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Explosionface posted:Fade Zebra. I also completely forgot it's battle worn, so there's that. That looks pretty baller, honestly. I actually don't hate my COP gun skin that much I just wish it were for a better assault rifle.
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Nov 19, 2015 08:58
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Oh hey, new thread ! That reminds me I still have to open my 20€ disappointment. I'll come around to it eventually
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Nov 19, 2015 09:06
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Explosionface posted:Fade Zebra. I also completely forgot it's battle worn, so there's that. need to pair this with a skin for the don juan to turn him into yipes
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Nov 19, 2015 09:17
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Following on from yesterday's talk: Ashley's in a newer position of trust.
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Nov 19, 2015 17:52
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Great first step. Maybe all that bullshit about more communication is gonna go somewhere. I can't think of a better advocate than Ashley. Is there a transcript of the Skype call somewhere?
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Nov 19, 2015 18:08
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Signing an NDA does not mean that they trust her more, nor does it mean she is going to get any more "demands" fulfilled. Obviously one can hope, but the meeting yesterday appeased some of the most vocal opponents while promising a sum total of dick aside from "better communication", which means nothing. I don't mean that it means nothing is promised, I mean it literally means nothing definitive and the whiners here spent their collective load while getting absolutely nothing in return except an appearance with almir. Which if your goal was to get on TV with a minor subculture celebrity, mission accomplished, I guess? It is very naive to think that this changes anything with regard to overkill and the community moderation team. The simplest explanation is that this piece of paper makes them feel respected and included when really nothing has changed and overkill continues to get community managers for free. NDAs are so common in industry that people throw them out just to be sure. I'm under 9 NDAs for various companies right now because supposedly they gave out industry secrets during the loving interviews I did. Spoilers, they didn't, these places are just paranoid. Honestly the fact that people are assuaged by this on the steam forums just makes me think that the "protest" against "Overshill" is an even bigger loving joke. What precisely could they have told Ashley leading up to the release of safes that would have made her job easier? Or what would she have said that would have fixed all the problems? Wake the gently caress up, the most that would've happened is they would've given her the heads up 2 or 3 days before and she would've been mentally prepared for the poo poo storm. She could have said anything she pleased to Almir, it wouldn't have changed what was about to happen. They are not going to bring her in on marketing or design decisions, which is clearly what Ashley thinks is going to happen in her post since she keeps going on about trust and communication. You're going to be told what you need to know, and that's that something is coming. What, when, and how will have already been decided.
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Nov 19, 2015 18:27
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You have to applaud Overkill. They know how to control the mob. The mob is volatile and easily distracted and they're weaving a special kind of magic and getting away with murder.
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Nov 19, 2015 18:43
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If by "murder" you mean "microtransactions"
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Nov 19, 2015 18:57
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Sex Robot posted:You have to applaud Overkill. They know how to control the mob. The mob is volatile and easily distracted and they're weaving a special kind of magic and getting away with murder. Except its  Ashely that is doing it and has been at the helm (along with the other community mods, i just know her best) all along for a lot of other poo poo this community has kicked up like racism/sexism/wickism for the new heisters
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Nov 19, 2015 19:27
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Coolguye posted:Signing an NDA does not mean that they trust her more, nor does it mean she is going to get any more "demands" fulfilled. Obviously one can hope, but the meeting yesterday appeased some of the most vocal opponents while promising a sum total of dick aside from "better communication", which means nothing. I don't mean that it means nothing is promised, I mean it literally means nothing definitive and the whiners here spent their collective load while getting absolutely nothing in return except an appearance with almir. Which if your goal was to get on TV with a minor subculture celebrity, mission accomplished, I guess? What a world we live in. I'm agreeing with Coolguye.
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Nov 19, 2015 19:39
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I think the most we can hope for is as Overkill half-bakes an idea and shoves it out the door ("business as usual"), Ashley & Company get advance warning and can - possibly - say WHAT THE gently caress YOU NEED TO ACTUALLY EXPLAIN THIS and do Overkill's job for them, and then when the idea is actually presented to the public the most egregiously stupid parts are explained in advance, as opposed to no explanation > e-rage > twitch stream > somewhat useful AMA explanation three weeks later. If that happens - and remember that's a best case scenario here - it's more than we could expect out of most companies, so I'm still for it.
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Nov 19, 2015 20:00
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Signing an NDA means that Ashley will have less control over what information she communicates. It probably will mean she gets more information about the back end of what's going on, but it doesn't mean anything in terms of information the community receives. I don't really have a problem with this because nothing overkill's done w/r/t micro transactions or crimefest has bothered me in the slightest.
