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Paladinus posted:The nazis' attempt at getting rid of the Jews has no direct influence on politics of the modern Germany This is historically impossible. It would be like saying the legacy of Jim Crow is over, or that our attempt at getting rid of Native Americans has no direct influence on our modern politics. I can't conceive a worldview that can contain this, logically or spiritually, as a stipulated fact. It seems so self-evidently wrong that I can't even conceive of how one arrives at this position. Please elaborate, because this just feels so wrong-headed I must be reading it wrong.
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Mar 29, 2024 00:48
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| # ¿ May 12, 2024 22:40 |
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Paladinus posted:By the biggest atrocity I meant Germany's extermination campaign against the peoples the nazis deemed racially inferior, which includes the Shoah but also genocides perpetrated against other nationalities. I would not agree that what is basically a piece of historical trivia figures at the same level of what is considered by many to be the greatest crime humans have ever committed against themselves, no, that would be a silly thing to believe. Some historical events carry greater weight, and meaning than others. I don't believe Germany is chock full of Nazis, I believe Germany is a country who didn't do the work to meaningfully grapple with Naziism, and the institutions (extra-national) that had the power to make that happen in the immediate aftermath of WWII placed a much higher priority on creating a capitalist bulwark out of the ashes than anything else, which has permanently impaired their ability to grapple with it. That there was an entire generation of Germans (and many thereafter) who came home from school one day and got really loving pissed at their parents and grandparents, in the ways they did, tells me that the nation did not reckon with itself properly. You don't come home shocked from school one day to scream at your elders asking what they knew and what they did because the whole nation has this figured out. I had a great German history teacher who spent a day in class talking about this phenomenon, and his take was that a country that had properly reckoned with this stuff wouldn't have a generationally-shared experience of recoiling in horror from the older members of your family once you hit the right grade in school. He described in in terms that made it seem like a coming of age cliche' for a few generations, an experience so widely shared it became a cultural commonplace. That isn't what happens in a nation that has made peace with what it did, it happens in one that scrambled to pretend it was normal again.
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Mar 29, 2024 01:06
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DeadlyMuffin posted:Isn't this how you make peace? If you have generations of people who, as they are educated (presumably by the government!) respond with horror at the atrocities of the Nazi era generation that seems like exactly the right response. When that younger generation is in power (which they are) they will know better. I would've wished for truth and reconciliation commissions and public acknowledgments--in Germany, this might've included bans on participation in any form of government for former Nazis. This would've been tough, because you lose a lot of that famous Nazi Managerial efficiency, but worth it. You don't lose the war and then put the genocidaires back into positions of power because it would be too hard to do it right, unless you do, and that's the extremely hosed moral compromise the Allies encouraged. Ideally former Nazis would not be able to carry any form of identification that didn't acknowledge that status, either. It should've been a badge of shame you couldn't escape until you died. The reason those children respond with horror is because entire generations that preceded them were not honest with themselves or their children about their national crimes and their own personal complicity. So they failed. They hosed up on being honest and open and saying "humans can become this. I will live with this shame until I die. Do not become what I did. Reject what I could or would not." instead they just pretended nothing was wrong. It didn't work. So no, I'm not going to give them any loving credit whatsoever for deciding to just not talk about the big Genocidal Oopsie until their kids were forced to learn what Grandpa was up to back then and screamed it out of them.
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Mar 29, 2024 01:30
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DeadlyMuffin posted:It can be simultaneously true that Germany did a lovely job de-Natzifying and that the modern German nation's stance toward Israel is not motivated by antisemitism. Yeah, no one is immune to propaganda, and citizens of western nations are a highly propagandized people, cradle to grave. It works. If you don’t have a framework for what to make of it outside of the liberal hegemon, what else can you do but make this an individualist catharsis where you scream at grandpa and call it a day? Without an understanding of the system grandpa was part of, and how much of that system remains unreconstructed, well, here we are.
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Mar 29, 2024 02:31
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Whoops No Accountability! https://www.jpost.com/breaking-news/article-798449 quote:The US is unlikely to impose sanctions on the Netzah Yehuda Battalion, at least not in the meantime, Ynet reported Wednesday afternoon, citing Israeli officials. So what’s the next broken promise of accountability gonna be?
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Apr 24, 2024 20:48
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GhostofJohnMuir posted:i wouldn't be particularly surprised if the white house ended up reversing course yet again, but seems like a lot of ambiguity at the moment. biden proved pretty decisively that you can confidently declare that the other government is definitely going to do something and be very wrong It’s pretty clear who’s driving the relationship and who is struggling like a beached whale on the sandy beach of ideology after the tide went out. Just humiliation after humiliation of the “senior partner” of the relationship. I, for one, love to see it.
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Apr 24, 2024 21:11
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Neon Belly posted:The video isn’t convincing of anything other than some sounds over someone recording a steady light in the sky (being pedantic, even small rotary drones are pretty loud), and it’s suspicious that no mainstream news orgs seem to be reporting that for multiple days Israel has been deploying drones to lure civilians out to shoot them. It has taken days or weeks for stories we saw posted on social media to finally be confirmed by mainstream media. We have been hearing about mass graves around hospitals for more than a month now and it finally breached the NYT yesterday. What’s your threshold for how long you’d wait to see this confirmed? Or is it just never until the right people say it back to you? Because nothing about the story itself is out of character for the IDF. They literally crush people with bulldozers, they tie children to the front of their vehicles as human shields, what about this makes it seem out of character?
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Apr 25, 2024 15:00
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Paladinus posted:This interpretation makes it much more plausible to me. If it's less about luring someone in closer to the drone and more about forcing someone out of shelter, it doesn't matter how realistic the sound is, it just needs to be loud and annoying. Or you could use it to lure people out of shelter because they refuse to come otherwise, and you know that they are just human, and would respond to the cries of a child. Now, why they would resist coming out of shelter for the IDF vs a crying child, well, I guess that’s a mystery. Really stretching to give the benefit of the doubt to people who have lied to you over and over and over again. I just can’t make sense of that.
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Apr 25, 2024 16:52
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| # ¿ May 12, 2024 22:40 |
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https://x.com/rtiron/status/1785331988485833154 Looks like nobody's keeping another Liberty incident off their bingo card.
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May 2, 2024 01:11
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