|
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Bernie_Sanders_presidential_campaign_endorsements,_2016 Bernie has way more endorsements from Socialist parties who aren't lame loving hippies also patch adams gently caress yeah
|
#
¿
Jan 20, 2016 20:13
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ Apr 30, 2024 00:02 |
|
|
I could see these people setting up a Narodnik on summer break from their liberal arts college
|
|
#
¿
Jan 20, 2016 20:27
|
|
|
What's the PSL's plan to make america great again? also where do they stand on campaign financing?
|
|
#
¿
Jan 21, 2016 06:45
|
|
|
The Trumpenproletariat are the only truly revolutionary class in this great nation.
|
|
#
¿
Jan 21, 2016 14:40
|
|
|
Carl Killer Miller posted:Patch adams is a piece of poo poo. I would rather hang out with robin williams He has a funny name and rebuked Robin williams once. What's the PSL got? loving nothing.
|
|
#
¿
Jan 21, 2016 19:06
|
|
|
Agreed, this is why I support Trump. I don't have a problem with genocide or oppression of a specific group if it raises living standards for the population in general.
|
|
#
¿
Jan 22, 2016 10:52
|
|
|
DOCTOR ZIMBARDO posted:A socialist economy would probably produce less luxury goods and have shorter operating hours for services in general, but on the other hand everyone gets drastically more leisure time so whatever, deal with it. It's important! But it's definitely not the most important thing where all this is concerned. For that see the platform and organizing elements relating to, for instance, racial justice or anti-imperialism. I don''t give a gently caress about luxury goods, but if I have to give up pizza as a precondition of socialism then I'd rather live in a neoliberal paradise. where did this self-denying spiritualistic philosophy of ascetism start with some socialists? Late 19th c. Russian revolutionaries like the Men of the 60s and 80s? Marxism is like the most materialistic philosophy ever its entirely based around material goods.
|
|
#
¿
Jan 27, 2016 18:40
|
|
|
The Kingfish posted:I have good news, friend. Under socialism you will be able to keep all your pizzas and other personal property. okay but what about when i eat those pizzas? am i allowed to just get more pizza as i please or will the state step in and ration them?
|
|
#
¿
Jan 27, 2016 23:18
|
|
|
Okay let's assume There's just been a communist revolution so here's me right, I am actually a pretty good chef so I can make the pizza dough and a pizza for everyone where do i get the ingredients from? can i offer to give cheesemaker and wheat grower and tomato grower and flour grinder some of my pizza in the future and then they'll give me the ingredients to make the pizza? do i need to call and arrange a time when i can use the pizza oven? i have my own oven at home but its not the same as a real pizza oven ofc.
|
|
#
¿
Jan 28, 2016 01:02
|
|
|
theres this italian guy who owns a pizza restaurant 30 seconds away from my apt and he charges high prices and he always burns the loving pies then pretends its legit. dude I know you're meant to have a little char but your poo poo is loving BURNT bro am I allowed to kill him and seize ownership of the pizza oven? how do i maintain his supply chain? becuase he has some good ingredients
|
|
#
¿
Jan 28, 2016 02:00
|
|
|
Do animals have the right of ownership over their milk and cheese and eggs?
|
|
#
¿
Jan 28, 2016 04:59
|
|
|
I think it's important to take stock of our situation from now and then and remember that we're all a group of highly(?) evolved monkeys floating on a rock in the endless void of space and go from there
|
|
#
¿
Jan 29, 2016 20:29
|
|
|
i don't really have a problem with killing the rich but it seems like when we do we kill a bunch of other people as well whoops
|
|
#
¿
Jan 30, 2016 01:09
|
|
|
Why do modern leftists support mass immigration of unskilled labour, a policy created by and for the ruling class in order to undercut the economic position and solidarity of the native working class?
|
|
#
¿
Feb 10, 2016 11:59
|
|
|
The solution for lovely conditions in other countries is for socialist revolution there and elsewhere and international solidarity, helping to develop their countries. It's not for everyone to come and live in the developed world so they can maybe eke out a better existence under the capitalist system while totally weakening the working class and putting more and more concentrated power in the hands of the elite.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 10, 2016 20:54
|
|
|
Like I'm pretty sure the USSR gave aid to other socialist countries that were poorer than them to help their development right? They didn't just pack everyone on a plane and fly them to Russia where conditions were better.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 10, 2016 21:25
|
|
|
Pener Kropoopkin posted:Basically the argument being made ITT is that immigration is bad, because it means a reduced capacity for consumption by the white working class. and the black working class and the hispanic working class and the asian working class and the indigenous american working class but yes let's pretend any opposition to mass immigration is because those selfish white workers don't want to share their INCREDIBLE WEALTH. They think they deserve more than $7.25 an hour? Fuckem.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 10, 2016 22:52
|
|
|
Pener Kropoopkin posted:Basically, it's not an immigrant's fault that Native Labor deradicalized, deunionized, and left itself open for the harshest acceleration of exploitation in the last 100 years. Blaming a Tamil guy with an H1B visa for your own disenfranchisement doesn't cut it, when you've never paid union dues or were even interested in organizing at all. Literally the same sentiment as: "The poor and lowly are a creeping pestilence - there are no innocent ones, and the downtrodden are the justly damned - sinners in a hell they've made"
|
|
#
¿
Feb 10, 2016 23:46
|
|
|
Pener Kropoopkin posted:If immigration was strictly limited then labor would be offshored to the Third World. Capital is more fluid and powerful than it ever has been in history while Labor is at its weakest. All the labour that can be offshored already is being, not every job can be offshored, the immigrants are brought in to drive down wages and conditions for those jobs which can't be offshored. Combining protectionism to ensure domestic manufacturing while blocking unskilled immigration is the best policy for labour. I also like how you blame the workers themselves for their situation, as though there wasn't a huge effort by the rich and the powerful to weaken them in the past decades, including through the policy of mass immigration and shipping real jobs overseas. Pretty sure the workers weren't yelling for those policies.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 10, 2016 23:59
|
|
|
Zombies' Downfall posted:This is a matter of time, technology, and priorities, not an immutable law. Regardless, it's totally inaccurate to say that without illegal immgration literally every job the illegal immigrants are doing will be shipped overseas instead, especially if it's paird with a sensible tariffs policy
|
|
#
¿
Feb 11, 2016 00:15
|
|
|
Pener Kropoopkin posted:That is not like, your fault or anything, but that is the reality of the class relation. So loving what? Why even bring it up except to guilt trip white/western people for their standard of living and for complaining about income inequality in their own countries? You're like someone during jim crow telling a white worker they can't be pissed at their treatment because black people have it worse. And maybe look up the concept of purchasing power parity once in a while.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 11, 2016 19:14
|
|
|
DOCTOR ZIMBARDO posted:Actually the point is precisely not to feel guilty for enjoying the superprofits of imperialism, or to Feel Bad about things while agitating for a bigger share of the imperialist pie. Instead the point is to act in solidarity with the workers of the world, and unite with them This is exactly what I want to do. The point is that mass immigration from the developing to the developed world benefits no one except the elite. Solidarity is about helping our comrades all over the world, not just the ones who got the chance of living as an underclass in the West. Mass immigration makes solidarity less likely, not more.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 11, 2016 20:53
|
|
|
Illegal immigrants are basically Scabs but on a national level
|
|
#
¿
Feb 11, 2016 22:17
|
|
|
DOCTOR ZIMBARDO posted:What difference does documentation make to whether or not an immigrant would somehow be a "scab?" uhh it's obviously the difference between being unionized/not-unionized legal/illegal see?
|
|
#
¿
Feb 12, 2016 07:05
|
|
|
Homework Explainer posted:russia is a gangster oligarch government that's been in freefall since the overthrow of the ussr. antagonizing the united states is a losing battle for putin and as the russian economy approaches crisis, it's an opportunity for the russian people to reestablish socialism. a majority longs for the days of the soviet union and this is the right strategy for the people of russia. it also weakens american imperialism. tactically supporting putin against the imperial bourgeoisie is a win-win. this will, i'm sure, get turned into "you love putin, who is an evil tyrantman. this is in no way an orientalist view of geopolitics. rah rah usa" like in the other thread okay what about the gay people though?
|
|
#
¿
Feb 12, 2016 18:06
|
|
|
There's a group of people who refuse to join the proper organisation, who are used by the elite to undercut wages and conditions, who care more about their own wealth than working class solidarity. Am I talking about strikebreakers? Or illegal immigrants?
