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shibbotech
Aug 21, 2014

I'm Doctor Shibbo, and this is Jackass.
Nap Ghost
I need 10 CCs of anime, stat! Let's Play Trauma Center: Under the Knife!



What is Trauma Center?
Trauma Center is a nifty series spawned shortly after the release of the Nintendo DS by Atlus. This entry is the first in the series, Under the Knife, which came out in 2005; it received some favorable reviews from critics, but the sheer difficulty that Atlus introduces in everything they touch turned off a fair number of players. It touts itself as a simulator, but really it feels a bit more like an action/puzzle game with a visual novel backbone for the story.

What is the story, anyway?
The year is 2018; cancer, AIDS, any currently-terminal disease you can think of? Yeah, all that's treatable now. In this game we play as Derek Stiles, a rookie surgeon who just finished his residency at Hope Hospital. He's young and foolhardy at best, but good-natured. His nurse assistant, Angie, helps to whip him in shape and get him to act like a proper doctor. All well and good, if a bit skeletal.

And then the anime takes over. Please no spoilers. This game takes a little while to get going, but wow does it get out there.

So...why this game? How will content be delivered?
I absolutely adored this game when it was first released. Back in those days, I wanted to be a neurosurgeon when I grew up, so I grabbed this game as soon as I'd heard about it and proceeded to play it for hours on end. It's remarkably addicting and enjoyable, and I do like the story quite a bit. The gameplay itself requires some quick thinking and decent reflexes, becoming rather complex by the endgame.

There's a great SSLP on the archives by World, but I feel that to really experience the game, you should watch a playthrough. My intent is to share that nostalgia I still have for the game with the viewers (even if I'm going to riff on it a fair bit). This will be a VLP without a particular regard to the scores of the missions, more intended to walk the viewer through the game's deceptively extensive and somewhat dark storyline while entertaining them along the way. By noooo means am I going to S-rank everything. I'm nostalgic, not insane.

What else are you going to offer? What makes this any different than a stream of the game, if you don't care about the operation scores?

Well, my friend, as I said above - my intention is to share my positive experience and nostalgia of the main storyline with the viewers. That said, I'm also planning on a series of side videos that touch on things beyond the main story: displaying a chapter's operations in one burst of best-effort to demonstrate mechanics and tips (and difficulty), some discussion videos in regards to threads of the storyline that parallel real-world events, and so on.

Of course, being a rookie surgeon means I could go for some help. Luckily, Nurse ManicVolcanic is here to assist me, alongside a team of guest co-commentators professional consultants on-hand to help treat the chronic ills of dead silence and awkward pauses. If you want to join the staff, just give me a shout. I'm shooting for at least weekly updates, but if I can get a few more in, so be it! To the OR!


Video List - Main Story
Update 1 - Meet Derek Stiles (or How I Learned I'm a Surgeon, Too)
Update 2 - Witch Doctor Stiles? (or Cardiac Warlock: the Reckoning)
Update 3 - The "A" is for Asclepius (or Let's Surgeon It Up)
Update 4 - Sadness and GUILT (or Emotional Trauma Center: Under Prozac)
Update 5 - Diseases are Painful (or "Caddikis")
Update 6 - Euthanasia Isn't A Place (or They Call Me Shibbo the Sentimental)
Update 7 - Delphi Set Us Up The Bomb (or Yin-Yang Tumors)
Update 8 - Math Is The Real Terrorism (or Superstar ManicVolcanic)
Update 9 - Diagnosis: Wednesday (or Toxin Hold 'Em)
Update 10 - Nanomachines, Son! (or "The Doctors Snark")
Update 11 - It Never Ends (or Skippotech 2: Dietary Supplements)
Update 12 - Crouching Delphi, Evasive Spider (or Why Dex Isn't a Dump Stat)
Update 13 - Sailing on the Seven Sins (or Prying Open My Third Eye)
Update 14 - Absolution and Tedium (or Living GUILT-free)
Update 15 - Epilogue (or Please Stop Hitting On My Mom, Thank You)

Video List - Operation Showcases
Operation Showcase: Chapter 1 (or Doctor Shibbo and Mister Styles)
Operation Showcase: Chapter 2 (or Walk Toward the Light)
Operation Showcase: Chapter 3 (or Abel and Kain/Caine/Cain)
Operation Showcase: Chapter 4 (or Pick 'er Up by the Pempti)

