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Generation Internet posted:As a matter of accuracy, in the last Black Sea game the Russians came with BMP-3s, which are different than BTR-82s and packed with considerably more high-explosive ammo. here's a fairly high-res version of the area if anyone wants it to draw on: 
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Sep 30, 2016 16:56
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Fray posted:I was just thinking the same about the ATGMs. I wouldn't be surprised to see the enemy go on the offensive since it sounds like their goal is to escape to the edge of the map. Concealed ATGMs would wreck any oh-so-goon-like charges up the highway. Yeah, my inclination is to use the long but covered sightlines in the Northeast to pin down any aggressive pushes up along the middle by deploying ATGM teams with a one company spread for scouting, recon denial, and force protection. Other companies work down the western side. Detached tanks push up the gaps in the woods the open area in the southwest while the infantry does force recon. Armor rolls up from the West and pins their force between the defensive positions in the Northeast and the flanking force. Risks: - how navigable is the western approach, is it too wide of an arc to wheel to be effective - how vulnerable will we be to bombardment fire especially in the defensive positions - how do we minimize/negate their recon advantage from drones - does this spread us too thin?
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Oct 1, 2016 02:47
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Davin Valkri posted:It also looks like they start on the west edge of the map, rather than the SE (as the village objective might suggest), so...yeah, they'd have overwatch over the whole road. Oh, hm. That might change things.
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Oct 1, 2016 02:49
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Gamerofthegame posted:We should charge. loving off through the woods in trucks may be problematic, that's why we need to verify if there are any navigable paths there. I also agree with the sentiment that we should dismount our infantry and use the vehicles as rear support before we engage. However, trying to somehow just do a frontal spearhead assault with a motorized rifle battalion across terrain that consists of a few narrow roads running between massive forests and open swampland feels like a singularly bad idea, especially versus a force of unknown composition but with what is almost certainly a superior core of Abrams or Bradleys who are going to be trying to dominate that open areas as best they can. I think whatever strategy we use should try and take advantage of mobile force to apply threats from multiple directions and redeploy quickly based on resistance we encounter. It might not make sense to do specifically what I suggested earlier (esp. the best allocation of our armored assets) but I think whatever we come up with should be a variation of this approach.
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Oct 1, 2016 15:25
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One thing to ask is "where will we be at +45m and what would be most useful at that point?" If we do a defense-in-depth and slowly falling back along the road while our West flank advances, we probably want something we can counterpunch with to really pin them down. On the other hand, if we try to aggressively push, we will need a larger number of units that we can use to secure an ever widening salient. Then we should consider what we want for the worst case of both of these strategies. We also don't know the exact in-gsme objectives, but it seems like we need to be actively holding/denying that highway crossing if possible. Can we do that with ATGMs and MBTs from the N/NE? Or do we need to push a company S/SW and contest access by controlling the highway from there? Finally, I think the "friendly direction"settings indicate the corridor from which air support (and possibly reinforcements, such as we are getting?) May arrive. Weighting our AA towards the West may be valuable. It Also means we should consider what we want to have in place should a US armored company suddenly show up or something.
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Oct 1, 2016 19:17
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The BMP-3 also has much better optics, and would be more useful as a support vehicle
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Oct 1, 2016 20:32
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abelian posted:Ok, thanks. With those kinds of call-in times, we should probably consider saving a good chunk of our indirect fires instead of using it in a pre-planned barrage. So with that in mind... abelian posted:All right, I've been heads down trying to finish this contour map without any distractions. I finally have a version that doesn't look like complete poo poo. It makes a lot more sense to try and hold the terrain to the west of the crossroads to contest the high ground and block an escape. Second objective should be to contest the crossroads.
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Oct 2, 2016 04:14
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professor_curly posted:I highly advise Coy Commanders take a strong hand here in the beginning at least - we need to be in good columns and get our Pause orders/move out orders right or else this will turn into a 1st class shitshow, like one of those Russian dashcam videos. Sorry, I don't see the problem? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uo4Wv2p62vM e: ohhhh https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuvatlfL8Bs
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Oct 3, 2016 03:36
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 1/2 Orders  Deployment Transports three-in-a-line, platoon command in third transport. Movement - Pause - Travel MOVE across the ford - Travel QUICK up to the road How does this look?  E: modified the delays E2: Updated as per commander's orders E3: MODIFIED THE DELAYS AGAIN Hubis fucked around with this message at 01:53 on Oct 6, 2016 |
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Oct 3, 2016 22:12
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koolkevz666 posted:https://i.imgur.com/WpgNHMR.png I reduced my delay to 30s so we should be OK, but make sure you don't run into 1st platoon
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Oct 3, 2016 23:40
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glynnenstein posted:There is an alternate path but it's rough terrain so slow and pathing is sorta random and unexpected. I would use it outright but I fear getting stuff stuck. Still, some 1st Company platoons have it as an alternate route if the main one is problematic. I had also questioned whether our ostensibly amphibious BTRs could ford the swamp outright, but was led to believe they'd end up bogged down and thus totally stuck. If anyone is able to confirm (or test this out themselves) that would be a great data point as well.
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Oct 4, 2016 17:52
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 Fortunately there won't be any mud around the lakes, or on that one narrow ford...
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Oct 4, 2016 21:50
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I've updated my orders as well
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Oct 5, 2016 01:58
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professor_curly posted:I agree. However I don't think using half our ammunition on a lark to play mind games with NATO is a worthwhile use. THAT is the Or another way to look at it: Why spend our artillery playing guessing games on a 5-minute turn when we could employ it far more effectively with even the sliiightest amount of recon? Especially since we strongly suspect they are going to be playing games in the woods to the south.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:47
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Phi230 posted:so it begins https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKhsPO6yYko
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Oct 6, 2016 23:48
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glynnenstein posted:We're right about on time for delayed barrages to start coming in, so hold that thought! haha Looking at the video, and the trouble the Recon BTRs are having off-roading through even that little bit of woodland by the highway I am wondering if it might be worth either dismounting when we hit the ravine on the south side, or cutting to the hilltop clearing to the west to zip all the way down that flank?
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Oct 8, 2016 01:32
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Is there anything we can do to unfuck 1st Co crossing with wait or slower movement or whatever, or should we just suck it up and let it play out for another 5 minutes?
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Oct 8, 2016 23:06
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This looks real good to me. hopefully we can get some solid Intel soon and pivot more precisely over the next few turns!Generation Internet posted:Gameplay wise you heard nothing besides your own smoke barrage for the entirety of the five turns. To be fair, how are you supposed to hear anything over 100 bogged down diesel engines full of angry hungover Russians all shouting at one another to get out of the way? Hubis fucked around with this message at 05:41 on Oct 9, 2016 |
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Oct 9, 2016 05:37
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professor_curly posted:Sorry if I overstepped things guys. I'll try to take a step back from now on. I think that's fine -- there's not a whole lot going on so general deployment instructions are probably reasonable since we're talking about vague moves. If you want in-fiction justification, we haven't made contact with the enemy yet, so of course battalion command is trying to micromanage everything!  I am sure once the actual shooting starts there will be enough micro decisions that you won't really be ABLE to micro manage anyways. Maybe a good rule of thumb would be to just limit yourself to whatever you can reasonably draw on a 1/4-res version of the map? Alternatively, we should probably make a copy of the map with decent grid coordinates.
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Oct 10, 2016 17:21
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1st Coy / 2nd Platoon 1st Squad Proceed E along the road. ACQUIRE 3 RPG-26, 5 93mm AT rockets, 500 7.62x54R and 500 5.45mm from APC DISMOUNT at point indicated and move S; APC continue E down road and take up position at the corner of the copse of trees looking down the ravine SPLIT SCOUT section off. Scout section proceed quickly to the edge of the woods at the outcropping as indicated, looking SSE down the ravine. Main squad continue further along the woods, then take position at the edge of the woods looking ESE along the ravine. 2nd Squad Proceed S along dirt road to the hilltop, then S along the edge of the woods. ACQUIRE 3 RPG-26, 5 93mm AT rockets, 500 7.62x54R and 500 5.45mm from APC DISMOUNT at point indicated and head SE into the woods SPLIT into sections and position as indicated APC, proceed to indicated position just in the edge of the woods by the path facing SSE 3rd Squad Proceed S along dirt road to the hilltop, then S along the edge of the woods. ACQUIRE 3 RPG-26, 5 93mm AT rockets, 500 7.62x54R and 500 5.45mm from APC DISMOUNT at indicated point and head ESE through woods SPLIT into sections and proceed to the edge of the woods as indicated APC proceed to position indicated within the the edge of the woods facing SE HQ Remain within APC as indicated. Hubis fucked around with this message at 15:51 on Oct 11, 2016 |
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Oct 11, 2016 05:21
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Hubis posted:HQ Mechanics question(s): How critical is C3 with the rules we are using? How important is keeping the Platoon HQ within proximity of the squads here? I kept the HQ inside the APC because there was no real need to move out from there, and I understood it that APCs (might) have better sat-link capability. Does this matter at our EWAR level?