|
|
#
¿
Feb 12, 2016 20:21
|
|
|
bunch of nerds itt marxistly denying genocide and supporting dictators
|
|
#
¿
Feb 12, 2016 21:12
|
|
|
*stomps on your sand khrushchyovka at the beach, walks off with hot babe marxistly*
|
|
#
¿
Feb 12, 2016 21:17
|
|
|
swampman posted:That should explain why I don't visit here much. That kind of valueless gibberish should be moderated away. Yeah, who wants to actually debate and discuss different viewpoints and opinions, enforce an SJW echochamber imo that always leads to a diverse and interesting forum
|
|
#
¿
Feb 12, 2016 22:47
|
|
|
Yeah I thought marxists were meant to be against identity politics and dumb SJW poo poo too but all the ones I've met recently have hated Bernie Sanders because he doesn't make killing all the Israelis and restoring Palestine his number 1 priority, and say that Muslims are an oppressed class like the working class becuase they occupy a unique place in society, and that the lovely theocratic patriarchal beliefs of Islam only came about due to their oppression by the white man (the only creature capable of evil in this world, despite European imperialism not kicking off until way after Islam had its own imperialist epoch )
|
|
#
¿
Feb 12, 2016 23:10
|
|
|
Jewel Repetition posted:Well that's weird because he's the least pro-Israel candidate on either side of the aisle, in spite of also being the only Jewish candidate. Yeah, they say it's not good enough though. Honestly I think they just want to be contrarian and say how everyone and everything in the democratic system is lovely and only a revolution led by them and their loser friends can make things right in a holy cleansing fire. I wouldn't be surprised if anti-semitism contributed a lot to it. One of the individuals was a palestinian-descent American who drew a comic book of herself as the "arab avenger" a wonderwoman type superhero visiting pain and suffering on the people of Israel and retaking it for the palestinians.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 13, 2016 00:37
|
|
|
Jewel Repetition posted:I think we're getting off-topic. I don't think this thread was ever on-topic. But everytime I meet a group of self-proclaimed Stalinists they're the type of people I can always visualise muttering away in their corner of the school cafeteria about how the popular jocks and cheerleaders will be up against the wall when the revolution comes.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 13, 2016 00:44
|
|
|
Homework Explainer posted:yes, positioning oneself against planet earth's overwhelmingly dominant political and economic system with low probability of success is a choice based entirely in narcissism and self-interest It probably is if you only position yourself so that you can talk about how special and informed you are compared to the sheeple, and never make any attempt to actually change things or organize basement stalinists
|
|
#
¿
Feb 13, 2016 00:47
|
|
|
Pener Kropoopkin posted:The reality is that you're just evading from being called out as a dumb loving retard, for comparing immigrants to scabs. Actually i think i made a pretty good case for why they're similar to scabs and I didn't see anyone make a rejoinder. I was just talking about stalinists i've met irl, not casting aspersions on the internet stalinists itt or the PSL
|
|
#
¿
Feb 13, 2016 01:24
|
|
|
Peel posted:as for illegal immigrants, given america's lovely immigration laws if they are scabs they are scabs in the same way as black workers who work outside a white union that refuses them entry - worker solidarity has been broken, but they didn't break it This really doesn't make any sense at all. Since when were open borders and the right to immigrate to other nations an integral part of socialist philosophy and a precondition for worker solidarity? I can stand in solidarity with international workers without wanting them to benefit capital and damage labour by immigrating in huge numbers.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 13, 2016 04:14
|
|
|
Pener Kropoopkin posted:They're not any more a benefit to capital if you unionize them, you loving idiot. You may as well be asking why young adults are integral for worker solidarity. There's always more every year, and they're competing for your job! You can't unionize them if they're illegal, and mass immigration only ever happens when it's of benefit to capital. More supply of labour = lower value for an individual labourer, regardless of anything else you want to say. Name one time in modern history where there was mass immigration, and they were quickly unionized and didn't take jobs with lower wages and conditions than the native workforce.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 13, 2016 20:40
|
|
|
You have literally been tricked into supporting a policy that benefits no one but the ruling class because the ruling class and their means of disseminating information have told you that it's racist and wrong to do otherwise. [timg]http://lpix.org/2360044/cabbagehead[1].jpg[/timg]
|
|
#
¿
Feb 13, 2016 20:52
|
|
|
Jewel Repetition posted:Do the socialists here support unfettered trade too Of course - the media told them it's racist to do otherwise. Pener Kropoopkin posted:The IWW was organizing Chinese and Japanese laborers in the early 20th Century, and the UFW organized Filipinos, Mexicans, and other Hispanics after their immigration wave in the 60s. A) those groups immigrated mostly legally B) Those groups took jobs with lower wages and conditions than those of the native workers, resulting in downward pressure on wages and conditions. The Saurus fucked around with this message at 22:26 on Feb 13, 2016 |
|
#
¿
Feb 13, 2016 22:24
|
|
|
Pener Kropoopkin posted:A labor shortage is not the same thing as full employment. A shortage of labor may be great for an individual, but very little gets done in the aggregate for the economy. The ideal is to achieve full employment and eradicate the Reserve Pool of Labor, not to artificially inflate an individual's bargaining power by suppressing the labor supply. Workers organized in union have far more collective bargaining power than they would individually regardless, under any circumstances. If there's one thing America isn't dealing with right now, with incredibly high unemployment, especially among black and hispanic youth, it's a labour shortage. Top City Homo posted:the eu is basically neoliberal austerity personified And yet the european left backs EU membership and uses economic fearmongering to try to prevent countries from voting to leave.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 13, 2016 22:56
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ Apr 30, 2024 00:02 |
|
|
1mpper posted:you're making the classic mistake of taking the vast amount of propaganda about venezuela, financed by that soft power, at face-value. also the vast amount of propaganda that says opposing mass immigration is wrong and racist
|
|
#
¿
Feb 14, 2016 00:10
|
|