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Angela Christine posted:I like the part where Sisko realizes he can't be both an objective Starfleet captain and the Emissary to/from the Prophets, so he resigns his commision and becomes a full time diplomat. See, that conflict of interest remains a constant in sisko's storyline over the series' trajectory. whereas if ds9 got the voyager treatment it would have been totally ignored barring a single episode in the first season
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TEAYCHES posted:they wouldnt let ron moore get anywhere near voyager and he was highly critical of it. heres a great, extremely long interview about it, really great behind the scenes how the sausage is made kinda poo poo " I don’t really care for where the franchise is now, where it’s going. It’s not about anything. It feels to me that it is a very content-free show. It’s not really speaking to the audience on any real level anymore. What’s happening is that it’s very superficial. It talks a good game. It talks about how it’s about deep social problems, and how it’s about sociological issues, and that it’s very relevant. It’s about exploration, and it’s about the unknown, and all these cute catch phrases, but scratch the surface of that and there is really not much underneath it all. VOYAGER doesn’t really believe in anything. The show doesn’t have a point of view that I can discern. It doesn’t have anything really to say. I truly believe it simply is just wandering around the galaxy. It doesn’t even really believe in its own central premise, which is to me its greatest flaw." this is good e: Moore laughs, "What is the difference really between Voyager and the rest of the fleet? When that ship comes home, it will blend right in. You won’t even know the difference. They haven’t personalized the ship in any way. It’s still the same kind of bare metal, military look that it had at the beginning. If you were trapped on that ship and making your way home, for years on end, wouldn’t you put something up on the walls? Would you put a plant or two somewhere in a corridor? Wouldn’t you try to make it a little more livable? That is the challenge that I think they have really dropped. They just won’t deal with the reality of the situation that ship is in. They look for stylistic twists, and ways to make the show interesting visually, and up the action quotient, and up the sex quotient. But that’s not the problem. If you can’t believe in your own premise, you then certainly can’t take the next step and try to have a point of view about life, about what it means to be human: what is the nature of the human heart, and good and evil, all of the great questions that STAR TREK is famous for trying to grapple with in a science fiction context. When VOYAGER tries to go there it is so completely superficial that it doesn’t mean anything. Even when they are trying to really mine something, it’s undercut by the fact that nothing else surrounding it is real, and that you can’t accept these people in the positions and what they are doing. " Ambrose Burnside fucked around with this message at 18:14 on Sep 5, 2015 |
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Sep 5, 2015 18:05
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Harveygod posted:Someone in the previous thread said to skip the Ferengi episodes. Doing this will deprive you of Liquidator Brunt and The Magnificent Ferengi, which is chalk-full of Ferengi and is probably the most fun episode of the entire series. the ferengi stuff is often straight-up great, which is very surprising given, u know, everything even. like. the one where nog agitates the bar into unionizing and quotes marx at quark (lmao) is p dang good and nobody even thinks of that one
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Sep 5, 2015 23:53
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" Essentially what was the point of this entire series? It’s a wasted opportunity. That’s what pisses me off. You are not really taking advantage of this golden opportunity that you are handed as writers and as producers. You can do so much with STAR TREK. It is such a broad, flexible canvas. If DEEP SPACE NINE proved nothing else, it proves just how far you can take this series, and how far you can take the franchise. It can look totally different. It can be serialized, and it can be a war show, and it can do stuff about religion and politics, and it can be interesting and engrossing, and gray and ambiguous. You don’t have to turn VOYAGER into DEEP SPACE NINE to take advantage of the fact that those opportunities exist. You just have to have the courage to do it. They are not speaking to me. They don’t have anything to say anymore." ol ron moore was hella on point here
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Sep 7, 2015 15:13
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"Now," says Ron Moore about STAR TREK, "you do another series or another movie, the attitude is, ‘Oh God, another one?’ That is wrong. Why feed into that public perception? I just don’t know any reason to do it. It doesn’t even serve Paramount’s long-term financial goals, in my opinion. If the studio really wants this thing to last for another thirty or forty years, they should look down the line further than just next year’s profits. They should take a longer term view and say, ‘We should let this rest for awhile. Let it go away; let it percolate down through the popular culture, and let it find its way to a whole new crop of fans.’ People are going to watch these shows in syndication forever. They are going watch the movies on video forever, and they are going to watch them on the Internet soon. Eventually they are going to be saying, ‘drat. When are they going to put out one of those STAR TREKs?’ They’ll start a letter writing campaigns, and they’ll get nostalgic for DEEP SPACE NINE eventually; they’ll get nostalgic for VOYAGER. You’ll get this, ‘Remember when there were two STAR TREK series on the air?’ People will forget, and they will want to see it again. All they have to do is wait, and then start fresh, and then take advantage of the opportunities, and reinvent the series." ... we hosed up 
