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JT Smiley posted:Personally, as a black man, I don't want Iris to be the ultimate prize in this white man's power fantasy. How can it be the white man's power fantasy when the literal problem is that white society in America doesn't value black women or find them attractive? This is about how the media disrespects black female characters. It's a feminist issue, it's not about you. It's about those little girls who say "Iris looks like me, we're beautiful."
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Aug 23, 2016 20:45
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JT Smiley posted:I don't even get the point of all this discussion when the show never stops hitting us over the head with how Iris and Barry are destined to be together. It's obviously going to happen, it's just this show sucks at romantic relationships so they have to come up with artificial barriers for the two of them. This is probably the opposite of the white man's power fantasy lol. This isn't Iris lusting after Barry, it's the opposite. Iris had two dudes vying for her affection. She's p much been the one controlling whatever she wants her love life to be.
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Aug 23, 2016 20:51
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Koalas March posted:How can it be the white man's power fantasy when the literal problem is that white society in America doesn't value black women or find them attractive? I'm referring to the show as a whole and I only brought up my face because you asked if anyone paying was black.
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Aug 23, 2016 20:54
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JT Smiley posted:I'm referring to the show as a whole and I only brought up my face because you asked if anyone paying was black. I didn't "ask if anyone was black". I asked one poster if he was white or not, so I could try and see his frame of reference. He could be any ethnicity. I was asking one specific person so I that I could better understand his personal point of view. I'm not saying you're not free to jump in with your opinion, after all this is a forum, but please don't twist my words.
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Aug 23, 2016 21:07
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Hey, I wasn't trying to twist your words I just misread what you said as I skimmed the thread before work.
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Aug 23, 2016 21:11
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JT Smiley posted:Hey, I wasn't trying to twist your words I just misread what you said as I skimmed the thread before work. We are cool, it was just a misunderstanding.  
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Aug 23, 2016 21:21
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iris is super hot and cool, we just need more of her as a main character doing her own stuff instead of just being another part of barry's support network. i think she really needs your standard "ace reporter uncovering something big" story arc soon, that would help.
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Aug 23, 2016 23:51
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I don't think we need parallel plots.
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Aug 23, 2016 23:57
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just have what she uncovers be related to the villain in some way, maybe something like a way to defeat him or his secret identity. daredevil did it pretty well but the writers for this show are a bit worse so idk if it would work
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Aug 24, 2016 00:05
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She had her own big plot with Joe and Wally last year, in which Barry served as a support character.
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Aug 24, 2016 00:05
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that was good but iirc while that was a way to introduce Wally's street racing stuff it wasn't really related to the main plot of zoom being bad guy. i want something that is related, or at the very least an episode with Iris as the one to find an escaped trickster or some other dangerous guy through reporter stuff
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Aug 24, 2016 00:15
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Aphrodite posted:I don't think we need parallel plots.
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Aug 24, 2016 00:28
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So interesting enough Greg Berlanti said that Savitar has not yet been casted. What this means is (SDCC trailer spoilers if those are still off limits) The black speedster fighting Wally in the Flashpoint trailers is just some rando and not Savitar
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Aug 24, 2016 01:55
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lotus circle posted:So interesting enough Greg Berlanti said that Savitar has not yet been casted. What this means is (SDCC trailer spoilers if those are still off limits) The black speedster fighting Wally in the Flashpoint trailers is just some rando and not Savitar Good, gently caress that guy, shirtless Savitar for life
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Aug 24, 2016 02:44
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Guy A. Person posted:Good, gently caress that guy, shirtless Savitar for life Hell yes
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Aug 24, 2016 04:00
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That other black suit speedster is apparently The Rival
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Aug 24, 2016 05:55
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There is a never-ending lineage of speedster glam twinks CW can deploy to frustrate Barry with!
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Aug 24, 2016 06:03
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I'm white and think Iris is hot as hell, so I hope this helps.
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Aug 24, 2016 14:47
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My opinion is, I don't care who Barry ends up with so sure, the arguments for Iris seem reasonable, but whoever it is can they please just not do the thing where they keep dumb secrets from each other for no reason like everyone in these shows does? Because that is the worst.
