HVAC thread: No returns, supplies are limited.

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Hobbies, Crafts, & Houses > HVAC thread: No returns, supplies are limited.

pmchem: Jan 22, 2010

SourKraut posted:

Yes, if you're going to be making the claim that ALL of the studies are "bullshit", then absolutely, explain why the methodologies are terrible and are being used as scare tactics. If you're pro-gas, that's fine, but you also have the knowledge and capability to mitigate the indoor air quality concerns. A lot of people don't.

The EPA certainly believes it's a concern, and I would hope that everyone recognizes how slow the EPA is to react and update guidance on potential COCs.

But the impact of NO2 on developing children is well known at this point , and while NO2, PM10 and PM2.5 exposures aren't likely to cause allergy or asthma, it definitely can have significant exacerbation for children who may have existing or genetic predisposition to them. I wouldn't necessarily trust every study that appears to establish a causal link, and there are certainly a lot of factors that need to be accounted for, as you said, but they have shown that combustion-related byproducts can be retained for several hours post-combustion, which makes it all the more important to have sufficient ventilation such as a properly-sized range hood, although studies have indicated that you need ventilation from both the range hood and ideally the overall home, since common residential range hoods have fairly poor capture efficiencies.

All of this seems like common sense, right? Especially because it has been observed that it's about a 2:1 ratio for PM 2.5 production for gas vs. electric, though it's also still an argument for ventilation via any method used and changing habits used.

But trying to hand wave any concerns away as being bullshit or due to "malfunctioning equipment" alone, seems to be a poor stance to take, especially when there are known to be exposure risk concerns amongst various population groups, many of whom may not be able to simply change where they live or swap out appliances easily, to address potential risk factors.

And full disclosure: I am involved in ASTM and ASCE for standards setting, so while I fully agree that studies need to be doing their due diligence in properly accounting for factors external to what is being evaluated, there is plenty of scientific research to support the argument outside of the studies you are probably looking at.

I guess you don't consider increasing asthma and allergy cases to be of concern. But this is somewhat of a naive take to have in terms of "Well, it clearly hasn't been KILLING people at high levels (that we know of) these last 100 years, so it's fine, bro!".

And honestly, 100 years ago, just as it is today worldwide, most in the US were using various forms of biomass for cooking (wood, coal, etc.), and I'm sure you know the risks and challenges associated with more-traditional forms of cooking, as well as the health impacts involved.

But yes, if you are going to handwave away every and all study and argument, be prepared to defend it and don't be a smug "I know everything' poster.

Burying the lede about your ASTM and ASCE creds, that sounds cool, any standard setting stories relevant to the thread to share?

# ¿ Oct 8, 2022 18:34

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# ¿ May 17, 2024 01:39

pmchem: Jan 22, 2010

SourKraut posted:

I should have just PM'd pmchem with it, sorry.

All good man, I�m sure there are other engineer/trades people reading who probably got more outta that than me! But I liked the story.

# ¿ Oct 13, 2022 23:07

pmchem: Jan 22, 2010

MRC48B posted:

Its a great time to own/operate a trades business. The help is still paid poo poo.

someone need their radiant heat installed?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMpPEaL2DK0

# ¿ Jan 11, 2024 01:01

pmchem: Jan 22, 2010

hey HVAC thread. our place has two trane heat pumps that are basically EOL. it also has two corresponding air handlers and two corresponding thermostats, one for each floor.

anyway, one of the heat pumps died so that floor is running on integrated electric furnace backup heat. some techs came out, nobody could source the right part (some internal control board) for a fix. old unit. we're getting quotes from multiple contractors for complete replacement of both systems. the upper floor air handler was not well-maintained by the previous owner and has its own issues and it makes sense to replace both units in sync, we think, due to age, improved efficiency, and for simplicity of future maintenance.

what's a reasonable ballpark you'd all expect for these quotes (full replacement of 2 systems on 2 floors) in an average COL area? apparently (like most things related to licensed trades) this poo poo was WAY cheaper 5-10 years ago. like 3x cheaper at least.

quote would cover replacement of both heat pumps, both air handlers, thermostats, and related misc accessories (basically everything but ductwork and refrigerant pipes). depending on brand and feature of heat pump (2 stage vs single stage, variable speed, trane vs york vs daikin vs goodman), total price is anywhere from $21,000 --> $28,000 (after discounts/rebates).

seems... high? what wide range of #s are people getting quoted these days?

# ¿ Feb 25, 2024 22:52

pmchem: Jan 22, 2010

devicenull posted:

If it starts venting into the house just rent it out - https://radonmine.com/

jesus loving christ

https://radonmine.com/more-on-radon-therapy/

quote:

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# ¿ Mar 10, 2024 21:11

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