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XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.
"Chronos", is that a guy from the comics?

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XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

BrianWilly posted:

I like the meta-ness of them having to work with the most D-string characters that have no impact on the timeline.

I really like the dynamic of these mofos.

Agreed, a bunch of misfits that don't really like each-other stuck on a ship together is always a good recipe.

At first I thought the roofie was dumb, but then I considered that drugging one of your "teammates" and forcing them to come along on the mission is a super fun awesome move right out of the playbook of something like Farscape and in that context this is a great show.

XboxPants fucked around with this message at 03:13 on Jan 22, 2016

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

VBane posted:

Honestly, how was Biker dude's responce to Sarah not "Can I watch?"

Speaking of, Caity Lotz's acting has improved tremendously from her debut on Arrow. Her lack of any range or emoting ability whatsoever was a consistent complaint early on, but instead of just staying mediocre she's actually sharpened her craft! Good on her, and good for us.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.
I agree with a those of you that are saying that much of the cast is unlikable, or at least often does unlikable things - it's just that this doesn't hurt the show for me. At first, I was bothered by it, to be sure. But eventually I recontextualized the show and adjusted my expectations. When Stein or whoever do something awful and ridiculous, now I don't get disappointed, I just laugh along with the show at what an rear end in a top hat they are.

I'm treating it more like something like Lexx or Farscape or Firefly. Rigel and Stanley and Jayne were never really "likable" characters, but that's part of the fun, watching to see how badly these screw-ups can screw up.


Hawkman still sucks, though. Nothing can save him. And Action Jackson's still a racist caricature 90% of the time. Also, X-O, I agree that Routh's performance was a little below average.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

BrianWilly posted:

That's a great clip. The production values for this show are superb.

Honestly though...Savage should just be completely outclassed by these people, shouldn't he? I'm not even sure how he should be a threat to Ray alone.

Eh, he uses magic so they can just sorta use that background to handwave whatever abilities or powers are necessary in a given scene.

Not that's a good thing, really.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

tsob posted:

Did it get stuck on revolver after he spent a few weeks in the West getting drunk and shooting the poo poo with Jonah Hex?

Well it'd just be silly if it was styled out of something from Victorian England.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

shades of eternity posted:

5. Firestorm is a problematic character. There are only a handful of character's that are at his power level and the only one that comes close is Flash and it's really isn't close. Of the two actors, Professor Martin Stein is the better of the two in acting and again, it's because he's had a longer chance to strut their stuff. Jefferson Jackson had one episode to connect pre series and he's feels bloody stereotypical. I hope that changes over time.

Jackson desperately needs some kind of characterization that doesn't boil down to "the black guy". Maybe they can do something with the whole team-player aspect; if he can pull out some decent acting, a storyline of him growing into a leadership role for the team could be cool.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.
Just call her Hawk, DC has the copyright.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

Adder Moray posted:

I just figured that, prior to Rip's intervention, Firestorm would have just quit. Jackson is clearly not digging their arrangement.

Meanwhile, how many brilliant inventors have there been in the history of the world that barely anyone can remember because the things they made weren't paradigm shifts. Ray exists at the same time as Harrison Wells. The experimental physicist turned secret murderer who is responsible for the existence of metahumans. Who is Ray Palmer compared to that?

He also seems to be pretty lovely at super-heroing. He's made progress since his debut but he still screwed up the mission he was on for Ollie against Dahrk in the Legends pilot with the computer thing.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

losonti tokash posted:

Doesn't seem that weird that after Thawne was erased from existence that Gideon would find its way back into the hands of good(?) guys.

Wait a second, wouldn't the Time Masters have some serious problems with basically everything RF did in season 1?

Thawne mentioned Rip and had familiarity with his time travel technology. Hell, Eobard probably was a Time Master, either that or was using a bunch of stolen Time Master tech or something.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

Rhyno posted:

I said it when he first appeared and I will say it again, Tiny Ray is the goddamned best.

