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I'm excited for Oath just because BFZ has a bunch of mechanics that only key off other cards in the set and right now there's just not enough of them to make anything really worthwhile. Need more than 37 total allies in Standard if you want anyone to play with them.Twiddy posted:(if possibly stupidly parasitic, who knows). It's the set partner to BFZ, so that's probably a design goal.
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Nov 18, 2015 03:05
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GeneX posted:That's a surprisingly interesting solution to the perceived issue of fetches+fetchable duals ruining standard This assumes there are any Diamond cards good enough to make deckbuilding choices around.
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Nov 18, 2015 08:42
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This does raise the issue of having another mechanic currently specific to this block that has like ten playable cards supporting it, but I guess that didn't stop them the first time. ♦ by itself is probably a good idea for the future though. Colorless has grown a real identity over the lifetime of the game and being able to make marquee colorless cards that you can't just splash freely into whatever normal deck probably opens up a lot of design space for them moving forward.
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Nov 18, 2015 17:38
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You raise valid design concerns, but I still remind you that BFZ seems to have been a dubiously designed set from the get-go in terms of shamelessly parasitic mechanics so I don't think those are grounds enough by themselves to rule out the ♦.
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Nov 18, 2015 17:46
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I'm going to be pissed if Wastes are real and a bunch of good Diamond cards come out that make painlands spike in value, destroying another avenue for cheap dual lands in this loving standard.
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Nov 18, 2015 18:13
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odiv posted:♦ Time to start speculating on Shivan Reefs.
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Nov 18, 2015 18:17
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The Human Crouton posted:I can see having a ♦ cost on cards to represent that it must be paid with colorless mana, but why have lands make ♦ when (1) is the same thing? Presumably to emphasize that Colorless mana has its own identity now and drive home that ♦ and (1) are not universally interchangeable.
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Nov 18, 2015 18:32
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I'm definitely not going to miss Fetches in standard. Full speed mana fixing + fuel for Delve and Jace (if you're willing to bring a $700 deck to an FNM) is dumb. The good news is that Aritocrat / Rally decks run pretty cheap since most of their engine cards are weird jank that's only good in one context, and they're pretty fun if you don't mind taking long turns. Can someone fill me on on why Deathtouch one drops aren't played more often as blockers? Last night at an FNM I ran a cut-down version of 4 Color Rally without blue, and I ran a set of Ruthless Rippers in place of Sidisi's Faithful. They did a huge amount of work trolling any deck whose plan was to attack with creatures on the ground. Obviously they have limitations, but a lot of the staple aggro cards like Swiftspear and Anafenza don't have a good way to get past them unless your opponent is willing to spend their second turn casting a removal spell on your one drop instead of building board state. EDIT: Ruthless Ripper might be my new favorite mediocre card. It's a 1/1 Deathtouch for 1, which is always an annoying place to start, but it can also be played as a morph that flips by revealing a black card in your hand (meaning you can do it while tapped out) and makes your opponent lose two life when it flips. Combine all that with the fact that it's not actually a played card in anything and you get some great reactions the first time you do it. Voyager I fucked around with this message at 05:19 on Dec 13, 2015 |
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Dec 13, 2015 05:02
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Ruthless Ripper is even more fun in a BGx Aristocrats deck because after your opponent knows you're running it you can potentially play mindgames with Haruspex, and your Ripper trading is likely to also fuel your sac engine. With a good board state, it can read "I reveal this black card from my hand to flip the Ripper I just tapped out to play on my turn. You lose two life, then it trades with your best creature, then you lose a life and I gain a life, and then I draw a card". It's basically a conditional removal spell attached to the body of a creature.
Voyager I fucked around with this message at 05:42 on Dec 13, 2015 |
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Dec 13, 2015 05:22
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There's no way the margins are actually that thin on a facility that has to pay rent and utilities, even assuming the owners didn't need to do things like pay themselves salaries or eat.
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Dec 13, 2015 07:56
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Those are unbelievably poo poo margins. Where does the revenue come from then? Is the real money in individual card sales and value trade-ins, with events mostly being a way to get people into the building?
Voyager I fucked around with this message at 08:27 on Dec 13, 2015 |
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Dec 13, 2015 08:25
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So the penalty for obvious cheating is that if you get caught the Judge stops you?
