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lilljonas posted:To me it is baffling to see how you can sacrifice all your other political ideals on the alter of making life harder for brown people, but then, many voters don't think about how things will actually turn out when the parties start to haggle with each other. And it is so incredibly obvious that Jimmie will be ready to sell out every single molecule of their party programme that Ulf doesn't like in exchange for a carte blanche for implementing the worst possible immigration-related policies. I am not so sure of that, SD economical program is in the middle of S&M, and M was frustrated during last autumn because SD was not that interested in their lower taxes approach. And M will be as dependent on SD as the opposite, especially if SD ends up as the larger party. But sure, I believe SD is willing to sell out on this very issue which is their basis for existing. lilljonas posted:This is a very dishonest remark. You said that we currently have an unprecedented level of immigration now, a common talking point from the right of why a sudden halt to all immigration is necessary. It was pointed out in the thread that you are wrong, and that immigration has actually decreased since a peak in 2015-16, half a decade ago. Then you turn it into a smug "oh you say immigration is zero now?". This is strawmanning bullshit. Be better. It is all a question about time scale as SCBs graphs show. Compared to 2015-2016, yes, it is lower, compared to 90-00, it is ~2x. 1 million immigrants in 20 years is still a number. But immigration is crap at the moment for many reasons, none which have really been resolved since 2015. The whole immigration/asylum process needs to be more stratified so that those in desperate need gets asylum and qualified labor gets visa (a major problem where I work, since apparently a PhD doesn't automatically qualify for a visa). TheFluff posted:Exactly, most of the voter base agrees, so I'm not sure what you're even trying to argue at this point? I pointed out that specifically when it comes to these questions of financing and regulation, the opposition is at odds with a large majority of the voter base. In response you said that private schools aren't going away, which to me is almost a non-sequitur. I mean, yeah, just like a lot of other thread regulars I'm opposed to private schools in general, but that's entirely unrelated to the opposition doing poorly in the polls. You can be against the current financing system of private schools and still support private schools. The playing field should be leveled so that they compete on the same level, which is clearly not the case. TheFluff posted:I don't think Svenonius et al is as local an issue as you seem to think either, BTW. It's had more impact in Stockholm specifically, sure, but people complain a lot about Stockholm local news being disproportionally represented in national news for a reason. Svenonius is hardly ever mentioned in Sydsvenskan and I honestly care more about Copenhagen than Stockholm. So it is a local thing, but like in every other country, people in a capitol think their issues are general for a country. Postorder Trollet89 posted:As a working teacher who has been employed both in public and private schools in Sweden i'll chip in. If private schools go away, parents will move to communes with schools that are good. As far as I see it, my kids will go to communal schools since where I live, they are doing well on a national perspective. Which is a pulling factor to move where I live. There are a whole lot of parents moving out of Malmö once they hit 30 and gets kids. Or to put it like this, I can easily be against private schools since abolishing them won't affect me at all  Also see Zudgemuds response below, which I agree with. Zudgemud posted:I'm at least very aware that it does not lower segregation, it's more a way out of bad school districts for those that have the time, money and will to do it (realistically middle-class). Without it I'm pretty sure my "utsatta område" would become even more unattractive for new middle class families because then they would be forced to send their kids to one of the aforementioned lovely schools, and segregation would not improve either. Zudgemud posted:I would say that it is the exact same thing in Swedish miljonprogram areas, they are often placed a bit off from the "main" city population centers which makes it harder to commute to a different school district. Which is why I'm currently in favor of bussing kids around to force integration and break up the self-reinforcing status of bad neighborhoods. In Stockholm and Gothenburg, this is the case. Not so in Malmö, where they have shutdown communal schools that underperformed to bus students around, which have really not solved anything. The underperformance is interesting given that schools in segregated areas gets twice the money of the richer districts, while still continuing to being worse. Bussing kids around is from my point of view the same kind of solution as the old-fashioned "we put the rowdy boy right next to the quiet nice girl in the hope that he will calm down". From a personal perspective, I detest this approach since I have seen it first-hand. I grew up in a small-town outside of Malmö, where I went to school with kids from varying backgrounds (and since it was the 80-90s, almost entirely ethnic Swedes). Being the kid that was good in school was not always the easiest thing. So for my kids, deciding to move to a place where my kids will go to school with other kids whose parents are also well-educated was an easy thing to do. Cardiac fucked around with this message at 17:45 on Aug 24, 2022 |
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Aug 24, 2022 17:31
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Cardiac posted:I am not so sure of that, SD economical program is in the middle of S&M Safeword.
