NBA Draft 2017: It's not "my pick."

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Sports Argument Stadium > NBA Draft 2017: It's not "my pick."

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Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

ESPN said it was a fake tweet for what it's worth.

E: although I am really turned off by the Ball dad too.

Rick fucked around with this message at 05:21 on Feb 26, 2017

# ¿ Feb 26, 2017 05:17

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# ¿ May 9, 2024 20:42

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Kibner posted:

http://www.sbnation.com/2017/2/25/14740734/lonzo-ball-father-lakers-ucla-bruins-2017-nba-draft

Ugh. I don't think Ball is a good fit with the Lakers anyway even if they do keep their pick.

# ¿ Feb 26, 2017 05:25

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

DeimosRising posted:

Yeah but that kind of attitude, confidence, swagger...he belongs under the bright lights of la la land...he's perfect, and Magic knows it...

Yeah )=

I am trying to watch Zach Collins and this guy won't loving pass to him in the post.

# ¿ Feb 26, 2017 05:57

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Dejan Bimble posted:

I suppose you could make the argument that ball is big enough to guard sgs, so he can share the floor with D'angelo. But he's not that long or athletic, so it's not as natural an arrangement as the hand wave people want to make it seem. Also, D'angelo seems much better when hes handling the ball a lot and working in th eflow of an offense. Just sticking him to the side and asking him to play like Lou Williams or something while Lonzo is the Real pg seems like a waste of talent. I'm really afraid of Lonzo Ball as an NBA prospect, he could really contribute to the right team or he could be useless on a team without spacing and athleticism

I think a lot of the people making the argument are just looking at the fact that Russell doesn't get a lot of assists and deciding he is not a point guard. But like the Lakers are like 13 PPM better with him on the floor so he is clearly doing something to facilitate.

I think it is worth trying to make it work for like Fultz but I have the same worries as you do for Ball.

Paul Zuvella posted:

Lmao why would you even want to play for the lakers at this point.

Yeah why would you want to play for the team that world wide is still the most popular team in the league by a giant margin.

# ¿ Feb 26, 2017 21:42

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

It did look like he was being overcoached at first but he started playing so well that like all that "pull a guy for minor mistakes" bullshit had to stop.

If you believe his current shooting isn't a fluke, or that he can learn to shoot even if it is, there's no reason not to take him at #2 (well, maybe Philly fans can make an argument about needing a PG more). Of course that might be a foolish belief but I'll admit I'm really on board with him.

# ¿ Feb 27, 2017 08:31

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

I finally got to the Arizona/Washington game and like obviously the main event is Fultz but Markkanen playing center is really impressive. For a guy who likes to spot up and shoot or float off of the dribble he has a really nice old fashioned post game.

# ¿ Feb 28, 2017 03:56

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

straight up brolic posted:

DeAaron Fox is going to be the worst shooter drafted in the first round since Tony Wroten

IT should get like 20% of his paycheck because no way dude gets drafted in the lottery--where a lot of people are projecting him--two years ago.

# ¿ Mar 1, 2017 03:57

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

To me the question isn't if Jackson will learn to hit threes, but if he is still going to be able to get to the basket in the NBA.

# ¿ Mar 3, 2017 02:15

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Yeah that's what I tend to believe. I all the time see people saying "well what about Winslow, Stanley Johnson" and like, I get the comparison, but Jackson's just so much more skilled than they were in college in finishing in a wide variety of manners.

--

I'm currently falling into a homer trap with Markkanen but man I really love this dude. I mean like we know what he can do offensively but he just defensively shut ASU down today. I guess they aren't exactly a talent laden but like dude was just wreaking havoc on them.

# ¿ Mar 5, 2017 08:38

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Dejan Bimble posted:

I can see the Markelle Fultz D'angelo "The Mussel" Russell comparisons. They both play point in the same sort of smooth and cool way, everything looks really relaxed and they sort of bop with the ball. Markelle is just more athletic, faster, bouncier, and better, better at getting to the basket, better at shooting, just better, maybe not a better passer, but it's washington, so who knows.

Fultz is really built to destroy the modern NBA defenses provided his knee is not a permanent issue or that he's not slower than we think because he's going against college dudes.

But yeah if the Lakers get him via some miracle (I don't trust them to draft him even if they get the first anymore) he would probably be more likely to be the offensive guard with D'Angelo still passing.

