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team overhead smash posted:I hate to break it to you but we don't need to go alt history to get an early American dynasty started. Quincy is like the lamest president, and the weak Adams line is a mere artifact of history. The only remainder of the once-proud legacy is a mid-tier beer company. I demand immaculate, anachronistic dynasties. Octatonic has issued a correction as of 20:24 on Nov 22, 2015 |
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Nov 22, 2015 20:22
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also the interesting work 'the education of henry adams' http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/2044, which has been very highly ranked among the best non-fiction works in english basically the later adamses knew a ton of important people but weren't very powerful. this guy was perceptive enough to notice the world moving on from his viewpoints and smart enough to write up some interesting observations regarding this, in the third person no less. the chapter 'the virgin and the dynamo' is particularly well regarded. on the other hand he had a casual hatred of jews that shines through at various points in the work and it's been noted that it's basically an extremely biased and convenient autobiography. he never mentions his wife, who committed suicide, once in the work, for example. i'm glad i read it though, it's pretty unique also the chapter about diplomacy in london during the civil war is really interesting since he was there as a clerk for his dad who was the ambassador in that crucial time and place, one of the last of the adamses to really do anything worth showing up in a history book one of the most interesting things about the book is the significance of the very brief treatment it gives of one of adams' closest friends, clarence king, who led a double life. on the one hand he was a famous geologist who surveyed the west, the first director of the united states geophysical survey, and sufferer from depression and business failures; on the other hand, he had five kids with a black lady who supposedly never knew that this blue-eyed dude was just pretending to be a black railroad porter so he could be with her until he confessed it on his deathbed. there were a lot of people who 'passed' in one direction or another (including their kids; two daughters who married white men, two sons who fought as blacks in wwi) and racism has always been a social distinction above all so maybe pale blue-eyed black dudes were more normal in those more strongly hypocritical days but i feel like there's probably more to the story than wikipedia has to tell us but adams has just a few things to say that touch on this secret life of his friend; one is that king didn't care for white upper class women, he liked stronger stuff. another was that he was a defender of 'the archaic races', indians and blacks (in other words he wasn't as racist as most rich white dudes! i wonder what it was like to have avant-garde views on race and still participate in high white society). i feel like adams might've known more than was apropros to share in this book it's those kind of things that make me realize how complicated and impossible is the task of putting oneself in the shoes of someone who grew up, lived, and died in a society complete alien to one's own oystertoadfish has issued a correction as of 20:38 on Nov 22, 2015 |
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Nov 22, 2015 20:26
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Octatonic posted:Quincy is like the lamest president, and the weak Adams line is a mere artifact of history. The only remainder of the once-proud legacy is a mid-tier beer company. I demand immaculate, anachronistic dynasties. Speaking of that, he left out a non-presidential portion of said early american political dynasties: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Adams
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Nov 22, 2015 20:32
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I would like to see Burr as president. I like his stance on cigareets, whuskey and wild, wild women. Fortunately, we are lucky enough to have some vintage footage from his campaign. He wants equal rights for women, slaves and slave women, which just make him the perfect man to become president, imho. Another major problem of this young nation is the monopolization of power by the Federalist aristocrats. And he is just the right man to right this wrong. His only shortcoming is that he is a bit too wishy washy when it comes to the French Revolution, but for this he will have Thomas Jefferson as Vice President, because Vive La Revolution and gently caress the British! (And afaik, slave women are a hot topic for Jefferson, as well). In short: Vote Burr/Jefferson in '92! Ibogaine has issued a correction as of 20:55 on Nov 22, 2015 |
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Nov 22, 2015 20:52
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required reading for all voters
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Nov 22, 2015 21:04
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Can't believe you all voted for Adams, "America's first poo poo president"
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Nov 22, 2015 21:06
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federalist till i or the party dies and apparently im immortal so
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Nov 22, 2015 21:09
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Burr sounds like an old timey Trump. Maybe if the donald went and shot some other politician in a duel he would be more popular E: also this thread is awesome
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Nov 22, 2015 22:28
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Fellis posted:Burr sounds like an old timey Trump. Basically this. Build a wall to keep the British out!
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Nov 22, 2015 22:38
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Fellis posted:Burr sounds like an old timey Trump. Maybe if the donald went and shot some other politician in a duel he would be more popular Didn't work out so well for Burr though.
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Nov 22, 2015 22:42
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Don’t be Burrned. Vote Washington/Adams
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Nov 22, 2015 22:48
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Platystemon posted:Don’t be Burrned. #FeeltheBurrn is the only patriotic route, friend 
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Nov 22, 2015 22:51
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i like that washington is going to benefit from being the crypto-federalist in a race with only one open federalist in the election; he'll probably win, whereas he lost this thread in the last election because there were two pro-federal anti-slavery candidates the dynamics of the immortal ironic internet socialist voting bloc are fascinating
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Nov 22, 2015 22:56
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as an ignorant Brit the only things I really knew of Burr were from this historical re-enactment (spoiler alert for the distant future of 1804, guys!!!) so I'm surprised that Burr actually seems to have some good opinions on some things. Perhaps this video is just propaganda created by Hamilton's dastardly network of printers, which I assume was the 1790s version of Fox News.
