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1 hp should be enough for anybody
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Nov 30, 2016 19:34
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Aumanor posted:I'm not touching the newer releases util they bring back the ability to eat poisonous chunks (so most likely never). That was the worst change in a sea of bad changes. Fitzy Fitz posted:OK, that one does actually annoy me. Anything that increases chunk/hunger tedium is bad. the change to remove poisonous chunks removed the minigame of "ok, i'm hungry. time to swap to an rPois item, eat something, and then swap out again." how did it increase 'tedium'?
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Dec 1, 2016 21:43
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Aumanor posted:Still, I don't think any QoL changes helped pure casters and that's pretty much the only thing I play. Certainly not enough to offset poo poo like stasis and rmut being gone now. Add to that a slew of annoying little changes like ignite poison becoming way less useful and... ehh, I think I'll stay where I am. i'm told that ignite poison is currently insanely strong and may need a nerf, actually. have you tried it with OTR?
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Dec 1, 2016 21:44
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Can Of Worms posted:Even if you think that poisonous chunks had a meaningful impact on food changes there's a way less stupid thing to do: just change the edibility of various corpses (I'm pretty sure tarantellas, for example, used to be poisonous.) yep! tarantellas, orb spiders, torpor snails, and the late, lamented beetle clan (goliath, boulder, and boring) were all poisonous before, and were changed to be edible as part of the removal of poisonous chunks. Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:IMO Merge staves and maces as a start - "dire flail" becomes lajatang and it's done. staves have a niche. they're low-investment weapons perfect for 'casters'. none of the weapons in the class have a high delay, quarterstaves are good early, elemental staves are good with spell skills, and if you're lucky enough to find a lajatang, you're set. (a lajatang is a heck of a lot better than a dire flail, btw!) m&f weapons are much better for 'pure melee' characters, especially those not following gifting gods, since the great mace is by far the most common top-end melee weapon.
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Dec 1, 2016 23:46
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Matty posted:Infestation seems like a fun spell, guess it will be removed next version! Infestation was created by the Lord of Removals, MarvinPA. Who could remove it?
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Dec 2, 2016 04:39
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VROOM VROOM posted:All this change talk is making me glad I only play 0.12.2. Then again I'm a weirdo who likes e.g. brown chunks. If you decide to try a newer version sometime, please post about it! I'm very curious about your take on the last four years (!) of changes.
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Dec 2, 2016 04:39
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Carcer posted:No, I mean crabs as a race. A sprint that's literally a race would be kind of appropriate, though, don't you think? Blast through the GAUNTLET OF CRABS as quickly as possible. Poison crabs! Acid crabs! TSAR CRABBA! The potential is limitless...
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Dec 2, 2016 16:44
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Jvie posted:I really want to know. The Shoutitis mutation could be triggered by non-monsters, e.g. fulminating prisms, orbs of destruction, or tentacles. This seemed incorrect.
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Dec 2, 2016 20:06
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you really don't want to go to the shoals before you've at least cleared lair. https://crawl.develz.org/learndb/#hyperelliptic
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Dec 5, 2016 19:27
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Speleothing posted:a) WHY is this effect not listed? I've been skipping guardian golem because it can't so much as throw a punch Summons a protective golem. It redirects the injuries of its allies (but not the caster) to itself, though it risks overheating after absorbing significant amounts of damage. It will gain more health at high power. Probably 'overheating' could be more clear. 
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Dec 7, 2016 16:48
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E Equals MC Hammer posted:Every single game I've played with the slime pits in it always had an altar outside the entrance. You got extremely lucky.
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Dec 7, 2016 20:08
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Fitzy Fitz posted:The shop creation is probably there for gameplay balance reasons. Nope. If I had to give a reason for it, it'd go something like: (A) Gozag is the god of gold. (B) You use gold to buy items from shops. (C) So, let Gozag make shops for you to buy items from. It's true that it's slightly indirect, but it's a lot simpler than creating a whole new item purchase UI.
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Dec 8, 2016 19:12
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Captain Monkey posted:What's wrong with just reducing the piety cost and using the same call that opens a shop window each time you use the ability rather than making a physical shop? ...piety cost? Captain Monkey posted:Like, crawl UIs aren't exactly difficult to create, if only 
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Dec 8, 2016 20:44
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sorry, can you explain this one? i'm at a loss
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Dec 9, 2016 05:16
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i appreciate the extra work you put in to get a ? over your own character, btw.
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Dec 9, 2016 05:17
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euphronius posted:I really dislike the anime loading screen. I hope its removed. ? The dowan/duvessa one? cheetah7071 posted:How bad is Fedhas wrath, I'm loving tired of not having any fruits Fedhas wrath is traditionally considered 'a joke' and 'switch to Jiyva so you don't have to worry about it at all'. That's what I'm told!
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Dec 10, 2016 16:54
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cheetah7071 posted:Why does Jiyva negate the Fedhas wrath in particular? Jiyva was actually the swap I had in mind because slimify can go a long way to make up for a weak character J grants innate rCorr, which makes oklob rings (the biggest part of F wrath) a lot less threatening.
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Dec 11, 2016 17:01
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Fitzy Fitz posted:What's the chance of being affected by *corrode? I remember the chance for *confuse being really low, but... e: it's 3%; oops! PleasingFungus fucked around with this message at 23:49 on Dec 12, 2016 |
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Dec 12, 2016 03:33
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Fitzy Fitz posted:Oh cool, thanks for checking on that. I kinda assumed it would be closer to 5% or something! LordSloth posted:In practice, corrode seems to correlate with the 3% listed in the learndb. LordSloth is correct; I'd misread the code. Mea culpa! cheetah7071 posted:Is it impossible to paralyze jellies as Jiyva now that prayer is gone? Yep.
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Dec 12, 2016 23:49
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Darox posted:Also I don't think it's described anywhere that Jivya gives you TRJ-style jelly spawning. Good catch - honestly, I'd thought that was a J mut. Fixed, thanks!
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Dec 13, 2016 18:26
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cheetah7071 posted:If there aren't going to be any races which prefer specific weapons, then just merge all the weaponskills together one thing you can use weapon skills for is to push species to use weapons which they might not otherwise bother with; e.g. halflings' axe options are not very good, so why not give them good apts so that there's a reason to sometimes use em? sort of the opposite of the traditional philosophy for weapon skills, but potentially more interesting. however, the actual answer to your question is that it's good to make characters decide what weapons they're going to use and invest in them, just like spell schools.
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Dec 14, 2016 06:07
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tote up a bags posted:Deep Elves only works as a name if they have something to compare to, so I suggest we make Shallow Elves, who are only able to use the most popular weapons and only cast spells if they see another unique casting that spell (because then they know it's cool) we already have deep dwarves, tho. they're pals
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Dec 14, 2016 06:49
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you'll look awful silly when i... remove deep dwarves 'whisper farewell as you leave, Shadow Gimli'
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Dec 14, 2016 06:54
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Dark Gimli. Nega-Gimli
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Dec 14, 2016 06:55
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Speleothing posted:No they weren't. They were valuable for lots of players, particularly melee types, who had time to cast a spell or two between seeing a dangerous enemy and engaging. They were also a good investment of spell levels for people who had lvl 8 & 9 attack spells online and needed to up their survivability quickly. casting specific spells at the start of every fight is also pretty annoying, just because there are so many fights; a sequence of buffs to apply every time is also annoying, with or without 'out of combat' casting shenanigans. what you really want is for buffs to be situationally relevant, so you have to turn your brain on and figure out if they're appropriate tools. spectral weapon is an okay example of this; song of slaying is a better one. ponderozo's was intended to fall into this category but i think i may have failed there. if we wanted spell skills to give +defenses, it would be simpler and more appropriate to create items or egos that give defenses scaling with spell skills, or to just make spell skills give defenses automatically. the former has been suggested before and rejected as 'not actually wanted'; i suspect the latter would be as well. it's still a more useful course of discussion than calling for the return of old buffs, however. Araganzar posted:See, you are probably saying that as satire or others are thinking this is satire. But just in case you didn't know, this has already been proposed, coded, given an experimental branch on CBRO, playtested, and abandoned. 2 years ago. someday i'm gonna have another shot at this. i was the original ideas guy for this god! i mean, i didn't bother to implement it, and then someone else implemented it and found it wasn't that fun... but that doesn't mean my version would be! IronicDongz posted:no, it's a "these were actually annoying yet optimal for actual human beings playing the game" argument. i miss freezing aura, because you could use it with ?bw to get a guaranteed freezing weapon. (then immediately amnesia the spell, of course.) those were the days...
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Dec 14, 2016 18:18
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Carcer posted:People feeling that they're losing out for not doing something stupid and tedious for minimal gain is never going to sell me on removing a feature wholesale rather than leaving it as is and later on modifying the offending spell/race/class/whatever. what if you had rod effects, but they weren't a pain in the rear end to use
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Dec 14, 2016 18:19
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also vit has a piety cost at least (even if it's tiny)
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Dec 14, 2016 18:31
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mormonpartyboat posted:I'd say there's also deeper issues with how much 'spare' XP dedicated melee characters get, how there's somewhat early breakpoints for a lot of skills (like overcoming shield penalties and hitting the minimum delay for weapons), no real benefit for training more than one weapon skill (with crosstraining actually making this worse)and how valuable strength is for casting in armor. Pretty much everyone other than Trog followers benefit from at least a bit of dabbling in spells and you don't sacrifice very much to get some basic utility like blink or regeneration. I personally consider this to be a feature, not a bug. (It's also one of the way that heavy armours are balanced!)
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Dec 14, 2016 20:12
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Fitzy Fitz posted:I don't think we're going to get a better explanation than "I don't personally play this race..." gammafunk, the dev responsible for the removal, has played over two thousand high elf games. he's literally spent over one thousand hours of his life just playing high elves. i'm somewhat terrified, but i'm also reasonably confident that he knows his elves.
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Dec 14, 2016 21:38
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Fitzy Fitz posted:That explains why he's sick of it! :P brainwrinkle posted:I'm on board with removing Tolkien influence in the game! I'm just sad to see "good bow apts" removed from everything but Centaur. It feels like there is no other outlet for these feelings besides making GBS threads up the DCSS thread by complaining. i personally want to remove good bow apts from every race, and also bow apts, and also bows as a player weapon (along with crossbows and slings). sadly the other devs disagree...
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Dec 14, 2016 21:42
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Carcer posted:Why? even after all the improvements made to it over the years, ranged combat is an unfortunate combination of fiddly and non-tactical. fiddly when you have to worry about picking up ammo, switching ammo types, or switching to melee to conserve ammo; non-tactical, since you can hit anything onscreen, and so you lose most of the positioning play that comes with e.g. melee. (let's not even get into the joy that is kiting as a centaur...) there are interesting elements to ranged combat. if you try to drill down and get a purer version of those interesting elements, however, you tend to end up a system that pretty much duplicates either spells, wands, or rods. (i can expand on this if you want.) there are a lot of ways for crawl players to engage enemies at range, and pretty much everything other than 'ranged weapons' does it better!
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Dec 14, 2016 22:05
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Floodkiller posted:I realize I never provided my opinion on removing high elves: meh. I would probably say the same thing about mountain dwarves if I was playing when that happened. there's an interesting question about the purpose of aptitudes. are they intended as a guide for players, "this is what this race should do?" (for example, ogres +4 m&f apt, or mf's +4 polearms apt, both say, correctly, "You should be using this specific weapon class with this race.") or, are they intended to counterbalance other factors so that players are encouraged to use a wide variety of approaches with each race? for example, tengu have strong melee & casting apts, which make them well suited to 'hybrid' playstyles. most hybrids tend to want to use charms and tloc spells, to synergize with spellcasting stats & melee skills, but tengu have -2 in both charms and tloc, pushing them away from the obvious approach. (but without forbidding it entirely.) ogres' current m&f apts can be seen as being in the same vein - the existence of giant clubs & gscs push ogres toward m&f, but a low apt pushes them away again, suggesting different viable playstyles with the race. a third approach is an apt that does push a race in a certain direction, but not overwhelmingly. hill orcs have +3 axes (vs +1 for other weapon classes), which means that axes are usually better for them than other classes, but a good early weapon from one of the other classes can reasonably prompt a switch. i think that the latter two approaches are probably better than the former, and it's probably a good thing that ogres no longer have massive m&f apts. i'm not going to say that the current numbers are exactly right - i suspect that ogres might be a little "too weak" now, though I haven't played with them myself post-change! - but i think it's a move in the right direction.
