rannum posted:

Echoes is likely considered 15 in the same way the FE1 & 3 remakes are 11 & 12.

also you can vote on the Heroes website from any characters from any game in the series (ANY character, it's absurd) including FE4 so hey if you want to vote for your favorite guy t oget a fancy new outfit artwork character now's the time.

Any?

Oh, sure, you can vote for the big names like Elena (Ike's mom) and Layla (Dancer in one cutscene in Fates), but just try to vote for Altina or Anri, and you'll only find disappointment.

(It's just almost any. But it's close enough you can think any if you aren't looking for the specific exceptions.)

Ephraim225
Oct 28, 2010

chiasaur11 posted:

Any?

Oh, sure, you can vote for the big names like Elena (Ike's mom) and Layla (Dancer in one cutscene in Fates), but just try to vote for Altina or Anri, and you'll only find disappointment.

(It's just almost any. But it's close enough you can think any if you aren't looking for the specific exceptions.)

Can we vote for Aimee/Larabel?

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Ephraim225 posted:

Can we vote for Aimee/Larabel?

Yes.

Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make
Well guys, I've made some progress on that update now, and made a number of discoveries on the side. I've figured out the Jealousy charts of every Child and Fixed character in Gen 2, made a new discovery as to how to conveniently clear the Final Chapter, and I have a better sense of how many turns I have (hint: it's a lot). So, next time, I'll have a War Room mini-update about the Gen 2 Jealousy mechanics (and various stuff in regards to Celice X Julia), and then we'll be back to the main playthrough!

Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make
Actually, there's one thing I've been curious about...the remake of Fire Emblem 2 is coming out quickly. I actually know how to speedrun the entirety of that game on Normal mode; so would anyone be interested in such a run as a way of hyping the remake?

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Id be down for sure

Blaze Dragon
Aug 28, 2013
LOWTAX'S SPINE FUND

That'd be really cool. Speedruns are always fun.

rannum
Nov 3, 2012

a speed run for that would be cool to read about, yeah

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015
Probation
Can't post for 11 years!
I'd be down with that.

Idea! When the next chapter happens and we have the classic Siblings +1 Luck For The Daughter Talk, I want people to make adorable and heartwarming fanart of the reunion!

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Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make
Hey everyone! I'm happy to say that I've made a ton of progress in planning the FE Gaiden run. After scouring the darkest depths of the Japanese Internet (which turned out to be a much scarier place than I had anticipated), I found the Twitter account of the World Record holder of Normal Mode + All Survival (which means no one is dead at the end), and ended up getting his notes! I thought I had a pretty good route before, but NOW...now it's something special.

Anyway, what do you guys think of a sort of "hybrid thread?". I'll stream the speed run in 1-2 hour long chunks for anyone who wishes to watch, and then do some screenshots detailing the important parts of each battle (with commentary of course)? I ask because a friend of mine told me that speed runs tend to be most entertaining when streamed; but I also know that SRPG's tend to get tedious.

What do you all think?

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