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Banana Man posted:What's long pork
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Nov 5, 2018 09:00
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let us all hold hands and walk into the ocean
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Nov 5, 2018 11:03
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Relax, the oceans will come to us.
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Nov 5, 2018 11:50
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AceOfFlames posted:I will. Clearly the best course of action is just to ignore all of this and just live my life. gently caress, even something along the lines of OOCC'S Kitten Quest would be an improvement. I just hope I don't get blind to the point that I have children. Sorry to bother you again. Don't just copy me directly, but yeah, find things in your life that you love, then make up a stupid framework of what you are trying to achieve and devote your life to doing that thing as much as you can. It won't fix your depression, but it will change things a lot from 'sad all the time" to "sad a lot of the time but happy through the whole process over and over maybe for your whole life". It doesn't necessarily have to be traveling, but people that say to just stay in your house playing videogames your whole life feeling guilty are wrong. There is super cool stuff in the world and finding a sense of purpose, even if it's some dumb joke thing will, drag you along to see other stuff too, and on the way to the cat I saw a giraffatitan skeleton, watched, some german art cinema that stole the end music from paranoia agent, ate a hamburger out of a 1920s toilet stall, found a bunch of chinese passports behind a tree in an abandoned airport, went to all the famous locations from "wings of desire", and saw a bunch of weird fetuses and nipples in jars at the medical history museum, and none of that is stuff I'd have been doing without them being side trips on the main goal of petting every cat. 
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Nov 5, 2018 13:42
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Absurdism is only true philosophy to live by. Imagine Sisyphus happy.
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Nov 5, 2018 13:51
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There is not one miserable person in this thread that I believe for even a second that if a scientist called a meeting and demonstrated he could pull 100 million tons of carbon out of the atmosphere for a dollar in a scalable way and that climate change was canceled that I believe would then become happy instead of being angry and desperately trying to find the next thing that justifies their misanthropy and personal lovely pessimism.
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Nov 5, 2018 16:07
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:There is not one miserable person in this thread that I believe for even a second that if a scientist called a meeting and demonstrated he could pull 100 million tons of carbon out of the atmosphere for a dollar in a scalable way and that climate change was canceled that I believe would then become happy instead of being angry and desperately trying to find the next thing that justifies their misanthropy and personal lovely pessimism. Nah, I post in here from time to time.
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Nov 5, 2018 16:10
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:There is not one miserable person in this thread that I believe for even a second that if a scientist called a meeting and demonstrated he could pull 100 million tons of carbon out of the atmosphere for a dollar in a scalable way and that climate change was canceled that I believe would then become happy instead of being angry and desperately trying to find the next thing that justifies their misanthropy and personal lovely pessimism. I was about to say you'd be wrong but then I realized I would just switch my agenda over to the plastic in the ocean
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Nov 5, 2018 16:14
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It would be hard for you to prove that, considering it is impossible.
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Nov 5, 2018 16:19
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If there were any hope at all I think I would, funnily enough, have a child.
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Nov 5, 2018 16:27
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:There is not one miserable person in this thread that I believe for even a second that if a scientist called a meeting and demonstrated he could pull 100 million tons of carbon out of the atmosphere for a dollar in a scalable way and that climate change was canceled that I believe would then become happy instead of being angry and desperately trying to find the next thing that justifies their misanthropy and personal lovely pessimism. This is rich coming from someone who professes the alternative to endless growth should be extinction.
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Nov 5, 2018 16:32
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Mata posted:Relax, the oceans will come to us. Owlofcreamcheese posted:There is not one miserable person in this thread that I believe for even a second that if a scientist called a meeting and demonstrated he could pull 100 million tons of carbon out of the atmosphere for a dollar in a scalable way and that climate change was canceled that I believe would then become happy instead of being angry and desperately trying to find the next thing that justifies their misanthropy and personal lovely pessimism. True and good posts. Although I don't get how you can be a misanthrope and sad about climate change. It's gonna rule watching the human population drop by 10 figures at a time by the latter half of the century.
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Nov 5, 2018 16:49
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:There is not one miserable person in this thread that I believe for even a second that if a scientist called a meeting and demonstrated he could pull 100 million tons of carbon out of the atmosphere for a dollar in a scalable way and that climate change was canceled that I believe would then become happy instead of being angry and desperately trying to find the next thing that justifies their misanthropy and personal lovely pessimism. Yeah no capitalist and imperialist oppression is also a major worldwide issue and lol if you don’t find it despicable. Thankfully 18th century scientists have invented an easy and scalable tool to get rid of it, the thing is the ruling class has managed to instill in the rest population a strong fear of guillotine-based solutions.
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Nov 5, 2018 17:26
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People are depressed because the world is literally coming to an end, but here’s OOCC to mock them for it and Rime to make it worse.
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Nov 5, 2018 17:27
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If a "scientist" said all that, I'd ask them what field they were in and not be shocked at all when they say physics.
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Nov 5, 2018 17:43
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Conspiratiorist posted:This is rich coming from someone who professes the alternative to endless growth should be extinction. Everyone in this thread are some of the richest humans to ever live. Everyone making more than $18,000 a year is in the top 5% richest humans on earth. Fox news has that graphic where poor people aren't poor because they have refrigerators and that is a big laugh but lots of people on earth don't even have that. almost no one on earth currently is 'rich enough", even the richest people in the richest countries (that means you) don't really have enough to have what they need or what, and a "poor person" who is richer than 95% of the planet still has real suffering and real want and is legitimately impoverished. Like everyone in india should get the standard of life of someone in alabama making 25,000 a year and living like a king as one of the top 2% richest humans on earth, but that guy in alabama is legitimately suffering from poverty too, so the answer becomes that nearly everyone on earth needs to be unimaginably richer than they are now. Which is gonna be hard, maybe impossible, so it's try for that goal, or maybe we all die. "Don't try" isn't a valid option.
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Nov 5, 2018 17:59
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Trabisnikof posted:If a "scientist" said all that, I'd ask them what field they were in and not be shocked at all when they say physics. You mean "engineering". As a physicist, I can assure you my solution assumes a perfectly spherical and frictionless Earth and first-order perturbations at most, thereby making it a useless solution.
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Nov 5, 2018 18:43
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An interesting study on western (EU) dietary contributions to CO2 emissions. Caveat: a reminder that food production+consumption are relatively small contributor to total emissions. Also this topic tends to encourage the perennial debate over the utility of reducing individual consumption vs collective action. However the breakdown of emissions by food type and the observed relative emissions impact of food type vs location of production are interesting results IMO. The main goal of the study is to estimate the total greenhouse gas contributions for various EU state diets, accounting for production, land use, transport etc. A nice article summary is posted here: quote:A new study provides a more comprehensive accounting of the greenhouse gas emissions from EU diets. It shows that meat and dairy products are responsible for the lion’s share of greenhouse emissions from the EU diet. The abstract also summarizes the findings nicely: Global Food Security posted:The role of trade in the greenhouse gas footprints of EU diets  WTF Sweden, what happened to the environmental awareness? Also Bulgarians are way ahead of the curve  80% of emissions are meat +dairy. Also Latin America is the big non-domestic non-EU emitter. A related section from the paper: quote:Seventy percent of the LUC emissions were related to feed production, especially soybean, embedded in the animal products consumed in the EU.  Animal-product calories and non-EU (ie imported food) both scale with emissions, with animal products a relatively larger contributor.  Probably the most important plot, not properly accounting for the impact of trade and esp land-use change will miss ~20-25% of diet-related emissions. The discussion makes this point: quote:Although international trade can contribute to the efficiency of global resource use (Cole, 2004), the increasing trend in global trade has not decreased the total resource use worldwide (Wood et al., 2018). Developed OECD countries continue to displace environmental pressures onto non-OECD countries (Wood et al., 2018), which is observable when the accounting is based on consumption instead of the production perspective. In our accounting framework, consumption based accounting increases by more than 40% the EU emissions compared to production based accounting. This is mainly because production based accounting excludes emission sources such as land use change and international trade. Currently approximately 17% of EU household GHG footprints are associated with food consumption, which is nearly the same amount that is related to housing (22%) and a little less compared to the mobility sector (30%) (Ivanova et al., 2017). The food sector therefore presents an important potential for climate change mitigation, if GHG footprints can be lowered with less emission-intensive consumption and production. Stop eating animals: quote:The largest share of dietary emissions is related to the consumption of animal products, and therefore the most efficient approach to reducing dietary emissions is decreasing the amount of animal products consumed (Audsley et al., 2010, Davis et al., 2016, Foley et al., 2011, González et al., 2011, Stehfest et al., 2009). In this sense, our research confirms the conclusion of previous studies that so-called local diet emphasizing the consumption of domestic or locally produced food has less potential in reducing the emission intensity of a diet compared to a transition to a more plant-based diet (Weber and Matthews, 2008). Going beyond the study, if everyone in the EU went vegetarian overnight diet-related emissions would be cut by ~80%. The resulting diet-related per-capita annual emissions would be ~215kg CO2-eq. Current CO2-sequestration costs (assuming negative emission techs actually scale) are ~$600/tCO2, implying an annual per-capita cost to make non-animal EU food consumption carbon neutral of ~$130. This doesn't seem so bad, am I missing something? edit: VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV Defenistrator posted:What's a better alternative to carbon pricing or cap and trade? A lot of naysayers to these Strategies say there are better alternatives. "Supply-side" climate policy is an alternative, and is really a fancy way of saying preventing or restricting the ability of producers to supply fossil fuels. The idea is that it's a lot easier politically to prevent fossil fuel production capacity from being built than to implement demand side measures such as carbon taxes. No-one actually likes living next to a coal power-plant or pipeline. This David Robert's Vox article summarizes a related paper, and also showcases the four quadrants of emissions reduction policy:  Of course it's difficult to quantitatively estimate the potential for emissions reductions via supply restriction methods compared to carbon pricing. Nocturtle fucked around with this message at 20:49 on Nov 5, 2018 |
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Nov 5, 2018 19:10
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What's a better alternative to carbon pricing or cap and trade? A lot of naysayers to these Strategies say there are better alternatives.
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Nov 5, 2018 19:10
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:Everyone in this thread are some of the richest humans to ever live. Everyone making more than $18,000 a year is in the top 5% richest humans on earth. Fox news has that graphic where poor people aren't poor because they have refrigerators and that is a big laugh but lots of people on earth don't even have that. almost no one on earth currently is 'rich enough", even the richest people in the richest countries (that means you) don't really have enough to have what they need or what, and a "poor person" who is richer than 95% of the planet still has real suffering and real want and is legitimately impoverished. You can address real suffering and want and poverty without everyone living some idealized version of a middle-class Western life. There are lifestyle tradeoffs that can be made to allow for a more sustainable society without making everyone on the planet impoverished and miserable. It is beyond loving absurd that you would post this after posting this: quote:There is not one miserable person in this thread that I believe for even a second that if a scientist called a meeting and demonstrated he could pull 100 million tons of carbon out of the atmosphere for a dollar in a scalable way and that climate change was canceled that I believe would then become happy instead of being angry and desperately trying to find the next thing that justifies their misanthropy and personal lovely pessimism. Because you are doing the exact same thing that you are whining about the "miserable people" in this thread doing. There is nothing anyone here can say that will make you accept anything less than pedal to the metal expansion and you would literally prefer that human civilization die out rather than in any way alter what it means to have a good standard of living. "Everyone has to be able to live like rich Americans or we all die" is not loving humanism.
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Nov 5, 2018 19:49
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Paradoxish posted:You can address real suffering and want and poverty without everyone living some idealized version of a middle-class Western life. There are lifestyle tradeoffs that can be made to allow for a more sustainable society without making everyone on the planet impoverished and miserable. Made by who? Over the next 50 years china and india are going to have almost 3 billion people waking up and asking "why don't we have a middle class?" and the sacrifices you've decided you would be willing for them to make will literally not matter. When they decide they want tvs and cars and college educations the only solution possible is to have the good cars and tvs all ready so they want those or some equivalent they like better. If that technology is impossible then too bad, they will just use the regular old cars and tvs and either the world will die or we will adapt or whatever, a bunch of ideals about self sacrifice won't come into it at all.
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Nov 5, 2018 21:16
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:Made by who? Over the next 50 years china and india are going to have almost 3 billion people waking up and asking "why don't we have a middle class?" and the sacrifices you've decided you would be willing for them to make will literally not matter. Over the next 20 years they'll quite likely have a billion climate refugees between them. I think you don't appreciate the problem here. 
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Nov 5, 2018 21:23
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Of course oocc doesn't understand how even if we decouple emissions from quality of life in the future (we can if we choose) that emissions now still have a massive impact on the climate. When the world makes harder sacrifices in the future it will be exactly because we didn't make easier sacrifices now.
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Nov 5, 2018 21:32
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The Dipshit posted:Over the next 20 years they'll quite likely have a billion climate refugees between them. I think you don't appreciate the problem here. I pretty much agree with you here... I wonder how that will play out seeing as they both have nukes.
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Nov 5, 2018 21:33
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Defenistrator posted:What's a better alternative to carbon pricing or cap and trade? A lot of naysayers to these Strategies say there are better alternatives. Strict international climate policy contracts enforced by tariffs, sanctions and trade blockades off the top of my head. Would never work because of the US.
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Nov 5, 2018 21:37
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incredible flesh posted:let us all hold hands and walk into the ocean No, we should all walk into the ocean on our own. Proof that individual action can make a difference.
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Nov 5, 2018 21:52
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:There is not one miserable person in this thread that I believe for even a second that if a scientist called a meeting and demonstrated he could pull 100 million tons of carbon out of the atmosphere for a dollar in a scalable way and that climate change was canceled that I believe would then become happy instead of being angry and desperately trying to find the next thing that justifies their misanthropy and personal lovely pessimism. Nah, we would be wiped out by a gamma ray burst the next Tuesday after that.
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Nov 5, 2018 21:54
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Libluini posted:Nah, we would be wiped out by a gamma ray burst the next Tuesday after that. A GMB would only wipe out half the planet though. But then again that paradoxically would save the half that survived from climate change.
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Nov 5, 2018 22:09
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qkkl posted:A GMB would only wipe out half the planet though. But then again that paradoxically would save the half that survived from climate change. I'm pretty sure one half of the planet suddenly exploding would kill the other half as dead, just slower
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Nov 5, 2018 22:10
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The entire planet would definitely feel the loss of the ozone layer, compounded by regret over the ultimately unnecessary Freon ban.
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Nov 5, 2018 22:15
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So are you all just waiting for a signal to start a violent uprising or what?
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Nov 5, 2018 22:26
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Trainee PornStar posted:I pretty much agree with you here... The trigger will be the Indus Waters Treaty coming apart, as Pakistan relies on that water to subsist, and they have nukes too. MiddleOne posted:Strict international climate policy contracts enforced by tariffs, sanctions and trade blockades off the top of my head. It's been brought up before, but dealing with the problem requires a WWII-level mobilization, an almost literal War against Climate Change, with the big players watching each other carefully and leveraging their economic/military/political might to make sure everyone is playing ball. But instead we've opted for the Race to the Bottom, as the worst case scenarios predicted. Conspiratiorist fucked around with this message at 22:44 on Nov 5, 2018 |
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Nov 5, 2018 22:37
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Regardless of how the Washington carbon tax ballot question goes tomorrow, the associated campaign has some interesting details:The Atlantic posted:The Ballot Question That Could Transform U.S. Climate Politics Vox posted:Big Oil is using brute financial force to kill 2 state sustainability initiatives It's genuinely impressive the quantity and speed of resources brought to bear in order to oppose emissions mitigation, especially compared to the painstaking and lengthy negotiation process required to define the Washington ballot question in the first place. It's a great example how modern capitalism allows the co-ordination of completely disparate, in some cases competing, interests to align and attempt to thwart anything that might interfere with the rate of return. Also I don't like Bloomberg or really any of the billionaires hovering like flies above society's dying carcass, but at least he was on the right side for this issue. edit: The No campaign contributions are visible here and it's exactly who you'd expect.  Repeal Citizen's United JFC. edit: VVVVVVVVVVV from what I understand most Boltzmann brains will be too busy screaming in wordless horror to worry too much about about what we're doing. What a universe. Nocturtle fucked around with this message at 22:53 on Nov 5, 2018 |
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Nov 5, 2018 22:43
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Nocturtle posted:Regardless of how the Washington carbon tax ballot question goes tomorrow, the associated campaign has some interesting details: The shortsightedness of man. The true rate of return in the long run will be zero, as our society will be dead and gone. The Boltzmann Brains looking at us from space must be fascinated by all this suicidal madness.
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Nov 5, 2018 22:46
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Conspiratiorist posted:The trigger will be the Indus Waters Treaty coming apart, as Pakistan relies on that water to subsist, and they have nukes too. Bearing in mind both have nukes & bearing in mind your point about the water.. some sort of crazy all out war is almost certainly going to happen as the temperatures increase ? At this point I'm almost tempted to join the guy jetting around to see cats.
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Nov 5, 2018 22:53
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Trainee PornStar posted:Bearing in mind both have nukes & bearing in mind your point about the water.. some sort of crazy all out war is almost certainly going to happen as the temperatures increase ? The recently elected Pakistani PM is in bed with both China and Pakistan's military establishment, too, while India slides further into nationalism. These guys have been at each others throats for decades, so it's a powder keg ready to go up; the Indus drying up is merely one of many possible triggers, albeit one we know for sure is inevitable within the next couple decades.
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Nov 5, 2018 23:07
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So you are telling me they have a bunch of nuclear material and need to desalinate large quantities of water.  It's so sad that this is gonna end the way it is.
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Nov 6, 2018 01:05
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Star Man posted:So are you all just waiting for a signal to start a violent uprising or what? i'm waiting to die, friend
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Nov 6, 2018 01:12
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Lightning Knight posted:People are depressed because the world is literally coming to an end, but here’s OOCC to mock them for it and Rime to make it worse. Somebody's gotta post the news.  Quiet week so far.
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Nov 6, 2018 01:41
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Rime posted:Somebody's gotta post the news. Links to articles with barely a blurb posted by someone who usually doesn't understand what they read anyway? What service do you think you're providing that we can't get from a news feed?
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Nov 6, 2018 02:01
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