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RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Yeah but that's dumb and bad and also you only get it late game or if you're England.

E:

I'm willing to admit that I totally forgot that it existed though since I rarely get to Con Mon and never play as England :v:

RabidWeasel fucked around with this message at 00:10 on Jan 26, 2016

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RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

YF-23 posted:

I don't really remember seeing much talk about it, but do you remember how we were talking in the thread about how CK2's DLC is poo poo what with always expanding it the wrong way? There's a new DLC to be released on February 2nd that is just the opposite of that, Conclave. It went so far under the radar that they only had time to make 3 dev diaries for it:

Conclave Dev Diary #1
Conclave Dev Diary #2 (mostly council mechanics, realm peace)
Conclave Dev Diary #3 (because this one was posted yesterday, a week before release, they are giving a huge infodump on literally every feature so prepare for a long read)

Cool I might play CK2 for the first time in like 2 years.

I'd love it if someone did another learning LP since it sounds like there's going to be a gently caress ton of changes.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Gort posted:

The possibilities were nice, but some of the options were pretty game-breaking.

SMAC.txt

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
That looks like a really fun game, I'd tag Luxembourg over to Brandenburg though, makes more sense that way and you won't get Luxembourgian Germany :v:

Is that Papal Venice?

E: Just noticed Lux has some more provinces in the France area so gently caress if I know, maybe make it a PU instead of a single state?

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
I notice that a ton of the generally accepted good changes to CK2 have basically been making it work more like EU :v:

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
I wasn't expecting to be so excited about something that mundane but I've been wanting another game to try V2-style war goals for a while. I think one of the issues with EU4 is that because any war can become a 100% peace treaty, you're incentivised to usually push to that point. Presumably the peace AI can be designed so that it will be more willing to give up in a limited war than for a huge 100% conquest attempt (I don't mean this in a strict warscore sense but more that hopefully we won't see EU4-style AI stubbornness in smaller wars).

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
CKII later starts are cool and good already though, you can choose some badass historical figure and try and outdo them, or take the last member of a dying dynasty / culture / religion and make them great. EU4 later starts OTOH just kick you in the balls with lovely NI choices

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Polikarpov posted:

That is a good flag.

You're correct :prepop:

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
Yeah if it's only 4-6 planets I'm micromanaging then that's fine, my main concern would be that there needs to be something to prevent you from taking control of a system directly every however many turns, optimising pops, and then giving it back to the sector you got it from originally. This would be optimal if there isn't anything specifically making it not work, but it would also be horribly micro-heavy.

(they already confirmed that you can take back planets from a sector)

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Because apparently I didn't respond to this at the time:

quote:

I think you'l find that Ubik actually owns that hospital now

:vince:

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

VerdantSquire posted:

thanks for making me feel really hosed up for force vassaling some weaker nations

At least you didn't force annex them, that's got to be illegal :gonk:

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
Having alien slaves around reminds you how you are superior to them and also probably makes your life easier because they can do work which would otherwise have to be paid for, or perhaps is highly dangerous or unpleasant. I mean I'm pretty sure a lot of white plantation owners supported bringing more black slaves into the southern US while also being racist.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Kersch posted:

If Stellaris doesn't have sexy catboys, I may have to sit this one out

Mods will fix it :pervert:

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
I really want to know the story behind the disgusting red borders because there's no way anyone thought that looked good.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Gort posted:

Well, that was a disappointing game of Darkest Hour.

Played the USSR, went to partial mobilisation during the Winter War with Finland, ended up building so many divisions between then and 1941 that Germany took one look and decided not to attack me. Since I'd been using my slider moves to make the USSR less of a dictatorial hellhole, I couldn't declare war on Germany myself.

Waited until 1944 before giving up :/

Congratulations, you saved millions of lives, you won :)

If you didn't care about that then you shouldn't have stopped being Stalin The Paranoid rear end in a top hat.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Autonomous Monster posted:

I don't remember that.

What I do remember is that, at release, there were no limits on who could assimilate. Meaning that, by 1900 or so, the entirety of the Indian subcontinent would go British. One billion primary-culture POPs makes for a hell of a lot of industry :catstare:

Also Victoria is actually good and fun and I will greet the third instalment with joy, good cheer and a primal lust for wildly overdesigned economic simulations. :colbert:

My favourite variant on this was internal migration in V1 allowing you to f.e. get the entire population of Poland to move to the Ruhr and then assimilate to German because they moved over in a constant stream and never became a majority.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Star posted:

This is a worse semi-ironic derail than the whole bonuses/bonii poo poo.

Thanks to Stellaris we have the fun of arguing over the correct plural to use for ethos :v:

(I think it's ethea?)

