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RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
:siren:THREAD MASCOT:siren:


quote:

Don't roll your own crypto.

Don't invent your own encryption algorithm or protocol; that is extremely error-prone. As Bruce Schneier likes to say,

"Anyone can invent an encryption algorithm they themselves can't break; it's much harder to invent one that no one else can break".

Crypto algorithms are very intricate and need intensive vetting to be sure they are secure; if you invent your own, you won't get that, and it's very easy to end up with something insecure without realizing it.

Instead, use a standard cryptographic algorithm and protocol. Odds are that someone else has encountered your problem before and designed an appropriate algorithm for that purpose.

Your best case is to use a high-level well-vetted scheme: for communication security, use TLS (or SSL); for data at rest, use GPG (or PGP). If you can't do that, use a high-level crypto library, like cryptlib, GPGME, Keyczar, or NaCL, instead of a low-level one, like OpenSSL, CryptoAPI, JCE, etc.. Thanks to Nate Lawson for this suggestion.

recommended resources:
SecLists.Org Security Mailing List Archive
attrition.org
r/netsec
r/crypto

conferences/gatherings:
BSides (check for one local to you!)
Black Hat
DEF CON
ShmooCon

recent news:
HardenedBSD ends their call for donations on a successful note
Let's Encrypt begins closed beta
CISA is revealed to not contain Senator Whitehouse's CFAA amendment

more resources:
VulnHub - Vulnerable By Design
OverTheWire
SmashTheStack

RISCy Business fucked around with this message at 15:52 on Dec 18, 2015

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RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
reserved just in case

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
on this topic, if anyone needs/wants an invite to keybase, i have 5 left- send me a pm or an email (root[a]reverie.pw) with your email address and i'll get you squared away

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
hey, remember Linux.Encoder.1? turns out it sucks

http://labs.bitdefender.com/2015/11/linux-ransomware-debut-fails-on-predictable-encryption-key/

quote:

We mentioned that the AES key is generated locally on the victim’s computer. We looked into the way the key and initialization vector are generated by reverse-engineering the Linux.Encoder.1 sample in our lab. We realized that, rather than generating secure random keys and IVs, the sample would derive these two pieces of information from the libc rand() function seeded with the current system timestamp at the moment of encryption. This information can be easily retrieved by looking at the file’s timestamp. This is a huge design flaw that allows retrieval of the AES key without having to decrypt it with the RSA public key sold by the Trojan’s operator(s).

:effort:

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe

mindphlux posted:

hmmm wow I just hmmmmmm I mean go on wow this is so interesting tell me more

i love watching literal mongoloids post so thank you for this opportunity

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
some shady poo poo coming out of the marketing world (again):

Beware of ads that use inaudible sound to link your phone, TV, tablet, and PC

quote:

Cross-device tracking can also be performed through the use of ultrasonic inaudible sound beacons. Compared to probabilistic tracking through browser fingerprinting, the use of audio beacons is a more accurate way to track users across devices. The industry leader of cross-device tracking using audio beacons is SilverPush. When a user encounters a SilverPush advertiser on the web, the advertiser drops a cookie on the computer while also playing an ultrasonic audio through the use of the speakers on the computer or device. The inaudible code is recognized and received on the other smart device by the software development kit installed on it. SilverPush also embeds audio beacon signals into TV commercials which are "picked up silently by an app installed on a [device] (unknown to the user)." The audio beacon enables companies like SilverPush to know which ads the user saw, how long the user watched the ad before changing the channel, which kind of smart devices the individual uses, along with other information that adds to the profile of each user that is linked across devices.

The user is unaware of the audio beacon, but if a smart device has an app on it that uses the SilverPush software development kit, the software on the app will be listening for the audio beacon and once the beacon is detected, devices are immediately recognized as being used by the same individual. SilverPush states that the company is not listening in the background to all of the noises occurring in proximity to the device. The only factor that hinders the receipt of an audio beacon by a device is distance and there is no way for the user to opt-out of this form of cross-device tracking. SilverPush’s company policy is to not "divulge the names of the apps the technology is embedded," meaning that users have no knowledge of which apps are using this technology and no way to opt-out of this practice. As of April of 2015, SilverPush’s software is used by 67 apps and the company monitors 18 million smartphones.

some of the stuff that can be transmitted:



it can also trigger a recording as seen here

code:
SilverPush Beacon Demo App_v1.0.3.src/com/silverpush/democrossdevice/m.java:16:  private AudioRecord h;
SilverPush Beacon Demo App_v1.0.3.src/com/silverpush/democrossdevice/m.java:35:      this.h = new AudioRecord(this.f, this.g, this.d, this.e, this.j);
SilverPush Beacon Demo App_v1.0.3.src/com/silverpush/democrossdevice/n.java:7:  implements AudioRecord.OnRecordPositionUpdateListener
SilverPush Beacon Demo App_v1.0.3.src/com/silverpush/democrossdevice/n.java:13:  public void onMarkerReached(AudioRecord paramAudioRecord)
SilverPush Beacon Demo App_v1.0.3.src/com/silverpush/democrossdevice/n.java:17:  public void onPeriodicNotification(AudioRecord paramAudioRecord)
SilverPush Beacon Demo App_v1.0.3.src/com/silverpush/democrossdevice/p.java:9:    int i = AudioRecord.getMinBufferSize(44100, 16, 2);
SilverPush Beacon Demo App_v1.0.3.src/com/silverpush/democrossdevice/p.java:23:          AudioRecord localAudioRecord = new AudioRecord(1, 44100, 16, 2, m);
SilverPush Beacon Demo App_v1.0.3.src/com/silverpush/democrossdevice/p.java:24:          if (localAudioRecord.getState() != 1)
SilverPush Beacon Demo App_v1.0.3.src/com/silverpush/democrossdevice/p.java:26:          localAudioRecord.release();
there is a git repo [HERE] run by d0tslash on twitter with tons of information including APKs if you care or want to help

RISCy Business fucked around with this message at 16:56 on Nov 17, 2015

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe

Stanley Pain posted:

How is it going to record that data on any of your devices though? You'd have to be stupid to install their software on your phone or am I missing something here and they're exploiting something?


Ah I see, some apps might be using their SDK. I wonder how long before we get someone writing a program that can check for the SDK being used. I'm sure it has to have some form of normalized API calls.

yeah, it doesn't have to be THEIR app, just one utilizing their SDK. and what is pulled and sent is up to the whim of whoever runs that app. it would be possible to sniff out calls using wireshark if you're curious and think you may have such an app, since it seems a lot of them[citation needed] use the same url schema, you could use:

http.request.method=="POST" and http.request.uri contains "/oapi/getAd"

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe

Antillie posted:

I thought this was a thread were we could discuss whether or not it should be best practice to disable TLS 1.0 on web servers that also support TLS_FALLBACK_SCSV. Or maybe what a good lifetime value would be for a HTTP Strict Transport Security header and the pros and cons of including the preload option in said header. But for some reason we are talking about a new form of advertising tracking that is supposedly only being used in India.

infosec is a much larger and broader topic than you think it is. it entails not only application and network security, but privacy, cryptography, anonymity, and more. stick around and you might learn something.

also: 3 keybase invites left, root[a]reverie.pw since i don't have plat anymore

RISCy Business fucked around with this message at 04:15 on Nov 21, 2015

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
related to the recent dell stuff, i was just linked this: http://rol.im/dell/

arbitrary service tag disclosure via dell's "tribbles" software.

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
also, seems that a new POS malware that is extremely sophisticated is making the rounds: https://thestack.com/security/2015/11/24/modpos-retail-malware-is-not-the-work-of-script-kiddies/

quote:

‘ModPOS is highly modular and can be configured to target specific systems with components such as uploader/downloader, keylogger, POS RAM scraper and custom plugins for credential theft and other specialized functions like network reconnaissance. We believe other capabilities could also be leveraged. The modules are packed kernel drivers that use multiple methods of obfuscation and encryption to evade even the most sophisticated security controls.’

:stare:

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
i honestly don't know, that's kind of a weird setup since i'm used to people either encrypting everything or nothing.

is this going to be for linux or something else?

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
ok, i misread your post, sorry

i think you're overthinking this- you're better off using dm-crypt if you're on linux; as for windows/mac, i really don't know since i haven't really used encryption on either (don't own any macs and my gaming pc doesn't need to be encrypted)

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
http://malwarefor.me/2015-12-01-angler-ek-sending-cryptowall/

angler ek + cryptowall info with pcaps and samples

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
facebook refuses to pay out bug bounty based on arbitrary, unwritten rules: http://exfiltrated.com/research-Instagram-RCE.php

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe

Wiggly Wayne DDS posted:

have you been near a bug bounty in your life? the man went well beyond scope and is lucky he isn't in jail

considering he didn't touch any user data, only confirm he was able to pivot to a bucket containing user data, i'd say he was fairly safely within scope

now, if he had downloaded, altered, accessed or otherwise gotten at user data instead of just the bucket it was hosted on, then i'd agree with you, but it's pretty clear that he didn't

also, the timeline didn't load for me initially so i was unaware that he got paid, but i'd still say that what he found is deserving of a fair bit more than what he got

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
http://forums.juniper.net/t5/Security-Incident-Response/Important-Announcement-about-ScreenOS/ba-p/285554

also it turns out juniper hosed up and their netscreen vpn can potentially be MITM'd, at least that's what i'm gleaning from what i've seen so far

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe

Alereon posted:

I'm just gonna note that it's possible to disagree without being dicks to eachother, so let's all work on making this thread about security and not nerds arguing.

thanks

also thanks for the av babyface nerd, whoever it was

RISCy Business fucked around with this message at 16:13 on Dec 18, 2015

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
personally i like keepass, i have it on a locally accessible windows fileshare so i can copy it to my laptop and other devices when i update it

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
Researchers investigate North Korea's Red Star OS 3

and the presentation from 32c3:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTBemKiSgWI

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe

MrMoo posted:

There is a pretty awful Cisco appliance that has a SSL portal that works like this.

can confirm that it's awful, we have one in place where i work now.

i hate it. :colbert:

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
also, there's a new bug. in glibc. :cripes:

http://www.zdnet.com/article/patch-linux-now-google-red-hat-warn-over-critical-glibc-bug/

quote:

Google and Red Hat have linked up to deliver a patch for a serious bug in the GNU C Library, or glibc, which is widely used in Linux applications, distributions and devices.

Anyone running a Linux server is likely to need to install the jointly-developed patch that fixes a critical flaw in the getaddrinfo function in glibc.

The vulnerability had until recently gone unnoticed but was actually introduced in version 2.9 of the open-source library, which was released in May 2008.

Google has detailed that the bug is a stack buffer overflow flaw in the function, which can be remotely exploited by causing a machine to run a DNS lookup and delivering a response in the form of UDP or TCP packets that exceed 2,048 bytes.

Google engineers said any software using getaddrinfo, "May be exploited with attacker-controlled domain names, attacker-controlled DNS servers, or through a man-in-the-middle attack".

Like previous open-source bugs, this one also affects a wide range of Linux distributions, software and devices.

"Pretty much any Linux system uses glibc, and getaddrinfo is typically used to resolve IP addresses. Which means Linux servers as well as workstations, are vulnerable unless it runs an old version of glibc (pre 2.9)," noted Johannes Ullrich, CTO of the SANS Internet Storm Center.

Ullrich initially believed Android devices are probably also affected by the bug. However, security researcher Kenn White has since pointed out Google opted for the glibc alternative Bionic C software for Android.

White also said there is a possibility that CentOS, Oracle, and Amazon Linux may be vulnerable to the glibc vulnerability.

Although Google engineers discovered the flaw independently, when they began assessing it they discovered the issue had been previously reported to glibc's maintainers and that engineers at Red Hat were also investigating the issue.

The two companies collaborated on the development and testing of the patch that was released on Tuesday.

Red Hat has confirmed that affected products include multiple versions of RHEL server, workstation and desktop products.

Google has developed exploit code for the flaw but is not making that software publicly available. However, it has published a proof of concept that can be used to test if systems are vulnerable.

"When code crashes unexpectedly, it can be a sign of something much more significant than it appears; ignore crashes at your peril," Google's engineers said.

They also noted that while remote code execution is possible, it would still require bypassing exploit mitigations such as address-space layout randomization.

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe

Paul MaudDib posted:

Way to beg the question. In the real world,

  • Users don't use antivirus (hello members of this thread)
  • Users don't keep antivirus up to date
  • Users disable antivirus when the virus asks them to
  • Users add viruses to ignore list when their AV trips on it because they really want to run it
  • Users use pirated Windows or AV installations that cannot be scanned by AV

and that's the AV-related causes of why viruses spread. I would also throw in users that disable UAC or let any random application ecalate to admin (especially dubious stuff like keygens), which may allow additional ways for malware to escape AV detection or kills.

Not that antiviruses are perfect - because they're not, nothing is 100% - but if you don't undercut them by doing the above, they are pretty effective. Some are more effective than others though - Kaspersky, BitDefender, ESET, and F-Prot regularly top the pack in detection rates, others have lower detection rates.

Ransomware isn't really any different than a standard virus, which also spread quite prodigously. The difference is that an average virus doesn't make your computer unusable until you send 50 bitcoins to Russia. Regular viruses want to stay undetected so they can keep using your machine in their botnet, spamming ads for ch34p v1agra, etc. If every single infected momputer out there suddenly flashed an alert message, we would notice them a lot more.

oh man

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe

Paul MaudDib posted:

One rule will never catch 99.9% of anything. You're an idiot who's trying to score points by making an impossible request.


:lol:

OK, I'll keep that in mind if I piss off the NSA (but seriously - if they're giving you 1-on-1 attention you're hosed, they're getting in one way or another).

Do you not drive with seatbelts because someone might t-bone you at 80 miles per hour and in that case you'd die anyway? Antivirus picks most of the low-hanging fruit - yeah the NSA is getting in regardless, but you don't have to make it easy for the first script-kiddie who gets a chance at you.

You're an idiot if you think the NSA has anything to do with average consumer security.

i think you're entirely missing the point here

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe

Mustache Ride posted:

Jesus tapdancing christ, why is everyone so loving angry in these threads?

because if you get called out on being wrong about a thing you shouldn't double down on being wrong

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe

Mustache Ride posted:

Thats not a good reason to be angry. Soon you'll only be left arguing with yourself about how good you are at masturbating about security.

you had me at "masturbating"

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe

Paul MaudDib posted:

If they have professional experience, why don't they do more than ask me how antivirus works?

because you obviously don't know how it actually works, and what actual detection rates in the real world for AV suites are

you were given a perfectly reasonable and accurate explanation by a person who, for all intents and purposes is way smarter than you as to why AV is not the same line of defense it was 15 years ago but you just kept doubling down on being wrong, and then got all pissy because he posts in YOSPOS

protip: it doesn't matter where the person who is calling you out on being wrong posts, because at the end of the day you're still loving wrong

Paul MaudDib posted:

Mmm, yes, Aunt Stupid installing gentoo. I'm sure she's gonna be A-OK with compiling kernels and portage and poo poo.

have you ever heard the word "hyperbole" or are you purposely being this stupid

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe

Paul MaudDib posted:

I actually don't have plat and can't look up where he posts. Unlike the guy from this thread who stalked my posts so he could argue with me in another forum. I just could tell because he's a shitposter.

Where's the explanation? Link it for me. He told me to read a thread where his explanation was that the NSA was gonna get Grandma's cat pics. There was nothing but "under construction" on the first page of the thread and that was the first explanation he gave in the thread. I'm not joking.

quote:

All anti-virus products at their core operate the same and how they all update is as well. Anti-virus typically relies on signatures to know what is potentially malicious from what is not. However, this is its biggest flaw as those signatures can easily be thwarted by malware creators. As such, a determined attacker can easily create 2,000 different copies (in a single day no less) of the same malicious software and that may require the anti-virus vendor to create multiple signatures in order to successfully thwart it. The vendors know this and last year, Symantec admitted that at best they detect up to 45% of threats although there are suggestions that catching any new threats is at best 5% successful.

This is all on the backs of the AV industry's claims of having 'superb' features like suspicious behaviour detection and math-based anti-malware techniques--none of this really has made a dent in stemming the tide.

Don't let sites and organisations like AV-Test, Gartner, and whoever suggest that vendor X has the advantage over others. Their methodology either relies on being paid to be put in some "magic quadrant" (Gartner) which allows CIOs et al to just rubber stamp their choices or testing "real world" situations that otherwise are far from such.

What you need to consider besides common sense (most infections are the fault of users) is that there are other solutions besides anti-virus. These include simple things like network settings, popup and ad blockers, and keeping your system and browsers up to date.

also he wasn't seriously suggesting you install gentoo for your aunt you idiot

every single time you post in this thread you make an idiot out of yourself and i'm fairly certain that everyone is tired of it

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Paul MaudDib posted:

Did I misclick into YOSPOS or is this the serious forum for actual advice?

jesus christ

how do you have such little self-awareness? how has it not occurred to you that maybe, just maybe the person you're arguing with is smarter than you, or at the very least knows a lot more about this poo poo than you do?

at what point do you decide that maybe it's time to cut your losses, swallow your pride and just shut up?

i guarantee you if you survey security professionals they'll tell you the exact same thing- AV is dead, and the focus has shifted to educating users on how to protect themselves against the myriad threats that they'll come across on a regular basis.

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Paul MaudDib posted:

Probably about the time you post an actual argument that isn't "trust me" or conspiracy theories or some clickbait poo poo.

nobody's posting conspiracy theories? where are you getting this?

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Paul MaudDib posted:

This is literally a conspiracy theory about antivirus. The NSA is not targeting you personally, that is not a realistic threat vector. If they do, there is absolutely nothing you can do to defend against it, they can absolutely deploy something on the level of Equation Group or (hypothetically) BadBios and you will never know it.

nobody ever said antivirus is poo poo because the NSA is loving with it

antivirus is poo poo because it's poo poo, and it can't detect poo poo

Paul MaudDib posted:

(not naming names but she's my GF)

why did you post this :confused:

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
hey guys [shouting into next room] MY BOYFRIEND just got some adware on his laptop

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Wells posted:

my takeaway is that if you sell a product with the promise of security and it actually makes your computer less secure, it's not worth it if all it does it catch "the low hanging fruit". (if it even does that)

the vendor's literal job is to sell you a product, and they do that by giving you numbers that make you feel all warm and fuzzy but don't really have much of a basis in reality

if the vendor doesn't sell you a product, they don't get paid

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe
the focus has 100% shifted from recommending antivirus to recommending adblockers and the like because, as has been said over and over and over again, there's way too much poo poo for even the best antivirus to catch nowadays

"you are your own adversary" is completely true, the worst threat to your security is your own activities

AV will catch the relatively benign stuff, like adware, but the poo poo that you actually need to be concerned about is a whole hell of a lot harder to catch

i would recommend reading the talos blog (shameless plug) because there's a lot of insanely cool poo poo in there about how modern malware works, and the efforts to detect and block it

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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apseudonym posted:

I'm not sure I'd go so far as to say that vulns are how malware get installed/executed. Often times it's us, the user, that executes the malware.

lack of education/awareness is a vulnerability by definition

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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apseudonym posted:

If the security of your system depends on users(or IT admins or whatever) being smart and constantly vigilant about security then it is an unfixable system.

i never said that, all i said was that it is a vulnerability.

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Swagger Dagger posted:

I'm graduating from college in the fall with a BS in Computer Science, any tips on getting a job in the infosec industry? I'd rather be on the blue team/admin side of things but I'm kinda worried that I'll be job hunting and end up in something akin to a basic tech support job, and I've spent way too much time and money in college to really be able to afford that.

I'll have an S+ and probably a CCNA by then, if those will help. I know those are very basic, entry-level certs but it's what I can afford on my budget and I had to start somewhere.

see if you have a local convention (bsides, for example). don't just be a fly on the wall, ask questions, no matter how dumb they may sound. figure out what you want to do and ask people in the industry the best way to get into it. in my experience, people in infosec love to help people trying to break into the industry.

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Mr Chips posted:

Is there anything more recent than Ormandy's 2012 stuff on Sophos being poo poo? Central IT at my workplace has a 'policy' that it has to be installed on all machines (including RHEL machines) and having it sitting there taking up 200+ Mbytes x 2000 VMs seems like a waste of resources.

i can probably guarantee you that they won't change the policy even if you gave them evidence that sophos as poo poo

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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dpbjinc posted:

Seven million characteristics.

:nsavince:

gee bill, your mom lets you have SEVEN million characteristics?!

RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Fun Shoe

found your problem

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RISCy Business
Jun 17, 2015

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Subjunctive posted:

FireEye sure didn't

:mmmhmm:

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