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Bar Ran Dun posted:They won’t be able to on the pier. Like physically won’t be able to. I've been reading through your stream of quotes there are a few things that you seem to think obvious and true that others might think stupid and credulous. Let's go through a couple of your lines of argument. 1) The US doesn't have much leverage over Israel because it's worried about its own supply chain for various parts including optics - I'm not sure why you're choosing to ignore other forms of leverage Israel has (eg through a strong lobby network). The optics example doesn't make a lick of sense. If Israel threatened that kind of leverage of the US in a non-urgent situation, the answer isn't to immediately start presenting but to threaten to remove anything supply-chain oriented from Israel. You certainly don't start granting tens of billions to the country committing genocide. The US has leverage here. 2) The pier isn't bullshit because actually it could theoretically supply all the food Gaza needs! Trust me, I've worked in logistics - I think other posters have pointed out that the problem isn't that there's simply no way to get food into Gaza. It's that Israel doesn't want to let food into Gaza. Even in your theoretical scenario of full control over the pier with Schrodinger's Israel both too scared to do anything to aid trucks and so powerful it can threaten the US with supply chain disaster, this could simply have taken place at the land border with Egypt. Israel *hasn't stopped attacking food distribution networks in Gaza*. So one of the trucks picking up aid from the port, assuming Israel isn't trying to stop peanut butter as a luxury good anymore, still has to make it to wherever people are and offload. The reason people think your point here is incredibly stupid is because there are easier, better alternatives that don't require expensive construction, long lead time and the same forward management or risk to ongoing logistics.
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Apr 29, 2024 08:45
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Obviously NVG are just one example, but if the majority of notable exports are similar: I'm sure the US would be able to ration their consumption of goggles longer than Israel could hold out with major sanctions/blockades. Well, unless these are special goggles which run on a handful of blood diamonds cut into a specific shape by an Israeli hermit, which I think is just barely too absurd to be a real Pentagon contract.
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Apr 29, 2024 08:57
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I'm sure anything Israel can manufacture, the US or at worst one of their allies can. They can research and develop anything they want. Saying that the country who went to the moon in less than a decade and made an atomic bomb in less than five is being held hostage because of night vision goggles or whatever is absurd. The US has been supporting Israel for a long time, even when it was a much poorer country. If suddenly they looked at their list of reasons to support Israel and trade was on top, I'm sure they'd start working on local production and call it a day.
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Apr 29, 2024 09:26
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The US support for Israel is certainly more political (a President who is seen to desert Israel would almost certainly lose an election) and strategic (it has been a long-term US ally in a region with few of them) than it is economic. Honestly I suspect that even if public opinion stops being significantly in favour of Israel that may not be enough - there are plenty of horrible dictatorships that aren't particularly popular with the public that the US supports for purely strategic reasons.Demiurge4 posted:Honestly think it would be very interesting to see the court case against Hamas officials in the Hague. What they can pin on them, what they'll confess to and how much of it is going to be various shades of "shot rockets at Israel".
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Apr 29, 2024 09:52
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the peculiar thing about the argument wrt the pier is that if the US interest was to just make some noise to placate people while doing nothing, they could do that without a pier, without the expense and materiel commitment, and without putting american troops in harms way. hell, are doing that without a pier. personally I don't believe that the US gives a flying gently caress about undermining Israel's ability to inflict all manner of miseries on palestinians. some people in the government, eg the people protesting in the state dept, likely do care, but they aren't the ones setting any relevant policy so they effectively might as well not exist. so if the pier isn't necessary as an act of theatre (which I don't think there's any real argument that it is necessary as such, nor is it being trumpeted the way you would a piece of theatre) and assuming it isn't for its stated purpose, eg getting aid into Palestine with less interference from israel, then wtf is it for? Neurolimal posted:Obviously NVG are just one example, but if the majority of notable exports are similar: I'm sure the US would be able to ration their consumption of goggles longer than Israel could hold out with major sanctions/blockades. military quality controlled acquisition chains are every bit that insane and specific, yes. much more so, if anything Herstory Begins Now fucked around with this message at 11:30 on Apr 29, 2024 |
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Apr 29, 2024 11:25
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Herstory Begins Now posted:
Like I said on the last page this is totally backwards. Israel is reliant on the U.S. for most of its air defense systems, not the other way around.
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Apr 29, 2024 11:46
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So do all countries have to only buy the genocidal NVGs with no possible other option or is just that the genocidal NVGs are cheaper
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Apr 29, 2024 13:09
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^the genocidal nvgs are way, way better and are considered vital to national defense (substitute any number of products for nvgs in the above statement) strictly speaking it's more that israel's defense industry is completely entangled with US mic and viewing it in terms of specific products misses the forest for the trees also i'd agree that even with national security considerations in mind there's just a multitude of ways the US could leverage Israel if there was any major interest in doing so Herstory Begins Now fucked around with this message at 13:30 on Apr 29, 2024 |
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Apr 29, 2024 13:21
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Herstory Begins Now posted:^the genocidal nvgs are way, way better and are considered vital to national defense (substitute any number of products for nvgs in the above statement) https://elbitsystems.com/pr-new/elb...s-marine-corps/ But hey, at least we responded Nov 29 to the increased genocide by, uh, quintupling our order from the 2018 contract. That'll show them
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Apr 29, 2024 13:31
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yeah i don't believe that there is virtually any real intention to stop israel
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Apr 29, 2024 13:36
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The lead time on replacing Israeli NV manufacturing would likely be 2 years, probably a little more to iron out process issues. Before your done this will have ended, and like clockwork it will be back to business as usual. Almost no company is going to invest in something they know is going to have the legs cut from under it before they sell a single unit. You also have the double tap that in addition to running straight back to the genocide machine, your own politicians will then hamstring your sales with strict export restrictions. Meaning you won't be able to sell to anyone.
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Apr 29, 2024 13:42
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Hong XiuQuan posted:I've been reading through your stream of quotes there are a few things that you seem to think obvious and true that others might think stupid and credulous. Let's go through a couple of your lines of argument. I'm just theorizing here, but since there has been some discussion about how Israel as a nation entity seems to have adopted a rhetorical strategy of calling anyone criticizing them anti-Semites, it's maybe easier to understand or swallow "oh Israel manufactures fancy military poo poo that the US couldn't I'm not saying it's going on in this thread, but the general public slash media discourse around this whole disaster is, well, a mess, so I could see some logic in finding more beep-boop, non-emotional arguments to point at, even if they fall apart under some scrutiny or not. And the technical argument, ironically enough, is slightly more optimistic; if Israel is the only source of [magical people-killing doohickey], this situation has a relatively easy fix, make them in the US itself or buy them from someone else who makes people-killing doohickeys*. How do you go about the discourse around fixing the US political situation so that the Israeli lobbying organizations don't have so much power? It almost immediately caves in because getting money in general out of US politics is apparently impossible for a host of very cynical reasons. *Of course the actual argument seems to have been that these particular magical doohickeys cannot be found anywhere else on the planet, but the obvious counter-argument is that the US is a manufacturing powerhouse and maybe doesn't care about patent law as much as it does about people-killing doohickeys
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Apr 29, 2024 13:54
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It seems they may be at least a popular doohickey purveyor as since the "current conflict" started, in addition to 500M from the US, the firm has received 600M in orders from Australia, 400M from the EU, and 400M from "an Asia Pacific nation", though that last was for drones, not night vision. Learning a lot this morning about nation building and statecraft Rappaport posted:. That's the beauty of it! The doohickey at issue is made by Elbit Systems of America specifically, so it's not coming from Haifa like the Australians and similar! It's made in Norfolk and headquartered in Fort Worth lol https://www.elbitamerica.com/contact-us projecthalaxy fucked around with this message at 14:11 on Apr 29, 2024 |
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Apr 29, 2024 14:07
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Irony Be My Shield posted:The US support for Israel is certainly more political (a President who is seen to desert Israel would almost certainly lose an election) I really don't think that's true. I'm not sure if it was ever true, but it's certainly less true now than ever.
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Apr 29, 2024 14:13
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Charliegrs posted:Basically all of the media in the US is calling the campus protests anti semitic. So my question is, what evidence do they have of this because I'm not seeing it? Are they simply calling it anti semitic because the protests are pro Palestinian? Is anyone chanting pro Hamas slogans? I mean the crowds are pretty big so I wouldn't be surprised if there's at least a few actual anti semites but I'm guessing these protests by and large are anti genocide and not anti semitic but of course the media is doing a horrible job of actually representing what they are. I haven't looked into it too much but I do follow a few people who are definitely of the opinion that the campus protests are widely anti-semitic. I'm going to post examples not as an argument for that perspective but just as a sampling of what they're using to draw that conclusion. There's also a lot of pointless whataboutism regarding the privilege of students being able to camp out, Syria, and who knows what else.     https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/antisemitism/article-798915    He's written a lot also but it's a bit too much to repost here. I will end with a quote that has been reposted or referenced multiple times. quote:"FREE PALESTINE" is an Islamic conquest movement. So yeah.
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Apr 29, 2024 14:26
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projecthalaxy posted:It seems they may be at least a popular doohickey purveyor as since the "current conflict" started, in addition to 500M from the US, the firm has received 600M in orders from Australia, 400M from the EU, and 400M from "an Asia Pacific nation", though that last was for drones, not night vision. Elbit America is totally run by Americans and all of their NVG stuff is just a Harris rebrand. I’m not going to go digging through my arms room right now to win an internet argument but I’ve never seen an elbit branded optic in the wild, and the older junky stuff like the pvs 14 is made by multiple companies at this point. I think people in this thread are wildly overblowing the Israeli government’s ability to affect any of this stuff. I’m happy to be proven wrong, but you’d have to be real dumb to allow a foreign company, especially one with a reputation for whiny agressive implementation of backdoors, to be the exclusive manufacturer of a C2 system like a JBCP, a fancy optic with a HUD, or anything that integrates into it.
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Apr 29, 2024 14:47
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not a value-add posted:Elbit America is totally run by Americans and all of their NVG stuff is just a Harris rebrand. I’m not going to go digging through my arms room right now to win an internet argument but I’ve never seen an elbit branded optic in the wild, and the older junky stuff like the pvs 14 is made by multiple companies at this point. I think people in this thread are wildly overblowing the Israeli government’s ability to affect any of this stuff. Yeah idk man, I'm just googling stuff while I watch progress bars progress. By which I mean I'm an INDEPENDENT ACTOR doing CRITICAL OSINT OPERATIONS or whatever people were saying on twitter. This was the press release I found after finding Elbit was the all important NVG firm, already linked above quote:Haifa, Israel, November 29, 2023 – Elbit Systems Ltd. (NASDAQ: ESLT and TASE: ESLT) (“Elbit Systems” or the “Company”) announced today that according to the announcement of the U.S. Department of Defense (DOD), Elbit Systems’ U.S. subsidiary, Elbit Systems of America – Night Vision LLC, (“Elbit Systems of America”), was awarded an indefinite delivery/ indefinite quantity (ID/IQ) contract with a maximum ceiling of $500 million, for the supply of Squad Binocular Night Vision Goggle (SBNVG) systems; spare and repair parts; contractor logistics supports and test article refurbishment. I'm sure that means more to you than me!
