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some places have native majorities, but then they just treat their minority populations like poo poo whether or not said minorities are also native to the region. though i still think liberia is weird because the ruling (and originally foreign) minority treats the native majority like poo poo. just human nature to punch down, i guess.
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Jun 15, 2016 07:25
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kazr posted:a country where the natives..................are... the population?!?!?!?1/ is there a country like that? i can't think of any where some elite group is not oppressing the gently caress out of native/minority populations
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Jun 15, 2016 07:29
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Dr. Eldarion posted:Is there any country where the population doesn't treat their natives like poo poo? Maybe like somewhere in South America or something? Maybe New Zealand? But that could just be Kiwi propaganda. They're a tricksy people those New Zealanders.
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Jun 15, 2016 07:31
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Gotta hate somebody. 
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Jun 15, 2016 07:40
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Airborne Viking posted:When Canada became a nation, they signed a treaty saying that native bands get free funding from the government in exchange for most of the land. Status indians get nice things like free university (mostly), tax exemptions on reserves, and other random government benefits that would make a libertarian cream their pants. On the other hand they sell cheap smokes.
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Jun 15, 2016 07:49
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We've never forgiven them for casting the norsemen back into the sea. Canada could have been settled by cool Vikings, but instead we got to French and British losers.
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Jun 15, 2016 08:00
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one of my best friends is navajo and grew up on the reservation. that seal of th great navajo nation with the four mountains that mark their territory? they call them their prison walls. their own loving seal is a symbol of their entrapment in a lovely dessert. thats a bit hosed to me
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Jun 15, 2016 08:01
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PallasAthene posted:fake edit: I think someone I met there once mentioned some treaties let the tribes ignore catch limits and fish in some places where other people can't. In those treaties, the local tribes gave up millions of acres of land in exchange for things like special hunting rights on open and unclaimed lands. Since the tribes are sovereign nations, each one defines their own catch limits.
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Jun 15, 2016 08:03
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I think that the fact that natives are racist to non-natives doesn't help.
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Jun 15, 2016 08:29
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MettleRamiel posted:I think that the fact that natives are racist to non-natives doesn't help. Life just isn't fair to the white man.
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Jun 15, 2016 08:38
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As well as literally everything that's been said in the thread (although the idea that Canada hates natives because it jails them a lot and they kill themselves is charmingly backwards), the fact that the FNs made a lot of their treaties with the Crown rather than with Canada means that in theory at least those drat UNTOUCHABLE NATIVES are outside what settlers would think is the proper control of the country where they live. On the other hand I'm not sure the Crown has ever actually done anything for the natives post Canadian independence (or even much before) despite being petitioned constantly.
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Jun 15, 2016 09:27
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Tuxedo Gin posted:is there a country like that? Only one I can think of would be Iceland, which wasn't really populated before the Norse settlers came (except for a few Irish monks, apparently). Since there weren't any natives, they had to treat each other like poo poo instead.
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Jun 15, 2016 09:41
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Facebook Aunt posted:We've never forgiven them for casting the norsemen back into the sea. Canada could have been settled by cool Vikings, but instead we got to French and British losers. Well, consider the circumstances of Norse expansion across the north Atlantic: 1. Iceland was settled in the Viking era by a bunch of assholes who'd been kicked out of mainland Scandinavia for being antisocial. Consider for a minute what it meant to be too antisocial for Viking-era Scandinavia. (And they spent the next several generations feuding and murdering each other, read the sagas some time, they're pretty interesting.) 2. Greenland was settled by some people who got kicked out of Iceland for being assholes. 3. Finally, Vinland was discovered by some misfits who were too ornery to get along with the Greenland assholes. Would you really expect these guys to get along with any natives they found anywhere?
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Jun 15, 2016 09:45
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It doesn't help that the successful native communities look down on the poorer native communities as well. They're still all "native solidarity", but definitely in a "Yes, were all native brothers, but heh... HAHA, don't lump us in with those poors please."
