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DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001


Fun Shoe
So... running as Empire is kicking my arse. Hard diff. Mainly Norsca and various northern tribes. Dogs and fast Cav seem to dance around my blocks of spears and swords and head right to my cannons and crossbow. Had a couple of guys zig zag between 4 sword and spear units just to engage my cannon. I like running heavy cannon (4) after dwarf run. Isn't there some threat range that forces the calvary to engage my melee? I've even had then charge through my unit and hit the crossbow to almost disengage and them go from cannon to cannon group. A pain as I have to turn off the melee toggle on my crossbow and then re-select the guncrew on the cannon. A bit of a pain. Wondering why I'm so bad at micro. Also I am trying to put a protective block around the crew but marauders always dance around them. Annoying.

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DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001


Fun Shoe
Just finished Empire run. Bloody Amazing. Cleansed the land of all Norsca, Vampires and Greenskin before. A pain in the rear end but was so much fun after learning how to effectively counter the drat horse marauders. Time to do Azhag and finish Orc. I really wish there was sa way to take over a city and grant it to another nation. Friendly AI tend to build their cities short bus style and it would be a nice and very friendly gesture to say "here is this city I built... please have it and love me. " Also "be stronger and be my wonderful wall of protection against another nation pretty please. " I am very gay for Kislev and would like to rebuild their Empire and NOT take it over or have some random nation rebuild the ruin and add crap that lets Chaos take it over a few turns later. Just let me build the shiny wonderful city and use it please. I have yet to save that dwarf city on the top. They got steamrolled hard both times. Well before I met them. Only know about them from the Kislev mod.

Time to win it with Azhag and hopefully get the bloody crown before midgame.

DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001


Fun Shoe
I've given the game a bit of a rest and came back to hard. Greenskins with Azhag. Thorgrim just hands me my rear end by turn 3-7. Every time. He even seiged my main town and I couldn't touch any of his units. Granted I had lovely t1 gobbos and Orcs with my one unit of big uns but jesus. I know I should go Grimgor but really want to do it with Azhag. Is there any hope I have of taking on Thorgrims stack with my unbuffed t1 Azhag stack? Without cheats of course. I'm normally a persistant bastard and can find a way but this time he's just slapping me around like I owe him money. Any advice other than take Grimgor?

DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001


Fun Shoe

Mans posted:

Loot, don't conquer and try to make peace with the secondary dwarf factions. You'll need tons of money, you'll need bigguns and you'll need wolf riders to survive Thorgrim. Azhag is a cool LL, specially with a Magic Mod, but his early game is super anemic and you've got to pick your fights.

Remember that two or three units of goblin spearmen leading the charge to soak up all the dwarven ranged fire is almost mandatory if you want success versus the stunties.


Mans posted:

Loot, don't conquer and try to make peace with the secondary dwarf factions. You'll need tons of money, you'll need bigguns and you'll need wolf riders to survive Thorgrim. Azhag is a cool LL, specially with a Magic Mod, but his early game is super anemic and you've got to pick your fights.

Remember that two or three units of goblin spearmen leading the charge to soak up all the dwarven ranged fire is almost mandatory if you want success versus the stunties.

Ammanas posted:

Yeah dont fight a full dwarf stack until lile turn 30, even on normal battle difficulty the tier 1 & 2 units will lose. That or have overwhelming number superiority. Use the fact that ai wont really siege and attack black crag and hit and run other settlements to build a waaargh.

Thank you guys. That did it. I made it over the hump. Now that I've got Boar Units the stunties are going down. Azhag's starting units were such a drag. Still wish the Crown of Command was there day one. I also kept getting really unlucky with Thorgrim tendency to march down to hit me napping in a smaller town. This time he left me alone for a bit plus Looting while bashin the other Orc and gobbos gave me some insane money. Took the Waagh magic mod and apparently it disabled my death magic. Boo. But I refuse to start over again. Having one stack of pure gobbo is fun as a backup army. They... are lacking one on one but the sheer numbers seem to make autoresolve a guaranteed win. Yeah.... just mobbing up and numerical superiority is such a tried and true green tactic. God I love Orks in every setting.

As an aside: bought Napoleon: Total War and apparently it doesnt like some Nvidia Windows 10 machines like mine. Going to have to play around with graphics a bit as its a known bug. Sad as I want to get in on some war against old Boney. For the Motherland.