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Dec 14, 2015 01:52
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suicidesteve posted:Is that not what the penalty is supposed to be? He took back the spell, isn't that good enough? If the penalty for cheating is just having to take back the spell, then it incentivizes cheating since there is a potentially huge reward for the modest price of revealing the card you were going to cheat with if you get caught. The only reason not to come down on it super hard is that Magic actually is pretty complicated so having people auto-lose for minor mistakes would be dumb, and it's quite difficult to conclusively prove intent.
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Dec 14, 2015 02:04
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That sure is a lot of land hate  Fiend Computer posted:holy poo poo dust bowl wasteland and tectonic edge reprints. It's 6 mana to loot your whole hand and draw one and she doesn't start with enough loyalty to reliably -X the board by the time she comes out. She doesn't look great.
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Dec 14, 2015 02:13
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mandatory lesbian posted:third post just to say that i'm surprised Strip Mine isn't on the reserve list Rest in Piss four-color standard. The new fix lands look pretty sweet though. They can only produce colorless on their own, but they come into play untapped, can provide two colors of mana off of one color (which will probably lead to some goofy-as-hell mana chaining setups), and don't cost life to use.
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Dec 14, 2015 02:20
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Sickening posted:Ha, someone doesn't understand expeditions! Rinkles posted:Those are expedition only reprints of Shadowmoor lands Oh, so it's "blow up other overpriced bullshit mana bases, but only if you're running an overpriced bullshit mana base yourself". That's disappointing. EDIT: I looked it up and I understand now. I guess that's probably better than playing against Strip Mine in standard.
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Dec 14, 2015 02:26
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BizarroAzrael posted:Don't know about Kalitas, his persistent effect seems really good, but only against certain decks. I suppose with lifelink he can pressure a chump block to get a token and enable the activated ability, but the two best decks right now either have Jack and only a handful of other creatures, or Gideon who makes tokens all day. He ruins Aristocrats decks that can't blow one up as soon as he's on the board (exile bypasses "dies" triggers) while still being a pretty playable card even without relying getting maximum value out of his ability. There's a lot of graveyard play in standard and creatures dying is a normal part of most games. He might spend more time in the sideboard but he's a good Anafenza alternative to people who aren't Abzan.
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Dec 14, 2015 05:11
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Errant Gin Monks posted:Radiant flames is just as good and cheap. It won't see much play outside of eldrazi ramp, where it will be very loving over powered. If I'm reading it correctly, the flashback-esque effect on Kozilek's Return also can't be countered (unless standard has some stifle effect I don't know about). It's a triggered effect, not a spell being cast, so it can't be countered directly, and the trigger itself is an on-cast rather than an ETB. You put a fatty on the stack and the board gets wiped.
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Dec 14, 2015 05:46
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Having Return essentially be a 7-mana uncounterable board wipe could be a pretty big deal by itself in some matchups, especially since Abzan has apparently started splashing blue for Disdainful Stroke.
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Dec 14, 2015 06:06
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little munchkin posted:I've never actually been to a keep draft do people actually do this? There's no reason to do this in a keep draft because you can just take the expensive card and it's yours forever. The only reason anyone would ever leave with cards in a keep draft is if they open something dumb like Gideon and an Expedition in the same pack, and some stores will just let you buy a new pack to replace it for the draft since someone not wanting to pass a $40 card is pretty understandable.
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Dec 15, 2015 05:12
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C opens up a lot of design space for the future to print good colorless cards without having to worry about every single deck being able to include them at no cost. Right now they've done that primarily by having colorless-only interactions, but C is a more elegant solution for the long term. Agreed on the actual implementation in BFZ and Oath being kinda weird but whatever.
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Dec 15, 2015 05:34
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I don't play Modern, but Twin doesn't seem all that bad since every time you attempt the combo you risk getting 2-for-1'ed or otherwise hosed over by any form of instant-speed interaction.
