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Which Thread Title shall we name this new thread?
This poll is closed.
Independence Day 2: Resturgeonce 44 21.36%
ScotPol - Unclustering this gently caress 19 9.22%
Trainspotting 2: Independence is my heroin 9 4.37%
Indyref II: Boris hosed a Dead Country 14 6.80%
ScotPol: Wings over Bullshit 8 3.88%
Independence 2: Cameron Lied, UK Died 24 11.65%
Scotpol IV: I Vow To Flee My Country 14 6.80%
ScotPol - A twice in a generation thread 17 8.25%
ScotPol - Where Everything's hosed Up and the Referendums Don't Matter 15 7.28%
ScotPol Thread: Dependence Referendum Incoming 2 0.97%
Indyref II: The Scottish Insturgeoncy 10 4.85%
ScotPol Thread: Act of European Union 5 2.43%
ScotPol - Like Game of Thrones only we wish we would all die 25 12.14%
Total: 206 votes
[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

 
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OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Blurred posted:

Wtf? How can someone be for national self-determination and independence from a larger union in one case and then oppose it in another? Like, what reasons do they have for believing that Scotland should remain in the UK that don't conflict with their reasons for the UK leaving the EU? Apart from them just being vicious, self-interested dumb cunts of course?

They're British Nationalists, which means they're not in favor of independence as a concept, they're in favor of British Supremacy, which means 1. Britain must be preserved, and 2. Britain shouldn't be doing anyone any favors.

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OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Lady Galaga posted:

Hmm yes lets stay in this failing union because apparently Scotland wanting to have decisions about how Scotland is ran and not be dictated by England is nationalism

The sky isn't falling because Article 50 hasn't been triggered yet. Scotland will get their independence referendum soon enough, there's a lot on the line to get the ball rolling again before London companies decide to gently caress off to Paris/Frankfurt for good. I'm sure there's demand from people to move their HQ to Edinburgh over Europe once it happens too.

You are right though, more nationalism isn't the solution. Perhaps you can be the one to tell that to the boys down in England.

Pot, kettle.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

That may also be as a result of Scotland being 95% white.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

A Buttery Pastry posted:

Well, England is having hate crimes targeted at white people too, so that wouldn't be the sole explanation I don't think.

As in, Scotland is overwhelmingly white british. I think about 94%

While this hardly precludes the commission of hate crimes it does mean that you'll have to work about 3 times as hard to find someone to do a hate crime on than in England.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

They aren't terribly good recorded either.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

CommissarMega posted:

Alestorm is the best thing to come out of Scotland and you know it :colbert: Yes, above even Gloryhammer.

They get full marks for effort but I've never heard anything by them that I'd actually listen to.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Jedit posted:

I think Alestorm are the Scottish equivalent of the Dropkick Murphys. This is not a compliment.

As twee as they are I actually do like a couple of dropkick murphys songs.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

The chorus of minds within the shell of Gove are all attempting to experience the event at the same time.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Gordon Brown isn't especially evil.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

She doesn't look very much like hitler.

I'm disappointed, I was hoping the point of a miss hitler competition would be to see who could make you sexually attracted to the fuhrer.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Schottland ist ein BerlinerEuropa.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

The watch automatically sets itself to GEMT and cannot be changed.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

I mean it's not like British nationalists have better tat.



I want a 3 foot tall nazi saluting queen in my front garden.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Regarde Aduck posted:

There is a difference between being hosed under the Tories and hosed under the SNP within the EU. The Tories will make sure the poorest bare the brunt of Brexit's downsides.

I mean that's sort of what the EU's doing to Greece.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Scottish notes are not legal tender in the united kingdom either, the bank of england just accepts them.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Almost as good as when Grave Digger sung about it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nb93QbUGcL0

Germany of course having more actual representation in the Scotland/England tiff.

OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 16:07 on Jul 18, 2016

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Who's up for declaring ScottishGreater Faroese Peninsulan inependence?

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Looking forward to Coohoolin writing the relevant additional verse to the buggery on the oresund song.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Baron Corbyn posted:

Owen Smith being opposed to the Barnett Formula is hardly surprising considering he's Welsh and we get hosed by it. Though considering how little Welsh politicians ever seem to speak up for Welsh interests and how little Welsh people are interested in politics to realise how much they're getting hosed and actively chose to gently caress themselves even harder in the EU referendum, I wouldn't be surprised if there were a different motivation to his opposition to it.

He probably opposes it because he's centrist/red tory shite.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Statistically she's right, as far as I know.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Extreme0 posted:

In terms of trading? Yes sort of...at the moment.

I mean in terms of remain/leave being a particularly strong issue for yes/no voters.

