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Say Nothing
Mar 5, 2013

by FactsAreUseless

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Cumslut1895
Feb 18, 2015

by FactsAreUseless

probably already removed from wikipedia

Raygereio
Nov 12, 2012

Cumslut1895 posted:

probably already removed from wikipedia
The Kettle war was a real thing. Though it was just a tiny incident. And it wasn't really a decisive Dutch victory.
The Dutch had been blocking the river Schelde since 1585, denying Spanish controlled harbours in present day Belgium trade (and boosting trade for their own harbours). Spain ceded the southern Netherlands to Austria, who started demanding that the Schelde be opened again.
The Holy Roman Emperor (Joseph II) had the backing of the British on this and Joseph figured that the Dutch wouldn't want to piss off the British as the former just lost to the latter in the 4th Anglo-Dutch war. So in 1784 he send some ships down the Schelde. To Joseph's surprise the Dutch weren't bluffing and send a ship to intercept his ships. The Dutch fired one warning shot (which hit the poor kettle) and the Austrian ships promptly surrendered.
Both sides geared up for war, but before anything serious happened the French mediated and a treaty was signed: Some territories were exchanged and the Dutch would continue blocking the Schelde, but had to pay Austria 9,5 million guilder.

My history book mentioned that the Austrians occupied fort Lillo and broke some dikes which caused many people to drown. But I'm having trouble finding other sources for that. I guess if it happened they were considered collateral damage.

Red Bones
Aug 9, 2012

"I think he's a bad enough person to stay ghost through his sheer love of child-killing."

In the 1690s Scotland attempted to get in on the colonialism business by trying to make a land route across Panama. This involved a huge chunk of Scotland's national wealth, because very few international backers were keen on the project, so the Scottish public contributed a lot of the funds in small donations. The plan was a complete failure, bankrupted large chunks of Scotland (it took away roughly 25% of Scotland's net wealth iirc) and was a significant factor in the country forming a union with England a few years later.

anchorpunch
Mar 30, 2006
Hitler did nothing wrong.

Ringo Star Get
Sep 18, 2006

JUST FUCKING TAKE OFF ALREADY, SHIT
Well Hitler did kill himself, which is a good thing. But he caused Germany to lose the war, so yes, he did do some things wrong.

System Metternich
Feb 28, 2010

But what did he mean by that?

Red Bones posted:

In the 1690s Scotland attempted to get in on the colonialism business by trying to make a land route across Panama. This involved a huge chunk of Scotland's national wealth, because very few international backers were keen on the project, so the Scottish public contributed a lot of the funds in small donations. The plan was a complete failure, bankrupted large chunks of Scotland (it took away roughly 25% of Scotland's net wealth iirc) and was a significant factor in the country forming a union with England a few years later.

I once made an effort post about that in the old pictures thread of D&D. Fascinating stuff.

Regarding other relatively unknown colonial ventures:

  • Sweden for a time tried to establish colonies along the African Gold Coast (present-day Ghana). They were established in 1650 and annexed by the Danes in 1663 (only to lose them to the British a year later)
  • Sweden also maintained a colonial presence along the Delaware River from 1638 to 1655, when it was annexed by the Dutch. The Swedes also bought the Caribbean island of Saint-Barthélemy from France in 1784 (who bought it back in 1877) and used it as a free harbour.
  • The island of Guadeloupe was also ceded to Sweden by the British in 1813 as compensation for their losses in the Napoleonic Wars, but Sweden sold it to France a year later for the respectable price of 24 million francs. This was so much money that Sweden was able to pay off its national debt by it and establish an annual apanage to the royal family by it as well. This so-called "Guadeloupe Fund" was paid out to the royals until 1983.
  • As I said above, Denmark had annexed the Swedish possessions in Africa for a time there (they were all sold to the UK in 1850). Denmark also held a number of islands in the Caribbean which were sold to the US in 1917 and are now known as the "U.S. Virgin Islands". A number of colonial possessions in India were sold to Britain in 1845.
  • Denmark also claimed the Nicobar Islands for its colonial empire from 1754-1868. Disregarding that, the Austrian Empire also claimed a number of Nicobar islands for itself in 1778. Both that venture and the attempt to build up an Austrian presence in Africa (present-day Mocambique) went nowherea and quickly fizzled out, though.
  • The German state of Brandenburg-Prussia also tried to gain colonies for some time, trying to build up a presence both in Western Africa and the Caribbean. The earliest colony was established in 1683, and the last of them was lost to French troops in 1721.
  • The tiny German county of Hanau once tried to lease an area of about 38,600 square miles in what is today French Guiana and northern Brazil from the Dutch. Hanau, which at that time measured only 193 square miles. Hanau was nearly led into bankruptcy by the deal.
  • What is today Venezuela belonged for a while to a German banking family, the Welsers. Instead of properly governing the country, their agents only concerned themselves with looking for the fabled city of El Dorado instead, leading to Emperor Charles V. revoking their licence in 1546 after 16 years of Welser "rule". Maybe I'll be doing an effortpost about that next, because it's a pretty fascinating story.
  • The Duchy of Courland and Semigallia (today's Latvia) felt inspired by the attempts of Brandenburg (the duke's wife at the time was both from Brandenburg and a shareowner of the Dutch West India Company) and tried to start a colonial venture of its own, as well. Throughout the 17th century colonies both in West Africa and especially in the Caribbean were established, lost and established again. After finally leaving its largest (though still tiny) colony of Tobago in 1690, the Courish authorities continued to appoint absentee governors until 1795 (when the duchy was annexed by Russia).
  • Last but not least: Courland with its 200,000 inhabitants was not the smallest European power to try and colonise the Americas! A number of Caribbean islands also belonged to the Knights Hospitaller (a Catholic military order) from 1651 to 1665. As an aside: The Hospitallers, today better known as the "Sovereign Military Order of Malta", is today widely considered to be a sovereign subject of international law even though it has no territory. The Order maintains formal diplomatic relations with 105 states and issues passports, coinage and stamps.

XMNN
Apr 26, 2008
I am incredibly stupid

Red Bones posted:

In the 1690s Scotland attempted to get in on the colonialism business by trying to make a land route across Panama. This involved a huge chunk of Scotland's national wealth, because very few international backers were keen on the project, so the Scottish public contributed a lot of the funds in small donations. The plan was a complete failure, bankrupted large chunks of Scotland (it took away roughly 25% of Scotland's net wealth iirc) and was a significant factor in the country forming a union with England a few years later.
This plan was monumentally flawed from the outset because they chose a really, really lovely place to set up. Even today the area is pretty much unpopulated and undeveloped.

The Pan-American highway from the northern coast of Alaska to Tierra del Fuego isn't actually a continuous piece of road, it has a 60 mile section missing because there are still no land connections through the Darien Gap.

Siivola
Dec 23, 2012

System Metternich posted:

What is today Venezuela belonged for a while to a German banking family, the Welsers. Instead of properly governing the country, their agents only concerned themselves with looking for the fabled city of El Dorado instead, leading to Emperor Charles V. revoking their licence in 1546 after 16 years of Welser "rule". Maybe I'll be doing an effortpost about that next, because it's a pretty fascinating story.
Don Rosa made a really cool Uncle Scrooge comic about that one, by the title of The Last Lord of El Dorado.

FreudianSlippers
Apr 12, 2010

Shooting and Fucking
are the same thing!

Red Bones posted:

In the 1690s Scotland attempted to get in on the colonialism business by trying to make a land route across Panama. This involved a huge chunk of Scotland's national wealth, because very few international backers were keen on the project, so the Scottish public contributed a lot of the funds in small donations. The plan was a complete failure, bankrupted large chunks of Scotland (it took away roughly 25% of Scotland's net wealth iirc) and was a significant factor in the country forming a union with England a few years later.

Scotland was sort of already in the colonialism business since most of the settlers that colonized northern-Ireland were Scottish.

BrigadierSensible posted:

Melbourne was originally going to be called Batmania, after John Batman.

This would have lead to awesomely named football teams such as the Batmania Demons, Batmania Heart, (now Batmania City), and the currently defunct basketball team East Batmania Spectres.

Batman is a city in south-eastern Turkey (or northern Kurdistan depending on who you ask). There is also a village in Iran called Batman.

System Metternich
Feb 28, 2010

But what did he mean by that?

Batman, son of Suparman, jailed in Singapore :v:

cash crab
Apr 5, 2015

all the time i am eating from the trashcan. the name of this trashcan is ideology


Happy Armistice Day, everyone!

