|
Drifter posted:I wonder if the treatment and eventual exclusion of Obama's volunteer GOTVers by the DNC led to a lot fo them just not going to vote for hillary. This was me in '12. This was not relevant in '16. I campaigned for him in 08, voted against him in 12 (third party lol never a republican), and was for Bernie in 16, but when he lost I begrudgingly fell in line with Hillary because holy poo poo Donald Trump? But people like me aren't why she lost. She lost because she ignored her so-called firewall of Obama 2012 states. Not one campaign stop in Wisconsin or Michigan? Come the gently caress on. With the kind of baggage she had to start with she should not have underestimated her base, especially not in a year where a populist fascist won the gop vote and a populist socialist mounted a fairly strong opposition to her presumed coronation, especially among one of her most needed demographics. Hindsight is 20/20, but she ran a poo poo campaign.
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 02:42
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 1, 2024 17:43 |
|
|
I'm still not convinced that anyone other than Obama or Biden could have defeated Trump this round, no matter how the campaign was run. Either of the Democratic picks would have caused scores on the other side to sit at home out of apathy or spite. Meanwhile, Trump would continue to say anything anyone wanted to hear and the media would give him an unchecked podium. Allowing him to spout what verbal diarrhea he wanted without fact checking lended legitimacy to what he was saying and we might be too far beyond the tipping point to correct now. gently caress the Republicans for not keeping their house in order too. Trump should have never gotten to the nomination stage. They were so scared of losing their party by alienating his supporters that they lost their party to the likes of Bannon and may never get it back.
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 03:01
|
|
|
Echo Chamber posted:Who's saying this? I was speaking more about the general escalation of the whole "gently caress SANDERS" and the whole "BERNIE WOULD HAVE WON" crowds that do exist in real numbers at a time in which less than 80,000 votes decided this election. Especially when both of those crowds generally need each other to push through their ideals since they are like 95% similar. To think that there weren't people who thought that this election was locked up and couldn't bring themselves to vote for Hillary is probably a mistake.
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 04:11
|
|
|
Grinning Goblin posted:To think that there weren't people who thought that this election was locked up and couldn't bring themselves to vote for Hillary is probably a mistake. I'm still firmly of the belief that the main contributing factor to Trump winning was all the news coverage saying that Hillary was "guaranteed" to win. If you're guaranteed something and you think you don't have to do something you don't want to do (like vote for Hillary) to get it, then chances are you probably won't do it. I think a lot of people said "well I don't really want to vote for Hillary, and CNN's polls and predictions told me I don't have to, so I'll let everybody else vote for her". Get enough people thinking like this and you get the bystander effect, everybody thinks that everybody else is going to step up and vote so nobody does.
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 04:17
|
|
|
Bystander effect may work in some cases, but painting it as a major cause will cause the next election to be lost too. For example, I would point to Luzerne county in PA. It's traditionally democratic leaning. The last republican to carry the county in a presidential election was Bush 1988. 59.26% of the voters are registered Democrat. Voter turnout in 2012 - 123,741 51.7% Obama / 46.8% Romney Voter turnout in 2016 - 134,983 58.29% Trump / 38.86% Clinton This is a county that twice voted for Obama, voted for John Kerry, and voted for Al Gore. However, Trump ran the gently caress away with the county with the highest margin since loving Nixon. There is something fundamentally wrong there and it wasn't voter turnout.
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 04:32
|
|
|
Working as a volunteer/activist these rifts are not going away. I regularly talk to a sizable amount of active anti-trump protestors who REFUSE to support the democratic party, candidates, or even the very idea that the best way to stop republicans is to elect a democrat. They drive me up the loving wall on a daily basis. Rationally I believe we have to figure out how to talk to 18-25 year olds, and have done a poor job of it. But personally.... oy.
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 04:36
|
|
|
I'm kind of jealous of the fact that Sam owns a repurposed Herman Cain campaign bus.
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 12:41
|
|
|
bull3964 posted:Bystander effect may work in some cases, but painting it as a major cause will cause the next election to be lost too. I live in Lackawanna county and let me tell you that Hilary is absolutely despised in PA. Anecdotally, I can say that I know a few older women who basically said "Sure Trump is a chauvinist amoral jackass, but Hilary is literally the devil" and voted against her specifically instead of staying home and not voting like they had planned because the Republican candidate was Donald loving Trump. Months before the election there were signs over ever rural area that were 'Lock her up: Democrats for Trump' or 'Trump that bitch'. When family from California came to visit they were astounded by the venom of the rhetoric. On top of that Hilary's message had absolutely no ground in PA. The rust belt is not a place where you want to say that everything is going well and anyone who says they're going to get rid of immigrants or affirmative action can be guaranteed to get the attention of a segment of the population that actually goes out and votes.
|
|
#
?