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Jun 15, 2016 09:46
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A lot of canadians are unpleasant, frigid assholes The first time i travelled outside of canada, i was shocked at how friendly and approachable everyone else was by comparison
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Jun 15, 2016 09:53
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Dr. Eldarion posted:Is there any country where the population doesn't treat their natives like poo poo? Maybe like somewhere in South America or something? we've let the welsh and Scots become prime minister at least once
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Jun 15, 2016 10:20
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99% of Canadians are angry that TAX DOLLARS are being wasted, and that the Chiefs are taking the millions the government gives them every year and stealing most of it while letting the Reserves decay and their people suffer. Also, the Reserves are very, very much against government oversight on the way the money is spent. I often teach First Nations youth, and earlier this year one senior told me her plans after graduation. She's basically going to university so that she can return and try to save her community, which she said has been mismanaged and corrupt her entire life 
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Jun 15, 2016 10:21
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littleorv posted:I'm a Canadian Injun. AMA How
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Jun 15, 2016 12:10
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a garbanzo bean posted:Canadians seem really polite otherwise and in the us natives are mostly forgotten or pitied what's the difference cause canadians are racist
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Jun 15, 2016 12:16
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Descend to slumber posted:and are in utter denial about the fact that the residential school system (and other prior attempts at regulating natives) count as an actual genocide.  can we make up a new word that means "murdering millions to wipe them out"? Genocide clearly has lost its meaning! residential schools are not genocide. we could not hide the modern world from these people forever. it wasn't a racist effort that made their way of life irrelevant, it was social progress. we didn't coddle people that wanted to live the lifestyle of an english peasant, we bought their land and made them go work in the cities! native cultures and ways of life were made irrelevant by the modern world a century ago, it doesn't do us or them any good to pretend that they can continue living in the woods or whatever. the arctic natives are the most egregious case, their material seal hunting culture is made irrelevant by food shipments, welfare payments, and modern housing. this means their culture is completely destroyed, children have zero respect for elders hunting traditions (why would you? you don't need seals to survive you can just go to walmart and spend your $20,000 arctic welfare bonus). we keep them up in the frozen hellscape and ship massive amounts of food to them in order to preserve our claimes to arctic sovereignty. there is no other reason for them to be up there! so we are stuck, its a human rights violation to let them live like nomads in the worst poverty imaginable, but it destroys their culture to modernize them!
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Jun 15, 2016 13:13
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Rutibex posted:
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Jun 15, 2016 13:18
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Rutibex posted:
Go look up what residential schools are again and then come back and redo your post
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Jun 15, 2016 13:30
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a garbanzo bean posted:Canadians seem really polite otherwise and in the us natives are mostly forgotten or pitied what's the difference I mean, how many thousands of years without building a single goddam road? Let's be honest, you're pretty fortunate they consider you as higher primates at all and haven't started lockin you up behind bars and charging a loonie a look. It's like you were playing Civ and by the time everyone had a few wonders built and steam ships, you were still fuckin around with spearmen and hadn't connected any cities. You're just lucky they found you guys before they got in to the nuke tree
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Jun 15, 2016 13:32
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Fried Watermelon posted:Go look up what residential schools are again and then come back and redo your post i know what they are. they are not death camps! yeah some people were mistreated, but the goal of the program was not malicious. it was supposed to teach them english and lets them more easily integrate into white communities, which was supposed to be positive. you do realize that education is mandatory today for native children in Canada just like every child right? if the residential schools were a "cultural genocide" than that genocide continues to this day!
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Jun 15, 2016 13:42
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Rutibex posted:i know what they are. they are not death camps! Residential schools were not about education, they were about stamping out a culture thousands of years old in as few generations as possible. They still managed to gently caress things up, though, because priests were still digging shallow graves for children, which goes pretty far beyond mistreated I cannot believe someone is arguing FOR residential schools, the only other time I've seen this happen the person was kicked out of her program (the Devil's Advocate defense didn't hold up)!
