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caps on caps on caps posted:But you are not arguing against neo-liberals here, almost everyone is left leaning if not socialist They're neoliberals who have learned to camouflage themselves.
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Apr 2, 2019 10:26
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Beefeater1980 posted:I’m curious, do you actually believe this? That there is literally no difference between a US newspaper and a propaganda division of an authoritarian state? Or are you just making a rhetorical point that the NYT is usually going to see the world the same way the state department does? it's reasoning like this that lets NYT support every american butchery while still keeping its status as respected it's a rag and it's always been a rag, but it has "prestige" so people are taught to consider it something more than that
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May 12, 2019 09:34
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I think Chomsky said they supported every single military action, coup etc. that the US has been involved in in the last 100+ years. Spotless record.
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May 12, 2019 10:13
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Kawasaki Nun posted:How much time do you think Billionaires devote to dictating the reporting that goes on in their newsrooms? they don't have to dictate anything other than what type of person is employed there once you've got your rachel maddows, wolf blitzers and jake tappers in place you're set
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May 12, 2019 16:24
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the venezuelan private media straight up collaborated in the 2002 coup with barefaced lies and manipulated videos but they're private so it's fine I guess, let's destroy any media that doesn't broadcast live from Langley 24/7
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May 12, 2019 17:07
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Kawasaki Nun posted:So you're under the impression that they only hire journalistic talent that conforms with their political ideology? And the remaining talented would-be journalists are simply blacklisted from the American media employment system? I'm not "under the impression", I'm describing reality to you. That's how corporate media works, and that's why there aren't any leftist firebrands in there but you have people desecrating Leonard Cohen songs in order to glorify killing machine launches.
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May 12, 2019 17:43
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It's fine to be a propaganda outlet as long as it's not official, as long as you can couch it in velvet language where the CIA and the State Department are "sources" and getting your marching orders is "contacting X for comment". You can be wrong over and over and over again, lie over and over and over again and help psychos commit mass murder over and over and over again, as long as you're deemed "respected" it's all fine. But if you're honest about what you're doing you get designated "state propaganda".
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May 12, 2019 17:50
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Kawasaki Nun posted:Right I'm not trying to say the msm works well or serves it purpose or anything else. I'm simply trying to illustrate how there on constraints in a competitive media system that are absent for state run media. there aren't any constraints, you're making them up and ignoring reality nyt is worse than telesur because telesur's influence is miniscule compared to the murderous times and its audience and telsur is more trustworthy, even if it's state propaganda (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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May 12, 2019 17:52
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Kawasaki Nun posted:I've seen quite a few articles on the insidious nature of the alt right. Dozens in 2015, and even more in the years that followed. wow they managed to publish some articles critical of the alt-right, great job then they gave regula rop eds to bret stephens and bari weiss the truth is in the middle I guess
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May 12, 2019 17:59
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Kawasaki Nun posted:State media isn't beholden to the tastes of consumers though, that's entirely the point. which makes it better writing what the people want to hear is directly opposed to the public interest
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May 12, 2019 18:00
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Darth Walrus posted:That's a lot of words to say 'no, I don't know poo poo about the country or its recent history'. Do you want to rectify that? Because the best way is to read more, ask our local venegoons some questions, and not go into multi-paragraph rants about your deep and sincere love for kleptocrat propaganda from a government that tortures journalists. read more (of what I tell you to read) ask locals (but only the ones I tell you to ask)
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May 12, 2019 18:02
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Helsing posted:On the other hand the New York Times reporting on foreign countries with governments that the American government doesn't like is much less reliable. On the contrary, it's reliably bad whenever a country's interests are opposed to the interests of the US government.
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May 12, 2019 18:06
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Darth Walrus posted:It takes a special kind of person to take such personal affront to the idea of diversifying their perspective on a country they know so little about. it takes a completely ordinary kind of person to play semantic games like this
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May 12, 2019 18:25
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Kawasaki Nun posted:There is a not small contingent of posters itt that believe anyone who presents opinions or observations contrary to their worldview are either under the control of malicious forces or are unwitting collaborators. 
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May 12, 2019 18:27
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yes, the NYT editors are free to edit the paper in the way the State Department tells them to, that was never in question
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May 13, 2019 18:16
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Kawasaki Nun posted:Do you ever post anything of substance or are you satisfied with being white noise? the substance is there, but I'm not surprised you can't see it
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May 13, 2019 18:37
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Kawasaki Nun posted:The substance is that you are more interested in pithy one liners than having a discussion, and it's the definition of white noise. what discussion is possible with someone as consistently wrong as you?
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May 13, 2019 18:48
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Every post you write builds the case against your own thesis. Like you just described the same thing that I said previously - that the best way to keep your media on the company line is to employ the people who don't have to toe it because they already believe it.