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Dec 16, 2015 09:47
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Dungeon Ecology posted:Is there anything that replaces Jace in that 4-color CoCo deck? I finally got the manabase together and that motherfucker is the only thing I can't justify putting money behind. Jace does a couple of big things for the deck; he improves your hand while also letting you fill your graveyard for Rally, he lets you flashback CoCo to get even more creatures in play, and he does this all while being a viable CoCo target himself. I don't think there's anything that replaces those abilities, so your best bet is probably just to look for other viable CoCo targets with useful ETBs in your colors, or just in general any creature that is essentially a desirable spell attached to a body since those can get CoCo'ed, Rallied, and work as fuel for your sac engine. I wouldn't key in too hard on the actual mana cost; the deck cuts its curve off at 3 mana to work with CoCo, so it's naturally going to have a big cluster there, and even without Jace you're already running liked a dozen 1-2 drops. Fleshbag Marauder might be an interesting choice. Nothing's going to really replace what Jace brings to the deck, but you could get a lot of value out of it against decks that don't run wide. EDIT: In general, the Rally Decks focus a little more on creatures with good ETBs than pure sac value dudes like Sultai Emissary since the gameplan is to trigger them multiple times with Rally or even go Rally > bounce with Faithful for a third trigger, though they're still certainly not bad fits for the deck if you just need a filler card. Voyager I fucked around with this message at 10:03 on Dec 16, 2015 |
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Dec 16, 2015 09:58
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My LGS is a tiny-rear end shop with like four tables for card games that starts to get a bit crowded if there's much more than a dozen people in an event. The regulars still run the full range in terms of both age and seriousness, though probably tending towards the more casual end of things most nights. Then last night at our FNM some guy apparently walked in straight off the pro circuit or some poo poo running the full tryhard Jeskai Black setup; full playset of Jace, a dozen fetches, and even foil full arts for his basics. His deck probably cost more than everyone else in the event combined, and he even played like he was on some casted Grand Prix event, right down to all habits and mannerisms people were making fun of the last page or so (everyone else is laughing it up and having a good time and he's tensed over his hand like a cornered animal while snapping his cards ceaselessly). He ended up dropping a round to one of the better locals running some goofy Omnath ramp deck and became enormously, hilariously distressed, going into great detail about how he should never have lost a game in that matchup and browbeating himself relentlessly for his failure to take 1st place. He wasn't trying to belittle his opponents and he was correctly assessing that he lost because he made avoidable mistakes (don't tap out against a ramp deck with like 8 mana available and a full hand), but wasn't overly blessed with tact and the sheer intensity of is anguish absolutely made my night. Then later on in the draft tournament he picked another major league deck and lost the first round against some goobery 15-year old while complaining that he was losing because the locals at our store drafted the meta wrong. I opened a Foil Dromoka in one of my prize packs and had one of the proprietors immediately buy it off me for cash at full value and getting to watch that guy melt down was still the highlight of the event.
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Dec 20, 2015 05:50
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Zoness posted:This post sounds like "I'm an idiot who can't grasp context" You're the one responding to McMagic posts.
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Dec 22, 2015 19:29
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Irony Be My Shield posted:The 4-color environment we have now only exists because of the combination of fetches + fetchable duals. What could SoI possibly include that would keep manafixing at that level? My other concern is that a lot of the vaguely playable mechanics from BFZ seem to rely on Fetches to be playable in one way or another. The big converge spells like Bring to Light are going to be really hard to build around without crazy rainbow manabases, and even simpler stuff like Landfall gets a lot of its power from being able to hit two triggers per turn and get them at instant speed. I'm not pining for 4-color standard by any means, but it seems odd that they'd make a bunch of set mechanics that rely on a support base which is about to rotate out.
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Dec 23, 2015 23:58
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I started playing the game in Odyssey block and quit during Onslaught block so bringing back Madness would be a loving sweet nostalgia trip for me.
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Dec 24, 2015 01:24
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Boco_T posted:The best was yesterday at the Modern IQ this guy (who I hate and will continue to hate) was using "the most recent Star City Invitational token is a Germ" as evidence to whoever was sitting near him Is there any train of logic to that whatsoever or is he just an idiot?