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Dec 14, 2016 22:26
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odiv posted:Has something like that ever happened with any online server? hellcrawl is playable right now, on both beartato and c3po. i think that circus animals might have had a server at some point? but i forget. wouldn't be surprised if crawl light or crawl alternative had servers, in ancient times. in general, we're more than happy to help fork developers out, both in terms of the codebase and helping people go through the server hosting process.
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Dec 14, 2016 22:27
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odiv posted:But no server admin has seen an upcoming change and gone, "Nah, I don't think I'll implement that one." I'd imagine, right? that'd be a lot of work! the only server i'm aware of that runs its own fork is the korean server, and that's so that they can hack in all kinds of stuff, like sound and a korean translation (!?). most server admins want to put as little work in as possible, which is only sensible, given how much we pay them
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Dec 14, 2016 22:35
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EHE turned three years old this month.. an aberration... or an inspiration??
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Dec 15, 2016 00:02
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tweet my meat posted:the survivability of the high elf ???
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Dec 15, 2016 01:42
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Crampy Grampaw posted:First they came for the Divinations, and I did not speak out— fact: dcss devs are literally nazis
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Dec 16, 2016 01:06
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oh, that's a good idea! while we're talking about bringing back removed content, why not bring back shadow traps? c'mon, let's get a petition together.
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Dec 17, 2016 04:57
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Heithinn Grasida posted:Most of the changes on the .20 list look good! I'd just like to indicate my opinion that if the game becomes shorter, which is good, experience really needs to become more plentiful. dpeg posted:Sure, xp reduction makes the game harder. That is the point. However, the powerhouse combinations (Mi/Tr melee, DE casters, Spriggans) would still work. IronicDongz posted:This feels like one of those things where it seemed like everyone was on the same page-if you asked me one week ago, I'd say that basically all experienced crawl players held the opinion that crawl has too much XP. (I certainly feel that way, and most of the players I talk to.) But it seems like recently there's been more people pushing back in the maximalist direction, probably due to these recent changes. If you steadily decrease the amount of experience in the game, you'll get a steady decrease in the number of experienced players who say "there is too much xp". This is a trend which, much like the shortening of branches, has been ongoing for some time (much longer than a week! :P), and it's worth treating with respect. I personally think that, outside of extended, crawl no longer has a 'glut' of experience. In 3-rune games, I never get that old feeling of 'more xp than i know what to do with'; xp is reasonably tight from start to end. Crawl is a very 'loosely balanced' game, so you probably could cut somewhat more xp without doing noticable harm. I don't think there's any actual need to do so, however, and I think a lot of the urge to do so is inertia: like you said everyone knows that crawl has too much XP, since it always used to... And some of Heithinn's concerns are very reasonable; I don't care about 'roleplaying' in dcss at all, but I've been worried about the Fate of the Hybrid for some time now. They're a more fragile species than the evergreen MiBe or DECj and thus more endangered by shrinking habitats... it seems very possible to me that cutting xp aggressively will shrink the variety of 'viable' character combinations significantly.
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Dec 19, 2016 21:08
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LogicNinja posted:It bugs me that they do nothing if you already have riposte. They should enhance long blades in some way, otherwise finding them on a long blade character is like, "well gently caress." they double the riposte chance  I guess that's not documented, huh? i'll add a note to make it clearer.
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Dec 20, 2016 21:22
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