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
I'd forgotten how much I loved that picture. A treasure for us all.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Phlegmish posted:

I feel like the people who are complaining now would not be fans of this solution.

It's not great but it's more accurate. The biggest problem is that the name needs to be able to apply to both an individual's belief as well as the way that the government functions. I like the Heirarchial vs. Egalitarian choice of naming which has been suggested on the forums but it isn't anywhere near as snappy in spite of being a better representation of what the ethos actually means in game terms (focusing mostly on the slavery tolerance part)

Randarkman posted:

Or make it so that fanatic collectivism assures smiles and rainbows for everyone instead of famine and death camps.

This is what actually happens, though. Fanatic collective pops don't dislike being slaves, and use less food, so they're both happy and more famine resistant!

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

GaussianCopula posted:

In most cases it's the pops that are not fanatically supporting the collective regime that get sent to death camps.

I'm talking about Stellaris specifically where there is nothing game-mechanistically making "collectivist death camps" a thing. I am kind of annoyed about this because of the number of posts I've seen on other forums along the lines of "woah these guys are evil commie gulag masters because their ethos game effect has the word slavery in it, and the glorious :911: free market is an objective good". Yes I'm getting mad about other peoples' headcanon and I'm a lovely baby for it but come on. If the ethos was more appropriately named it wouldn't be a problem.

A Buttery Pastry posted:

I think we're talking about HoI? Though the issues are similar.

I was replying to the post immediately above mine, assuming that it referred only to Stellaris given the use of the word Ethos. I'm not really interested in HoI4, my small amount of enthusiasm for it was crushed by Stellaris being much more my type of game and setting.

Chief Savage Man posted:

Paradox Grand Strategy: The Truth Is In The Middle

Furthermore, Liberalism must be destroyed :ussr:

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

A Buttery Pastry posted:

You get escalating events informing you of the Holocaust being carried out, choosing any option but "I, Adolf Hitler, am fully in favor of the destruction of the Jews through the use summary executions and extermination camps." results in a German civil war where the player is put in control of regular conservative Wehrmacht dudes. Winning this war after having chosen any of the other options in the first Holocaust event gives the player the "Clean Wehrmacht" achievement.

This reminds me that the communist germany mod owned and I want it to be a thing for HoI4.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
This entire conversation has made me extremely thirsty for a "general war never broke out in early 20th century Europe but some other poo poo happened and now everyone's nervous again" HoI4 mod. Though I guess that it's a lot more difficult to construct a scenario there that's both plausible and produces fun gameplay, compared to something like Kaiserreich.

I think it's a lot more interesting of a question in terms of alt histories though, WW2 is so much the child of WW1 that it's intriguing to think what could have happened without it.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Ofaloaf posted:

There was a Hearts of Iron 2 mod to that end, A Peace To End All Peaces. Can't recall if it was any good or not, probably involved a Nazi France or some such.

I had a vague memory of this but wasn't it more or less just "nothing happens in Europe for 20 years, then suddenly WW1 starts in 1938". Like it was just WW1 being fought with WW2 tech?

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Groogy posted:

But FT only adds content for the campaign(new auxiliary races, etc. [mostly graphical assets]) which some custom games cannibalized. If you bought WC3 to play DotA then that is your game. Are you gonna say that EU3 was not complete unless you had Steppe Wolf or Magna Mundi?

Not that I agree on the point you're arguing against but yes EU3 was extremely incomplete without mods. I don't think I played the game vanilla more than once or twice for every expansion.

On the contrary I don't use any CK2 or EU4 mods other than cosmetic stuff.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Enjoy posted:

Someone on Reddit just concluded a cool after action report of Commie Germany Mod for Darkest Hour

https://www.reddit.com/r/paradoxplaza/comments/493ttc/a_communist_germany_aar_part_1/
https://www.reddit.com/r/paradoxplaza/comments/4ll3m3/a_communist_germany_aar_part_17_final_part/

It's pretty well written (the AAR I mean) and he's done that thing where he cleans up the narrative/events so it's more entertaining to read

Doesn't invite Trotsky to lead the government, this guy is dead to me now.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Stairmaster posted:

three miles-prower island.

:vince:

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Tomn posted:

Regardless of which game it's in I personally really, really like the idea of game mechanics not just allowing but encouraging you to lose gloriously. It's something to break up the otherwise uninterrupted and snowballing rise to power that usually shows up in strategy games.

Yeah I remember there being some pretty bad but interesting looking game I saw on the LP forum once where you play as one of a selection of empires in various time periods and you won by essentially getting hosed over slightly less badly than in actual history.

I get the impression that it was an adaptation of a weird board game but my memories are extremely hazy on this in general, I just liked the idea of "success by not losing so hard".

