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ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!

MadRhetoric posted:

Oh hey, this thing. Even after becoming a system sold for real money, it's still the bastard child of 4e and Apocalypse World. :v:

That's a positive right?

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ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!

Jimbozig posted:

When I was trying to figure out what my stretch goals were, I pitched such a thing to people and their reaction was ehhh. I guess I just pitched it to the wrong people. The thing is already partway designed, so it's a good bet that you'll see it as a mini-expansion sometime.

The idea is that you can play as rival gangs fighting over turf. Each player would play a different gang. Each gang has certain classes they can use, with the possibility of hiring others. There are different sorts of missions you can run to take land or resources from your rivals.

This sounds like necromunda lite and that's kind of incredidible.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Gambler powers could all be the kinds of dice shenanigans you saw in older gw games.

Make 2 attacks, but doubles hit you.

The attack has exploding dice but on a 1 you explode and you hurt your friends, simple stuff.

The big problem in my eyes with that is that feels like it should be a very swingy class thematically and that's a pain in the balls for a game that tries for tight encounter balance

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Yesterday in strike.

I (Lewellyn, secret elf prince) with a single hit point remaining, and both of my allies already down, ran up the back of a dying dragon (slow poison) and punched out my arc boss evil twin, in a molten crater outside of the walls of a burning city.

It was a pretty good game of strike.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
I like the idea of some powers being built around the exposed variant for ranged combat thematics.

Chow yun fats dramatic dive.
Encounter power
Shift 3 squares, make a ranged basic attack, and ignore exposed until eoynt.

In action movies a consistent way to handle exposure is to leap through the air heroically but because it's a bolt on option it's not really factored in to skills.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!

Gort posted:

I'm not sure it's possible to make a system that can go from medieval-style battles to "if you're in the open you're dead"-style WW2 battles with just one rule change. It might be better to have two separate rule-sets for melee-heavy and ranged-heavy settings.

I dunno. In the open = dead may be true of reality, but its not true of cinema logic and I don't think you need to go too far from the core rules to do a passable die hard, john woo or old bond fight.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!

Gort posted:

Having played Strike to the higher levels (party's level 9 now) I'm not really loving how monster damage increases as level goes up. Player-character hitpoints stay the same, but they gain a couple of new powers that negate attacks, which presumably is supposed to make up for the monster damage escalation.

What this means is that players take a couple of hits to go down, but once you're hitting a player-character's hitpoints, they're going down in a couple of hits. I've had situations where a player-character has gone down in a single attack. It's not a huge deal since there are lots of ways for a player to get back up (1 in 3 chance on death rolls, leader healing, rallying) but it still feels a bit lovely for the player to be on full health and down in the dirt at the end of the action.

It might be better if monster damage stayed static throughout the game, but the DM was advised to use larger "encounter budgets" (EG: At level 1 you use one normal monster per PC, at level 10 you use two) as the party levels up.

I play in gorts game and we trialed a game with more bads with their damage toned down and I gotta say I preferred going back to early game flow.

I like strike a lot but I definitely enjoyed the early game more. While it's averaging out similarly and ends up ok there's a lot more swing in encounters at the high end which can sometimes feel random and frustrating rather than heroic.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!

Jimbozig posted:

No, none of it. Only the base damage (the one at the top of the power) gets added again.

It used to double everything in an early playtest, but that made things super swingy. It was fun when a player would blow up a monster but not as much fun when a PC would get blown up by a crit before acting.

I'm the archer in question. This is what I expected.

But yeah, It's area denial all day long, especially with how big it gets. If there is any kind of chokepoint for our defender to hold while marking things it's an absolute no brainer. As for the responses above it doesn't really change much. I'd also argue that while yes, you can always come up with narrative reasons to push players to mix it up a bit, the tactical game sitting right in the middle of this whole shebang normally provides a good spread of interesting powers and the GM shouldn't actually need to press me like that. Regardless -

quote:

Goblins hiding under tables like turtle shells.
I often theme area denial as me overwatching an area and taking quick potshots at whoever comes through, particularly when I'm in an area where firing a cloud of arrows into the air makes no sense.

quote:

Enemies that can be ranged right back
happens all the time. I'm still better off area denialing and catching some of their buds than most other choices

quote:

A big mean ogre using an anchor like a grappling hook with reach and push/pull attacks
I get big bonuses for being close, if being close is a horrible idea I have extra shift and I move 10 squares. Him moving me doesn't make

quote:

Swarms
the bonus damage is surely an area attack and therefore good against swarms :)

quote:

Battles where the party have to race to get somewhere, so standing around and making the monsters come to them isn't going to work
this works, meaning I'll switch over to pin down for the duration.

I think part of my problem is that on, say, trick arrow or super trick arrow, so many of the abilites have little caveats on them that they end up far less exciting and interesting than they should be. For starters, so many (And in my head this is worse for super trick arrow) just don't work on tougher badguys thanks to the way they shrug off savable effects. the delay on exploding arrows exploding and the AOE on flaming arrows made them pretty risky to use (Inevitably saved for the narrative - setting a building on fire or knocking down a barricade, almost never used for their mechanical effect). Slow poison seems to normally trigger just after the fight ends.

It seems to me that the trick arrows should be one of the highlights of the combat, just in purely thematic terms, but for me the momentary/persistent weakness, or the wind up shot, are the moments that actually make the table sit up and take notice. I can hit very hard on pretty much any attack, and the skills that make me hit even harder and just annihilate some toughs are the definite stand out moments, but these ultimately end up getting played as a rider on area denial. It's just overwhelmingly reliable.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Also involved in campaign. Llewellyn the elf striker. Finished the game by posing awkwardly in front of the warhammer emperor while our healer failed a skill roll to save his griffin. Good times.

My skill list is fuckin long and I'm drunk now so so here's the whole thing.

Ambush
Hunting
Pathfinding
Weather prediction
Nature's bounty
Herbal medicine
Agility
Stealth
Escape artist
Trick shooting
Tree speaking
Pulling stuff
Matrix dodge
Bluff
Catch
Kick
Throw (we played blood bowl)
Building
Sea legs
Pulp hero
Swashbuckling
Vicious mockery
Training
Escaping Brenn
Disbelieve
Sneak up and get Im!
Legolasing

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
I'll chip in as I was the striker archer.

I'll specifically say I enjoyed low level more than high level, at least initially. You've got an interesting setup where escalating badguy damage gets set against escalating powers rather than escalating health. This is cool because it's not as zero sum as most systems but it starts to swing towards extremes. Badguys who dropped me in one or two good hits were a consistent frustration. It doesn't feel particularly heroic to be scrabbling in the dirt.

As for damage no one else came close. By the end I had bonuses to my short ranged dice roll result, bonuses to my damage, and bonuses including permanent advantage on targets of my choice, which meant when I focused on a boss I was massively critting more often than not.

On the other hand, even with that damage in play we would have been lost without it. We consistently scraped through fights by the skin of our teeth.

A couple of further thoughts. That build seems to simulate a guy with a shotgun far better than any kind of archer, and running up to people with my bow felt a bit daft sometimes. Mechanically seemed the only choice though.

People go down a lot. Strikes come into play when that happens but I was thinking about this in terms of movies and it's pretty unusual for a hero to drop in a film outside of a major moment.

It's really not a major critique but I'd personally like to see people getting downed less but it being a much bigger deal when it happens. Not just a couple of minor concessions, but the heroes forced to retreat while the villain completes his terrible ritual. The despair point in the movie before the heroes rally for the big finish.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
it's like persistent weakness or something like that, can't remember offhand.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
I'd like to add an addendum to my earlier comment.

I've played a number of RPGs over a number of years. A number of those gamess were meant for long form campaign play, and of those I've finished a grand total of 2, a 4th ed campaign and this Strike campaign. That puts Strike on a pretty high pedestal in my eyes, and the things I raise are pretty minor and brought up over a long campaign, so good job and thank you for the good times.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Even if you tie tram conflict in heavily to players it's still going to have an issue similar to what I dislike about fate, where your narrative strengths get used in a very mechanical way with the advantage stacking to set up the final success.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
The rules for theatre of the mind combat apparently got pulled from the rulebook at some point

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
I feel exposed could work really well but the classes need new ways to mitigate it to make well timed movement important - some Max Payne or John Woo powers.

Encounter attack power - shootdodge
Shift 3 and make your basic ranged attack. Treat yourself as in cover until eoynt.

Since cover becomes more important in general the force movement powers become more powerful too, but I think players could use some more options for getting people out of cover like flush ala xcom

ShineDog fucked around with this message at 08:21 on Aug 16, 2016

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!

hyphz posted:

Fair enough. I was kind of confused by the section in Dangerous Delves which states the GM should design the "dungeon" in advance. So there are either guards behind the door or there aren't, regardless of how well or badly you pick the lock. If it is intended to be flexible in this way then what does the GM design?

There's a mantra in dungeon world.

"Draw maps, leave gaps."

Your dungeon map can be loose. You can stat some appropriate baddies and say "room may have baddies", but the details are flexible. If you've got some fun setpiece ideas then that's the cool bit and the actual where and what of each part of the dungeon can be mushy.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Strike is a really loving hard name to search for, btw.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
What's the up on any more ranged classes coming into this? With most classes being fairly melee focused I'm a little wary of modern or scifi reskinning.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
How many players do you guys strike scales to nicely before it bogs down too far?

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Strikes skill system is super fun and unique, pbta also is super fun, but I don't think they work well together, just because each requires your attention.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Can someone clarify the 5/6 player badguy balance rules and how that's supposed to stack with goons and such?

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!

Jimbozig posted:

Immediately.


Yes. And there is a note in the class for Blasters, too.

Well, Goons don't generally have Encounter Powers, so for 5p they don't change. (If the combat is all or mostly goons, you can throw in an extra goon or two.) For 6p, they increase their attack damage by 1 on all attacks.

For Stooges, the situation is similar.

For all enemies, the extra damage just increases the number next to the damage symbol (or auto-damage like the Grappler's Crush power); it doesn't increase conditional or ongoing damage.

Clear?

Clear. Seems it could go badly for the pcs if goons move before them since you're looking at plus 8 damage instead of a plus 4 for a similar encounters worth. I assume this is offset by players being able to explode huge swaths of goons in a single round?

I assume I can just put in equal numbers and it'll still work OK, even if it takes longer.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
It specifies for buddies that role boosts apply on certain actions originating with the buddy. I don't see it specified anywhere that they actually don't otherwise. I assume this is the case?

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
If a player wants to be able to spend an AP to do the "declare something useful" thing that many games have, would you say that's a reasonable and fun use of them as a house rule?

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
I'd just start at 1 since strike characters start pretty heroic, and there are only really 10 levels with less power variation between levels than dnd.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Any thoughts on doing a multi crew starship for tactical combat? I imagine it would work something like the ogre, different stations as different heads. No idea how to put it together.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Because its hard (impossible) to fit everything youll need on the default sheet, i made a big set of printable character sheets that had the various choices available at each level as check boxes, the powers themselves are on a deck of poker cards. Similarly for the roles. The role sheet has lots of space for all the role playing skills and stuff too

So a player takes the archer/blitzer sheet and the striker sheet. It tells them every special rule of their class and tells them what powers to draw from the deck. I put the power cards into coloured sleeves denoting their usage, so you can just flip your encounter powers over and know at a glance.

My graphic designer housemate made the cards look nice and professional. The character sheets are a little rough right now but will look clean and nice once I've had another pass.

I'd share these because i find them useful, but given that they comprise basically a whole critical chapter i don't want to share them openly. Jimbo, once I've tidied up the sheets would you be interested in having these?

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
I want to see make a big online repository of cool monsters people can submit to and download to print off.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
I'll drop some feedback for these soon.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
No. Let me look up the deets of those powers though.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Monsters getting miss tokens would be a little cruel I think

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Cool, but incredibly unfriendly for home printing.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
I'm thinking of those Titanfall 2 time levels where you can flip between two timelines.

In some parts youll come to a place where in each timeline there is a harder than average fight, to the point that you will be probably be overwhelmed and die if you play straight.

You can escape the fight by travelling into the future or past, but there's another huge battle waiting for you that you'll need to escape from quickly, so you're juggling where the safe places in the other timeline are in your head, and flitting back and forward managing two fights at once was the absolute pinnacle of the game.

The timelines also have different enemy types, ranged soldiers in the past and predominantly melee monster in the future, so what constitutes useful ground isn't constant.

I guess that would be 2 mostly identical maps and the opportunity to choose which timeline you are in at the beginning of your turn?

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!

Tuxedo Catfish posted:

That was a really cool gimmick and honestly I would rather play the game that Titanfall 2 turned into for those 5-10 minutes than the one about big clunky robots that it actually was.

Really? I think it's one of those quietly brilliant campaigns most of the way through, the early wallrunning tutorial stuff aside. Most sections of the game have a strong gimmick that escalates, hits you with enough challenges to ask for your mastery, then drops it and moves on before it gets old. The time flipping bit and the factory where it builds houses around you were the highlights but I can't think of a bit I didn't enjoy mechanically.

The story itself was mediocre of course.

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Ufo strike is standalone but would the classes be back compatible?

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
I'm very pumped about the concept of that expansion jimbozig. Reskinning works fine but it's real squeeze to get some of the powers to make sense in a modern or fairly straight future setting

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Tbf once I've got more damaging powers I don't intend to use it exclusively but I'm surprised ised it's not a reduce damage power

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
I think my biggest issue with d6 is how easy it is for a few enemy 6s to just blat a player down without them getting much of a chance to act, particularly if a sniper type is around

ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!
Something I've noted as a concern is how quickly simple damage classes could do spike damage to players and just take them down with a handful of good rolls.

As such I made some basic changes to the sniper archetype - the gunslinger, who would deal the snipers extra damage as an effect to another player within range and line of sight instead of the initial target, or the soldier, whose effect was to upgrade his attack into a blast.

This helped spread the damage round rather than obliterate one player. Just a thought for anyone running it.

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ShineDog
May 21, 2007
It is inevitable!

drrockso20 posted:

Spaceship stuff

There's a system on the way specifically about this, called lancer: battlegroup. You may want to check it out.

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