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Aug 24, 2016 15:57
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Tiggum posted:My opinion is, I don't care who Barry ends up with so sure, the arguments for Iris seem reasonable, but whoever it is can they please just not do the thing where they keep dumb secrets from each other for no reason like everyone in these shows does? Because that is the worst. Of course there's nothing preventing the writing staff from introducing a new black/Asian/whatever love interest that also does poo poo, or even giving Iris something to do like her journalism gig, but that won't happen because gently caress.
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Aug 24, 2016 16:30
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Pizdec posted:My point essentially was that this WILL happen regardless given the writing of this show, so it might as well happen with a nice role model for an underrepresented part of society. Whether that's black female with no agency vs a white female that does poo poo is murky, is there a social justice point system I can use?
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Aug 24, 2016 18:02
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Tiggum posted:My opinion is, I don't care who Barry ends up with so sure, the arguments for Iris seem reasonable, but whoever it is can they please just not do the thing where they keep dumb secrets from each other for no reason like everyone in these shows does? Because that is the worst. This is standard CW writing, the characters refuse to tell each other anything. Barry: you don't understand, I wish I could tell you! Iris: I don't want to hear it *iris leaves in a huff* Barry: but I'm the flash...
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Aug 24, 2016 18:09
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ElCondemn posted:This is standard CW writing, the characters refuse to tell each other anything. That's just really a staple of the majority of TV nowadays and not something you can just dump on the CW. Especially when other shows on the network (izombie, crazy ex-girlfriend) handle the same situations so much better. Also I hope they keep Barry single until they make him likeable season one Barry again.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:11
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JT Smiley posted:That's just really a staple of the majority of TV nowadays and not something you can just dump on the CW. Especially when other shows on the network (izombie, crazy ex-girlfriend) handle the same situations so much better. I don't know, I watch iZombie and had to stop for a while because of all the pointless secret keeping. I'm not saying it's just a CW issue, it's just a standard thing with the CW to create drama by characters refusing to talk to each other. There are lots of shows that don't rely on this trope to create entertaining TV, but it's just especially bad in teen drama shows because the stakes are so low.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:23
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To be fair, "I'm a Zombie" isn't really the most believable secret. Even when she tells Clive in the season 2 finale, his reaction is "I don't believe you."
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Aug 24, 2016 20:57
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Magenta is also in this season.
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Aug 24, 2016 21:02
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Koalas March posted:Iris is strong willed. She went to a dangerous man, alone, to try and keep her brother out of trouble. I get what you're trying to do but like half the cast of the show matches this profile (idk about the last scene I dont really watch deleted scenes and ill be honest anything including wally i just kinda switched my brain off). EDit: Yeah I understand there is racial/cultural stuff im not going to get as a non-american but gently caress, literally any time Iris and Barry interact it either is or results in the absolute worst TV the show spits out. There is zero chemistry, the dialogue is embarrassing, the drama is a complete joke and is such a blackhole of that it sucks in normally good characters, plots and dialogue into its vortex. Seems like shes a half-decent actress too because many of her scene outside of that context are for the most part solid (whenever shes not around the journalism stuff hilariously enough) kingcom fucked around with this message at 02:59 on Aug 25, 2016 |
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Aug 25, 2016 02:44
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I hope they reveal this season that Iris is actually Miss Martian.
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Aug 25, 2016 10:33
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Whizbang posted:I hope they reveal this season that Iris is actually Miss Martian. Sharon Leal will actually be playing Miss Martian.
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Aug 25, 2016 12:30
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Koalas March posted:Sharon Leal will actually be playing Miss Martian. The ridiculously hot woman from Boston Public?
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Aug 25, 2016 13:00
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TheCenturion posted:The ridiculously hot woman from Boston Public? Yes!  I'm hoping this means we get some intersectionality on Supergirl. 😊😃 Koalas March fucked around with this message at 14:13 on Aug 25, 2016 |
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Aug 25, 2016 14:09
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8q4jniBXNSE Man Cailtin's actress would look good wearing just about anything huh?