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Autonomous Monster posted:

This wasn't Great Invasions by any chance, was it?
Quite possibly, I just looked that game up and it does seem familiar, though it also looks almost exactly like EU2 so :iiam:

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Phi230 posted:

I feel like Stellaris half heartedly included a bunch of "paradox" features like pops and vassals and warscore but they had none of the depth that makes them good in the games they are from. Like a lot of stuff like cassus belli, warscore, etc really may as well have not been there because they didnt matter.

Like named wars. A minor feature that adds flavor in other games but in stellaris it doesnt matter what wars are named because wars arent really fought for any reason

Someone linked to this in the Stellaris thread and I think that it's a pretty good read, it makes it sound like they spent maybe 2 years figuring out the game's identity crisis and making the UI and related items work well, then all of the actually important stuff to do with systems and balance got churned over in the last 6 months and mulched down into a "boring but kind of works" implementation. Look how many times they said that they had a feature removed or seriously overhauled close to release.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

ThaumPenguin posted:

I hate being "the Chosen one" in RPGs.

It's stressful.

Stress is fine, the problem is that it just throws a whole load of baggage in terms of story and probably gameplay which are totally worthless or actively detrimental unless you're someone specifically looking to be "the hero".

Open world survival games have the stress without the baggage :v:

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
They managed to take 2 of the biggest mods from EU3 and combine the worst traits of both and then poo poo even more crimes against visual design on top, it's quite special.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
V3 is going to have to be the best game ever to overcome my sadness at not getting a good cold war game but I'm optimistic.

Also this time can we please not have really weird dumb ideologies just for symmetry's sake? :anarchists: not :ancap: please

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

ArchangeI posted:

I still don't get the OOB fetish. It was only in one out of four HoI games (I guess if you wanted to be super-specific it was only in one out of 6) and yet people pretend it is the most important part of the series. And it adds nothing! Nothing at all! No one ever agonized on whether this army should have that general or this one, no one ever wondered if the first corps should have three divisions or four. It was something you tried to engage with as little as humanly possible. ANd what little choice there was is still replicated by the system in HoI 4.

It...just...WHY?

If you're a "realism is always good even when it makes the game worse" grognard then it's essential.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Groogy posted:

In HOI4 the AI can actually do stuff.....
I remember when Wiz managed to get the HOI3 AI get into a gridlock where it went like "Dafuq is happening... what how now? Eeeh okay?" and it just collapsed on itself and couldn't do anything anymore.
Just want to point out, I've completed more CK2 games from Charlemagne than I've done HOI3... HOI franchise was always my least favorite.

So we agree that HoI is bad, time to ram all those dev hours into Rome 2: Victoria 3: an East vs. West Game

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
I unironically think that the oases are pretty cool but everything else is dumb and bad especially HRE provinces that look just as stupid as they did in real life.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
Honestly EU4 is much less mod friendly what with the constant huge patches and core game being improved on all the time compared to EU3's small number of expansions and much smaller, less frequent patches, plus the core game having more obvious issues to fix with mods.

I am a little surprised that there doesn't seem to be a popular mod which aims to make the game slightly slower paced and more historically plausible without being some gigantic total conversion monstrosity; EU3 had a ton of them but they seem to all have died or suffered from fatal feature bloat.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
Where can I buy the wallpaper. I do not need to feel human if I can be surrounded by the loving embrace of flags.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Autonomous Monster posted:

Fascist Babylonia is the raddest poo poo :eyepop:

It's historically accurate for fascists to have the coolest flags but it's a shame that so many crazy good flags in V2 are fascist only. Unbroken Tower of Babel flag is pretty loving legit though.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Groogy posted:

Because there is tons of hard coding for how people should migrate and move in the scripts. Just like how it is hard coded that all of Italy's population should be exterminated in case you don't form Italy. Or my favorite, get instant game over because an AI pressed the "Form Germany" button.

I think you are gonna need a war to break out somewhere in high populated areas if you want to get immigrants.


It's not until CK2 we started being way more dynamic with how we design our scripts and go on more values than directly "You are USA so here is a +1000% migration bonus".


TL;DR: If you are playing Vicky2 and not one of the big name nations then expect to not be playing by the same rules like everyone else. Also you will probably be majorly hosed if you are not good at exploiting the game mechanics.

In all seriousness this is why people (though let's be honest, there's not many of us) go on about V3 so much - the first 2 games were great in spite of being kind of bad in a lot of places so the thought of a Victoria game with the polish and attention to detail of EU4 or CK2 is extremely compelling.

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RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
I like the strat where you buy non-core provinces off Russia, get all the non-Russians to migrate to your other provinces, then sell the massively depopulated provinces back to Russia at a premium because they're now Russian culture :v:

At least I think that's how it worked, it's been a long time.

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