Video List - Second Opinion Comparison Videos
Let's Compare - Chapter 1
Let's Compare - Chapter 2

Video List - Stupid Side Stuff/Guest Challenges
Autograph (Sazero Challenge 1)
so a child wanted to co-commentate
Do Not Taunt Happy Fun Bomb (Sazero Challenge 2)

shibbotech fucked around with this message at 23:55 on Oct 30, 2016

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shibbotech
Aug 21, 2014

I'm Doctor Shibbo, and this is Jackass.
Nap Ghost
Medical Illuminati Recruitment Poster Contest!
In part 5 of the LP, we're introduced to what basically amounts to a shadow organization hellbent on curing all disease forever. On a whim, we devised a contest while recording the episode.

Come up with a poster and slogan to help convince people to join Cadeceus (or whatever medical shadow organization you want)! Manic and I will judge the entries. Winner gets a plat upgrade or an avatar change, their choice. I know we said "one week" in the video, but I'll be closing this 23:59 Central Time on 7/17/16.

As an addition, anyone who submits an entry will be given a chance to guest on an episode of the LP if you so desire! Good luck, and I look forward to seeing how this pans out!

The Splash posted:

Also... got a bit ahead of things but hey, when one has time to play around in Photoshop:

shibbotech fucked around with this message at 01:21 on Jul 7, 2016

Skrewtape
Sep 10, 2003
I like pie
I like the first video, and I'm looking forward to the rest of this LP. I played this game when it came and I remember it gets super difficult later on; difficult enough that I never finished it. I didn't even know there was such a thing as an S ranking in the game. Do you know what some of the secret objectives are to get them?

shibbotech
Aug 21, 2014

I'm Doctor Shibbo, and this is Jackass.
Nap Ghost

Skrewtape posted:

I like the first video, and I'm looking forward to the rest of this LP. I played this game when it came and I remember it gets super difficult later on; difficult enough that I never finished it. I didn't even know there was such a thing as an S ranking in the game. Do you know what some of the secret objectives are to get them?

Hey, thanks for the feedback! I'm glad you enjoyed the first video. This game definitely ramps up the difficulty - honestly, part 3 of this LP contains two of my least favorite operations in the game because of how tight some of the maneuvers get - and truthfully, I don't know that I could S-rank every operation. To me, though, that would kill the fond and admittedly rose-colored view I have to the game.

The objectives I refer to, for the most part, are all geared toward maxing out the "Special Bonus" segment of the score. For example, in operation 1-6 ("A Real Doctor"), you cannot have more than two Bad rankings on parts of the procedures; in 1-2 ("Standard Procedure 2") and 1-3 ("A Farewell"), using the ultrasound and not keeping the tumors on screen will cost you enough points to lose the S-rank, making it a better idea to avoid the tool entirely and memorize where they are instead. In addition, to obtain an S-rank, you cannot make any misses during the operation, and there is a hidden time limit that must be met - otherwise you just get an A-rank. There's another component to this that I'll touch on when a later mechanic is introduced.

To avoid a double post, I'd also like to say that part two is now up! We clear the rest of chapter 1, I try some more editing techniques, and we learn that medicine might be more magical than we thought.

HaroldofTheRock
Jun 3, 2003

Pillbug
Chalk me up as another person who didn't finish this game once it got super hard...and those S rank requirements? Uuuuuugh

It was nice to see our dark lord Satan pull through for you :devil: in the second video.

I don't know how familiar you are with avisynth, but forms user Mastigophoran made a script for dynamic shifting around the screens: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=10443

You may be interested in checking it out, but I do think the two screens stacked works for this LP too.

ManicVolcanic
Jun 5, 2016

HaroldofTheRock posted:

Chalk me up as another person who didn't finish this game once it got super hard...and those S rank requirements? Uuuuuugh

It was nice to see our dark lord Satan pull through for you :devil: in the second video.

I don't know how familiar you are with avisynth, but forms user Mastigophoran made a script for dynamic shifting around the screens: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=10443

You may be interested in checking it out, but I do think the two screens stacked works for this LP too.