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Dec 28, 2015 23:10
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Off the top of my head, you could probably do some goofy ghetto Atarka poo poo where you go as wide as possible with Dragon Fodder tokens into a Become Immense on Zada and stomp somebody with a table made of 7/7s. One advantage is that it's a lot harder to blow out with spot removal than a normal Atarka combo because you're making everything big instead of just one creature and the Zada triggers go on the stack as soon as the spell is cast, so once you declare it there's no way to stop it; even a counter on the original spell won't stop the copies from happening. Actually, that sounds pretty legit if you can forgive it relying on a 4-drop, though it may play out more like a conventional Atarka deck that can additionally say "if I untap with Zada on the board and a pump spell in hand, you lost, and if you spent your only spot removal killing Zada on your turn to stop the combo than you might just lose to the pump spell anyways." Voyager I fucked around with this message at 23:33 on Dec 28, 2015 |
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Dec 28, 2015 23:28
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Are there any good dual land options for GW (and I guess allied colors in general) that don't come into play tapped and don't rely on fetches? Painlands do the job well enough for enemy colors, but the options for allied colors seem less desirable; the Khans basics come in tapped and the BFZ duals aren't reliable sources of untapped mana in the early game for decks that have to draw their lands naturally.
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Dec 29, 2015 02:25
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Brownhat posted:The real twist will be when they reprint it in Oath and keep it banned in Modern. We already have two Modern banned cards in Standard so that wouldn't really be that crazy.
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Dec 29, 2015 02:36
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little munchkin posted:If devoid aggro ever becomes a thing then the mimic seems like a good 2-drop alongside Forrunner Of Slaughter. Dust Stalker would let you swing with a pair of 5/3s on turn four which seems good. The deck still needs a lot more toys to compete with Jace-based control decks though. Devoid Aggro is already a thing, it's just not very good yet. A two-drop that turns into a Dust Stalker would absolutely go in the current version of the deck, though that may say more about the quality of the deck than the card.
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Dec 29, 2015 21:03
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Angry Grimace posted:I was gonna say "but he has Bargain out" except lol he only has 3 cards. She might be an okay Gideon-lite if she was 2G instead of 1GG, but that mana cost is a pretty big punch in the balls for what she brings to the table. She could almost work in the BGx(x) Aristocrats/Rally decks that are bouncing around, but she can't get hit by Collected Company like the flipwalkers and lol if you think they're spending one of their like 5 non-creature spell slots on this. Definitely not worth $15 when Gideon is $20 though.
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Dec 29, 2015 22:01
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Balon posted:I can't wait to open this as my pre-release promo along with zero walkers. Can't wait to hatedraft this after someone across the table from me flips out about opening a Gideon.
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Dec 30, 2015 08:56
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Elyv posted:This is in pack 1/2, Gideon is in pack 3 Oh well. Maybe they'll accidentally print another good Planeswalker again.
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Dec 30, 2015 09:03
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I was making fun of BFZ for having an overall low power level except for Gideon immediately inserting himself as a standard staple.
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Dec 30, 2015 09:08
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stinkles1112 posted:I wish they would print some playable Eldrazi aggro guys at a CMC of something other than three. Like we've got Herald of Kozilek, Wasteland Strangler, Ruination Guide, Vile Aggregate, Molten Nursery, now this guy, plus I want Kolaghan's Command and Exquisite Firecraft, and I want all of those cards to be in the Ghostfire Blade deck that I just know is gonna be a thing. There's the new 2/1 that borrows stats for a turn, which is totally playable when you expect to be slamming bigger creatures every turn from there.
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Dec 30, 2015 20:52
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stinkles1112 posted:Yeah that guy is probably good enough but what I'd really like to see is another decent one drop to stick a turn two Ghostfire Blade on. In an ideal world they'll give me a devoid 2/1 for 1 Agreed. Sludge Crawler's pump is good enough to get some utility out of it but there's really not much else going on in one mana. The deck is also really dependent on whether or not you draw a Ghostfire Blade.
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Dec 30, 2015 21:21
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UberJew posted:There's also not any interaction in that graveyard or hand for the storm player so they didn't have any decisions to make, nobody played any magic that game The reanimate guy had to pick the right creature to Entomb I guess???
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Dec 30, 2015 22:34
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Night Danger Moose posted:This was my first thought too. His artist needs to be fired into the sun. Get a stopwatch, start it, look at the tree, and see how long it takes you to stop laughing.
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Dec 30, 2015 23:21
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