Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
Jefferson Montero starts the game on the transfer list.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

XBenedict posted:

Still a disproportionate amount of shots hitting the woodwork.

Yeah, alright Sam.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
Just buy a 25 year old and save yourself 5 years of development time. You'll probably give up on the career before Johnny Brazil is ready for the first team.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
I like buying middle-aged journeymen for £1m and getting them their first international caps and then sticking with them even when the team outgrows their ability because I'm a sentimental old fool.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Brendan Rodgers posted:

I sold Lallana to Arsenal on day 1 for £29m including addons(!), Lovren to Monaco for £18m, and went shopping. After a dodgy start where my last FM15 tactic just horribly failed and needed a lot of tweaking, the front 3 of Morata, Sturridge, and Berardi, as IF-A, CF-A, and IF-A, is now basically winning me the league on autopilot, they're scoring preposterous goals in my super fluid and expressive/roamy tactic with Couts and Hendo just practising their killer balls and tempo dictation in every match. Combined with the new ME animations it's some of the most beautiful football I've ever watched in FM.

Think I'll go West Ham or Crystal Palace next, get them into europe.

Liverpool are again madly overrated because their researcher is in charge of the PL as a whole and can do what he wants.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
It's like a cassette tape.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
The way it works is that all teams are given a CA16 figure, which is the average Current Ability rating of the top 16 players at the club, not including new signings or players that were injured for most of the previous season. Researchers have to tailor their ratings to meet this CA16 as near as possible (also there's a few other averages, too, but CA16 is the most important). This number is based on how the team finished in their league table.

The exception to this is that Liverpool's CA16 is higher than Spurs', and about 5 points higher than Southampton's.

He doesn't have to include Sturridge (although Gerrard's crazy rating is in there).

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

joshtothemaxx posted:

For the first time ever in 4+ years of playing, I have TWO 5-star players on my MLS side. One I developed, and a Canadian regen who grew up in Norway (?). Go figure.

That just means the rest of your squad is shite.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Telex posted:

Good news! It's MLS. Two 5*'s means you win the league without even trying too hard.

5* is relative to your squad, not everyone else's. Jozy Altidore would be a 5* player on a team of 12 year old girls.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

jyrka posted:

Doesn't it say the star ratings are relative to your league when you hover your mouse over it?

It wouldn't surprise me. The game has exceptionally bad technical writing because it's written by coders and only edited when translated for foreign markets.

Tactical training develops Mental attributes, not Tactical familiarity. Fitness training develops Physical attributes, and has no effect on player fitness. On the new player instruction screen, "Closing Down Sometimes" means "Closing Down as team instruction", which can be high or low and almost never "sometimes".

Star ratings are based on your squad's current ability and reputation and your coach's' judging ability, relative to the rest of your first team squad with 2.5 stars being average. Potential stars are based on ideal development of "important attributes" with leftover PA (which literally never happens, and you would never want it to) and age, passed through the same chinese whispers machine of deliberately stupid ai. They are a waste of time and I recommend everyone removes those columns from their spreadsheets.

sassassin fucked around with this message at 10:53 on Nov 10, 2015

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

The Big Taff Man posted:

Have you bought the game yet sassassin

I have not.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
I might pick it up on Friday when it's had the release patch.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
There's a bug in the beta where old players that join in for a testimonial game don't always leave the squad afterwards.

Lampard, Gudjohnsen & Cole back at Chelsea.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Humbaba posted:

Paul Scholes just signed for my newly-promoted QPR squad... as a coach. 4.5 stars as a technical coach.

My biggest complaint so far is Charlie Austin and the "Likes to Beat Offside Trap" PPM. We won the championship in 2015/2016, and Charlie played in something like 35 games. In those games he was offside 140 times. The next highest person on the team was 15. I don't know if it's the engine or just Charlie, but we lose so many promising attacks because he's not very pacey, but tries to act like he's Sergio Aguero.

Having a lol at this because the irl Swansea fans I talk to who complain about Gomis being offside all the time are all dead keen on Austin.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
Guess I'm not getting it a while longer.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

kingturnip posted:

I'll be honest, not a fan of the way Jumping/Natural Fitness swap places between the full Player Attributes screen and the mouse-over preview.
If it was intentional, it's poo poo design, and if it's an error, it's really lazy.