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Aug 24, 2022 17:33
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Rust Martialis posted:Safeword. Phrasing.....
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Aug 24, 2022 17:46
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Postorder Trollet89 posted:We also don't want Nazis in government agencies, and if MP goes that's a goddamn garantuee. Right now it's looking like they're gonna make it but I'm seriously concidering 1x MP vote for parliament. I think it's totally great that we've ended up in the same god drat "lesser of evils" catch 22 moment that they got in the US.
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Aug 24, 2022 18:07
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A combination of bussing and intense resource redirection is typically what works. Also like most teachers I wanna get rid of EO, Elevombudsmannen and allow for better disciplinary action. Having different classmates does affect results somewhat, but so does the social envorment at home. If you live in a 3 room apartment where mom and dad speak somali to you and your 4 silblings, it doesnt matter quite as much where you go to. The problem with private schools is a combination of several factors. I'll list some here that are common talking points in teacher unions: * Schools are organised and run/financed at the municipal level (kommunerna) which screws with funding and coordination, especially in big cities. * Perverse financial incentives and rentseeking behavior from big capital leads to less teacher density (to increase profit margins) and a selection bias for privileged students (upper middle class kids). * Near unlimited free choice and queue times makes the two above factors alot worse. * Municipal corruption leads to school buildings in right wing municipalities being sold for a fraction of their value to private interests. * Public schools have to maintain staffing for a set number of students, private ones do not. Despite this private schools get the same or more funding per student as public ones. This incentivises poorer municipalities to seek out private options so that they can better balance their budget. * Funding is tied to grades (outcomes), not needs. This reinforces grade inflation and selection bias, to attract more privileged kids. * No laws or regulations exist that dictate how much money must be spent on the schools themselves (basically, there is no profit tax). Postorder Trollet89 fucked around with this message at 18:29 on Aug 24, 2022 |
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Aug 24, 2022 18:22
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Cardiac posted:If you don't know what it is, you have some very basic catching up to do. quote:It is all a question about time scale as SCBs graphs show. Compared to 2015-2016, yes, it is lower, compared to 90-00, it is ~2x. quote:Which is a pulling factor to move where I live. There are a whole lot of parents moving out of Malmö once they hit 30 and gets kids. quote:The underperformance is interesting given that schools in segregated areas gets twice the money of the richer districts, while still continuing to being worse.
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Aug 24, 2022 19:12
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EL won't join R in making "No concentration camps in loving Rwanda" a dealbreaker before the election. Please let me know if anyone worth voting for ever surfaces in this blighted nation again.
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Aug 24, 2022 20:07
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Cardiac posted:I am not so sure of that, SD economical program is in the middle of S&M, and M was frustrated during last autumn because SD was not that interested in their lower taxes approach. white flight/fright is cool and good, agreed op
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Aug 24, 2022 20:18
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Postmord must have misplaced my röstkort this time around. Gotta order a new one i guess.  They really can't do anything right this year.
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Aug 24, 2022 20:22
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If you vote in advance you don't need it, just show ID and they'll print it for you at the advance polling station. BTW I saw a claim recently that the thing where they let you change your mind on election day even if you've already voted in advance is apparently an extremely rare if not downright unique feature?? I have no idea if it's true or not but surely there must be other places doing it?
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Aug 24, 2022 20:36
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Cardiac posted:You can be against the current financing system of private schools and still support private schools. Obviously, but this is still completely unrelated to the question we were discussing though???
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Aug 24, 2022 20:40
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Had spare time to went ahead and voted today. Let me tell any other Malmö goons - whenever you think Caroli can't get any bleaker, it outdoes itself
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Aug 24, 2022 20:40
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TheFluff posted:If you vote in advance you don't need it, just show ID and they'll print it for you at the advance polling station. Hmm pretty sure it was the other way around but I'll look it up. Seems you can get it by pdf now anyway so.
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Aug 24, 2022 20:48
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Threadkiller Dog posted:Hmm pretty sure it was the other way around but I'll look it up. Seems you can get it by pdf now anyway so. I guess it's possible they might've changed it this year, but I'm pretty sure they haven't. In both of the last two elections I've voted when I happened to be passing by an advance polling station and went "I guess I might as well get that done huh".