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Jun 15, 2016 13:48
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If they wanted to stamp out the culture there were so many better, cheaper and faster ways of doing that, the Russians have made some pretty outstanding innovations in Fueled Air Explosives in the Baltics, while here in the US we seem to prefer selective droning
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Jun 15, 2016 13:53
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Professor Shark posted:Residential schools were not about education, they were about stamping out a culture thousands of years old in as few generations as possible. They still managed to gently caress things up, though, because priests were still digging shallow graves for children, which goes pretty far beyond mistreated i'm not saying they were run well, i just take exception to calling it "genocide", like we are no better than Nazis or something. if we were nazi then we would have killed them all long ago, and no one would care or remember by now! the native cultures were made irrelevant by modernity, we didn't do that on purpose. helping them to adjust as quickly as possible is a noble goal
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Jun 15, 2016 14:05
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Yaawwwnnn
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Jun 15, 2016 14:08
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How
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Jun 15, 2016 14:09
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I like how every conversation about another country still turns into a discussion about america.
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Jun 15, 2016 14:13
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Rutibex posted:i know what they are. they are not death camps! That meant an end to native languages and the imposition of French and English, an end to nomadic agriculture in favour of alloting land and teaching the kids European farming practices, and the dismantling of community relationships. There was also a culture of complete and utter ambivalence about their wards, which is why about one kid in twenty who went to these schools just straight up loving died, let alone all of the physical and sexual abuse that went on which the various churches of the world still have completely not dealt with.
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Jun 15, 2016 14:16
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Are there any countries that treat the previous nations as anything more than 2nd class citizens? I haven't heard of any. The takeaway lesson is: don't lose wars, no matter what.
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Jun 15, 2016 14:21
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notZaar posted:Are there any countries that treat the previous nations as anything more than 2nd class citizens? I haven't heard of any. The takeaway lesson is: don't lose wars, no matter what.
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Jun 15, 2016 14:25
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canada is literally british hitler you heard it here first folks
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Jun 15, 2016 14:25
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should've let them freeze their asses off in the tundra for another three thousand years IMO
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Jun 15, 2016 14:27
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spacetoaster posted:I like how every conversation about another country still turns into a discussion about america. yeah, loving Canada, thinkin' they part of America, lol.
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Jun 15, 2016 14:28
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White Americans are great, because they will gleefully announce to people that they are 1/16 Cherokee (bullshit), but then look down their nose at dark skinned indigenous people from the radical, totally Metal jungle that was the Mayan Empire The only experience I've had with Canadians is that they sure do like to have sex with Mexicans and vice versa It's like that crush you have on the classmate two rows down, but in between you is the guy who sniffs the teachers chair and talks about the Papist Conspiracy all day ElGroucho fucked around with this message at 14:37 on Jun 15, 2016 |
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Jun 15, 2016 14:35
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a garbanzo bean posted:Canadians seem really polite otherwise and in the us natives are mostly forgotten or pitied what's the difference So yeah, pretty much everyone I've worked with since then has been openly racist against natives, what it comes down to is Canadians are just lovely people in general. Or people are just lovely. Probably the latter. CrcleSqreSanchz posted:Yeah, I've been working with Aboriginals now for about a decade, and seeing the sheer desolation we have done to their culture and then expect them to "suck it up" and "become a positive member of our (white) community" is so loving sad. Rutibex posted:i know what they are. they are not death camps! Chocobo fucked around with this message at 14:49 on Jun 15, 2016 |
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Jun 15, 2016 14:47
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No Pants posted:In those treaties, the local tribes gave up millions of acres of land in exchange for things like special hunting rights on open and unclaimed lands. Since the tribes are sovereign nations, each one defines their own catch limits. Makes perfect sense in light of the land they gave up. What doesn't make sense is hating them for it. I used to hear stories all the time about Indians riding down the Puyallup or Carbon rivers in a johnboat with clouds of outboard smoke trailing behind, cutting the lines of every fisherman on the shore with a knife and hand-lining the fish the guy was fighting into the boat so they could cut the eggs out to sell to the Japanese and toss the still-flopping fish right back into the water. And Fish & Game was powerless to stop it because of the treaties. I never saw anything remotely close to it. However, one time an Indian guy saw my friends and I not catching fish with shrimp from Cabela's as bait and came up and showed us how to use a bobber and pink worm to catch steelhead.
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Jun 15, 2016 14:52
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Rutibex posted:i know what they are. they are not death camps! You don't have four kids by any chance, do you? An insane psychopath I know moved to Ottawa recently to dodge child support payments, and he writes long winded harassing text messages just like you do.
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Jun 15, 2016 15:21
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