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Oct 11, 2016 15:24
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glynnenstein posted:Pro-level map. I'm going to have to step up my drawing lines game. (I'm using Paint.NET) This will sound complicated, but it's really not -- once you know where the menu options are, the most complicated step (4) is pretty automatic. Doing the actual drawing takes the most time. 1) Trim the background map to however big you need it to be 2) Color-correct it so that the drawing on top is more distinct 2a) Adjustments > Hue/Saturation: Drop saturation to like 70 2b) Adjustments > Brightness/Contrast: increase the contrast by 15 3) Create a new layer. Draw all your orders there 3a) You can use multiple layers as needed, letting you erase/redraw parts more easily. For example, each of my squads are drawn on a separate layer, then merged down to one at the end 3b) Use the Shapes tool (bottom of the tool-bar) to draw some approximation of soviet military map symbols. [I am actually creating a set of custom shapes specifically for this purpose] 3c) Use the line tool w/ arrowheads to draw the paths nice and neatly 3d) Merge your order layers together (if needed) 4) Add a shadow under the orders to make them stand out more 4a) Create a new layer below the Orders layer. Fill it with white 4b) Select the Orders layer, then do "Layers > Duplicate Layer" 4c) Merge the "blank" layer with one of the duplicates, so that you are working on a single layer in the middle 4d) Open the layer properties, set it to "multiply" 4e) Adjustments > Black and White 4f) Adjustments > Levels: Drag the bottom of the slider on the left all the way up to make the lines totally black 4g) Effects > Blurs > Gaussian Blur... -- do a small (2-4px) blur 4h) Adjustments > Levels: Drag the bottom of the slider on the left up or down to get the shadowing contrast you want. A value of 128 works ok 5) Merge all the layers down
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Oct 11, 2016 15:50
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dublish posted:Quoting so I don't lose this. I've been using our Roll20 map and editing in GIMP, but it never hurts to have more options. Gimp should have an equivalent to all this (might actually be more streamlined -- I just find Paint.NET to be a slightly better balance of "quick and dirty" with just enough extra functionality to be useful). I'm going to play around with Inkscape as well. Being a fully vector-based editor might be cool in that it would let you lay out orders and then drag around all the control-points at will. e: Dark_Swordmaster posted:What do you use to screenshot this game? I'm using Gyazo and A) It took four attempts because it would screenshot the menu or a popup that I had up a minute ago or whatever. It was BROKEN. B) It does these where it switches it to the lowest detail possible and blurs/obscures features. Did this ever get answered? Since I'm commanding a Platoon, I figure throwing a few screenshots with specific locations may be useful in the near future. Hubis fucked around with this message at 17:35 on Oct 11, 2016 |
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Oct 11, 2016 17:29
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Are the woods around Jagged Pass South "Heavy Forest"? If so, they're 100% impassible to vehicles, so 1 Coy BTRs are probably only going to be useful flanking West around Mt Moon or East supporting Mt Silver. e: Just checked -- it's mostly all "light forest" of varying density, with scattered "heavy forest" pockets throughout. The ravine itself appears to be fairly navigable, though a few locations will require going through the trees to get around some Marsh tiles. glynnenstein posted:The only concrete testing I could find showed that US units improved artillery call-in times by 1 minute by being in Stryker vehicles vs using their iphones or whatever. I assume they're just playing a militarized version of Angry Birds Hubis fucked around with this message at 21:51 on Oct 11, 2016 |
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Oct 11, 2016 21:30
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abelian posted:Agree that overruling like that is inappropriate in most cases. I think as an additional rule of thumb, let's try to leave it to Company Commanders to fill in for their immediate subordinates. In this case it seems like people were waiting for Dublish to fill in, and he either didn't realize that or wanted to keep the orders standing (in which case we should indicate so on the orders sheet).
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Oct 12, 2016 00:56
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Jaguars! posted:Some drat good shooting there, I think that'll spook the NATO boys quite a bit. I'll say! It didn't occur to me before, but the sight lines from those tanks down the road means that we can do a decent job cutting them off from getting to that cover on their side of the open field. Based on their current deployment, my guess is that they're trying to push a motorized infantry force to the clump of woods SW of the intersection and hope to contest access that way. Holding the hill as we currently do really makes that more difficult. What it seems like they are NOT doing is a fast end-run around the bottom, which to me indicates that we can potentially push 1st Coy more aggressively along the west. It also SEEMS like the recon team didn't have too much trouble getting up that ravine in their APC. I imagine it would still be pretty hairy with an entire company worth of vehicles moving through it, but it might make sense to send 1/2 and 1/3 down from different sides, and plan to shift 1/1 to support 2nd Coy in the east. Generation Internet posted:
I think the problem with having too many contingencies is that it's going to be a pain in the rear end for you to run, and will be awkward/frustrating for us to try and guess what we need to potentially plan for 5 minutes in advanced. That's a lot of room for misinterpretation and second-guessing. I think 3m rounds is a decent compromise at this stage. As things get hotter we could step it down to 2m if needed. Hubis fucked around with this message at 11:42 on Oct 12, 2016 |
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Oct 12, 2016 11:28
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abelian posted:In the shots below, I have full trees on. The game engine though decides that, when it can't keep up, tree rendering is a nonessential function and gets cut. So to a certain extent, it's beyond my control. Also, it seems that tree branch LoS often does not line up with the camera LoS in combat mission, so there is no substitute for the LoS tool, crappy as it is. Is there a decent way to test LOS/distance from an arbitrary point? abelian posted:Hero of the Russian Federation tank (for *DOUBLE KILL*) squeezed between two lone trees and perched himself on top of a mound of dirt. Scopes are crutch of decadent westerners, comrade! abelian posted:
Euro-Truck Simulator, except you are driving a logistic vehicle through the Fulda Gap  (Can you link me to that symbols mod?) abelian posted:Reposting the above from earlier. Keep in mind that they likely have at least as many vehicles as us. We've only seen the tip of the spear. The rest of their forces could be bottled up behind their lead elements, but that would strike me as rather foolish of them. We don't know that they haven't sent other elements to probe the the south/west. glynnenstein posted:Those APCs are in trouble in the open, but I wonder what they're doing with their tanks. They obviously pushed some troops (recon? spotters? atgm?) to try to get into that lobe of woods in the open; we may want to barrage the trees with some slow anti-personnel mortar fire in case some units made/make it there. Unless I am misreading the symbols, I think I see one unidentified tank in the very rear of the spotted column. They may have been trying to use the tanks to overwatch a forward push of recon/observers? Anyways, if I were them (and based on what we see now) I might try and do something like this  Send out a token recon and holding force to the flats. Take the woods at the crossroads and try to use that to get a foothold on the far side of the road. Meanwhile, sweep westward along the south, using infantry to scout and secure a path while the main push of armor heads to mount silver. Hold tight at the crossroads and try to sweep around so that their main force can cross mount silver to the Highway. e: Based on how far they are right now and depending on how much traffic they are seeing themselves, they might be half-way across that southern road, and might reach that western crossroads at the end of next turn? We might want to place artillery on the forest southwest of the main crossroads to forestall them getting a foothold there (if that is indeed how they're moving out) but I'm not certain it's worth wasting on a blind guess yet. I agree with Glynenstein that a harass mission on the copse of trees at the far end of the flats would at least be useful tactically, if not necessarily inflicting a lot of direct material harm Hubis fucked around with this message at 16:17 on Oct 12, 2016 |
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Oct 12, 2016 16:09
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Phi230 posted:Im extremely apprehensive about moving our tanks especially if the reports of enemy armor on overwatch are true. Don't take my word on that necessarily -- someone who is more used to reading the game than I am should confirm.
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Oct 12, 2016 16:25
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glynnenstein posted:
Let's let the next two minutes play out, orders as they stand. I think 3rd Platoon can probably not dismount (which will save a LOT of time with our current turn setup) and possibly hold back, getting ready to rock down into the ravine on that western entrance, but that's just a guess. I'll probably leave my orders as they stand as even if we want to push harder I don't see myself not dismounting and leap-frogging through that middle area. I do think 1st Platoon should possibly consider poising to swing eastward and support 2nd Company in the center, but I don't think that is something we need to worry about for the next 2m.
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Oct 13, 2016 01:48
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koolkevz666 posted:I'd like to swing at least one tank down towards the south, we should be on a fairly high elevation and I would like to see if I can spot anything coming up from the south. Would only be a quick peek and scoot mission. Thoughts? Yeah I was thinking of something like that as well. My APC is going to head to the top of that pass to your west so you wouldn't be unsupported for long. I'll try to load the map and see if there are any decent vantages from there professor_curly posted:Not a serious idea, but I almost want to see if we could send a T-90 down into the southern part of the map just to see if it could set up somewhere and see how much havoc it could cause. It's not that far away. They definitely wouldn't have anything in a position that the tank would hit it in the woods, but you might be popping out blind into an advancing force. Then again, "first-est with the most-est" and whatnot. It would be great if we could find another keyhole position to cut them off from disembarking on their side of the woods, but I don't know if that is feasible.
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Oct 13, 2016 03:41
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1st Coy / 2nd Platoon Previous orders stand as given. Hubis posted:1st Coy / 2nd Platoon
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Oct 13, 2016 19:38
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Generation Internet posted:Orders are final 
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Oct 15, 2016 01:01
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professor_curly posted:[ The recon on Mt Silver is hiding right now. Being hidden, their spotting is degraded. As I see it, they need to not be using the "hide" order to be useful, and we should fix that asap.
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Oct 16, 2016 05:24
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dublish posted:I'm not too enthusiastic about the plan as is. While I think striking south is a good goal, and will allow us to attack the town from good positions, I think 1st Co needs to be a much bigger part of this. Half my forces (2nd Platoon, 4th Platoon including our ATGM, and the grenade launcher platoon on loan from Davin) are all still crossing Flo, behind 1st Co. Putting NastyToes' 3rd Platoon way out on Ravaged Path like that, with no cover to their rear should they be attacked in force, is very risky. I'll order it, but I want glynn pushing to Lava Ridge immediately rather than later. I can try to accelerate my getting into position in the woods south of Jagged Pass. I think at least getting a firm line abreast in those woods even if we don't have scouting on the other side is critical to make sure we don't end up being flanked. Next turn we will have recon with eyes on the south side of the woods I think? That should put us on a much better position to make decisions on their disposition and intentions.
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Oct 16, 2016 16:09
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1st Coy / 2nd Platoon  Quick and dirty orders All units Move QUICK to the road, MOVE through the trees, QUICK down the road, and then MOVE down the ravine to the split point. All squads ACQUIRE 3 RPG-26, 5 93mm AT rockets, 500 7.62x54R and 500 5.45mm from APC. Have APCs for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd squads split as depicted and have all units + HQ DISMOUNT. SQUADS proceed as depicted. Set up observation points at the edge of the dense treeline. APCs follow behind through the gullies with the HUNT order.
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Oct 16, 2016 22:50
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koolkevz666 posted:We got any idea what immobilized my HQ tank? It didn't seem to enter any trees or rough ground as far as I could see so I can't tell what caused it to break down. Was that a MOVE or QUICK order? I was operating under the assumption QUICK moves made navigating boggy terrain more risky
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Oct 17, 2016 14:29
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At the least it seems Forums Terrorist should get through those woods and onto the highway alongside so he can roll out. That will take a good chunk of a turn anyways.
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Oct 18, 2016 00:43
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1st Coy / 2nd Platoon  All APCs MOVE to positions as indicated. Position at the edge of the tree-lines and face down the ravine in the directions specified. All squads dismount once the APC endpoint is reached. If the APC is fairly close after minute 1, go ahead and dismount then. 1st Squad dismount, then move QUICK to first position. SPLIT squad and MOVE second team to next position. FACE as indicated. 2nd Squad dismount, then SPLIT SCOUT. Scout team MOVE to the right position as flank coverage. FACE as indicated. 3rd Squad dismount, then move QUICK to slightly inward from the first position. SPLIT squad and MOVE teams forward to the edge of the woods. FACE as indicated. HQ remain mounted.
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Oct 18, 2016 16:58
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professor_curly posted:Ya 2nd Coy - your guys are already tired or exhausted, so I think it is a good idea to MOVE to your locations when going on foot. It'll take more time, but exhausted troops aren't going to be very useful for fighting, unfortunately. Hubis just went in and checked on your dudes' conditions. Given how strung out 2nd Coy is right now, the best thing to do might be to have them MOVE to the edge of the woods to meet the APCs and then just wait to recover. Fuligin posted:2nd Company 2nd Platoon Orders Yes, everyone should MOVE NORMALLY when crossing the thin copse of trees. Also it looks like the trees are thinner in the middle of the ridge separating Flo-Rida pass from the Highway, so I'd go QUICK to treeline, MOVE to highway through the dead center, then FAST to wherever you want to end up.
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Oct 18, 2016 17:08
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abelian posted:That Abrams has a few more smoke-on-lase get-out-of-jail-free cards. I wish these AT-14s didn't have a "hey buddy I'm trying to kill you" feature built into their design. I expect at least five or six more minutes of smoke before tank kills become likely. We would do a much better job circumventing that if we maneuvered a little further around those woods at the top clockwise. Right now they've got that copse of trees by the road to hide behind, but if we can wheel maybe a few tanks out that way we can constrict their angles and usable cover much better...
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Oct 18, 2016 22:03
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