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Apr 29, 2024 15:04
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The business units for a lot of these things get traded around, depending on who does the acquisition they become little Americanized subsidiaries to prevent technology transfer is the long and short of it. The products, at least what you see down in a line unit, don’t really change. Sometimes it’s just having a certain number of Americans with clearances on the board, sometimes it’s completely walled off with a whole separate company. I don’t know the intricacies of what requirements have to be met, but I’d be pretty surprised if the US government didn’t immediately just force a sale if the Israeli/Italian/French/Germans tried to pull some shenanigans and cancel a contract or whatever. For the bigger stuff like ADA systems there’s a lot of joint development. Sometimes you’ll have a situation where a large purchase of systems by a specific nation will fund the development of a fun feature of an existing system, but it’s still the US controlling everything. Honestly I can’t think of a single joint developed and foreign manufactured system that the US actually fields for air defense right now. Israel’s entire AMD spectrum was joint developed by the US, but we don’t procure any of it beyond test battery amounts. not a value-add fucked around with this message at 15:50 on Apr 29, 2024 |
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Apr 29, 2024 15:45
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I was a scout in the Army and we used many different fancy high tech optics, and they were all American made by Harris, Raytheon, or Northrop Grumman. PVS-14s were our shittiest NVGs in the arms room and mostly given to support soldiers and staff officers.
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Apr 29, 2024 15:49
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You really missed out on the PVS-7s for the full zero depth perception ankle breaking falling in random holes experience.
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Apr 29, 2024 15:59
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Bar Ran Dun posted:Think about trucks in a line at a border crossing. Each one getting opened only by Israelis. The line has to wait on each inspection one after the other. If they get rejected it’s a big deal, all the way back to where they came. Do you have any idea what an inspection station is? Trucks aren't being searched linearly on the road one by one, each one holding up the entire line of vehicles behind them. There is an entire complex, or to put it in your terms "a bigass parking lot," dedicated to being able to inspect significant amounts of cargo. It is literally built to accommodate a throughput of 450 truck inspections a day. It isn't a matter of logistical capacity for inspections, like you've misrepresented. 
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Apr 29, 2024 16:07
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Oh wow im just finding this out for the first time. Welcome to the ummah brother en.wikipedia.org posted:In March 2024, on the eve of Ramadan, King and his wife Rai King formally converted to Islam from Christianity in the presence of Palestinian-American imam Omar Suleiman.[98] He's been really involved quote:### Claimed involvement in release of Israeli hostages by Hamas
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Apr 29, 2024 16:55
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Rebel Blob posted:It isn't a matter of logistical capacity for inspections, like you've misrepresented. It’s that the logistics are fundamentally different. At a marine terminal goods have to wait for the ship. The ship is going to load and then sail at a particular date and time. They can be inspected in that window without creating unnecessary delays. If deficiencies are noted they can be rectified in that window, reinspected, and still make the ship. That’s a very different situation from being inspected at a land border crossing. And when I say bigass parking lot, that means 50,000 to 100,000 spots. Back when I was doing hazardous materials inspections I could hit 20-30 cans in an hour. Just me with a pair of bolt cutters. And that’s having to find the fuckers driving around in a terminal lot. Somebody like me with my type of background is going to be there in Cyprus. That isn’t going to be what the Israelis are used to dealing with. They’re used to a extreme power imbalance, literally having the ability to point guns at folks. A trucker/aid worker at a border station isn’t ever going to be able to push back.
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Apr 29, 2024 17:28
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The American media coverage of the campus protests is the first widespread deployment in the US (I think) of a strategy that was thoroughly honed by the UK media in its coverage of Jeremy Corbyn and Labour during its supposed "antisemitism scandal." (If you're interested, Al Jazeera has a great documentary on this that's freely available: https://www.ajiunit.com/investigation/the-labour-files/). Basically, the media publishes reports that Jewish groups are "concerned" or "feel unsafe" in relation to some other group's activities (in the UK it was the leftist wing of the Labour party) because there are some (completely vague, often anonymous) claims that they're antisemitic. If these campaigns haven't been orchestrated by pro-Israeli groups from day one, they are then immediately echoed and amplified by them. One or two actually antisemitic incidents involving fringe members of the group, or people that aren't even affiliated with that group, are then dredged up and cited repeatedly with the implication that they are representative of the views of all members of that group. This then gets breathlessly repeated ad nauseum by the media as it basically covers the media coverage of its own story ("X denies involvement in antisemitism scandal;" "Y claims that X's denial is an offense to the Jewish community;" and so on). Eventually the actual small number of incidents cited as beginning the controversy are drowned out by the coverage of the scandal itself, and the accusations just become self evidently true, because if they weren't, why would the media be covering them so much? It's basically the culture war equivalent of "Have you stopped beating your wife?"
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Apr 29, 2024 17:34
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Fidelitious posted:I haven't looked into it too much but I do follow a few people who are definitely of the opinion that the campus protests are widely anti-semitic. I'm going to post examples not as an argument for that perspective but just as a sampling of what they're using to draw that conclusion. I think some skepticism is warranted regarding some of the claims you cite, given how not-subtle pro-Zionist groups have been about deploying agents provocateurs among these protests. From February of this year: https://twitter.com/ShirionOrg/status/1757554375080165740  (highlighting not mine, but it is a pretty important bullet point) I fully believe the examples regarding Yemen, but there's a whole lot of context being left out of what the Houthis are saying. e: It is worth underlining how much practice pro-Zionist groups and the Israeli government have had in sliming anti-apartheid movements. From a 2022 article in The Nation: quote:This is an old story. Since at least the 1970s, the ADL has used its history as a civil rights organization as a screen for a flagrantly right-wing politics on Israel. In the ’80s, for instance, the ADL worked to mask Israel’s ties to the apartheid regime in South Africa, and in the late ’90s, the ADL settled a lawsuit after US anti-apartheid activists accused the organization of hiring former intelligence agents to spy on them. Abe Foxman, Greenblatt’s predecessor, was famously quick to smear critics of Israel as anti-Semites—including, or perhaps especially, left-wing Jewish academics—and was vituperatively Islamophobic, with a portfolio of bigotry that included defending the US government’s program of domestic spying on Muslim communities and joining in the frenzied opposition to the construction of a mosque near Ground Zero. Majorian fucked around with this message at 17:49 on Apr 29, 2024 |
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Apr 29, 2024 17:37
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Bar Ran Dun posted:It’s that the logistics are fundamentally different. But what if Israel wants unnecessary delays? What if they don’t want the cargo to make the ship?
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Apr 29, 2024 17:57
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Gripweed posted:But what if Israel wants unnecessary delays? What if they don’t want the cargo to make the ship? We'll find out how much aid, if any, gets through the pier relatively soon. I'm curious what it would take for the people dismissing the pier as performative or useless to admit that they were mistaken. If *any* aid makes it through?
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Apr 29, 2024 17:58
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DeadlyMuffin posted:We'll find out how much aid, if any, gets through the pier relatively soon. The end of the starvation in Gaza, you loving pedant angels dancing on a pin motherfuckers.
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Apr 29, 2024 18:02
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For all the effort posts no one has really been able to explain why the pier will work better than ground routes. If currently the situation is: Aid------>Ground Crossing ------->Israelis who are intentionally blocking the aid --------->Gazans How is Aid------>Pier ------->Israelis who are intentionally blocking the aid --------->Gazans any better exactly?
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Apr 29, 2024 18:05
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Dumb question but is it even possible to adequately feed 2 million people when the only way the food can enter an area is through a pier?
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Apr 29, 2024 18:17
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Gripweed posted:But what if Israel wants unnecessary delays? What if they don’t want the cargo to make the ship? Do you see how much of an enormous pain in the rear end I am when I think that I am correct and the person I’m taking to is incorrect. Welcome to normal on the waterfront. Someone like me, (probably older than me) will be gently telling them to eat poo poo and hair, while taking thorough notes and photos and exactly following the written inspection guidelines and procedures. If they are intent on stopping it, I think they’ll “accidentally” kill UN World Food Program folks in Gaza. There’s a good chance that happens. If it does happen I think then things escalate even further, peacekeeper escorts for the food aid.