Feb 15, 2017 00:40
|
|
|
I live near Pittsburgh so I was mostly insulated from that. Though, you prove my point to a bit. Even with that vitriol, Hilary still won in your country. Not to the margin that Dems usually win, but she won. She got 10k fewer votes than Obama, but Trump got 13k more votes than Romney. Even if every single person that voted for Obama and not for Hilary voted for Trump, a further 3k people turned out to vote specifically for Trump. That's were the attention needs to be.
|
|
#
?
Feb 15, 2017 00:53
|
|
|
bull3964 posted:I live near Pittsburgh so I was mostly insulated from that. I thought it was clear that I was agreeing with you that there is something fundamentally wrong here, but now that I reread that yeah I hosed up, my mistake. And there is a pretty distinct possibility my county goes red in the future which was previously unthinkable, but I don't have any evidence for that beyond anecdotes. Ithle01 fucked around with this message at 01:40 on Feb 15, 2017 |
|
#
?
Feb 15, 2017 01:33
|
|
|
Ithle01 posted:I thought it was clear that I was agreeing with you that there is something fundamentally wrong here. And there is a pretty distinct possibility my county goes red in the future which was previously unthinkable. Ah, got you. Yeah, I thought you were getting at it being a personality thing purely. The jobs thing is frustrating. I live where the rust belt transformation did happen. It can happen. I hate hearing people wanting to go backwards. I know that steel mill job sounds good to you when you are underemployed, but you really don't want THAT job. Demand better. Besides, it's that mill is never coming back. It doesn't matter how many environmental regulations they slash or tariffs they put in place, those mills are never reopening. They are outdated hollowed out husks. Even if it was economically feasible to rebuild from scratch, it would be done with more automation and only a fraction of the former workers would be employed. I'm waiting for that shoe to drop with the carmakers being forced to invest in US factories instead of going over the border. They're just going to invest that money to modernize and cut further jobs.
|
|
#
?
Feb 15, 2017 01:43
|
|
|
Great show this week. I called all three of my reps regarding HR 424, HR 717, and HJ Res 69. I have them on speed dial now, and I've been calling every day.
|
|
#
?
Feb 17, 2017 03:03
|
|
|
Well apparently someone whose hair Bee made fun of was a cancer patient, so that's going to be brought up forever.
Dr Christmas fucked around with this message at 20:59 on Mar 12, 2017 |
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2017 19:43
|
|
|
Voter turnout on the left was down far more than it was on the right. A lot of potential votes got lost because people legitimately believed Trump had zero chance of winning. It's depressing. This was totally avoidable. 
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2017 20:36
|
|
|
Dr Christmas posted:Well apparently someone who's hair Bee made fun of was a cancer patient, so that's going to be brought up forever. coyo7e fucked around with this message at 23:04 on Mar 12, 2017 |
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2017 20:41
|
|
|
Samantha Bee is a segregationist.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2017 22:55
|
|
|
precision posted:Voter turnout on the left was down far more than it was on the right. A lot of potential votes got lost because people legitimately believed Trump had zero chance of winning. It's depressing. This was totally avoidable. The reasons Hillary lost are myriad. But yeah there was a major enthusiasm gap in play.
|
|
#
?
Mar 13, 2017 16:27
|
|
|
If only those millennials had actually Pokemon Go'd to the polls
|
|
#
?
Mar 14, 2017 21:45
|
|
|
With such a small number of votes deciding the election, you can pretty much blame the rainfall in the northern quadrant as a reason for the loss. Mainly though, I think Democrats were complacent. With or without Trump as a candidate.
|
|
#
?
Mar 14, 2017 23:00
|
|
|
If only Democrats had a bunch of "news" people constantly screaming that if you vote for the other guy the world will literally end because, well, here we are...
|
|
#
?
Mar 14, 2017 23:59
|
|
|
precision posted:If only Democrats had a bunch of "news" people constantly screaming that if you vote for the other guy the world will literally end because, well, here we are...
|
|
#
?
Mar 15, 2017 00:17
|
|
|
Narcissus1916 posted:With such a small number of votes deciding the election, you can pretty much blame the rainfall in the northern quadrant as a reason for the loss. Because the deciding margin was so close, thanks to the Electoral College, everyone's theory about who is really to blame for the country accidentally voted in the worst possible option is at least partially right. Like, if New York society could have just brought itself to quietly and unenthusiastically humor Trump we wouldn't be in this situation. Sometimes you've just got to let the wrong one in and put up with their gauche presence for the greater good.
|
|
#
?