Reading about Attila still makes me curious. I really want to become the flail of god and pile skulls of those fools that stood against me. For the blood of my ancestors if nothing else.

DogsInSpace! fucked around with this message at 20:00 on Jul 24, 2016

DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001


Fun Shoe

madmac posted:

You would think so but no, Black Orcs demolish Bestigors 1v1. And T1 Orc Boyz are about on par or better than T3 Gor Herds, outside the speed and vanguard advantage. Big'Uns are much stronger than any light or medium infantry Beastmen can field.

Also beastmen LD is terrible at base, it only seems high because of all the buffs they can get from Beastlords and Gorebulls.

As for Archers, Greenskins might not be great, but their Goblin Archers are about on par with Ungor Raiders minus the stalk and vanguard. Night Goblin Archers are flatly superior, and Arrer Boyz blow them away in terms of actual ranged DPS on anything with armor.

I'm not saying Beastmen are bad, far from it, but the base stats on most of their units are terrible and they're very reliant on leader buffs, ambushes, and speed to make up for it. Which is cool, because Beastmen are super fun to play and probably my new favorite faction. They really do have a much harder time with early game Orcs than they do early game humans, though, and I watched a bunch of tournament games this morning so I feel safe in saying Greenskins are a tough match-up for them there as well, even with devolve as broken as it is.

Late game changes things up a bit, because high end heavy cav and such starts to become a problem for Beastmen, but early/mid game it's much easier to bully the humans than Orcs.

Re: Skill points, I also always skip LD for Beastmen. The redskills they get just aren't that good outside of Apocalyptic Vision and you have so many other things you need. Blue Tree and topskills/magic all the way.

madmac posted:


Not really. Greenskins have better ranged, better artillery, better cav and largely better infantry. Beastmen have better mobility, better magic, better monster infantry, and stronger Lords/Heroes aside from Gimgor. Beastmen basically have to leverage their better special units to overcome a rather large core army disadvantage.

Coming straight off another Greenskin campaign, you are 100% right though unupgraded Ungor Archers seem to outrange sans-upgrade gobbo bowmen with a better accuracy than base orc archers. Later on, with Orcs, you get night gobbo superior poison archers (with fanatics) but your base ungor archers are pretty much the same as they were at t1. Orcs surpass them hard. I wish they'd (ungor archers) get a poison upgrade or something. On the plus side they flank, move fast so even with base weedy oomie stats they do alright hitting enemy mobs in the flank or rear. Campaign I almost always have a decent flanking force to take out war machines. Chariot wise the Brownskin chariot seems to match the boar chariot... but its still a chariot so take that as you will. Their tanky Mino Boss is pretty drat good in the early and mid game. Late game still seems to be going strong if not quite the monster he was. Freakin magic is awesome. I like beasts more than wild but both are good. I'd rather summon a manticore anyday over the cygor. Speaking of Cygor: they are the only artillery you get. They seem profoundly mediocre to me but I get at least one as they look cool and are fun. They aren't the most accurate so aim them at a defended gate or in the mob mass. They cause terror so if they get rushed by cav they ... have survived in my experience. No minimum range if I remember or at least very short range. I swear they have pitched boulders at guys at point blank. Bestigors are cool as long as you accept they will never be as tanky as Black Orcs. Fast and great at flanking some group stuck against another square.

Great army and they are fairly close to taking my favourite slot.... but I'm super nuts about anything Orky.

One weird thing: the Orcs keep giving me money. They don't want to be my defensive or military ally but they keep tossing me money. Not demanding money but offering me gifts. For no reason. For about 120 turn now. I did kill the stunties for em so maybe thats it.

DogsInSpace! fucked around with this message at 22:51 on Jul 31, 2016

DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001


Fun Shoe

Stephen9001 posted:

Oh that's obvious. They're behaving like a player who wants to prop up a faction that is an enemy of a faction they don't like, and so give them gold to help out. How does it feel to be on the receiving end of such treatment?