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Nov 23, 2015 00:03
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Angepain posted:as an ignorant Brit the only things I really knew of Burr were from this historical re-enactment (spoiler alert for the distant future of 1804, guys!!!) so I'm surprised that Burr actually seems to have some good opinions on some things. Perhaps this video is just propaganda created by Hamilton's dastardly network of printers, which I assume was the 1790s version of Fox News. My thoughts on Burr: Aaron Burr's got a Frank Underwood quality to him. He is very good at appealing to the common man, but everyone who interacts with him on a day-to-day basis ends up pretty unnerved by his pursuit for power. You can check his Wikipedia page for a brief overview, but there are a few episodes that stand out. He'll later use disaster relief funds to fund his own personal bank, to counter Hamilton and the Federalist establishment. He'll also be implicated in a scheme to carve a fiefdom out of Louisiana. QuoProQuid has issued a correction as of 00:58 on Nov 23, 2015 |
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Nov 23, 2015 00:40
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oystertoadfish posted:i like that washington is going to benefit from being the crypto-federalist in a race with only one open federalist in the election; he'll probably win, whereas he lost this thread in the last election because there were two pro-federal anti-slavery candidates To be fair, none of us would be allowed to vote were we alive back then. Surprise surprise, poor people from the 21st century know how much of a shitfucking loon states rights are. Also we're all against slavery, for some weird reason.
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Nov 23, 2015 00:51
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I'm going lobby for a constitutional amendment so that Alexander Hamilton can run for President, until then though I plan to vote for Adams/Washington.
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Nov 23, 2015 00:52
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Thump! posted:To be fair, none of us would be allowed to vote were we alive back then. Surprise surprise, poor people from the 21st century know how much of a shitfucking loon states rights are. slavery was the great voting-against-your-own-interest thing of its era, analogous to the stuff that modern liberals get really angry at poor people for supporting with their votes. opposing obamacare, keeping the minimum wage low, stuff like that. it was understood that slavery depressed the white man's wages - this is why republicans tended to oppose both slavery and the right of black people to move to northern states, where slave or not they would be desparate enough to undercut local wages (and also practically everybody was racist then BUT I DIGRESS FROM MY DIGRESSION) - but all those poor southern whites were induced to vote for slavery by culture it's somewhat of a moot point in this election, however, both because the poor whites are disenfranchised by the intent of the framers of the constitution and because slavery at this point, still two years before eli whitney (a new englander) patented the cotton gin, was not at all the integral part of southern culture it became in the tremendously profitable decades to follow. at this point it was still a thing to do in practice but hate in principle, like so many other things then and now i guess i should spoiler tag that lol oystertoadfish has issued a correction as of 01:09 on Nov 23, 2015 |
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Nov 23, 2015 01:04
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Thump! posted:To be fair, none of us would be allowed to vote were we alive back then. Surprise surprise, poor people from the 21st century know how much of a shitfucking loon states rights are. As a not-poor white man from Boston I probably had a decent chance of being able to vote. And being anti-slavery would make me fit right in with my preferred candidate so far of Adams
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Nov 23, 2015 01:09
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Slavery is my litmus test, so that drops pretty much everyone except Burr and Adams. France is exactly the type of revolution we need to support to overthrow this system of monarchies, and it's a pity the cringing "states rightists" in the Democratic-Republican party are the only ones who realize that. Adams's plan of public education sounds great and will get our workers ready for the new economy that will form as we remove all these drat monarchs from power. I'd still rather see Thomas Paine up there, though. We need an American Robespierre. Burr-Adams '92.
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Nov 23, 2015 03:56
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ABJ anyone BUT jefferson
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Nov 23, 2015 04:51
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Remember that Thomas Jefferson almost didn't buy the Louisiana Territories because he figured it was unconstitutional. Even Ron Paul wouldn't have gotten close enough to loving that one up.
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Nov 23, 2015 05:01
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my response to you jerks voting for john adams over a straight g-wash/jjay ticket http://youtu.be/SH46xK-FyJg?t=39s
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Nov 23, 2015 05:13
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troubled teen posted:As a not-poor white man from Boston I probably had a decent chance of being able to vote. And being anti-slavery would make me fit right in with my preferred candidate so far of Adams Yeah but how much land do you own Mr. Not-Poor White Man from Boston? None? Good, welcome to the soup line, fellow proletariat brother 
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Nov 23, 2015 05:19
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Thump! posted:Yeah but how much land do you own Mr. Not-Poor White Man from Boston?
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Nov 23, 2015 05:30
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Federalism trumps support for the French Revolution at this precarious point. National strength and improving relations with the British is our best hope for survival. Vote Adams, end impressment!