Now in convenient Action Figure form! (god drat that was a cheap-rear end goofy prop :lol::lol:)

Pretty much everything else was on-point, or at the very least improved from episode 1. Jackson got a small amount of character, Vandal Savage was... slightly more threatening. Hawkguy got recognized as a creep and then died. Everything I could ask for. :allears:

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

Trundel posted:

I loved how messed up everyone is turning out as. No one can get along, no one knows how to work with each other, Ray being a keener on tech getting Snart and Rory almost caught was excellent, I loved that Snart and Rory stuck to their plan of 'go back in time and try to steal poo poo', and Hawkbro admitted to acting like a creepy weirdo before dying.
:perfect:
Minus that the cold gun doesn't seem to freeze and the flamethrower doesn't seem to set things on fire. Here's hoping that gets fixed.

He did burn/explode a bunch of crates & barrels with it in the big overhead shot. It just doesn't set people on fire.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

Xealot posted:

Hey, if Legends could've swung Burn Gorman as the villain...well, they didn't. But he's a real commodity.

Oh, you motherfucker. Yeah, that would have done it.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

SonicRulez posted:

I liked this episode. The dialogue from telling Hunter to gently caress off to "Master Race over here" was great. Firestorm shrugging off a nuke was a bit much.

Eh, that's just his powerset. He can shrug off a nuke, but whack him with a sturdy rake and he's out.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.
I'm quite used to giving campy shows like this a pass on some things just not making sense, and I'm perfectly willing to - I've been a fan of Flash and Arrow for years now - but jesus loving christ they are just making zero. effort. at. all. to justify why the team hasn't killed Vandal already.

Like holy poo poo, in this episode Rip and the team have taken out all the goons and have utterly defeated and incapacitated Savage and have him completely at their mercy. And then the show literally just cuts to the next scene with the heroes back on the ship trying to figure out how to find Savage. What the gently caress? Did we miss a scene?

loving come on writers, this show is otherwise quite good, and I'm willing to work with you if you give me literally any lame excuse at all, but you gotta give me something. They're surpassing bad writing at this point and moving into just straight-up basic continuity errors.

J33uk posted:

Anyone else wondering if Stein can't remember Ray due to those events not having occurred for him? Are we going to have some sort of time fuckery in Ray's past? I mean sure it could just be down to him having taught a ton of super smart people, but in a time travel show when you have people not remembering something like that there's always a chance some goofy happened. And seriously Wentworth is doing something right.

Yes this did occur to me. It does come across more like Stein saying "dude I'm quite sure I never taught you" rather than just "hmm, I don't think I remember you". And despite being an old pothead, he doesn't seem particularly addled or foggy in other areas.

It was probably just a red herring for the double-fakeout though.

XboxPants fucked around with this message at 08:14 on Feb 5, 2016

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.
Oh, also, is it me or was Snart's house 100% the same set as Barry's house?

Which isn't necessarily a problem, it would make sense for it to be tract housing and be kinda a fun wrinkle to the Barry & Leonard angle if they grew up in the same model of house.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

Aphrodite posted:

They aren't trying to kill him now. They're trying to prevent his rise.

They don't want to gently caress with time that much.

Fair enough, I hope they more explicitly decide to go in that direction. It makes more sense and makes for a better show.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

pentyne posted:

Of all the Arrow/Flash episodes that were a fun ride, this series seems like a non-stop party for the cast. I have never seen such insane chemistry between an entire cast before. Almost every line read they seem like they can barely keep it together. Ray getting called out on quoting Top Gun and his facial expressions were perfect.

As much as I complained about the larger narrative stuff, I really like the way they're structuring the individual episodes with little C-plots between just 2 characters. It's a great opportunity to flesh out the relationship dynamics between the cast quickly - Stein/Ray, Sara/Kendra, etc. Reminds me a bit of what they did in the old Justice League cartoon. And like you said, they're actually building good chemistry between these people, too. Even Jackson the Natural Athlete.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

twistedmentat posted:

I think there's a difference between me and you, and a guy who has thousands of years of experience, knowledge and resources. Obviously Savage can't know the future, but he can influance the future in ways none of us could. He could effect say, a family going into politics that could become a leader that eventually he could use to start wars or other stuff. We already saw that he has started a religion around himself, and his influence it vastly beyond anyone else could imagine.