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May 13, 2019 21:11
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lmao was it created specially for the article
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May 15, 2019 16:49
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Shaocaholica posted:Lol what stake does he have in this? he's a decent human being
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May 15, 2019 20:41
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Darth Walrus posted:Read back through that guy's post history in this thread and realise what an incredibly gross thing that was to say. he's possibly the worst poster in the thread
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May 26, 2019 12:58
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30.5 Days posted:How could anyone know if a former settler state has racism without living there? It is a mystery. no you see it's enough to be born in a country to be "intimately familiar" with the social and economic circumstances of every citizen of any class which is why I get my views on america from alex jones and sarah palin, they're americans
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May 26, 2019 13:05
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Darth Walrus posted:OK, so which independent left-wing Venezuelan journalists have you been getting news from that might give you a better understanding of the country? it's great how you're setting up this dumb loving dichotomy where you gotta get your info either from the guy who said pinochet was better than maduro but has the right amount of venezuelan genes or some fairytale venezuelan independent left journalist
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May 26, 2019 13:24
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Darth Walrus posted:Cute way to admit you don't know poo poo about the country but are willing to scream at its residents anyway. Bet you have some real fun opinions on Syrian refugees. yeah, I'm also superhitler in disguise, you caught me! guess I can't escape your intrepid intellect, which isn't capable of basic reasoning like "maybe being born in a place doesn't endow one with automatic familiarity with all societal issues in that place".
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May 26, 2019 13:29
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how dare you argue with real venezuelans btw obama was an illegal president cause he was born in kenya, I know because actual americans told me so
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May 26, 2019 23:48
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fnox posted:and I don’t understand why you guys make the distinction between people of German and English descent but not between people of Haitian or Cameroonian descent if you're talking about the "sabine mengele-eichmann" jokes they're not "making a distinction", it's an implication that they're (grand)children of nazis
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May 28, 2019 07:38
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536 posted:Obviously. But thats not to forget there are a ton of maduro apologists that post Telesur uncritically and say that its just the same as the NYT. of course not, the nyt is worse
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May 30, 2019 14:28
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Slanderer posted:You're right, they were bad leftists for not...parroting right-wing propaganda and supporting america's colonialist foreign policy? no, you see, users of the somethingawful forums were supposed to enact political change in both the internal politics of venezuela but also foreign policy of the united states this is a completely good faith argument
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Jun 2, 2019 17:39
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Darth Walrus posted:He's asking for goons to help Venezuelan refugees, either personally through donations and charity work or through lobbying any relevant political figures/organisations. Helping people flee the country and make actual lives for themselves once they're out is a lot easier and less reprehensible than Trumpian regime change. it's obvious from my post that I'm replying to all his bitching about "leftists" and "tankies" not doing anything about maduro so why are you replying to me referencing something that has nothing to do with what I'm talking about? I already know why, because you're disingenuos
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Jun 2, 2019 18:27
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fnox posted:What do you call an outlet that gets every story wrong? the new york times
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Jun 5, 2019 13:06
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fnox posted:He's free, therefore not a dictatorship. But if he were arrested, he deserves it, therefore not a dictatorship. Cool. Lets set some metrics, what would Maduro need to do for you to consider him a dictator? the freedom of a coup plotter isn't a yes or no litmus test of whether somebody is a dictator or not, maduro can be or not be a dictator whether guaido is in prison or not
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Jun 6, 2019 16:24
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the part of the loop that's conveniently missing from your account is the one where you say "it's already as bad as that" and (some) people don't believe you
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Jun 6, 2019 20:36
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*does not want his children to suffer, sees a door labeled "way out" and reaches for it* A man with a distinguished neckbeard aproaches you and says "You have to vaccinate your children, not doing it may lead to worse suffering for them and others. Here's a list of many people who went through that door and what happened to them and others. This is a bad idea." "gently caress YOU you motherfucker, obviously you don't care about the suffering my child will go through RIGHT NOW, I don't care that you THINK poo poo is worse behind that door, maybe it will be better, you don't know, you don't care about me, gently caress you and your bullshit list"
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Jun 8, 2019 12:29
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thank you for proving my point, these "stories" are dumb as hell and prove nothing actually on closer reading the first one is dumber than I thought because it explicitly says that everyone who passed through the door ended up worse
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Jun 8, 2019 13:44
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Rust Martialis posted:Yeah, agreed, yours was pretty dumb, neglecting active suffering going on right now. yours is dumber cause you're actively inviting more suffering but cloaking it in "well we can't be one hundred percent sure that the same thing will happen that I admit happens every single time"
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Jun 8, 2019 15:56
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Darth Walrus posted:When is the last time you saw that lot actually ask a question and try to learn more about the country this thread is about? this is just "read the OP" and "ask venegoons" in different words
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Jun 9, 2019 04:35
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Darth Walrus posted:I mean, pfft, talking to and learning from people with different life experiences from your own? On an international discussion forum? Who does that, amirite? so I should trust everything someone has to say about a country if he's from that country? or is it that having an account on SA imbues their analysis of a complex situation with additional credibility?
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Jun 9, 2019 05:28
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Rust Martialis posted:No, but you might try not being utterly dogmatically close-minded in the face of massive suffering, just for once. unlike you? or is it "intellectual stability" when you do it and "dogmatic close-mindedness" when someone else does? word games
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Jun 9, 2019 06:26
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Rust Martialis posted:My position has changed as I learn and events take place, over the literal *years* this thread has followed the PSUV driving Venezuela into the poo poo. Try again, maybe. lmao I don't believe you for a second
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Jun 9, 2019 07:28
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Rust Martialis posted:My post history button exists, friend. I don't know if you're winding me up or what but your posting history doesn't show anything. Maybe the search is broken, so your great transformation remains hidden.
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Jun 9, 2019 08:43
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