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Nov 23, 2015 05:45
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In case any of y'all haven't heard, Broadway's getting its rear end kicked by an A-Ham hip-hop musical and it's good https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSZwEaYHSpc
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Nov 23, 2015 06:02
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foobardog posted:Slavery is my litmus test, so that drops pretty much everyone except Burr and Adams. You're going to love 1804 and 1808. Aliquid posted:In case any of y'all haven't heard, Broadway's getting its rear end kicked by an A-Ham hip-hop musical and it's good It's excellent.
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Nov 24, 2015 02:48
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I can't believe you all are turning to the Democratic-Republicans. Burr isn't going to do anything about slavery. Got to go with some people with proven, solid (if boring) ability to not be power mad. Washington/Adams.
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Nov 24, 2015 04:15
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We need to draft Paine/Hamilton in 1792. Barring that, we need to either vote a National Unity Government of Adams/Burr or a national unity government of Adams/Washington. Four more years of Adams either way.
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Nov 24, 2015 04:52
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Voted for the guys on Mount Rushmore.
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Nov 24, 2015 06:45
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Aliquid posted:In case any of y'all haven't heard, Broadway's getting its rear end kicked by an A-Ham hip-hop musical and it's good  After reading up on it a bit, I gotta see this.
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Nov 24, 2015 07:14
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GreyjoyBastard posted:
I really wish I had the money to.
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Nov 24, 2015 07:16
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QuoProQuid posted:You're going to love 1804 and 1808.  To be honest, I'm used to this, in the actual real-life presidential elections I've voted in, the candidate I voted for has only won once. 
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Nov 24, 2015 08:36
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I think the Republic has really gone downhill since the revolution. We need President Aaron Burr to make America great again. We can respect George Washington's desire to step out of the spotlight by making him the vice president. This would also balance the ticket between New York and Virginia.
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Nov 24, 2015 12:04
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Look here guys: Washington is a good guy, a really decent man. But he just wants to settle down on his farm. And you know why? Because he knows himself that he just doesn't have the energy to be President, and that there are better suited men than him. Now he is running, of course, but only because there are those around him pressuring and hounding him against his will. I say: Let the man settle down and be remembered as a celebrated general. With his low energy, he would only hurt his reputation and his country if he were forced to be president. Like Cincinattus, he already did his duty for his country and then returned to his plow. And you know what: I respect him for that. And I respect him so much that I want to grant him his wish: A quiet and enjoyable country life. But now it is time for a man of action, an energetic man for tumultous times: Aaron Burr! (And Jefferson as VP, because we should side with our revolutionary brothers in France and not give an inch to perfidious Albion). edit: Maybe Jefferson could draft up a list of British sympathizers, just to be sure...
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Nov 24, 2015 12:28
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I can see Burr running a Trump-style populist campaign. Only thing missing would be him calling Washington and Adams losers.
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Nov 24, 2015 14:58
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Alter Ego posted:I can see Burr running a Trump-style populist campaign. Only thing missing would be him calling Washington and Adams losers. Burr is more of a Nixon than a Trump. Only his fall from grace came before he could become president, not during.
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Nov 25, 2015 04:07
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JosefStalinator posted:Burr is more of a Nixon than a Trump. Only his fall from grace came before he could become president, not during. When was Burr's last
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Nov 25, 2015 04:24
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ELECTION RESULTS: 1792 Thank you all for voting. I am happy to announce that His Elective Majesty, Our Lord-Protector, John Adams, President of the United States, Protector of Their Liberties, has been re-elected President of the United States. Serving by his side is Aaron Burr, who is certain to serve admirably at the President’s side. Adams has already taken Burr into his confidence and given him a prominent role in the administration. Jefferson and Clinton are stunned by the upset. Jefferson has already mobilized the press against the two victors.   RESULTS BREAKDOWN Most popular candidates: 1. John Adams – 53 votes (62.4%) 2. Aaron Burr – 46 votes (54.1%) 3. George Washington – 40 votes (47.1%) 4. Thomas Jefferson – 16 votes (18.8%) 5. George Clinton - 13 votes (15.3%) Most popular tickets: 1. George Washington / John Adams – 24 votes 2. John Adams / Aaron Burr – 23 votes 3. George Washington / Aaron Burr – 10 votes 4. George Clinton / Aaron Burr - 8 votes 5. John Adams / Thomas Jefferson – 5 votes 6. Thomas Jefferson / Aaron Burr – 5 votes 7. George Washington / Thomas Jefferson – 4 votes 8. George Washington / George Clinton – 2 votes 9. George Clinton / Thomas Jefferson – 2 votes 10. John Adams / George Clinton – 1 vote 11. Thomas Jefferson / Aaron Burr – 1 vote QuoProQuid has issued a correction as of 16:19 on Nov 29, 2015 |
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Nov 29, 2015 16:12
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