It's all alphabetical. Long Throws jumps down below Technique on one of the screens when it gets abbreviated to Throws.

It's bad.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
I tried this over the weekend and they still haven't fixed players chasing after the ball when it's rolling towards a teammate. Seemed to be a bit less waiting to be tackled and falling over, though.

Still not buying it.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Brendan Rodgers posted:

Honestly it's like a day before release they jacked up the "human error" element of anything to do with closing down the ball or which man a player thinks he should mark.

To test this set your guys to minimum closing down settings and watch them on full match for a few minutes, you will see them do bizarre close downs they have no business doing and you know you didn't tell them to do, they just don't want to retain a logical shape or let the better positioned guy do it instead.

That's the biggest thing, even when 2 players should have it covered in tactical terms, and the third player should cover something else. They just go for the ball!

Buy players with lower workrate. It's a trap stat.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
I got game



edit: losing 4-1 to Spurs in the cup now. I deserve this (manager shaved off the tache).

sassassin fucked around with this message at 14:06 on Nov 29, 2015

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
40 points after 19 games, then lost to Spurs twice more after the cup defeat (5-1 final score) and now haven't won in 6.

Haven't had this many problems with form turning to poo poo after half a season for a few years.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

THE PWNER posted:

And did they remove the thing where your assistant would give you tactical advice mid-match? Like "There's too much space between our midfield and attack." That was really invaluable to tell you in what area you need to adjust your tactics. Can't find the tab.

That advice has always been counterproductive bullshit. If your short passing is working it suggests going long ball because your accuracy is good.

Limited Defenders are bad. Limited full-backs are worse. There is no need to use them unless a specific player is far worse than the average level for the league you're competing in. They are all long-ball merchants/aimless blasted clearance gurus.

'Take a breather' is a low-effort shout used for maintaining condition when a game is already won. Players stop making forward runs and don't make tackles. Why are you using it?

BWM-S isn't a holding player role. It closes down aggressively and gets involved in build-up play. You need a holding player in a 4-4-2 unless you do something funky with CB/FB relationships (FB ai is hosed in this version so don't try it).

If you did preseason right familiarity should be up around Accomplished by the time the season kicks off. I don't know how hard it is to do things properly at Conference level, though.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
code:
         GK-D
FB-S  CB-D  CB-D  FB-D
WM-S  CM-D  CM-A  WM-S
      TM-S  P-A
Standard/Flexible/No Instructions

Make small changes as necessary after a couple of league games when your team knows what it's doing and you do too.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
One of the worst things about FM is that you have to have your tactic settled from the first day to prevent your players from donkeying about when the season starts. Pre-season should be for tinkering and playing with stuff stress free, but instead any changes you make are detrimental so you just kick off and do something else for the whole game (and pray no one gets injured).

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Ragingsheep posted:

I'm convinced that they have absolutely no idea how the match engine actually works and each patch/release is them just tweaking random numbers to hope for the best.

Not far off. They also don't know what attributes do what because the coders just use them wherever they feel like as they go.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
Fire your assistant.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
You obviously know why the problem is happening and you don't want to change anything because your team is working to a specific strategy you decided to implement. There's nothing to fix (unless you are wrong and the lack of pressing is going to lead to a humiliating defeat).

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

THE PWNER posted:

Nah they just stopped working for me. I think a big problem with my wingers is that they can only play AML/AMR and not ML/MR, so I can't drop them further back into midfield when I need to. The new role suitability stuff in this version rather than just position suitability is really making versatility way more important than ever before.

The what? Positional familiarity works exactly the same as it always has.

There are star ratings, but as they are just assistant advice they should be ignored at every opportunity.

Low positional familiarity only effects the Decisions attribute of a player, so if it helps your shape feel free to play whoever you want wherever you want. It doesn't make much difference if their other attributes suits the job you want the player to do.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

texasmed posted:

I kind of wondered why I couldn't find anybody with good star ratings at roles like Complete Forward or Half Back in the conferences. I select them anyway and the forwards still get goals, so I don't really care.

The roles are just instructions, and while attributes do have an effect on players ability to follow those instructions (low workrate will limit closing down, low flair will limit risky passes etc.), there is no separate penalty applied to a player that doesn't fit the archetype for the role. Star ratings are as always just an approximation filtered through a fallible-by-design assistant ai intended to help players who don't know what they're doing (and have no intention of learning).