Thanks for the advice. The dynamic shifting is neat, but we decided it wouldn't be really useful for what we're doing.

And our dark lord Satan always pulls through. :devil:

Space Kablooey
May 6, 2009


That's a huge glass shard that just popped out from a heart. :stare:

shibbotech
Aug 21, 2014

I'm Doctor Shibbo, and this is Jackass.
Nap Ghost

HaroldofTheRock posted:

Awesome advice stuff and mutual groaning at S-ranks

I'm slowly becoming familiar with AviSynth and editing in general, this was a really interesting read and thank you for sending it my way! Given the nature of this game, I'm electing to stick with the stacked screens, but I can definitely see where this'd be helpful for other DS games.

HardDisk posted:

That's a huge glass shard that just popped out from a heart. :stare:

I think that's a huge part of why that's my personal favorite operation. It just keeps escalating. Revive him! Treat his wounds! Explore his chest! Treat his heart! Revive him again! Oh god, so much glass! Holy poo poo, his heart just split in half!

And then he's completely fine as soon as the suture's made. Good. Realism.

Also: we have a showcase of the operations in Chapter 1! Thanks again to our nursing assistant Kriss for popping in, for both this and part 3 (which should be up later this week!)

HaroldofTheRock
Jun 3, 2003

Pillbug
:stare: So uh what is the situation with tort reform in the far flung future of 2018?

First part of the video I was cringing at the thought of a doctor racing through the procedure as fast as you went...then I saw the second part :stonk:

Seriously though, you have insane skill. Those S ranks were crazy to watch.

Mzbundifund
Nov 5, 2011

I'm afraid so.
I love this stupid game and your commentary is fun to listen to. It's funny and not loud and overbearing.

Fun fact about Operation Surprise Lung Tumor there, the lungs are actually a really common place for a tumor to metastasize to. Metastasis is the process where a cancer cell breaks off from an existing tumor, travels through the bloodstream, and lodges somewhere else. Since the patient had tumors in his bowels, if a cell were to break off from there it would travel through a series of veins, each vein larger than the last, until at last reaching his heart. From there the oxygen depleted blood goes to the lungs to get more oxygen, and in the process it travels through a mesh of super narrow pulmonary arteries. These arteries are so narrow that even red blood cells have to travel through them in single file, and if there's anywhere that a free-floating cancer cell is going to get stuck, it's there. From there the cancer cell divides and forms a new tumor, and that's metastasis.

tl,dr: The first step in any cancer diagnosis is to check for metastasis, and the first place you look is in the lungs.

...I'm not positive how a giant hemorrhaging tumor would be so difficult to spot though.

shibbotech
Aug 21, 2014

I'm Doctor Shibbo, and this is Jackass.
Nap Ghost

HaroldofTheRock posted:

:stare: So uh what is the situation with tort reform in the far flung future of 2018?
First part of the video I was cringing at the thought of a doctor racing through the procedure as fast as you went...then I saw the second part :stonk:
Seriously though, you have insane skill. Those S ranks were crazy to watch.

Well thanks for the kind words, chief! And let's be real, I'd rather have someone like Derek get his hands -out- of my body ASAP. And we're all human, mistakes are made and frustration needs to be vented...

I also believe we're operating under a no-payer system, as at no point in the game is insurance or medical billing brought up, as far as I recall. We get waaaaay too anime for such mundane discussions. Since there's no cost, surely there's no malpractice, right? Hahaha...ha...please don't report me to the board I'll get better I promise

Mzbundifund posted:

I love this stupid game and your commentary is fun to listen to. It's funny and not loud and overbearing.

(elaboration on Operation Surprise Lung Tumor)

I appreciate the compliment, as well as the clarification from a medical perspective! Metastasis I'm somewhat familiar with as a concept, but I was unaware of the proclivity for cells to propagate to the lungs. Makes a lot of sense after thinking about it though. And I suppose it's difficult to spot when you're more concerned with getting drinks with symposium buddies than keeping people alive. Derek's not really the best doc. :downs:

Last but not least, part three of the main storyline is up! I tried a few new things with the audio editing and would appreciate feedback on that. Thanks again to everyone enjoying the thread so far!

ManicVolcanic
Jun 5, 2016
I'm excited. Things can only get more ridiculous from here.

Skippy Granola
Sep 3, 2011

It's not what it looks like.
Oooooh I never managed to complete this game. I think I tapped out just as the peak anime was getting started - thank you for finally bringing me closure with your worm-shaped sutures

Blastinus
Feb 28, 2010

Time to try my luck
:rolldice:
Crap.
I find it a little odd that the game would give you a new special technique and then proceed to penalize you for using it, but this IS Atlus we're talking about. I'm surprised that they don't also take away points every time you inject a patient with Green Potion.

Miz Kriss
Mar 17, 2009

It's only an avatar if the Cubs get swept.

Blastinus posted:

I find it a little odd that the game would give you a new special technique and then proceed to penalize you for using it, but this IS Atlus we're talking about. I'm surprised that they don't also take away points every time you inject a patient with Green Potion.

I thought they did :downs:

shibbotech
Aug 21, 2014

I'm Doctor Shibbo, and this is Jackass.
Nap Ghost

Skippy Granola posted:

Oooooh I never managed to complete this game. I think I tapped out just as the peak anime was getting started - thank you for finally bringing me closure with your worm-shaped sutures

That's another ancient Greek technique, the Sutures of Skolex. Not to be confused with the Bandages of Boreas or the Antibiotics of Apollo. The sad part is, I can't tell where you tapped out from that description - because every time you think it peaks, it seems to soar to greater heights. It's the Icarus of anime, if you will, except instead of plummeting into the oceans of reality it just veers directly into the hellfire of Atlus gameplay. Hopefully I'll be able to show you all sorts of fascinating stuff, Skippy.

Blastinus posted:

I find it a little odd that the game would give you a new special technique and then proceed to penalize you for using it, but this IS Atlus we're talking about. I'm surprised that they don't also take away points every time you inject a patient with Green Potion.

Now, to be fair, they don't penalize you in the sense that it actually changes anything relating to the story - hell, I'm convinced they intended you to utilize it heavily throughout your first time through the main game, as just picking up the game and playing it is pretty rough. But if you're going to play the vanity game and go for S-ranks across the board in challenge mode, well...prepare to suffer.

Side note: I've been reviewing the requirements for S-ranking the two actual operations in part 3, and it looks like I need to knock at least twenty seconds off 2-1 (Dormant Ability, the spleen thing) as well as entirely skip Angie's conversation, as well as knock almost a full minute off 2-4 (Awakening, the aneurysm thing). Also they spelled "aneurysm" wrong in the text.

Part 4 may feature a special guest as a pharmacist, depending on his availability. Hoping to have that up around Thursday!

shibbotech fucked around with this message at 03:58 on Jun 21, 2016

Space Kablooey
May 6, 2009


The reason that the head surgeon doesn't use the Healing Touch anymore is that the patient's life insurance probably didn't cover death from anime bullshit magic and the hospital had to pay they asses out of that malpractice lawsuit. :v:

Skippy Granola
Sep 3, 2011

It's not what it looks like.
Fun fact, the hospital used to be called St. Cenobite's

GeminiSun
Feb 16, 2011




The aneurysm operation was what did me in. I don't do well with difficulty cliffs or strict time limits, or both at once, or both at once while an imaginary person's life hangs in the balance. Way too much stress for my delicate little heart.

Thanks for doing this LP, Shibbo. Now I can experience Derek Stiles: Ace Surgeon vicariously through someone who is way the gently caress less stressed out about imaginary surgery than I am.

shibbotech
Aug 21, 2014

I'm Doctor Shibbo, and this is Jackass.
Nap Ghost

GeminiSun posted:

The aneurysm operation was what did me in. I don't do well with difficulty cliffs or strict time limits, or both at once, or both at once while an imaginary person's life hangs in the balance. Way too much stress for my delicate little heart.

Thanks for doing this LP, Shibbo. Now I can experience Derek Stiles: Ace Surgeon vicariously through someone who is way the gently caress less stressed out about imaginary surgery than I am.

Hey, it's quite my pleasure. Part 4's gameplay contains my favorite side character in the game, but also a sudden tonal shift out of the blue. I'm still hoping to have the vid up tomorrow so you can see, but it definitely goes from gameplay stress to storyline stress and marks a gradual descent from "medical action puzzler" to "surprisingly heavy twitchy anime surgery".

HardDisk posted:

The reason that the head surgeon doesn't use the Healing Touch anymore is that the patient's life insurance probably didn't cover death from anime bullshit magic and the hospital had to pay they asses out of that malpractice lawsuit. :v:

This actually makes a disturbing amount of sense by the internal logic of the game itself. Huh. I'm accepting this as canon. And presuming Phoenix Wright was involved with the suit.

As an aside, it looks like parts 4 and 5 will cover the remainder of chapter 2, then I'll see about the operation showcase. I'm hoping to post the rest of chapter two by Saturday or Sunday.

I'd also like to make a bit of an interest check. Would anyone watch a brief side video going over Asclepius in mythology? I like the figure and some of the myths he's in, so it's something I was kicking around doing - a little research and maybe 7-8 minutes of discussion. This wouldn't take priority over the gameplay, though. Lemme know what you think!

ManicVolcanic
Jun 5, 2016
I, for one, rarely pass up a chance to talk about nerd poo poo, so I'd be all sorts of super down for talking about Greek myths and whatnot.

Space Kablooey
May 6, 2009


shibbotech posted:

This actually makes a disturbing amount of sense by the internal logic of the game itself. Huh. I'm accepting this as canon. And presuming Phoenix Wright was involved with the suit.

Wait, it does? What else could it be? :v:

shibbotech posted:

I'd also like to make a bit of an interest check. Would anyone watch a brief side video going over Asclepius in mythology? I like the figure and some of the myths he's in, so it's something I was kicking around doing - a little research and maybe 7-8 minutes of discussion. This wouldn't take priority over the gameplay, though. Lemme know what you think!

Yeah, I'm down with that too.

shibbotech
Aug 21, 2014

I'm Doctor Shibbo, and this is Jackass.
Nap Ghost
I'll keep the interest check going for now, but I'm glad to hear the positive response so far! I really appreciate everyone who's taking the time to stop in and comment; this is a really awesome experience.

Not much to say at this time, since I think the video speaks for itself, but part 4 of the story is up! It marks a very decisive turning point from the mundane to the fictional, but crosses through Depression Valley along the way. The journey has begun, my friends.

Miz Kriss
Mar 17, 2009

It's only an avatar if the Cubs get swept.
And what a journey it will be. :getin:

Miz Kriss fucked around with this message at 04:28 on Jun 24, 2016

Space Kablooey
May 6, 2009


:stonklol:

ZenVulgarity
Oct 9, 2012

I made the hat by transforming my zen

Casually S-ranking on occasion Trauma Center with good chill commentary? Hell yea. :jerky:

GeminiSun
Feb 16, 2011




Haha, wow, gently caress off, Angie. You rag on Derek for his bedside manner and then you go and say the Worst Things Possible to a suicidal patient? Just gently caress right off.

Not that Derek's much better, frankly. I don't know if this is general misunderstanding of depression or just values dissonance (probably both), but wow, me and my depression over here would like to punch all of these characters in the face for talking to the poor kid that way. Jesus. "We wasted our time saving you, go ahead and die you ungrateful poo poo", with a follow-up of "you should be ashamed of yourself for wanting to die, because people care about you"? How about you all EAT MY poo poo. :mad:

.... anyway. :sweatdrop:

And then just, OH, THERE'S A DEATH DOCTOR, all like, casually? What?? WHAT IS THIS GAME. :stare:

This is a fuckin' ride, I tell you what.

shibbotech
Aug 21, 2014

I'm Doctor Shibbo, and this is Jackass.
Nap Ghost

ZenVulgarity posted:

Casually S-ranking on occasion Trauma Center with good chill commentary? Hell yea. :jerky:

Hey hey, glad you're enjoying it Zen! I was legitimately worried while starting this if I could provide entertaining commentary, though it seems like the thread's a fan. Manic's been a blast to work with as well. Hopefully the showcases will fulfill your A/S-ranking needs, as well. I like to keep things pretty chill. No idea if I'll succeed by the end of this game...

GeminiSun posted:

(impassioned and accurate critique of bedside manner in 2-7)

And then just, OH, THERE'S A DEATH DOCTOR, all like, casually? What?? WHAT IS THIS GAME. :stare:

This is a fuckin' ride, I tell you what.

You make many, many salient points there. I personally enjoyed Linda's actual characterization, and that's what made the scene stick out to me - it's genuinely one of the better representations I've seen of someone who's overwhelmed and in the throes of a crisis, without coming across as too blunt or cheesy. Couple that with Angie's outbursts and Derek's efforts to help as best he can (despite his utterly atrocious bedside manner), and it just feels like a very human situation, I suppose. Compared to the occasionally clunky or cliche writing in this game, and it really made these four operations stand out for me as a child.

And yeah, surprise euthanasia guy, awesome. Wonderful. So to recap what we've learned so far: Angie's a 21-year-old nurse. Derek's a 26-year-old rookie surgeon who just finished a residency, and can also operate on everything forever. Derek possesses a power called the Healing Touch, rumored to be descended from Asclepius, the Greek god of medicine, which lets him cure potentially incurable diseases and save patients who should die. Also there are confidential possibly alien things infecting people and a doctor going around killing people who ask for death.

This is chapter 2 of 6.

Part 5 should hopefully be up later this weekend.

GeminiSun
Feb 16, 2011




Yeah, Linda's actual writing is really pretty good, and it makes the terrible bedside manner (and ACTIVE MALICE HI ANGIE) all the more jarring. :psyduck:

Definitely looking forward to part 5, though. If this rate of anime escalation continues... :stare:

hopeandjoy
Nov 28, 2014



GeminiSun posted:

Haha, wow, gently caress off, Angie. You rag on Derek for his bedside manner and then you go and say the Worst Things Possible to a suicidal patient? Just gently caress right off.

Not that Derek's much better, frankly. I don't know if this is general misunderstanding of depression or just values dissonance (probably both), but wow, me and my depression over here would like to punch all of these characters in the face for talking to the poor kid that way. Jesus. "We wasted our time saving you, go ahead and die you ungrateful poo poo", with a follow-up of "you should be ashamed of yourself for wanting to die, because people care about you"? How about you all EAT MY poo poo. :mad:

.... anyway. :sweatdrop:

And then just, OH, THERE'S A DEATH DOCTOR, all like, casually? What?? WHAT IS THIS GAME. :stare:

This is a fuckin' ride, I tell you what.

I'm pretty sure this is pure :japan: values dissonance, as mental health understanding is even shittier there than it is in the west. For one thing, actually seeking help is stigmatized, as it's supposed to stay in the family.

Skippy Granola
Sep 3, 2011

It's not what it looks like.

shibbotech posted:

Hey hey, glad you're enjoying it Zen! I was legitimately worried while starting this if I could provide entertaining commentary, though it seems like the thread's a fan. Manic's been a blast to work with as well. Hopefully the showcases will fulfill your A/S-ranking needs, as well. I like to keep things pretty chill. No idea if I'll succeed by the end of this game...


You make many, many salient points there. I personally enjoyed Linda's actual characterization, and that's what made the scene stick out to me - it's genuinely one of the better representations I've seen of someone who's overwhelmed and in the throes of a crisis, without coming across as too blunt or cheesy. Couple that with Angie's outbursts and Derek's efforts to help as best he can (despite his utterly atrocious bedside manner), and it just feels like a very human situation, I suppose. Compared to the occasionally clunky or cliche writing in this game, and it really made these four operations stand out for me as a child.

And yeah, surprise euthanasia guy, awesome. Wonderful. So to recap what we've learned so far: Angie's a 21-year-old nurse. Derek's a 26-year-old rookie surgeon who just finished a residency, and can also operate on everything forever. Derek possesses a power called the Healing Touch, rumored to be descended from Asclepius, the Greek god of medicine, which lets him cure potentially incurable diseases and save patients who should die. Also there are confidential possibly alien things infecting people and a doctor going around killing people who ask for death.

This is chapter 2 of 6.

Part 5 should hopefully be up later this weekend.

I remember in one episode of M.A.S.H. there was a suicidal soldier, and eventually Colonel Potter is like "YOU WANNA DIE SO BAD, LET ME HELP" and tries to gas him with the nitrous mask. Apparently it worked. I dunno, suicidal ideation is a tricky one to write because there's no one way to fix it.

I agree with Gemini, and with your reaction in the video - Angie was out of line. But I guess she was pretty emotional at the time - she was close to unravelling when she caught Derek outside of the hospital, so maybe that precocious 21 year old wunderkind hasn't quite developed a sense of clinical detachment.

GeminiSun
Feb 16, 2011




hopeandjoy posted:

I'm pretty sure this is pure :japan: values dissonance, as mental health understanding is even shittier there than it is in the west. For one thing, actually seeking help is stigmatized, as it's supposed to stay in the family.

That's what I thought was most likely, yeah. There's just enough of the well-intentioned but Completely Wrong attitude that you also find in the US to make me bristle, but even as I was bristling I was thinking "Okay, yeah, this is Extremely Japan..."

Blastinus
Feb 28, 2010

Time to try my luck
:rolldice:
Crap.
I was wondering how they were going to raise the stakes of this medical drama, but I can't say I was expecting alien invaders, complete with a surgical boss fight. How hard is it to catch those tiny things with stylus controls when they're moving around so much?

shibbotech
Aug 21, 2014

I'm Doctor Shibbo, and this is Jackass.
Nap Ghost

hopeandjoy posted:

I'm pretty sure this is pure :japan: values dissonance, as mental health understanding is even shittier there than it is in the west. For one thing, actually seeking help is stigmatized, as it's supposed to stay in the family.

GeminiSun posted:

That's what I thought was most likely, yeah. There's just enough of the well-intentioned but Completely Wrong attitude that you also find in the US to make me bristle, but even as I was bristling I was thinking "Okay, yeah, this is Extremely Japan..."

I was unaware as to the severity of the stigma against mental illness in Japan - I'm not nearly as up to snuff on other cultures as I should be - so I started doing a little digging into the topic. Even some cursory searching via Google Scholar reveals some really jarring stuff:

"Review of mental-health stigma in Japan" posted:

Regarding knowledge about mental illness, reviewed studies showed that in the Japanese general population, few people think that people can recover from mental disorders. Psychosocial factors, including weakness of personality, are often considered the cause of mental illness, rather than biological factors. In addition, the majority of the general public in Japan keep a greater social distance from individuals with mental illness, especially in close personal relationships.

"Stigma of mental illness in Japan" posted:

In Japanese society, the social expectation is that supervision or caring for people who have disorders associated with loss of mental and behavioural self-control will be borne by the patients or their families. Thus mental illness is not viewed as something that requires professional treatment. The loss of mental self-control is essentially seen as something over which the person is unable to exercise will power. Japanese are socially programmed to feel a sense of shame if they lack this will power. Although treatments are available for many mental-health disorders, almost two-thirds of sufferers never seek help from a health professional.

Edit: it appears that quoting links as sources adds a quote to the end of the links - if you want to read those articles, be sure to delete the trailing quotation mark!

Real talk, I'm fighting my own battle with good ol' 296.33 and it's hard enough in a supportive environment not to feel a sense of shame or failure when that dark weight settles on your shoulders. I can't imagine being in a culture where it's touted as a weakness and an inherent failure of personality or strength to suffer from something beyond your control. Granted, that second link is from 2002 - hopefully the statistic of patients never seeking help has fallen in the past decade and a half. The mescaline article is also interesting, by the by.

On a cheerier note:

Blastinus posted:

I was wondering how they were going to raise the stakes of this medical drama, but I can't say I was expecting alien invaders, complete with a surgical boss fight. How hard is it to catch those tiny things with stylus controls when they're moving around so much?

It's actually not that bad once you get used to it! By far the boss is the worst part of that operation, since she can dive under and go invisible. And yes, it's a she - they refer to the boss as the Queen. Digging them out just requires a really short laceration, and the laser is practically pinpoint, so it's not too rough.

shibbotech fucked around with this message at 03:52 on Jun 25, 2016

Seyser Koze
Dec 15, 2013

Mucho Mucho
Nap Ghost

GeminiSun posted:

And then just, OH, THERE'S A DEATH DOCTOR, all like, casually? What?? WHAT IS THIS GAME. :stare:

Pretty sure a number of mystery authors were doing the exact same storyline far in advance of this. Michael Palmer comes to mind.