During the Imperial War Conference in the First World War, Canada briefly tried to gain control of Maine and Alaska because we didn't understand the idea that we were trying to seize enemy territory. :canada:

Nebakenezzer
Sep 13, 2005

The Mote in God's Eye

cash crab posted:

Happy Armistice Day, everyone!

During the Imperial War Conference in the First World War, Canada briefly tried to gain control of Maine and Alaska because we didn't understand the idea that we were trying to seize enemy territory. :canada:

Can...you provide a bit more detail :stare:

Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011




Maximum Tomfoolery
Apr 12, 2010

SeanBeansShako
Nov 20, 2009

Now the Drums beat up again,
For all true Soldier Gentlemen.
That is a hilariously small kill count, even against birds with that much ammuntion just wasted.

canyoneer
Sep 13, 2005


I only have canyoneyes for you
Inca/Andean people used a proto-freeze drying method to preserve potatoes.
Also, "jerky" is one of the few Quechua root words in English.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

SeanBeansShako posted:

That is a hilariously small kill count, even against birds with that much ammuntion just wasted.
Hence decisive emu victory.

BravestOfTheLamps
Oct 12, 2012

by FactsAreUseless
Lipstick Apathy
The Colosseum was inhabited during the Middle Ages.

The word "nepotism" comes from the practices of Popes naming nephews (nepos in latin) as cardinals. The practice was so well-established that the Cardinal Nephew was an official position for a century.

There is a fragmentary trial document from Renaissance Italy. It is a testimony of the household assassin of an Archbishop and his abbot son, concerning a murder of a peasant that they allegedly ordered. This is an utterly unremarkable case for the era.

BravestOfTheLamps has a new favorite as of 23:08 on Nov 11, 2015

Vindolanda
Feb 13, 2012

It's just like him too, y'know?

BravestOfTheLamps posted:

The Colosseum was inhabited during the Middle Ages.

Not only inhabited, but like many ancient structures it was used as a fortress by important families. There are relief panels from the outside bearing the marks of musket balls etc., and it was also used as a manufactory.

Along the theme of Ancient Rome, until the fascist period the Tiber would flood every now and again, filling the forum and low areas with silt. Because this built up after the decline of the western empire, many monuments are significantly better preserved at 20 feet above the present (and ancient) ground level. Some arches have been really knocked about by the axle bosses of early medieval carts.

Medieval Medic
Sep 8, 2011
Gille de Rais, a notable companion of Joan of Arc, was a child murdering serial killer.

Tsaedje
May 11, 2007

BRAWNY BUTTONS 4 LYFE

BravestOfTheLamps posted:

The Colosseum was inhabited during the Middle Ages.

The word "nepotism" comes from the practices of Popes naming nephews (nepos in latin) as cardinals. The practice was so well-established that the Cardinal Nephew was an official position for a century.

There is a fragmentary trial document from Renaissance Italy. It is a testimony of the household assassin of an Archbishop and his abbot son, concerning a murder of a peasant that they allegedly ordered. This is an utterly unremarkable case for the era.

Also those "nephews" were mostly the various popes' bastard sons

cash crab
Apr 5, 2015

all the time i am eating from the trashcan. the name of this trashcan is ideology


Nebakenezzer posted:

Can...you provide a bit more detail :stare:

Yes. During the conference, Robert Borden and an another representative (whose name escapes me now) vacillated between discussions. Borden's ultimate goals were to support the British Empire, and, inexplicably, gain territory and fame for the United States (possibly to increase trade). While Borden was out, his representative suggested taking over Maine and reversing the Alaskan border dispute before he was taken aside and informed that the purpose of this meeting was to distribute enemy territory, not take over the US or gain control over other Dominion islands.

If you'd like to read more, transcripts from the War Conference are available but they are very boring.

Aesop Poprock
Oct 21, 2008


Grimey Drawer

Medieval Medic posted:

Gille de Rais, a notable companion of Joan of Arc, was a child murdering serial killer.

Isn't the contemporary idea about this that basically everything brought up against him was completely false because the guy who prosecuted him stood to gain all titles to his land?

BravestOfTheLamps
Oct 12, 2012

by FactsAreUseless
Lipstick Apathy

Tsaedje posted:

Also those "nephews" were mostly the various popes' bastard sons

Nah, Cesare Borgia was really an exception. Paul III created three grandsons as cardinals, and somebody who might have been his son.

Speaking of Paul III's grandsons:


Ranuccio Farnese, prior of San Giovanni del Venice, in the habit of a Knight of Malta. Yes, even 12-year olds got monasteries (and codpieces).

- The House of Medici produced four popes, the most for a single lineage.

BravestOfTheLamps has a new favorite as of 07:42 on Nov 12, 2015

Frostwerks
Sep 24, 2007

by Lowtax

Vindolanda posted:

Not only inhabited, but like many ancient structures it was used as a fortress by important families. There are relief panels from the outside bearing the marks of musket balls etc., and it was also used as a manufactory.

Along the theme of Ancient Rome, until the fascist period the Tiber would flood every now and again, filling the forum and low areas with silt. Because this built up after the decline of the western empire, many monuments are significantly better preserved at 20 feet above the present (and ancient) ground level. Some arches have been really knocked about by the axle bosses of early medieval carts.

Not just that but it is exceedingly likely that medieval Bologna looked preeeetttyyy close to this back in the day:





Maybe not as many but there were unquestionably scores of them and it's because they're good vantage points and projectile platforms and Italians do everything as a family including fight with other families.

Munin
Nov 14, 2004


Frostwerks posted:

Not just that but it is exceedingly likely that medieval Bologna looked preeeetttyyy close to this back in the day:





Maybe not as many but there were unquestionably scores of them and it's because they're good vantage points and projectile platforms and Italians do everything as a family including fight with other families.

Well, it also had a lot to do with "mine is bigger than yours" trying to outdo the Jones stuff.

Samovar
Jun 4, 2011

I'm 😤 not a 🦸🏻‍♂️hero...🧜🏻



I can see why they didn't put THAT city in Assassin's Creed 2.

Munin
Nov 14, 2004


Samovar posted:

I can see why they didn't put THAT city in Assassin's Creed 2.

They did. One of the smaller cities you visit has a whole set of towers. Not quite as numerous as in the picture but every major noble house in the city had one.

[edit] It was San Gimignano.

twoday
May 4, 2005



C-SPAM Times best-selling author

Frostwerks posted:

Not just that but it is exceedingly likely that medieval Bologna looked preeeetttyyy close to this back in the day:





Maybe not as many but there were unquestionably scores of them and it's because they're good vantage points and projectile platforms and Italians do everything as a family including fight with other families.

Imagine their calves!

500excf type r
Mar 7, 2013

I'm as annoying as the high-pitched whine of my motorcycle, desperately compensating for the lack of substance in my life.
Something I always found neat was William Beaumont and his handyman Alexis St. Martin.

In 1822, St. Martin, a french/canadian fur trapper is shot in the abdomen in an accident on Mackinac Island in Michigan. William Beaumont is a US Army surgeon stationed in Green Bay. Beaumont treats St. Martin for his injuries but doesn't expect him to live. St. Martin lives but he has a hole in his stomach, literally. Beaumont hires Martin to be his handyman and conducts tests on him. He took foods and stuck them through St. Martin's stomach hole to learn about digestion as well as removing stomach acid and testing it outside the body. This went on for about 10 years with St. Martin hating life and running away and then returning eventually. He finally making it away for good and Beaumont tried until his death to get him to return.

Mark Twain had his railings at his house in Hartford CT unusually low so he would feel taller. He also used a balcony off his office when unwanted visitors came by to avoid lying/deceit. He would go on to the balcony while his housekeeper would meet the guest and inform them that Mr. Clements was not available as he had just stepped out.

Safety Biscuits
Oct 21, 2010

BravestOfTheLamps posted:

There is a fragmentary trial document from Renaissance Italy. It is a testimony of the household assassin of an Archbishop and his abbot son, concerning a murder of a peasant that they allegedly ordered. This is an utterly unremarkable case for the era.

That does actually seem pretty weird because why would an archbishop and an abbot conspire to murder a peasant?

RC and Moon Pie posted:

President John Tyler (1790-1862), a man who held the office from 1841-45, has two living grandsons.

As of last check. Couldn't find any evidence that they had died since the last news sources earlier this year.

I think until a couple of years ago there were still a few Confederate widows about - women who had, while very young, married old men for their pensions. Assuming the soldiers were born in 1845, living until 1930-ish doesn't impossible (age 85), and if the wives were born about 1910 they'd be 105 now. I'm being pretty generous with those figures but iirc that's roughly how the sums worked out.

Railing Kill
Nov 14, 2008

You are the first crack in the sheer face of god. From you it will spread.

Trin Tragula posted:

Napoleon Bonaparte's Imperial Guard regularly went into battle while singing a jolly little song about onions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YE70jrhOrjk

Loosely translated: "We love onions fried with oil, let's charge, the onions change us into a lion, let's charge, but no onion for those Austrian bastards, let's charge." The Grenadiers of the Old Guard, the elite of the elite, were also granted the special privilege to bitch and moan as they pleased about the vagaries of military life, and so became known as "the grumblers", or les Grognards.

This is awesome and I never knew (or bother to look, to be fair) the origin of the term "grognard." Thank you!

Nostalgia4Butts
Jun 1, 2006

WHERE MY HOSE DRINKERS AT

EX250 Type R posted:

Mark Twain had his railings at his house in Hartford CT unusually low so he would feel taller. He also used a balcony off his office when unwanted visitors came by to avoid lying/deceit. He would go on to the balcony while his housekeeper would meet the guest and inform them that Mr. Clements was not available as he had just stepped out.

He also would sleep with his head at the foot of his bed because he had a very nice headboard and thought it was a waste to not look at it as he was going to sleep

The house is very cool to go through, growing up in CT we visited it for school field trips a bunch.

syscall girl
Nov 7, 2009

by FactsAreUseless
Fun Shoe

Nostalgia4Butts posted:

He also would sleep with his head at the foot of his bed because he had a very nice headboard and thought it was a waste to not look at it as he was going to sleep

The house is very cool to go through, growing up in CT we visited it for school field trips a bunch.

So he was a Connecticut Yankee

Jaguars!
Jul 31, 2012


Wiki front page had some interesting tidbits today:

:eng101: In 2004 a Sperm whale being carried to Autopsy in Tainan spontaneously exploded due to gas buildup, showering sightseers with bits of whale.

:eng101: Harris's List of Covent Garden Ladies is "An exact Description of the most celebrated Ladies of pleasure who frequent COVENT GARDEN and other Parts of the Metropolis". IOW, a directory of London's 18th century prostitutes, complete with waxing lyrical about their anatomy and notable skills.

Jaguars! has a new favorite as of 02:41 on Nov 13, 2015

gleebster
Dec 16, 2006

Only a howler
Pillbug

BravestOfTheLamps posted:

The Colosseum was inhabited during the Middle Ages.

The word "nepotism" comes from the practices of Popes naming nephews (nepos in latin) as cardinals. The practice was so well-established that the Cardinal Nephew was an official position for a century.

There is a fragmentary trial document from Renaissance Italy. It is a testimony of the household assassin of an Archbishop and his abbot son, concerning a murder of a peasant that they allegedly ordered. This is an utterly unremarkable case for the era.

Nepos actually means grandson.

Nostalgia4Butts
Jun 1, 2006

WHERE MY HOSE DRINKERS AT

syscall girl posted:

So he was a Connecticut Yankee

Nope, born in Missouri and moved to CT

Nebakenezzer
Sep 13, 2005

The Mote in God's Eye

House Louse posted:

That does actually seem pretty weird because why would an archbishop and an abbot conspire to murder a peasant?


I think until a couple of years ago there were still a few Confederate widows about - women who had, while very young, married old men for their pensions. Assuming the soldiers were born in 1845, living until 1930-ish doesn't impossible (age 85), and if the wives were born about 1910 they'd be 105 now. I'm being pretty generous with those figures but iirc that's roughly how the sums worked out.

1949 Life magazine has an article on the 68 Civil War veterans still alive.



By 1953 they were down to five.

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goose willis
Jun 14, 2015

Get ready for teh wacky laughz0r!
Can you imagine seeing everything from Lincoln's assassination to the rise of industrialization to both World Wars and the Great Depression in-between and then the very dawn of the atomic age and the earliest parts of the space race? You would have been born in a time when nobility and monarchy were still things and the military still did cavalry charges and people owned slaves and most people were agricultural and by the time you died you'd have bombs capable of erasing entire cities from the map while there's electricity and cars everywhere and people are just starting to think of flying to the moon.

It gets better, though. Two of the people that were involved in the assassination of Franz Ferdinand at the start of World War I both lived until nearly the end of the Cold War. One lived until 1990.

1896 - 1980: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cvjetko_Popovi%C4%87
1897 - 1990: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaso_%C4%8Cubrilovi%C4%87

Can you imagine how much change these two lived through? They would have even seen the early internet!

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