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Aug 24, 2022 20:52
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TheFluff posted:I guess it's possible they might've changed it this year, but I'm pretty sure they haven't. In both of the last two elections I've voted when I happened to be passing by an advance polling station and went "I guess I might as well get that done huh". Yeah I usually do it the same way, but always with my röstkort so never really thought much of it beyond that. In 20 years of voting I've never actually voted on election day!
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Aug 24, 2022 20:54
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Beeswax posted:Had spare time to went ahead and voted today. Let me tell any other Malmö goons - whenever you think Caroli can't get any bleaker, it outdoes itself
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Aug 24, 2022 20:55
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On the 11th of September, I am going to put on a nice shirt, take a brisk walk to my local polling station with a smile on my face, and vote eleven times for Nyans.
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Aug 24, 2022 20:56
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Beeswax posted:Had spare time to went ahead and voted today. Let me tell any other Malmö goons - whenever you think Caroli can't get any bleaker, it outdoes itself Putting a mostly empty outlet sports clothes shop in the previously empty half of the mall... kinda made it look even more empty.
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Aug 25, 2022 08:22
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TheFluff posted:Are you being dense on purpose
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Aug 25, 2022 08:34
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norwegian centrist press' new favourite thing is to call people basically traitors for wanting export restrictions it's a brave new world where the hallmark of solidarity is to sell one's resources indiscriminately to the highest bidder, and refusing to do so is aiding putin
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Aug 25, 2022 10:45
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Örebro now Parallel lines converging in this man's face 
Rust Martialis fucked around with this message at 13:15 on Aug 25, 2022 |
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Aug 25, 2022 13:12
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I rather liked Örebro when I was studying there a few years back, dunno if whatever issues they have at hand can be handwaved away with “A BILLION DOLLARS!”
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Aug 25, 2022 13:37
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Looks like S might've found their wedge issue for the election. Nevermind cost of living or the energy crisis, some girls are wearing cloth on their heads. S is well known to take a tough stance on the mistreatment of young girls, to which I'm sure the Foreign Minister will attest. https://nyheder.tv2.dk/politik/2022-08-25-s-har-tidligere-vaeret-imod-torklaedeforbud-men-vil-nu-se-pa-det Also lol at some of the names in that commission. Halime Oguz and Mehmet Necef, both offering very neutral perspectives, I'm sure.
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Aug 25, 2022 14:15
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There are only two voting issues worth anything in Danish politics. The racist vote and the stupid vote. Anyway, as far as comparisons to SD in Sweden goes, DPP, for 25+ years, always had a stated economic politic about conserving the welfare state, being supportive of the big healthcare areas and in particular and old people and working class people. They never ever ever actually cared about any of that, and sacrificed every principle and political goal on the alter of ‘gently caress brown people, especially muslims’. That is now a completely mainstream political position in Denmark. Top 10 strictest immigration laws in the world and being tough on immigration it’s STILL the most important topic in every election we have.
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Aug 25, 2022 18:51
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BigglesSWE posted:I rather liked Örebro when I was studying there a few years back, dunno if whatever issues they have at hand can be handwaved away with “A BILLION DOLLARS!” it will cost a lot more than that to fix the main issue (too flat)
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Aug 25, 2022 19:11
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Megamissen posted:it will cost a lot more than that to fix the main issue (too flat) [cries in Malmö södra innerstad]
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Aug 25, 2022 19:30
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Revelation 2-13 posted:Top 10 strictest immigration laws in the world and being tough on immigration it’s STILL the most important topic in every election we have. But the government's fair and evenhanded commission included that woman who'd make Naser Khader blush and the guy who doesn't see any signs of racism in this country where more than 1/4 wants to expel all Muslims, obviously their policy is grounded in a scientific and facts-based approach.
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Aug 25, 2022 21:39
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So the guy who stabbed Ing-Marie Wieselgren apparently now admits Annie Lööf was the target?
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Aug 25, 2022 22:02
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Nu börjar gnället på Norge. https://svenska.yle.fi/a/7-10019955 quote:Också på hemmaplan finns det de som argumenterar för en större solidaritet med Europa. Parlamentsledamoten Rasmus Hansson från landets miljöparti, MDG, skriver i en kommentar i tidningen Klassekampen att det bästa Norge kan göra är att reducera gaspriserna. Lol annars...
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Aug 26, 2022 06:44
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Bytter det mot at EU gir bindende aksept for at det er helt greit at vi regulerer strømeksporten selv. Det er verdt en vinter med makspris på gass. Men å bare gi uten å få noe til gjengjeld er uakseptabelt.
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Aug 26, 2022 07:02
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We'll have to invade norway within 50 years anyway to take their stuff
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Aug 26, 2022 07:47
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Cardiac posted:In Stockholm and Gothenburg, this is the case. Not so in Malmö, where they have shutdown communal schools that underperformed to bus students around, which have really not solved anything. The underperformance is not that strange considering that schools in these areas have a hard time retaining personnel (despite comparatively good wages) which really hampers learning and the amount of help the kids can get from home is often low. Add to that some language problems and all other extra costs that come from accommodating students that have for one reason or another not successfully completed the previous years schooling. Cardiac posted:Bussing kids around is from my point of view the same kind of solution as the old-fashioned "we put the rowdy boy right next to the quiet nice girl in the hope that he will calm down". Putting all the rowdy kids from the same area in the same local schools is still poo poo though, and puts all the problems that these kids cause on the on the neighboring families that have the least means to do something about the situation. And, as is evident from today, those with the means will continue to self segregate from these areas and integration will continue to be terrible because the rich Swedish parts of town are never forced to interact with the other immigrant heavy parts of town. fnox posted:So the guy who stabbed Ing-Marie Wieselgren apparently now admits Annie Lööf was the target? She was a target, he had a list. Collapsing Farts posted:We'll have to invade norway within 50 years anyway to take their stuff So will it be the Swedish caliphate defence forces, the SD friekorps or the Sapmi jaeger confederation that first goes to war over the collapsed cod populations, depleted oil fields and junkies?
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Aug 26, 2022 08:48
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From the so-called "Commission for the Forgotten Women's Struggles" that proposed the school hijab ban: We must help them, but not too much.
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Aug 26, 2022 11:08
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Baudolino posted:Bytter det mot at EU gir bindende aksept for at det er helt greit at vi regulerer strømeksporten selv. Det er verdt en vinter med makspris på gass. this stuff drives me up a wall. people are talking about "solidarity" as though the EU is just going to see how nice we are and be nice in return when we need a hand. some kind of deal is fine, this "oh we should be good people and not look out for our own interests" thing is completely ridiculous and very end-of-history-brained
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Aug 26, 2022 11:29
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lol speaking of hos bad M, and especially Ulf Kristersson is, the latest polling show them falling drastically in support and that Sd is now overtaking them. gently caress my life that Swedes are so ok with outright racism, but it's also hilarious when the borgerliga keep eating themselves while pushing the overton window towards authoritarianism. https://www.dn.se/sverige/dn-ipsos-moderaterna-tappar-stort-sd-nast-storst/
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Aug 26, 2022 14:05
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lilljonas posted:lol speaking of hos bad M, and especially Ulf Kristersson is, the latest polling show them falling drastically in support and that Sd is now overtaking them. gently caress my life that Swedes are so ok with outright racism, but it's also hilarious when the borgerliga keep eating themselves while pushing the overton window towards authoritarianism. Absolutely: https://www.aftonbladet.se/ledare/a/XqxLJ7/jag-verkar-ha-fatt-ratt-om-von-papen Ulf Kristersson Von Papen is gonna make the history books for all the wrong reasons.
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Aug 26, 2022 14:13
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Postorder Trollet89 posted:Absolutely: Very nice editorial. Pro click as they say
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Aug 26, 2022 17:00
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Postorder Trollet89 posted:Absolutely: Ah, the Tucker Carlson of Sweden. He is a mouthpiece for S, who owns the editorial part of Aftonbladet.
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Aug 26, 2022 17:46
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I'm not sure you can be the Tucker Carlson of anything if you're left wing. You need a better comparison here. Surely there's a bought left-wing pundit out there to compare him to
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Aug 26, 2022 17:59
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Cardiac posted:Ah, the Tucker Carlson of Sweden. cardiac being factually wrong?  LO (the trade union confederation) owns 9% of the shares of aftonbladet and may veto the appointment of political editors. they do not have any further influence and definitely do not "own" the editorial part of the paper. LO isn't the social democratic party either, but I'm not really gonna quibble about that given how close they are. like, the paper openly describes its editorial position as "independent social-democrat" so it's not exactly surprising that it publishes editorials that are mostly in line with what the social democrats think. it's not exactly a conspiracy. is your position just that it should be rejected purely on the grounds that it's something that S would agree with??? also, tucker carlson?! loving lmao
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Aug 26, 2022 22:20
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