Pick roles based on what is best for the team and your style of play. Assigning all your players their "best" roles is missing the forest for the trees.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

8bitlawd posted:

So if you have a talented but inconsistent player are you just doomed to him under performing in half the matches or can you somewhat manage that by giving him a role off the bench. Making him save his magic for fleeting moments on the field instead.

If he's good enough at best I'd start him every game and haul him off after 45 if he's garbage.

Ideally you'd give him a non-vital role so your whole gameplan doesn't fall apart if he's off form (so not your lone playmaker if you use one).

Consistency can improve with plenty of games and a run of form.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

THE PWNER posted:

Seems like no matter how well our finances are doing my board isn't going to give me proportional wage budget increases. Got promoted, immediately went 15 mil into the green from prize money/tv money/sponsorships etc, and my wage budget increases from... 4.5mil p/a when we had 100k in the bank, to 5mil after.

Basically every player up to standard demands a wage we can't possibly afford.

Did you get a transfer budget? Pump some of that into wages.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
Protip: Never, ever use opposition instructions.

But if you do never ever let the ai set them.

Have fun watching your centre backs charge out of position to close down amcs and showing every winner inside.

If your tactic doesn't work without them your tactics sucks and you should change it.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

julian assflange posted:

Also I have noticed that in my save, TNS in the welsh premier are nearing 100 game unbeaten :pwn:

It's not a real league, don't worry.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
I've seen the new rating guidelines for the January update. Leicester players are going to be fully sick, but not as good as Liverpool who have their own special band that allows their stars to be amazing despite being poo poo irl.

Swansea are getting big deductions but that's hardly a shock.

Looks like the PL overall is getting upgraded.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
Arsenal and City are the top band so will have the strongest squads and best players. No one will get downgraded, especially if they've been injured a lot.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
The Pl head researcher is a Liverpool fan so when they decide how good each team will be in the database Liverpool are always way better than their league position implies (which is the normal metric).

In January their "star players" will be as good as anyone in the league and their squad average only below the top 4. There's a huge drop to the next band of teams which now includes Leicester. Coutinho will be 10 ca points higher than Mahrez.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Ragingsheep posted:

lol not too surprised. Did the same thing happen with Arsenal a few versions back? I remember everyone was always complaining about them.

The arsenal thing was their youth players always had sky high potential, even though their academy is second rate.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Fat Lowtax posted:

I still can't get over how ugly the managers look. I know FM is supposed to be playable on a huge range of machines (and that's good), but man

They're too cheap to hire anyone with graphics experience. Like the writing and ui stuff it's all handled by coders.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
A tactic build on solid footballing ideas will always do well in the match engine.

Most of the difficulty comes from how deliberately confusing and misleading the labelling is. Once you work out what the buttons really do it's not hard to overachieve.


Bogan Krkic posted:

I'm having good success with the same formation I use every version, 4231 with a flat back 4, DLP-S and BWM-D, IF-A AP-A IF-A, and an advanced forward. Proper defensive midfielders are crap

Defensive midfielders get bad ratings in this years game, but the ratings don't matter if the scoreboard shows the right result.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Fat Lowtax posted:

So I just signed a "good" regen winger without realizing he has a 1 for workrate, yes folks that's right a loving 1. What on earth does the match engine do with that, does he just stand around all game?

It means he won't close down unless he just happens to be near the man with the ball. Its a defensive attribute.

Getting involved in play generally is - perversely - Aggression. There is grey area overlap between the two because the coders sing from their own inconsistent hymn sheets, but the official definition of Work Rate is that it's the Pressing attribute.

In certain systems low workrate is a good thing. Train him as a Raumdeuter or something. How is his Off The Ball?

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Shazback posted:

This is some real bullshit because of how counterintuitive it is.

It's doubly confusing because most of the researchers don't know what some of the important style attributes actually do either, so you can't look at real players ingame and get an accurate sense of how things work.

Leon Britton has something like 6 Aggression. Because he's small. But for digital Leon to play like actual Leon he should have high aggression to replicate how he buzzes about the pitch, offering himself for passes and making challenges. He doesn't hide, or wait in position for the play to find him. A high aggression player gets involved (and dives into tackles).

He's also got low Off The Ball as he's not effective in the final third, even though that attribute controls how a player finds space to receive the ball all over the pitch.

Bale and Ronald have 12 Acceleration.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply