|
HEY GAL posted:funny how that works out Even though I've more or less left the Southern Baptist church I grew up in, I still strongly believe in the core ideas and principles of Baptist belief and practice. I just can't tolerate how deeply the Southern Baptist Convention has become tied up in right-wing American politics. Fully accepting (i.e. into positions of leadership in the church) women has become something of an issue for me, as has welcoming LGBT people in the church. Fortunately I'm a Protestant so I haven't had any trouble finding churches of other denominations that are "Eh, close enough, I don't really care about the fine details anyhow." 
|
#
¿
Oct 22, 2016 14:34
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ May 12, 2024 15:09 |
|
|
HEY GAL posted:i was not kidding when i said you and Man Whore might enjoy having a study group / prayer group over PMs or something. you know--at least there's two of you I'm getting ready to move again in a couple of weeks for a new job, so it will be time to start church shopping all over again.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 22, 2016 14:44
|
|
|
Pellisworth posted:When new ideas enter a denomination's thought-stream, the chuch begins to correct itself. Let me use this example: Imagine four congregations on the edge of a cliff. Say a direct copy of the congregation nearest the cliff is sent to the back of the line and takes the place of the first congregation. The formerly first one becomes the second, the second becomes the third, and the fourth schisms off the cliff. 
|
|
#
¿
Oct 23, 2016 23:32
|
|
|
Well, I'm officially moving into a new city at the end of the week to start my new job. Time to start church shopping once again.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 1, 2016 22:31
|
|
|
System Metternich posted:All the best! Thank you.  Everything's set up and scheduled for the move, so if all goes well I'll be starting work at my new job on Monday. Besides the general anxiety and stress about the move and starting a new job (oh please God don't let me screw up, mainly), it will be time to hopefully find a church I'm happy with. Google maps has turned up a bunch of various denominations, so it looks like I won't be spoiled for choice. Maybe one of them will even have people my own age.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 2, 2016 04:26
|
|
|
shame on an IGA posted:I'm in the deep south and want to show explicit dismembership from the community I'm in the deep south and have a very different idea of Christianity from many people in the deep south.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 2, 2016 21:01
|
|
|
  
|
|
#
¿
Nov 8, 2016 00:38
|
|
?
|
Just spent about ten minutes broken down and praying.  I just don't understand how this could have happened. The next four to eight years are going to be awful, plus the long-lasting damage the GOP-controlled supreme court and congress will do. And the inevitable wars Trump will get us into, which have a real risk of going nuclear.I just don't understand.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 9, 2016 13:26
|
|
|
It was good I was busy at my new job all day, didn't have time to think about this and get depressed. As it is, congrats on the engagement Heigal!
|
|
#
¿
Nov 10, 2016 00:49
|
|
|
Caufman posted:I also like a gathering of two or three in the name of Jesus, even on the internet. You're not. Trump cares about nothing except himself, a clinical narcissist of the first order. Hillary, on the other hand, is a devout Methodist.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 13, 2016 00:47
|
|
|
Lutha Mahtin posted:as with much in religion, it is not primarily the thing itself which has significance, rather it is the meaning behind the gesture. and i think you are right to question what the heck is going on in a country where its citizens overwhelmingly claim to be christian, yet millions and millions of these people did not react in laughter to the ham-handed religious appeals made by an orange man The only people here I know who voted Trump out of anything pertaining to religious reasons said they don't like Trump himself but voted GOP due to the Supreme Court - they believed they had an obligation to vote for the party that opposes abortion, homosexuality, transgenderism, etc. There was a nice old lady at church who said she adored Hillary and thought she'd be a much better president, but she had to vote against Hillary because a Hillary presidency would mean expanded LGBT and abortion support.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 13, 2016 01:13
|
|
|
Valiantman posted:Thanks for this post. I was wondering why "love the sinner, hate the sin" would be bad since it seems to be a very good guideline. In fact I often teach teens about love and morals a bit like that but in a different language obviously, so we don't have the attitude as a common phrase. I suspected there's something I don't understand from behind the cultural/language barrier. In America, "love the sinner, hate the sin" typically translates to "bigotry, but we say it's for your own good," especially when it comes to LGBT issues and abortion.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 13, 2016 18:16
|
|
|
For those unfamiliar with the Protestant take on the saints and Mary, the general Protestant line is that there are only two levels of existence: Man and God. All humans - including Mary - are equal before God. They do not hear prayers, intercede with God, and miracles are God's will and not the mark of a saint or any such thing.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 17, 2016 02:52
|
|
|
The Phlegmatist posted:Like the Trinity? The Baptist spin on the Trinity is that the Trinity as such isn't really talked about, no, but all three aspects are each individually talked about a great deal and spoken of a couple of times by Jesus as a whole. We Protestants go down new and interesting rabbit holes we find looking through the Bible, rather than feeling the need to invent new holes like the idea of saints.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 22, 2016 03:31
|
|
|
Rodrigo Diaz posted:Ty for phrasing this better than I could. Fair enough. :/
|
|
#
¿
Nov 22, 2016 13:07
|
|
|
Pellisworth posted:this thread is at its best when theology discussion merges with tabletop games Yahweh Power: All Title: God Alignment: LG Worshipers: Any Alignment Clerics: Any Alignment Symbol: Cross Domains: Air, Animal, Destiny, Destruction, Earth, Fire, Healing, Knowledge, Law, Plant, Protection, Storm, Strength, Sun, Time, Water Portfolio: Creation, good, law, the universe Favored weapon: Turning the other cheek (Unarmed Strike)
|
|
#
¿
Nov 26, 2016 03:39
|
|
|
Mo Tzu posted:how much of that did you take from ilmater Only things they have in common are LG alignment and Unarmed Strike as favored weapon. I'd look more to Lathander for comparisons, or the Silver Flame if you have good taste in campaign settings.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 26, 2016 03:45
|
|
|
Personally, I see the intellectual appeal of atheism. I generally agree with the sentiment that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and what I and many people see as extraordinary evidence of God is not persuasive to many people. For me personally, though, religion is such an important part of my life that I can't help but see an atheist view of the universe as innately bleak and pointless, something that does not help my recurring struggles with depression. I choose to believe in God partially because atheism is too depressing for me to seriously contemplate.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 28, 2016 13:10
|
|
|
Tias posted:I may be on thin ice here since I'm not an academic, but my dictionary says empirical means "verifiable by observation or experience rather than theory or pure logic.". Observation, perhaps, but it is definitely my experience that God exists and has miraculously healed me from self-destructive behaviour I thought I was going to have for life. (I don't know if you were around for my introduction in the last thread, but I found faith through the auspices of the 12-step program in AA) I agree with this view, but not everyone agrees with what you and I and others consider evidence of God's existence.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 28, 2016 14:41
|
|
|
Deteriorata posted:Essentially, the evidence for the existence of God tends to be almost entirely personal, internal, and non-reproducible. It's enough to convince an individual, but not amenable to controlled studies. Personally, I regard the wonder of the universe and all that science has learned and observed, and the knowledge that it's all barely scratched the surface, as compelling evidence of God. I do not find the arguments that there was no architect, no artist behind it all to be compelling ones. I see science as the greatest evidence there is of God's existence.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 28, 2016 16:41
|
|
|
thechosenone posted:Wait what? poo poo that's pretty cool. I's it alright if I ask stupid questions like what saint or apostle would be most likely to be able to go super Saiyan? I just like connecting things to other things, I'm the kind of person who would love to hear metaphors extended well beyond their welcome. The Triad is an ersatz version of the Holy Trinity. You've got Tyr (God), Torm (Jesus), and Ilmater (the Holy Spirit).
|
|
#
¿
Dec 1, 2016 04:01
|
|
|
pidan posted:But if there is no Satan, who rules in hell? He is, but popular notions of the devil and hell really do go back to Dante and Milton. The Bible barely mentions hell at all.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 1, 2016 13:18
|
|
|
Arsenic Lupin posted:Never trust anybody whose favorite books of the Bible are Revelation and Daniel. Daniel is a fine book, the story of Daniel and the lion's den was one of my favorites as a kid. There's just... really weird parts of the book, too.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 2, 2016 02:20
|
|
|
my dad posted:You are vastly underestimating human children. Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented or determined fool.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 4, 2016 13:43
|
|
|
One day at church camp I was helping load luggage into the church van to go home and dropped a very heavy box on my toes. I was forced to stay completely silent the entire 14 hour drive home and the pastor talked to my parents because I took the Lord's name in vain loudly and repeatedly among other words I wasn't supposed to know or use.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 18, 2016 02:23
|
|
|
I kinda envy y'all for once. Protestantism in the American South has a very strong impulse towards banning alcohol completely.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 23, 2016 17:22
|
|
|
HEY GAL posted:different Protestant. These are Calvinists, not Baptists or Methodists. I know, thus I said Protestantism in the American South, which mostly means the SBC and similar-minded groups.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 23, 2016 17:36
|
|
|
