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Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

At this point, Mudman abruptly ends the conversation. He usually insists on the last word.
banjo music, showtunes, riverdance

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Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

At this point, Mudman abruptly ends the conversation. He usually insists on the last word.
maybe not Irish or Italian explicitly but there are still weird Anti-Catholic pockets

Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

At this point, Mudman abruptly ends the conversation. He usually insists on the last word.

icantfindaname posted:

Anglo-Saxons Irish were still considered Caucasian, aka White

I think its reductive to think being caucasian is the measuring stick of whiteness

I mean, at this point most Americans wouldn't consider Turks white

Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

At this point, Mudman abruptly ends the conversation. He usually insists on the last word.

icantfindaname posted:

Turks aren't considered white because of their religion/culture, not their skin color.

that's my point

white isn't a racial descriptor its a fluid cultural one

Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

At this point, Mudman abruptly ends the conversation. He usually insists on the last word.

icantfindaname posted:

It's not especially fluid though, it means 'Caucasian Christian or Jew'. Caucasian is a requirement, Muslim gets you booted. Subcontinental Indians or East Asians are never going to be considered white no matter how integrated into society they are, for example

Jews being white is incredibly contemporary. Whiteness is basically a designation of highest privilege in the American caste.

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Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

At this point, Mudman abruptly ends the conversation. He usually insists on the last word.

icantfindaname posted:

I think we're just talking past each other about race vs ethnicity, I don't think we disagree. But this is a dumb discussion to begin with

fair enough

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