But he can't change things that have already happened or create time paradoxes that threaten the existence of the entire universe. Come on man.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

Longbaugh01 posted:

I truly and honestly am not sure why people bag on this show as much as they do. It has its missteps, but the performances alone have been worth it.

It's so great! They've got so much freedom to play and show us cool things.

The one thing I'm worried about is that they may be setting things up for a potential Sara/Rip romance and I'm very much not into that at all.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

Senerio posted:

They apparently cast Ali Liebert as a love interest for Sara. She's "a 1950s housewife with a dark secret: she's a lesbian." That doesn't rule a Sara/Rip romance out per say, but...

Hooooly poo poo that description, wow. Maybe... maybe they should have come up with another way to phrase that. I get the social context of the 1950s, but even still.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

Jack of Hearts posted:

It's too bad Flash has so little to do with this show, the Russian lady was exactly the right levels of hot, crazy, and Soviet to be turned into Lady Flash.

I would totally let them off the hook if the writers said that her explosion gave her speed force powers (?somehow?) and also knocked her forward through time into the year 2016 (????somehow????).

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

twistedmentat posted:

I am 38 and working on a good Reed Richards/Dr Strange level of grey at the temples.

So lets say they defeat Savage this season, who do they set up as the Villain of the second season? DC doesn't have quite the number of time traveling villains as Marvel does.

:shrug: I would be 100% fine with the show dropping the subtitle and just turning into Legends at some point. Time travel's a great gimmick, but it doesn't have to be that forever. It can be whatever kind of anthology.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

Drifter posted:

You guys talking abotu them switching the roster seem to be forgetting all the weird lovely episodes between Flarrow trying to introduce those characters. One of the reasons Legends To Tomorrow is so okay is that you aren't having a lot of wasteful setups and intros.

And there's no way the CW crop of writers know how to write concise the way Netflix managed.

Well, I suppose they don't have to replace the entire cast every season. And they're constantly introducing new heroes in these shows. Coming up just within the next few weeks between the various series, we have Vixen, Jonah Hex, and Red Tornado. They've been working on Mr Terrific for a while and can pull that trigger at any time. Wildcat's still alive. They could give Jesse Quick some Velocity-9. If they've decided Suicide Squad characters are allowable, that's a bunch right there. And that's just hero characters. If a crazy flamer like Heat Wave can be included, then I think Slade or Anarky or Peek-a-Boo could get in too.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:

Mick is still the best.

Future Star City was a good timeline because Ollie said Felicity left. Sure the city is in ruins, but it's a price worth paying.

Love triangle subplot was dumb. Shame they couldn't give them anything else to do.

Mick should take out Savage next episode and become the new over-arching threat.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

King of Solomon posted:

I'm really disappointed that Ollie didn't fire arrows with his mouth. That would have been so good.

I realize you're trying to say he'd be holding the bowstring with his teeth or something, but the image I have in my mind from your comment is oh so much better and I'm just not willing to give it up. I'm also disappointed we didn't get to see this.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

RedneckwithGuns posted:

I'm not done watching the episode yet but old Oliver Queen looks like loving Peter O'Toole in Man of La Mancha.

Arrow would be loving fantastic as a live musical stage production. Write a new show each week, break some ground.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

VBane posted:

2. I don't think Gideon has sensors in the shuttle. Its on the ship, it can just remotely talk to the shuttle and take over navigation if needed. Also, I like how all the AI in the future have G names. Gideon. Gary. Gilbert.

They may not have thought things out this far, but this is also interesting because it shows Gideon isn't every AI, but a specific one - which raises further questions about why Eobard Thawne would have it. Hope he keeps coming back!

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XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

enraged_camel posted:

Yeah, I'm still not sure how Eobard Thawne ended up in the possession of Gideon...

My guess is the two shows simply wanted to use the same voice actor and they're gonna leave it unexplained.

My hope, on the other hand, is that they will journey to the 25th century at some point, but will have to leave Gideon behind for some reason, and it will end up in Thawne's hands.

Yeah, I fully believe they had no plan as to why they both had the same AI, but it gives them a really nice story hook to use to tie two fun things together should they so choose to do so at some point down the line.

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