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Sep 7, 2015 15:24
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i like the bit i quotes where he's like "people will begin watching star trek on this "internet" thing soon, i think, and once star trek is dead long enough people are gonna want it back with letter-writing campaigns and stuff" and im thinkin of the Captain Worf pitch like "dang"
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Sep 7, 2015 15:52
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i really cant see captain worf going anywhere, bless michael dorns lil heart, but i do hope it at least got the execs thinking about how 1) pre-reboot fans are still very much out there in a big way, and 2) huge-budget movies and 26-ep full-budget tv seasons both represent large investments with attendant risk, a netflix limited run, not so much
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Sep 7, 2015 15:59
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FrensaGeran posted:No joke I've actually read the Captain Worf pilot script and it's awful. this does not surprise me in the slightest
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Sep 7, 2015 18:32
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Sep 7, 2015 19:00
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i 'dug' how by like halfway through the first season (and repeatedly afterwards) odo's already admitted that he surveils everybody on the ship inc. when theyre in their private quarters, and infiltrates p much anything confidential or private, and people are like "well he's the CONSTABLE so whatever" and its never really treated as anything but a mild annoyance ds9 dropped the ball there imo, they were so good at looking at the tensions between federation talk and federation walk and the realities of post-scarcity paradise earth and the frontier, but they really oughta dragged odo into the light and made everybody very uncomfortable about how he was unapologetic about preferring cardassian 'justice' and he totally ignored federation civil rights as a matter of course and it was tolerated because HE GOT RESULTS GOD DAMMIT like he could have spied on a suspected vulcan arms dealer or sth and tried to bust them and then it turns out the vulcan was an intelligence operative and the whole thing embarrassed the vulcans so badly they were determined to see odo hung out to dry. u know, a real solid courtroom ep
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Sep 7, 2015 19:22
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sinking belle posted:i don't know what marx and bakunin have to do with star trek but i can't stop laughing at this edit b/c my brain is internet mush i can only ever reemmber sweet marx and hella bakunin and not the original, so i just rolled with that one
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Sep 7, 2015 21:54
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Chomp8645 posted:Never heard of this Renegades thing before. What's the deal? pre-reboot traditional star trek nerd death rattle after being taken off the "real studio" media respirator
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Sep 7, 2015 22:41
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idk what anybody says move along home is fun
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Sep 8, 2015 01:49
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tuvix was unambiguously murdered and the entire bridge crew are collectively responsible
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Sep 8, 2015 17:12
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remember when tuvix went around to his friends one by one and made an impassioned plea for even one of them to, just, say, "captain this is hosed up and not ok", thats all he was asking for. from the people he'd come to rely on and trust and care for in the weeks/months since being created, and the people who cared about him. tuvix very explicitly saying "this is murder, please dont murder me, i love and care and feel and have a right to exist" and not a single person would budge from "sorry dude we gotta murder ya, for reasons" and especially when their unanimous act of murder flew in the face of every single precedent-setting star trek episode irt the rights of "sentient but of-ambiguous-provenance beings". like, remember those worker robot-drone things in TNG that data discovered to be sentient? how picard immediately forbade their use for dangerous labour once that was discovered + went way out of his way to protect them when they were in danger? one will note that picard inexplicably did not go "yeah theyre sentient but whatever dude we need those minerals" its actually kind of incredible that theres any moral ambiguity in this episodes interpretation at all Ambrose Burnside fucked around with this message at 18:05 on Sep 8, 2015 |
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Sep 8, 2015 18:00
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counterfeitsaint posted:I don't know why people endlessly lose their poo poo about Tuvix. Through your inaction two sentient beings are unable to exist again, why does that mean absolutely nothing, while this dude in front of you does?