As far as I'm aware the EU is largely a non issue as far as yes/no goes, and does not enormously correlate with either position, thus the yes/no decision is still about as accurate as it was before; without anything approaching consensus.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Bagsy I told you so?

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Statistically the poll would suggest that there's broadly very little change on the subject.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

I wasn't aware that marrying late caused birth defects?

Like is it retroactive? If your parents have unmarried and then get married do you get birth defects when you're a teenager?

Does it have to be marrying each other? If your parents split and remarry individually do you suddenly collapse at work?

OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 20:44 on Aug 2, 2016

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

keep punching joe posted:

Reporting Scotland struggles for content because all it reports on are murders, and some rather shallow coverage of Holyrood. I'd hope that with a wider scope and much higher budget they could do something more comprehensive. The BBC in London would still exist and the hypothetical Scottish Six would have access to correspondents and video features that they can slot in amongst their own content.

They could perhaps ease that difficulty by inserting extra Rs into the word "murder". Make each one go a little bit further.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Extreme0 posted:

You might think he's doing a forced smile but that flag is really loving heavy and he is using every bit of his strength to keep it up.

He always looks like that when he smiles, he's a good tennisman but he doesn't photograph well.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013


Unusually Correct for Kez, that.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Extreme0 posted:

The Blairite that wants Corbyn gone is a socialist? loving hardly.

I did say it was unusual.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

I kind of want to see an English version of the National.

Like, not the English equivalent, which would be something the EDL would put out, but specifically that sort of front page but about people rolling cheeses down hills and the dangers of excessive crumpet eating.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

I'm reminded of this.

Though I personally would much rather eat oats than haggis.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

I like sausage and black pudding, as well as liver, I've just not found a haggis that tasted very good, usually crappy meat and too much pepper.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Coohoolin posted:

Unfortunately the barrage of baseless SNP BAD stories will help poo poo like this slink away under the radar. Criticising the SNP is no longer effectively possible in a wider context because the onslaught of bullshit accusations have inured people to accurate critique.

I'm... not sure the best takeaway from SNP affiliates being shitters is "well the real problem is that people criticize the SNP too much and that means people can't take criticism seriously!"

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013



I'm not sure I approve of this irresponsible use of time travel tbh.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

If you pulled down the rigs and scrapped the boats you could temporarily restart Scottish Steelmaking.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

At the rate we're going a free cardboard box for every baby might be enough to destabilize the housing market, that box might be worth £300/mo in rent by the time they're 18.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Leggsy posted:

God forbid we do anything that might actually reduce consumption, lest it affect middle-class student drinkers.

EDIT: I'd like to see what policy you lot would put forward as an alternative that is equally supported by statistical and case evidence. Or are we going to fall back on the old chestnut of "education", which works fine as a buzzword but does gently caress-all to actually help people.

Minimum pricing sounds like a roundabout way of saying "poor people can't be trusted with alcohol"

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

If you just ban all the bad things people will bootstrap themselves into being upstanding middle class citizens I'm sure.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

The NHS exists because the alternative is that the poor do not get healthcare, it has absolutely nothing to do with choice.

And the proposal hinges on removing access to alcohol, it is prohibitionist, it is merely not universally prohibitionist, much like most drug laws are not, because the wealthy can in practice, simply ignore them.

You are correct in that a government has a duty to provide for the welfare of its population but I require it to come up with a better policy than "large amounts of alcohol can only be entrusted to those of sufficient means" in which I see no significant distinction from gin laws.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Because I'm sure they needed a price hike to start considering that, I'm sure that their life is an ideal vacuum in which nothing but beer and beer money exists and there are no other contributing factors.

People drink, as they do many unhealthy things, because they extract a perceived benefit from it. People who do unhealthy things compulsively probably do not have a great deal of agency in the matter, and beating them with a stick for their actions will not be educational, beneficial, or humane.

If your society drives people to self harm, the championed response should not be "well just make razor blades expensive."

OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 01:56 on Oct 26, 2016

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OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

baronvonsabre posted:

I know ideological purity is very important to you, but just look for a moment at what you're arguing for. Cutting the price of alcohol and cigarettes not only increases the number of people who die due to them, that increase comes disproportionately from the less privileged.

I mean if we're suggesting that our respective policies are but one part of a wider change i would be 100% in favour of dropping all consumption duties and just instituting a massive wealth tax and then doing whatever you need to do to reduce consumption-based health complaints without banning or restricting access to any of the causes.

Because again, none of these taxes make any difference to the wealthy, and yet we are not, presumably, concerned about the enormous early mortality rate among people who have access to infinite drink and drugs.

I really cannot find a rebuttal to the idea that pricing or banning people out of access to substances is anything but moralizing, or in the very very best case, a miserably stopgap employed by a pathetic excuse for a government until they can find something better.

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