Nice. I did this all the time in a campaign but don't normally expect the computer to do something that tactical. It's an old trick and not exactly requiring brilliance but still... guess I'm just used to less clever tactical games. Now that you mention that it makes me remember my Dwarf run where I conquered the Orc territories and then sat around soaking in the profits and funding proxy wars from the comfort of my silver road couch. Gave Emperor Franzie and Kislev a ton of money. Think I saw a chaos army once, in the distance. The humans killed it while I drank some ale.

edit: now that I ponder it: I do wish there was a faction that could specialize in covert sabotage. Just spend all day wheeling and dealing making the various factions fight each other or certain enemies. Maybe you could use trade and naval power to ferry allies around and influence who you want them to fight. A possible route for High Elves? Never played High Elves with TT as I just liked to stomp them so much. Another wish is some viable way to go pure Gobbo. I want Grom the Paunch to invade Ulthuan and burn those weedy lil towers. I hates elves so bloody much.

DogsInSpace! fucked around with this message at 00:23 on Aug 1, 2016

DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001


Fun Shoe

SickZip posted:

Orc and Dwarf difficulty is really contingent on circumstances. Sometimes they'll be insanely easy and sometimes buckle up for a brutal grind to get out of your starting province because the one your not playing as confederated into a 20 province behemoth and all your fellow orcs/dwarves rolled over and died. The badlands are a land of contrasts. I wouldn't recommend them to a new player because those factions can degenerate into a tedious slog really easy

Empire is consistently tough. It will put you through your paces but none of your opponents tend toward wild snowballing.

VC is the most easy going faction. You can do whatever and usually triumph eventually.

Yeah my VC run was really easy. Even the nations that said nastygrams of "we dont like you and so declare war" didn't really come around much. A few turns and some bribes later and we were buds again. NPCs tend to avoid the death attrition. Orc and Dwarf you will always have a 50/50 of the opposing side sending a full stack of buffed troops before turn 10. My first two games were dwarf and orc and I had to restart/savescum multiple times. Empire is a ton of fun but you will not only fight but need to get really good at diplomacy. VC and BM are definitely the most forgiving. The only caveat with VC is watch your stance and move metre in non dead territory. You will take some attrition. There are skills to allow you to slowly expand but VC tend to move like their troops: a slow tide of inevitable grinning death.

Best advice I can give newbs: savescum. Nobody will know and you don't have to post that you are savescumming thus avoiding terrible internet mockery. Save at the start of every turn. Keep 3-5 saves around. Its like training wheels. Accidentally let Azzy or Kemmler rush out ahead of everyone and get slaughtered in seconds? Load and try again. You decided to do a long trek into varg territory unsupported just for the hell of it and now you realize that was not the best decision? Reload that old save. You suck at Total War in general? You get retries and learn from your mistakes. Eventually you stop savescumming as much then one day you will hardly save at all. You might even forget to save completely and lose a great game when you lose power suddenly.

mod talk:
Settle anywhere mod. Yeah it radically changes the game. With my lasts vc game - How I expanded territory was consolidated all the vamp areas and then dug deep into the mountain areas behind me. Those same mountain areas were good money and almost never got harassed while my 2 stacks could wander where they needed. Funny enough one of my first and bestest friends was a wandering tribe of savage orcs that somehow managed to counter varg the vargs and settle the destroyed areas of kislev. I really like the settle anywhere mod not as much for me but for the random nations that will pop up in the funniest places. I've seen a Tilean and Brettonian colonies in Norsca. Again, savage orc Kislev.

DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001


Fun Shoe

Triskelli posted:

Well chaos cultists can summon demons wherever, it's just harder for demons to stick around away from the gates at the poles.

Plus we're not counting Chaos Dwarfs, Skaven, and the Slaaneshi Dark Elves in this "only humans spread chaos" calculation.

As excited as I am for new DLC I can't be the only one salivating every time I get that event where the population of a city is depleted and the only evidence is an obscure symbol. THE HORNED RAT!. I want a Clan Skrye Lord with a curiously German sounding name along with Thanquol.
Curious though - what would the Skaven forces be like?
-Lots of disposable and cheap skavenslaves? Possibly with captured humies?
-With Thanquol: Instead of a mount you get an unlockable free Rat Ogre Pal that sticks by your side and doesn't count as a separate unit?
-Terrible infighting and increased chances of rebellion?
-Leadership around Gobbo level?
-All the sweet and nasty nasty devices? Warpfire throwers, Jezzail, Warpfire Cannons and Doomwheels all could work like currently in units.
-Universal ability to tunnel like Orcs and Stunties?
-What would be the cavalry equivalent? Would they have that?

Non-Skaven question: Do you guys think they would ever release Nagash as the undead equivalent to the Lord of Change? Would he be some massively powerful undead stack that could threaten to consume and take over the regular undead player? This has been such a good year for addictive games.

DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001


Fun Shoe

Dandywalken posted:

Iirc Skaven got some weird small personal doomwheel thing at some point. Always struck me as out of character, but meh.

Doomwheels are more of a steamtank/chariot of doom type weapon. Rat swarms would fill out the fast attack bat type. Been a loooong time since I pulled out the old Skaven warbook. Don't think they do have a cavalry option though. Slaves, clanrats then Stormvermin for basic troops. Poison wind Globadiers/Grenadiers, Plague Monks, Censer Bearers for special units (Unlock with Clan Pestilens House Building). Clan Moulder building lets you do monster build (t1 rat swarms and giant rats, t2 Rat Ogres and t3 are abominations) and Skrye opens up tech and war machine units.
At least ambushers and agents would be easy with Gutter and Night Runners plus the assassin agent.

Hell just found this
http://warhammerfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Skaven

So yeah.... horde and low leadership army with nasty characters, monsters, magic and brutal war machines. Now I'm contemplating my hand at creating my first mod. Wonder how hard it would be to implement the slaves as a disposable tar-pit mob that wouldn't affect other units morale when they break?

Also, other than specialists (Jezzail, Ratling Gun, Runner's blowguns and throwing stars and war machines) I don't remember if they have much in the way of ranged. I want to say no. I remember characters can get warplock weapons, slings or blowguns. Don't think they used bows or crossbows.

toasterwarrior posted:


EDIT: BTW, if you're fielding a Greenskin army full of heavy-hitters like Black Orcs and Big 'Un Boar Boyz, the shaman you'll want to take is the Night Goblin Shaman. Trust me on this; as fun as it is to summon a literal giant green foot to stomp on enemies, the debuffs of the Little Waaagh! are much more useful for your army's flexibility. For one thing, with some Spider Rider Archers in tow, you can actually stack enough speed penalties on horse skirmishers that your slow-rear end boar cavalry can catch up to them.

Agreed but the giant foot of death is just so drat Orky. Love that spell even if it isn't as effective as the buffs.

DogsInSpace! fucked around with this message at 06:00 on Aug 29, 2016

DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001


Fun Shoe

toasterwarrior posted:

One thing I'd like to see with Skaven is CA adapting the special rule table-top Skaven get that allows them to shoot into melee, likely causing a poo poo-ton of friendly fire. You know how even if you direct your ranged units to fire on an enemy that's being engaged by one of your units, if they don't have a clear shot, they'll still end up getting obstructed and mostly refuse to shoot? Skaven should just dump into the poor bastards, gunpowder Total War style.

Oh absolutely. Sacrificing some of your own men for victory should be almost mandatory. I know it hasn't been in a TT game but I could completely see a skaven spell that buffs movement, armour and attack for 20 seconds then detonates the unit with a big green kaboom. I know I will shoot warpfire throwers with glee into big mass melees with skavenslaves.

Also hope they keep the skaven speech repetitions and patterns with the various cutscenes as I want to hear "die die humies" at least once.

DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001


Fun Shoe

Pendent posted:

That is probably my biggest criticism- you can't change colors at all. In a Warhammer game.

You only need one colour in warhammer: Green.

p.s. please add skaven soon TW

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DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001


Fun Shoe

toasterwarrior posted:

gently caress it man, I haven't read White Dwarf in years. Might as well see what's up with GW since I do like seeing the paintjobs and conversions they do, though I guess it's primarily dependent on whether Grombrindal has good stats or not.

Be warned its not nearly as good as it was when/if you were a kid in the 90s/early 00s. Last time I browsed through one at the store there wasn't even a battle report. Nothing but ads and promos. No painting tips, no stories and, again, no battle report. It might have improved in a year but... just keep your expectations low.

Having a problem unlocking the new Volkmar the Grim after choosing Franz. Instructions say temple of sigmar. No specifics on location... just temple of Sigmar. That's the second upgrade to the sigmar building yeah? Tried upgrading to cathedral and nogo. Made it in Altdorf proper and still nogo. Is there something else I'm missing or am I bugged?

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