GeminiSun
Feb 16, 2011




shibbotech posted:

I was unaware as to the severity of the stigma against mental illness in Japan - I'm not nearly as up to snuff on other cultures as I should be - so I started doing a little digging into the topic. Even some cursory searching via Google Scholar reveals some really jarring stuff:

Real talk, I'm fighting my own battle with good ol' 296.33 and it's hard enough in a supportive environment not to feel a sense of shame or failure when that dark weight settles on your shoulders. I can't imagine being in a culture where it's touted as a weakness and an inherent failure of personality or strength to suffer from something beyond your control. Granted, that second link is from 2002 - hopefully the statistic of patients never seeking help has fallen in the past decade and a half. The mescaline article is also interesting, by the by.

Holy.... what.... :psyduck: I knew it wasn't great over there, but... what......

And yeah, drat - I've only been suicidal at my absolute worst points, but I think growing up in a cultural climate like that would have actually killed me. drat.

(Solidarity fistbump, btw.)

Seyser Koze posted:

Pretty sure a number of mystery authors were doing the exact same storyline far in advance of this. Michael Palmer comes to mind.

It's not so much the existence of a death doctor that surprises me, it's how casually they bring it up. "Well, she seems to be doing better. good thing she came here! If she went to some other hospital she might've gotten euthanized by that death doctor we're only just mentioning for the first time now! :downs:" Like, this topic isn't even worth a sprite change? :psyduck:

ManicVolcanic
Jun 5, 2016

GeminiSun posted:

It's not so much the existence of a death doctor that surprises me, it's how casually they bring it up. "Well, she seems to be doing better. good thing she came here! If she went to some other hospital she might've gotten euthanized by that death doctor we're only just mentioning for the first time now! :downs:" Like, this topic isn't even worth a sprite change? :psyduck:

Not only is it not worth a sprite change, it was Angie's neutral-happy sprite. Just like, oh yeah, super casual, happens all the time.

shibbotech
Aug 21, 2014

I'm Doctor Shibbo, and this is Jackass.
Nap Ghost

GeminiSun posted:

It's not so much the existence of a death doctor that surprises me, it's how casually they bring it up. "Well, she seems to be doing better. good thing she came here! If she went to some other hospital she might've gotten euthanized by that death doctor we're only just mentioning for the first time now! :downs:" Like, this topic isn't even worth a sprite change? :psyduck:

ManicVolcanic posted:

Not only is it not worth a sprite change, it was Angie's neutral-happy sprite. Just like, oh yeah, super casual, happens all the time.

What, you mean you guys didn't know there's an army of Kevorkians running around Angeles Bay? It's like a really awful Russian Roulette - your surgeon might save you, or he might just MDK you on the spot. Who knows. Remember kids, diseases are painful, but exit bags are painless.

Really though, I'm all for the right to die and all that good stuff, but this really is a rather casual plot thread they're tossing out. Rest assured we will get closure on that soon enough, though. And to help expedite that process, why don't we all enjoy update five of the main story? It's a bit short, but we close out chapter two. I've been working on some side stuff as well. Goals for the upcoming week are the Chapter 2 Operation Showcase, the first update of Chapter 3, and a comparison of the first chapter of Second Opinion! I'll also edit the contest rules into the second post of the thread.

ManicVolcanic
Jun 5, 2016

shibbotech posted:

your surgeon might save you, or he might just MDK you on the spot

I'm not sure what MDK means so I'm going to assume it's along the same lines as an RKO

Also, I'm quite pleased with this episode. Things are ramping up and it's certainly about time.

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Blastinus
Feb 28, 2010

Time to try my luck
:rolldice:
Crap.
Just a note for the future, that word Caduceus is actually pronounced cah-doosh-us or cah-doo-see-us. Normally I wouldn't make a big deal over how a word is pronounced, but it seems like it's going to factor in pretty heavily into the story, so I figured I'd nip it in the bud.

ManicVolcanic posted:

I'm not sure what MDK means so I'm going to assume it's along the same lines as an RKO

Murder Death Kill, which is also the name of a pretty fun 3rd-person shooter from a couple decades back. They weren't big on subtlety in the 90's.

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