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Apr 29, 2024 18:21
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Majorian posted:I think some skepticism is warranted regarding some of the claims you cite, given how not-subtle pro-Zionist groups have been about deploying agents provocateurs among these protests. From February of this year: These might be important to keep in mind if you are interested in the question of whether American protesters are good or bad people. Are they relevant to the question of whether the protests are spreading antisemitic ideas? If there's any real concern here, it's that when some dummy shows up to "support Palestine" with a sign about "gently caress the Jews" or whatever, it promotes that racist ideology, which is undergoing a resurgence around the world, which is dangerous in inciting stochastic terrorism and in promoting fascism, and which is totally counterproductive to Palestinian liberation. In this context I don't think it matters if the guy with the "gently caress the Jews" sign is an agent provocateur or a sincere believer - either way he's doing the same damage to the movement and to society writ large, and either way he has to be dealt with in the way these protests are actually dealing with guys like this: kick them out, loudly reject them, continue to fight for a free Palestine. Basically I don't think it matters why there are guys like this, what matters is how the protests handle/reject them, and so far I've been impressed by the principle and discipline there. quote:I fully believe the examples regarding Yemen, but there's a whole lot of context being left out of what the Houthis are saying. I think whether "gently caress the Jews" is inspired by contempt for Zionism or contempt for something else they associate with Judaism or both, again it's irrelevant to the actual impact of the rhetoric, in other words, the experiences of the people targeted by it. The reality of the Houthi state is repression/imprisonment/exile of local religious minorities - the Jews until they were all kicked out, and still ongoing with Bahai. If their flag said "curse the Jews" but religious minorities actually lived freely and peacefully, that would be valuable context. Like at the protests you can actually observe Jews hanging out, even engaging in religious ritual - Northwestern's encampment had two seder dinners. punishedkissinger posted:For all the effort posts no one has really been able to explain why the pier will work better than ground routes. I thought the point of the pier was that, like the airdrops, it gets around Israeli interference - as if Israel were an enemy of the US and not, as Biden maintains, our closest and most super-special ally. Civilized Fishbot fucked around with this message at 18:26 on Apr 29, 2024 |
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Apr 29, 2024 18:22
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Bar Ran Dun posted:It’s that the logistics are fundamentally different. Without wanting to question or disregard your experience in this particular field, if you were there and the Israelis had authority, there still wouldn't be a viable movement of goods. Because Israel being involved is the one and only impediment to moving aid into Gaza. This is Israel, they've boarded previously inspected aid ships in international water and killed the crews before. And they have frequently and brazenly murdered US citizens and international aid workers without any repercussions. This one weird trick of letting boats load up in Cyprus is not going to confound them into compliance. DeadlyMuffin posted:We'll find out how much aid, if any, gets through the pier relatively soon. The pier cannot supply enough food for the people of Gaza. It is a grander and superficially less cynical looking version of the "let's airdrop a few tons of poo poo into the sea and watch them drown" demonstration that Biden cares. It is a PR bandage for the benefit of the US government going into an election, it is not in any way a meaningful attempt to end the deliberate famine in Gaza which the US is complicit in creating. A meaningful attempt by the US to end the famine would be the border points opening again weeks ago because the US demonstrated a fraction of the influence it has, and has exercised in the past, over Israel.