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Nov 19, 2015 20:36
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Psion posted:I think the most we can hope for is as Overkill half-bakes an idea and shoves it out the door ("business as usual"), Ashley & Company get advance warning and can - possibly - say WHAT THE gently caress YOU NEED TO ACTUALLY EXPLAIN THIS and do Overkill's job for them, and then when the idea is actually presented to the public the most egregiously stupid parts are explained in advance, as opposed to no explanation > e-rage > twitch stream > somewhat useful AMA explanation three weeks later. I've always wondered why this wasn't the case beforehand; you can't expect a person to do their job well if you don't tell them about major shakeups that are coming down the pipe.
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Nov 19, 2015 20:42
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New deagle skin! http://i.imgur.com/qovSlQ7.gifv
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Nov 19, 2015 20:54
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Wales Grey posted:I've always wondered why this wasn't the case beforehand; you can't expect a person to do their job well if you don't tell them about major shakeups that are coming down the pipe. It is entirely possible they simply haven't internalized the need for it. Once burned, twice shy, so we can but hope they're figuring it out. Let's take hypothetical decision X, which will be a thinly disguised analogue for microtransactions. The publisher says "do this." The develoeprs get the word and start doing it. It's their job, whether or not they like it. They keep going. They finish the product, send it out, say, we've accomplished the goals of this project. It gets dropped in the production queue because time is money. At the same time, they've been working on it for weeks/months - so it's not "new" to them. They've internalized it as the way things are going to be now. It comes out, internet explodes, because nobody outside that bubble had the slightest inkling. Is this the developer's fault? Not particularly, no - they're doing their jobs. But somewhere in there, someone didn't step back and ask "now how would someone coming at this cold feel about it? And how can we handle that?" And that's the fault of PR. Which has always - always been a major weakness on Overkill's part. I'm not saying gently caress ALMIR so don't read it like that - it's like blaming Major Nelson for the terrible decisions made before launching the Xbone; the failure was progressive and many steps up the chain from "PR frontman." I am saying the mechanisms in place at 505/Overkill to control their PR/brand/messaging are inadequate. That's what I mean when I wrote "Ashley and company do their jobs for them" because this is something Overkill needs to have handled. The publisher usually handles it. Theirs isn't.
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Nov 19, 2015 20:55
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Wales Grey posted:I've always wondered why this wasn't the case beforehand; you can't expect a person to do their job well if you don't tell them about major shakeups that are coming down the pipe. Because she doesn't work for them. The reality of the situation is that none of the community management team has actually been vetted at any point prior to this stupid strike and almir's interview. They got their positions purely by being the most active people around, and kept the positions by not stirring the pot too much. None of them owe anything to Overkill beyond sentimentality, and you're a fool if you rely on that to establish a functional system. The situation works out great for Overkill because the management team does a decent job for no accountability burden on Overkill's part, and, just as importantly, for free. That's the real value that Overkill's getting out of the interview and the NDA - their team shuts up and gets back to what they were doing well, and they don't have to answer to anything the team does or pay them a dime. I'm not saying that Overkill is being unethical here - capitalizing off the excitement of your community is standard, and GOOD, business practice for a hundred reasons - but what I am saying is that they had rock-solid proof that they had value to Overkill and they basically shelved their complaints in return for what is in all likelihood going to be a few crumbs of information that won't really impact their lives at all. Oh and by the way they traded away their right to talk about stuff with relation to Overkill, too! The real question in my mind is, what were they pulling this stunt for? Was it for themselves, because they have been treated poorly and put in impossible situations? If so, then why the public Almir stunt, and why did they cave so easily? 10 USD an hour for 10 hours a week of work moderating the forums is barely even beer money this day and age, but it would've been an entirely fair agreement for something they were doing anyway, and it would've given Overkill a real incentive to make sure that they're part of the team in a way a basic NDA doesn't. Hell, for my clients I frequently find faceless moderators for 8-10 bucks an hour, and then bill the client for 15-20. This is a valuable service, they knew it because of what they knew Almir was willing to do, and they pissed it away. So they did nothing for themselves. Was it for the community, because of the massive shitstorm? If so, why did they drop their complaint after getting less than nothing? Again, signing the NDA is not a privilege, it is a responsibility. They are, arguably, LESS able to advocate for the community now than they were a few days ago, precisely because if they hear something, they can't talk about it and provide feedback the way they normally would. Almir promised absolutely gently caress-all on the call but it made them happy anyway. So they did nothing, or less than nothing, for the community. Really what it boils down to is that the 'protest' was exactly what Almir implied it was from the start - a very vocal super-minority that had no idea what they wanted aside from 'not that'. Being a vocal person who doesn't like something on the internet doesn't make you persuasive, it makes you a joke. I think there's a number of people starting to realize that as the boycott calls break down like Modern Warfare 2's, so their 'protest' had fewer teeth than an 85 year old moonshiner, and even less direction. And at least in my mind, shelving your complaints in return for less than nothing just confirms that you didn't have a leg to stand on. This entire thing has been a joke. A very sad joke, with people like jivjov as the punch line. And that's my absolute last seriouspost on the subject. Anyone who responds to this, I appreciate your input so much that I will respond by channeling the Imp Zone.
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Nov 19, 2015 21:40
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NDA means they trust her less because now they got the squeeze on information and if she breaks it and they find out they can nebulously punish her.
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Nov 19, 2015 21:46
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Most NDA's aren't enforceable. It depends entirely on the wording. Knowing OVK, theirs is probably pretty broad with very few specifics. I wouldn't say they can nebulously punish her. First off, they'd need to take her to court. Unless she's giving away The Colonels Special Blend, leaking poo poo about upcoming DLC or micro-transactions wouldn't do anything to actually damage the company. Honestly, it just makes it look to the outside like she's getting special information and all that. It's just a legal codpiece to make their poo poo look bigger.
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Nov 20, 2015 00:07
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I think the saddest thing about it is Almir blatantly said "poo poo changed" in regards to why Payday 2 of now is different than the Payday 2 of several years ago. Like, that is business. poo poo changes. And to Reddit, this is the most grievous of sins. I cannot fathom a group of people who treat offhand comments of several years ago as sacred covenants to never be defiled. I'm putting too much faith in redditors to understand basic real world interactions I feel.
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Nov 20, 2015 00:57
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cheezit posted:Most NDA's aren't enforceable. It depends entirely on the wording. Knowing OVK, theirs is probably pretty broad with very few specifics. I wouldn't say they can nebulously punish her. First off, they'd need to take her to court. Unless she's giving away The Colonels Special Blend, leaking poo poo about upcoming DLC or micro-transactions wouldn't do anything to actually damage the company. You don't need the NDA to be enforceable to be able to use it as a lovely excuse to fire someone.
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Nov 20, 2015 01:13
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There would be an enormous shitstorm if they kicked out ashley. I would be surprised if they did that, NDA or not.
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Nov 20, 2015 01:21
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Gestalt Intellect posted:There would be an enormous shitstorm if they kicked out ashley. I would be surprised if they did that, NDA or not. Uh huh, and would that be bigger or smaller than the shitstorms of.... oh, I don't know, paid microtransactions? Let's not overestimate things here. Really, what I want is for the dataminers to go figure out how exactly safe drops work - what the criteria are for getting one, and then what do you have to do to get a second? Is it just time played? Games played? Games played on different days? Someone's gotta be able to figure this out. I have plenty of anecdotal evidence and let me say in advance to the three people who are about to post their anecdotal experiences: that's not really helpful. I want to know if the actual formula has been found.
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Nov 20, 2015 01:25
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Elliotw2 posted:You don't need the NDA to be enforceable to be able to use it as a lovely excuse to fire someone. Yeah, but it's mostly laughable when the threat is against a volunteer gig.
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Nov 20, 2015 01:49
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Lyrai posted:I think the saddest thing about it is Almir blatantly said "poo poo changed" in regards to why Payday 2 of now is different than the Payday 2 of several years ago. Like, that is business. poo poo changes. And to Reddit, this is the most grievous of sins. My qualm with it was always the "don't piss on my back and tell me it's raining" angle. You release a new way for us to give you money. Don't do it as reward for jumping through hoops and pretend you're doing the playerbase a favor by adding this. TF2 was at least always honest about this. Hell if my memory serves, a lot of the promo material at release was Saxton Hale talking about idiots wasting money on pointless hats. Sex Robot fucked around with this message at 02:04 on Nov 20, 2015 |
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Nov 20, 2015 02:01
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Psion posted:
It's every 5-6 days, based solely on the time from your last safe drop. Nothing more nothing less. Lab Rats DW or Jewelry Store Normal will give you a safe if you play every 6 days. If you want to ensure you always get a safe just boot the game up every 6 days and complete a heist. When you get a safe drop go scratch the days off your calendar until your safe drops again. It's very consistent. Source: Played the game everyday for 2 weeks after crimefest. Got a safe every 5-6 days, regardless of what I did or played afterward. Also played consistently with other people and the period was the same with them as well. The reason why I say 5-6 days is I didn't slam a stop-watch the second I got one, so let's say 5.5 days? im depressed lol fucked around with this message at 02:15 on Nov 20, 2015 |
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Nov 20, 2015 02:05
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cheezit posted:Most NDA's aren't enforceable. It depends entirely on the wording. Knowing OVK, theirs is probably pretty broad with very few specifics. I wouldn't say they can nebulously punish her. First off, they'd need to take her to court. Unless she's giving away The Colonels Special Blend, leaking poo poo about upcoming DLC or micro-transactions wouldn't do anything to actually damage the company. Psion posted:Really, what I want is for the dataminers to go figure out how exactly safe drops work - what the criteria are for getting one, and then what do you have to do to get a second? Is it just time played? Games played? Games played on different days? Someone's gotta be able to figure this out.
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Nov 20, 2015 02:29
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im depressed lol posted:Source: anecdotal evidence  literally the exact thing I didn't want. Discendo Vox posted:I believe dataminers can't do anything to determine what drill and safe rates are, as they're steam-side. Aren't CS:GO crates and TF2 crates fairly well understood, though? Is that because Valve posted how they work or people figuring it out? like back when I actually
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Nov 20, 2015 04:14
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Just had an odd bug where no matter who you were talking to or calling at your character would yell "Clover" instead. Happened to both me and my buddy, yell at each other, speed ups, revive calls all of em Clover.
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Nov 20, 2015 04:18
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Prokhor Zakharov posted:Just had an odd bug where no matter who you were talking to or calling at your character would yell "Clover" instead. Happened to both me and my buddy, yell at each other, speed ups, revive calls all of em Clover. Chains has a problem where he calls far too many people Bonnie, but everyone-as-Clover is new. That's pretty awesome. Who were you playing as?
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Nov 20, 2015 04:19
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Psion posted:
I thought it was funny because i was going to make an obnoxious irony post with lots of meaningless details and conclusions and then someone had already beaten me unironically
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Nov 20, 2015 05:29
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Lyrai posted:I think the saddest thing about it is Almir blatantly said "poo poo changed" in regards to why Payday 2 of now is different than the Payday 2 of several years ago. Like, that is business. poo poo changes. And to Reddit, this is the most grievous of sins. Some of the symptoms of autism include an inability to deal with change and a lack of social ability or comprehension.
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Nov 20, 2015 07:43
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Coolguye posted:Because she doesn't work for them. This is a very good post.
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Nov 20, 2015 08:47
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The sights and sounds of Vegas have inspired my shitpost planning. I've got a much more complete Death Vox plan for Car Shop that includes meaningful (optional) stealth, gunplay, challenge, and ends with you ramping your car over an active SWAT Turret into the securing/escape zone.
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Nov 20, 2015 08:54
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Discendo Vox posted:The sights and sounds of Vegas have inspired my shitpost planning. I've got a much more complete Death Vox plan for Car Shop that includes meaningful (optional) stealth, gunplay, challenge, and ends with you ramping your car over an active SWAT Turret into the securing/escape zone. Will you lose money if your car gets too many bullet holes in it or your crash it too much?
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Nov 20, 2015 09:11
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Fellis posted:I thought it was funny because i was going to make an obnoxious irony post with lots of meaningless details and conclusions and then someone had already beaten me unironically I wish you had, that would've been funny. If you do I'll go update the achievement to 2/3 
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Nov 20, 2015 18:13
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Coolguye posted:And that's my absolute last seriouspost on the subject. Anyone who responds to this, I appreciate your input so much that I will respond by channeling the Imp Zone. fite me irl bro  I still haven't watched the interview thing, is it just a Skype call? If it is, can someone turn it into a podcast instead?
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Nov 20, 2015 18:36
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Lyrai posted:I think the saddest thing about it is Almir blatantly said "poo poo changed" in regards to why Payday 2 of now is different than the Payday 2 of several years ago. Like, that is business. poo poo changes. And to Reddit, this is the most grievous of sins. Hah, you think it was just redditors who took that comment 100% like a legally binding thing? Prepare to be disappointed! Its been years, of course poo poo is going to change
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Nov 20, 2015 18:50
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Psion posted:Aren't CS:GO crates and TF2 crates fairly well understood, though? Is that because Valve posted how they work or people figuring it out? like back when I actually It's because Valve told the public exactly how they work. At least TF2 ones, I have no idea if CS:GO ones work on the same principle.
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Nov 20, 2015 18:56
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watho posted:It's because Valve told the public exactly how they work. At least TF2 ones, I have no idea if CS:GO ones work on the same principle. All Valve crate-key things work the exact same. Playing gives you a shot at a random item drop, often that's a crate. The only way to unlock that crate is to buy a key for roughly three-four bucks and unlock it. You can sell any item, crate, or key provided they haven't been specifically barred from being traded. Payday 2's was introduced using the EXACT same model and anyone familiar with it the whole thing was just, "Oh, that." It was kind of gross in the way microtransactions are but eh, don't like it don't give 'em money. The only difference is that after the backlash Overkill made it so keys can drop as well, meaning every so often you'd get a free safe, and that contents of safes can only come from safes, never drop while playing. All in all, I don't care beyond the fact that microtransactions are kinda gross.
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Nov 20, 2015 19:20
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| # ? Apr 20, 2024 02:45 |
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http://steamcommunity.com/groups/vocalminority#announcements/detail/768223743057109904
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Nov 20, 2015 20:56
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