Mar 15, 2017 00:21
|
|
|
Narcissus1916 posted:Rationally I believe we have to figure out how to talk to 18-25 year olds, and have done a poor job of it. But personally.... oy. And it absolutely infuriates me when I see their FB feed full of pro-worker / anticapitalist activism because way to loving stick it to the folks you want to be fighting for.
|
|
#
?
Mar 15, 2017 08:00
|
|
|
Anyone who considers Jill Stein to have been a viable candidate ought to be taken almost as seriously as a Ben... Carson. supporter.....
|
|
#
?
Mar 15, 2017 08:49
|
|
|
Goddrat that rape kit bill bit was amazing.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2017 20:24
|
|
|
It was moving and I'm glad to have closure on it, but it honestly made me MORE angry and distressed that there was that much maddening work to get such a sensible thing done. So many needless layers of bullshit. And one terrible senator gets to block a thing the house passed like what. Anyway, show is still great and tragically underrated.
|
|
#
?
Apr 3, 2017 14:46
|
|
|
man that smart gun report was kinda mind boggling.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2017 15:41
|
|
|
anybody see her not the corresponse dinner?
|
|
#
?
May 1, 2017 12:04
|
|
|
It was pretty good, but not a solid hourlong laugh riot. In particular, the interstitial segments where Sam roasted presidents' past were all strong misses. My fave segments: What is Facts? with Steve Buscemi Will Ferrell as GWB The Woman in the High Castle
|
|
#
?
May 1, 2017 18:32
|
|
|
It's on my DVR, just haven't gotten around to watching it. Being a full hour has kept me from sitting down and watching it.
|
|
#
?
May 1, 2017 18:42
|
|
|
It was okay, a lot of it felt like rehashed jokes she's already done and Will Farrell as GW was him stepping out and obviously reading a script Bee wrote. It was kinda eh, but I'm starting to get a bit exhausted with Bee in general The Peaches intro was good though.
|
|
#
?
May 1, 2017 20:17
|
|
|
I like Bee but her skits really aren't very good.
|
|
#
?
May 1, 2017 20:23
|
|
|
I mean, it's her first shot at an hour-long that I'm aware of, and it wasn't the strongest theme to begin with. It wasn't bad, just probably they were aiming too high too soon. But you have to admit TBS is coughing up more money than you expected for this show.
|
|
#
?
May 1, 2017 21:25
|
|
|
Yeah, I'm not mad at her. She's trying to do a lot of different comedy things at once. She's nailed the Stewart angry political commentary and she does well with the correspondent pieces and interview packages. The scripted stuff is just a couple of steps behind. But that's pretty good for a year 1 where like she's probably ahead of Trevor Noah on the learning curve.* The show seems like its got a good future. *Although I again feel the need to defend Noah on having a tougher job since he does more shows in a shorter turn around, and also doesn't have the years of familiarity and outrage about America politics that Bee and Oliver have.
|
|
#
?
May 1, 2017 21:38
|
|
|
I actually think Trevor is doing a very good job.
|
|
#
?
May 1, 2017 22:27
|
|
|
I like him but he's 3rd behind the three shows for me. But I think that's mostly his freshness to all this and the "daily" grind. Bee and Oliver have a week to work up their poo poo and years of experience with this stuff so I expect them to be better.
|
|
#
?
May 1, 2017 22:32
|
|
|
To be honest, I preferred Hasan Minhaj's performance at the actual correspondents' dinner.
|
|
#
?
May 2, 2017 16:48
|
|
|
STAC Goat posted:I like him but he's 3rd behind the three shows for me. But I think that's mostly his freshness to all this and the "daily" grind. Bee and Oliver have a week to work up their poo poo and years of experience with this stuff so I expect them to be better. The more recent LWT have been extremely unfunny to me. But Colbert has been stepping up his game in the Age of Trump and Seth Meyers' Closer Look bits are pretty good. I need to get around to watching Bee's Not the WHCD, but haven't gone out of my way to make time for it because the teaser bits make it look exactly as self-congratulatory as the actual WHCD.
|
|
#
?
May 2, 2017 17:18
|
|
|
Comrade Fakename posted:To be honest, I preferred Hasan Minhaj's performance at the actual correspondents' dinner. He was great!
|
|
#
?
May 2, 2017 19:37
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 1, 2024 17:43 |
|
|
Mars4523 posted:The more recent LWT have been extremely unfunny to me. But Colbert has been stepping up his game in the Age of Trump and Seth Meyers' Closer Look bits are pretty good. Ultimately I like that there's so many options that I can kind of bounce back and forth between them depending on who I'm finding funny and who I'm finding tired.
|
|
#
?
May 2, 2017 23:37
|
|