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Apr 29, 2024 18:24
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Charliegrs posted:Dumb question but is it even possible to adequately feed 2 million people when the only way the food can enter an area is through a pier? I was in a MEU. If the United States wanted we have the logistical capacity to end the famine in 48 hours, though that relatively high cost moving that fast. It’s already been months and we could bring in food very economically even in that time frame. There is nobody better at this sort of logistics than the US military. This nitpicky discussion over the logistics of why exactly we just can’t seem to manage to get enough aid in or the specifics of Israeli inspection process is nauseating to me given the context and I don’t know why we have to indulge the couple of people who want to dive into it. Because the actual effect of the pier is to shut people up so Israel can finish its genocide faster. Butter Activities fucked around with this message at 18:38 on Apr 29, 2024 |
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Apr 29, 2024 18:34
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Charliegrs posted:Dumb question but is it even possible to adequately feed 2 million people when the only way the food can enter an area is through a pier? Yes that’s exactly how one would do that. When the big earthquake hits Seattle / Tacoma this is how they’ll keep everybody from dying. They drill JLOTS every couple of years up here to practice what they’d need to do to keep about a million people fed/ get necessary aid and response folks in. punishedkissinger posted:For all the effort posts no one has really been able to explain why the pier will work better than ground routes. The Israelis have total real control over the ground entry routes. Vs. They’re being allowed to be involved with the pier to save face. If they want to stop it they have to use force to stop it. I think their next step will be kill WFP Aid workers once it’s going. The WCK “accident” was them communicating they would go that far in response to the pier announcement. Bluff or not it needs called. Edit: yes there are faster ways, but those ways involve Americans physically entering Gaza, like an invasion, a real loving beach landing. That’s a very very bad idea. That to the Israelis would be the US invading Israel. Bar Ran Dun fucked around with this message at 18:42 on Apr 29, 2024 |
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Apr 29, 2024 18:38
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Bar Ran Dun posted:The Israelis have total real control over the ground entry routes. How is this different from the US military or the UN or whomever leading a land convoy on the ground, not stopping for checkpoints, and saying "if you want to stop us, you'll have to use force?" At this point I just have to assume you're trolling. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Apr 29, 2024 18:41
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In fairness the actual procedure at this port is hard to get info on, the NYTimes breakdown article is pretty vague but it does refer to Israel being involved before the aid is allowed to enter, and of course the IDF has a military encampment at the entry point. Edit: It looks like it will be "inspected" in Cyprus, so very likely that's where it will get held up indefininitely. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2024/04/27/world/middleeast/gaza-pier-israel-hamas-war.html quote:At the Larnaca port, Israeli representatives will be present as Cypriot authorities inspect items, according to an Israeli official with knowledge of the inspection plans. So yeah, logistically this isn't doing anything to solve the issue, which is that Israel intends to starve 2 million people to death.
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Apr 29, 2024 18:43
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Charliegrs posted:Dumb question but is it even possible to adequately feed 2 million people when the only way the food can enter an area is through a pier? In theory yes, the pier can probably handle the volume of food required. Distribution once it gets off the pier is another story - even if Israel was all for this happening it would be a major undertaking to get food where it needed to go. And of course since that's not going to happen, there will continue to be famine conditions throughout Gaza. The pier may help, and may help a lot depending on how far Israel wants to go in on the interference, but it's not going to solve the hunger problem.
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Apr 29, 2024 18:43
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Internet Explorer posted:How is this different from the US military or the UN or whomever leading a land convoy on the ground, not stopping for checkpoints, and saying "if you want to stop us, you'll have to use force?" You would like the US military to lead a land convoy through Egypt, ignore the borders, continuously/repeatedly to establish a permanent supply chain. You don’t see why that’s different? That’s called an invasion. You are suggesting the US or Egypt to invade an unhinged nuclear power obsessed with self defense.
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Apr 29, 2024 18:49
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| # ? May 15, 2024 13:28 |
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Bar Ran Dun posted:You would like the US military to lead a land convoy through Egypt, ignore the borders, continuously/repeatedly to establish a permanent supply chain. You're the one who brought up doing a Cuban Missile Crisis off the coast of Israel.
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Apr 29, 2024 18:52
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