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Sep 8, 2015 21:12
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counterfeitsaint posted:Was it just a possibility? I thought it was a sure thing, and it basically boiled down to push A for Tuvix, push B for the other two. i would posit that one scenario involves murder and the other involves declining to pursue a course of action that would create life. if youre drawing equivalence between the two, yeah, you kinda gotta grapple with the much larger problem of abortion/non-procreative sex/etc, or even "doing things with your life that are not calculated for pareto-optimal societal benefit" necessarily being Bad Moral Failings
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Sep 9, 2015 00:47
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tuvix is tearing this family apart
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Sep 9, 2015 00:47
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The Bible posted:The same goes for that Lizard sex episode of Voyager. Total garbage even by Voyager standards, but still immeasurably superior to even the best TOS episode. dont say things you cant take back
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Sep 9, 2015 01:24
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i actually liked kes, her character wasnt incredibly interesting but it was a whole lot better than seven "look at the titty. look. are our ratings going up yet" of nine
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Sep 9, 2015 01:26
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counterfeitsaint posted:Those lives already existed though. if you didnt have to murder someone to bring them back then clearly. but you do have to kill someone, is the thing, and i do not see a scenario outside of hardline utilitarianism that justifies it or excuses what is very explicitly cold-blooded murder
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Sep 9, 2015 01:30
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armin shimerman is perfect for quark for other reasons, too- namely that he's both jewish and on the board of directors for the screen actor's guild. so after TNG when he had more latitude with his character he went way out of his way to try to address the legitimately perceived anti-semitism, plus being genuinely sensitive to/cognizant of the labour n ethical aspects of playing a hypercapitalist business owner with a secret shameful soft spot (which culminates in 'bar associate', which is a hella good n underrated ferengi ep)
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Sep 9, 2015 18:22
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q thought sisko was a fuckin chump. theres a reason he never came back to ds9
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Sep 10, 2015 15:35
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Clark Nova posted:
my god i must have this
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Sep 10, 2015 18:36
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heres a post from a previous star trek thread i thoroughly enjoy quote:FIRST DAY AT THE OFFICE
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Sep 10, 2015 18:38
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found it. im so happy 
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Sep 10, 2015 19:20
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My Q-Face posted:
its a good scene b/c it's awkward and tacitly insulting to the chief and betrays how picard has failed to form meaningful relationships w/ the noncom workin joes on the enterprise. oh, chief, youre leaving. sweet transporter room, i'm pretty sure you worked in here, right. you must love it here. the room you never get to leave b/c you just push the button to make the thing go.
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Sep 10, 2015 22:49
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that was a poo poo scene. "Oh, your favorite transporter room!"
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Gutcruncher posted:Not only is that a low number considering the gods are right there the whole time, but when were those? The wormhole guys never felt like some get out of jail card for the writers to me. erasing the dominion fleet in transit through the wormhole is probs the most egregious example but the series finale is p bad too iirc
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Sep 11, 2015 00:22
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counterfeitsaint posted:Oomox i did always kind of marvel at how much sex n sexual references are in star trek despite them hilariously toeing the daytime broadcasting line, and how oomox was ok despite, in context, being really kind of obscene Ambrose Burnside fucked around with this message at 23:47 on Sep 13, 2015 |
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Sep 13, 2015 22:04
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man there was even that really direct masturbation joke that one time, when rom was complaining about an earache from too much oomox or sth, and when someone asked him who the lucky lady was he shamefully muttered "no lady"
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Sep 13, 2015 23:48
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neelix was extremely possessive and probably downright abusive to kes and nobody ever commented on it or took note of how lovely his overwhelming jealousy was
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Sep 17, 2015 17:34
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*rescues woman from planet, leaving you as her only constant n emotional anchor* * flies into a rage and withholds intimacy and contact at the mere sign of her speaking ot other Available Men*
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Sep 17, 2015 17:37
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Tezzor posted:i bet he gets grants to run the restaurant from the Cultural Ministry of Hey Guys Leave the Holodeck Once in a While and all the space hipsters go there to instahologram about how Real food grown from the ground is. they smile good naturedly as he hands them a bill holder and they fill it with monopoly money. he is insanely senile lol
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Sep 18, 2015 20:39
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sisko is definitely the most compelling/interesting captain in part b/c he's deeply flawed, idk what kind of metric "best captain" is exactly
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Sep 18, 2015 20:41
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hard time. oof. the obrien must suffer-est of the obrien must suffers
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Sep 19, 2015 22:14
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probably one of my favourite things is when, iirc after being captured, worf immediately and brutally murders weyoun and dumar just lols shithousedly
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Sep 22, 2015 05:29
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having major characters be clones is a good way to be able to murder your important characters for whatever reason w/ no consequences. better than a dream sequence or holodeck simulation at any rate
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Sep 22, 2015 05:30
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Shadow posted:hahaha i loved damar lmao damar shouting YOU hosed UP IDIOT at weyoun 7's corpse
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Sep 22, 2015 18:51
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everybody post better jesus christ
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Sep 23, 2015 00:17
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Blazing Ownager posted:
i read a thing that said the cast loved having her around cause shes apparently hilarious, but she never cared about or really 'got' star trek and i think that does come across in her performance n character. not to any serious detriment, but it is interesting to look at the actors who were super engaged in the universe adn the whole project (patrick stewart and tim russ n so on) vs those who really didnt give a poo poo beyond "its a gig" (louise fletcher, robert beltran come to mind)
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Sep 23, 2015 01:20
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