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Aug 25, 2016 17:57
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mind the walrus posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8q4jniBXNSE Caitlin isn't in that trailer? She's not the woman on Cisco's arm, if that's to whom you are referring.
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Aug 25, 2016 20:45
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Koalas March posted:Yes! You've been posting pictures of my crushes all week and now you've found a new one
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Aug 25, 2016 20:59
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ElCondemn posted:This is standard CW writing, the characters refuse to tell each other anything. I kinda like how Arrow did the opposite with Tommy. Tommy's like "were you ever going to tell me you're a crazy murder man" and instead of Oliver saying "You're my best friend, of course I was going to!", he just stares and says "No."
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Aug 26, 2016 19:40
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Koalas March posted:Yes! She can phase through me anytime 
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Aug 29, 2016 07:42
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I'm giving season 1 my first rewatch, and I am incredibly bummed at what a downturn this show took in season 2. Eobard Thawne/Harrison Wells is honestly one of the most compelling characters I've seen in any TV show. Obviously the majority of the credit goes to Tom Cavanagh, but the writing overall is significantly better and his story is complicated and tragic and weird in so many ways. When he reveals himself to/kills Cisco, Cavanagh just completely owns the complexity of the character and his situation. That line "To me, you've been dead for centuries" is delivered with so much pathos. Thawne clearly doesn't want to kill Cisco, and he says that to justify the action to himself. Major props to Carlos Valdes, whose acting ability is very understated. It's a short scene, and it's completely erased from the timeline by end of episode, but goddamn nothing this show did before or since comes close. How did this show lose its footing so terribly in season 2? Maybe season 3 will improve on things, but my expectations are incredibly low.
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Aug 30, 2016 18:14
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Tv entropy is very rarely reversed. Once the slide starts, there's almost no stopping it. Not to say I won't be watching, of course. Season 2 was bad, but it wasn't Arrow bad or anything. 
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Aug 30, 2016 18:18
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MokBa posted:How did this show lose its footing so terribly in season 2? I feel like there are a couple key things that they poo poo the bed on that hopefully they won't be repeating/have learned from this season: - they spent several episodes and story arcs building up Legends of Tomorrow (Cisco's love interest, the new Firestorm, using the Arrow crossover to setup the Hawks, etc); this kind of sucked the momentum out of the first third of the season but they obviously aren't doing this again - taking away Cold - one of their most compelling recurring villains - also to star on LoT; apparently he is a series regular on both so we should still get several episodes out of him at least - trying to recapture the "secret villain reveal" magic but doing it in a half assed way - Jay and Wells2 should have been vying for control over Barry for the first half of the series but they made Jay super milquetoast and sidelined to try and keep suspicion away from him. Also the "time remnant" fiasco was another copout to cheat the audience out of being able to put together clues in an informed way. Monster Zoom and creepy weirdo Hunter were great but meshing with the Jay from the first half just didn't work. I don't think they will try the dumb secret villain thing again hopefully, or at least not in the same ham handed way - "Barry's identity is known by everyone but his love interest (and Wally)" bullshit; now basically everyone knows and it looks like he even reveals his identity early on in the Flashpoint timeline so hopefully we don't have to put up with that poo poo - Look I liked Patty just fine but if you are going to have Barry or Iris in a relationship don't just make it a super dumb "this person is just a distraction from ~true love~" thing; this one is probably going to happen to some extent because CW but hopefully they have learned from past mistakes and can make things a tad more organic So yeah I am still optimistic. It looks like based on the preview and several rumors theres going to be lots of fun off-the-wall poo poo which is why I watch this show in the first place (cool villains like Dr. Alchemy, Top and Mirror Master, a trip to Gorilla City, and alternate universe with mega-tycoon Cisco, a flipping musical episode) but without using 8 episodes of the season as a backdoor pilot for your other show and tired rehashing of most of the first season they should be able to pull out of their nose-dive.
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Aug 30, 2016 18:42
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Guy A. Person posted:- taking away Cold - one of their most compelling recurring villains - also to star on LoT; apparently he is a series regular on both so we should still get several episodes out of him at least I have bad news friend... just kidding, he signed a multi-show contract with WB so expect Snart for years to come!
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Aug 31, 2016 01:38
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