HEY GAL posted:Do you know when and why Baptists became strongly anti-alcohol? It grew out of the temperance movements of the nineteenth century, which were in large part a backlash against the social upheaval and perceived social and moral decay that accompanied the Industrial Revolution and urbanization, and then amplified by the Second Great Awakening and the popular message of striving for holiness and purity in your everyday life. Ready access to alcohol was blamed for not just drunkenness but all manner of social problems, and an outright prohibition movement arose from the Methodists, Presbyterians, Baptists, and American Catholics (believe it or not, one of the biggest early voices in the religious prohibitionism movement was an Irish Catholic priest) - the Lutherans and Anglicans didn't care for it much. The Southern Baptist Convention was a vocal supporter of the Prohibition Amendment, and continues to advocate abstaining from alcohol today, though it is one of only a few large religious organizations that really make a point of it. The Southern Baptist view as a general rule today is that alcohol is not inherently sinful or inimical to being a Christian, but that alcohol impairs one's judgment and generally makes it easier to sin - to say nothing of actual alcoholism and the effects it can have on the self and the community, and thus is best avoided entirely by good Christians.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 23, 2016 17:59
|
|
|
HEY GAL posted:this was the case in the period i study as well A lot of the thinking behind the original religious prohibitionism movement remains in the American South today, because the conditions didn't change all that much. The American South is still one of the most impoverished parts of the industrialized, Western world, and poverty throughout history tends to mean alcohol and drugs are a problem. This is a particularly big deal in African-American communities, the South is the demographic heartland of African-Americans in the United States, and alcoholism is still a severe problem in many black communities. Things aren't much different in poor white communities, and so there's still a religious pushback against alcohol in many parts of the South due to the still ongoing problems from rampant alcohol abuse. That's something I think is important to remember when talking about Southern Baptist views on social issues, and to a certain extent Protestantism in the American South in general: the American South is very rural and very poor, and the SBC is pretty representative of the religions present for those communities. There are areas here and there in the South that are different, like Atlanta and New Orleans and Miami and whatnot, but the bulk of the SBC's membership and leadership come from and are concerned with the the rest of the region. Cythereal fucked around with this message at 18:56 on Dec 23, 2016 |
|
#
¿
Dec 23, 2016 18:53
|
|
|
Merry Christmas, folks.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 24, 2016 22:59
|
|
|
I didn't go to a Christmas Eve service because I've been fighting a really bad cold that's been going around at work. Merry Christmas, all.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 25, 2016 13:27
|
|
|
Wait, Precious Blood? Is this another transubstantiation thing?
|
|
#
¿
Dec 27, 2016 19:21
|
|
|
HEY GAL posted:Yes, God's blood is precious because it's, you know, God's What need does God have of blood? Still, thanks for clarifying. Never heard that specific term before. Cythereal fucked around with this message at 19:41 on Dec 27, 2016 |
|
#
¿
Dec 27, 2016 19:33
|
|
|
HEY GAL posted:i assume jesus's body worked like anyone else's, so to circulate oxygen throughout his body It was a Star Trek V joke. Personally, I agree with the SBC that Jesus was speaking symbolically of the wine being his blood.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 27, 2016 19:51
|
|
|
Mo Tzu posted:yeah i think we gathered that since you're not catholic, orthodox, or high church anglican You never know. I've been to a Baptist (not Southern Baptist, just Baptist) church that believed in transubstantiation. In theory, the SBC also doesn't officially dictate what every member church believes or requires member churches to believe in anything beyond Protestant 101.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 27, 2016 20:02
|
|
|
HEY GAL posted:is there any other kind, really? Anglicans, for one. Diet Catholic. Same great taste, less homophobia and misogyny.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 27, 2016 20:42
|
|
|
Mo Tzu posted:glass houses, SBC I personally don't identify with the SBC much anymore. My theology is still heavily in line, but I can't stomach their misogyny, homophobia, and entanglement in right-wing American politics.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 27, 2016 21:08
|
|
|
Sola Scriptura for the Baptists.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 28, 2016 14:37
|
|
|
Meridian posted:That is one part of Catholicism that really interests me. Seems to be a lot of intercessory prayer and reverence for Mary in general. Much more so than I have been exposed to previously. Thirteen Orphans posted:Something you might find interesting, then: In Catholic Marian theology, Mary has a special place in devotion to Saints. God is afforded worship, known as latria. Only God is worthy of worship. The devotion which is given to the saints is called dulia. The Virgin Mary is the sole recipient of the highest form of devotion to a saint known as hyperdulia. So theologically she is afforded a higher place than the other saints, but in no way is part of the worship due to God alone. *Baptist screaming intensifies*
|
|
#
¿
Dec 29, 2016 17:56
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ May 12, 2024 15:09 |
|
|
Mo Tzu posted:Nice contribution to the discussion Fair enough, should have taken the hint after last time.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 29, 2016 18:51
|
|