Rick fucked around with this message at 22:43 on Mar 11, 2017

# ¿ Mar 11, 2017 22:40

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Ouch, that is rough on the shooting predictions for Jackson. It is unfair, he was perfect for the 90s where the ability to get to the basket was king.

# ¿ Mar 12, 2017 01:29

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

straight up brolic posted:

Josh Jackson is a less broken MKG, which is a borderline all-star player.

I think MKG is the star I have seen the least so maybe this is why I am not thinking of it.

# ¿ Mar 12, 2017 20:50

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

straight up brolic posted:

Depending on fit I think he may actually still go #1 after the combine etc...teams will talk themselves into him

Jackson is probably the guy I'm most enamored with in the draft if I'm honest and basically have to force myself to remember his shooting and Fultz to stop myself from being foolish.

Well, I'm pretty high on Markkanen too but I know that's homerism.

# ¿ Mar 12, 2017 22:38

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

I like Dennis Smith a lot and if it wasn't for the fact he already had an ACL injury I'd probably be willing to be talked into picking him ahead of Ball.

# ¿ Mar 14, 2017 04:35

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

He already has the "he's a winner who knows how to win and wants to win because he's a winner who wins" crowd but really, what happens in the combine and workouts will have a lot more impact than the tournament for smart people. Throw in that he probably has a broken thumb, and he might be better off not playing in the tournament at all.

# ¿ Mar 14, 2017 07:10

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Cool Buff Man posted:

What the heck's going on with Walton and D'lo though

Earvin "Magic" Johnson.

E: To expand, when Magic Johnson took over as head coach of the team, he had only been casually watching them play, so he went ahead and put the team through preseason-like lineup experimentation to evaluate what he had. It was mid March when he took over the team. What's funnier is that he got the job by telling people that he would inspire the Lakers to make the playoffs before doing this so it wasn't even a tanking thing.

I don't think it's a coincidence that a coach who had used fairly stable lineups when the team was healthy (even if his minute distribution wasn't always stable) suddenly has used a different lineup every other game since Magic took over.

Rick fucked around with this message at 22:11 on Mar 14, 2017

# ¿ Mar 14, 2017 22:06

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Cool Buff Man posted:

Yeah, this is the part that shocked me. Up until a week ago, it seemed like the Lakers had the same sort of (starting anyway) lineup every time I checked the box score or watched a game, and I figured the players must have appreciated it after what they dealt with last season. I wish you luck in dealing with Big Earv.

Thank you, I think the Lakers are gonna need it. And it's making me super sports-angry like constantly.

My hope is, that it will be like the past and things start to go off the rails he'll bail, because he usually does bail pretty quickly once things turn sour. The Lakers still have Ryan West (there is a story that Jeanie could've had Jerry West back in the helm if she could've waited another six months with just the promise that Ryan would be his successor, but I'm just going to go ahead and pretend it's more Kevin Ding fan fiction for my sanity), who is really good at finding gems in the draft. Also Rob Palinka is by all accounts one of the better agents out there and since a few agents have transitioned into successful GMs I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt for now.

---

Slightly more on topic, but Wesley Iwundu looked way better today against Wake Forest than in any of the other games of his that I watched, although I've watched Kansas State the same way every time, which is, in the background, or while analyzing someone else primarily.

# ¿ Mar 15, 2017 09:20

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

InnercityGriot posted:

I mostly agree with this, but would add that I think Walton has been a bit of a disappointment to be honest. He has played Russell fewer minutes than I think he needs and applies unequal treatment to his players. Why does he allow Randle and Clarkson basically free reign and Russell gets benched for taking a quick shot or getting a turnover? Russell's per 36 numbers are pretty comparable to Porzingis but he is viewed more negatively I think entirely due to Lakers' coaching decisions.

I agree with the fact he is held to a different standard. I am okay with the minutes though just because Russell had two knee injuries the first half of the season, so there wasn't a point in him playing a ton. It seemed like they were just comfortable with him playing a bit more before the shuffle.

# ¿ Mar 15, 2017 23:40

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Latest Woj podcast is really trying to sell the idea of staying in school if you aren't a top ten pick. The argument is you won't get paid all that much anyway due to two way contracts. Also you don't want to go to the combine and then go back to college because teams have made up their mind on players who have done that, which is why like, Trier's stock hasn't gone up even though he's played better this year.

# ¿ Mar 18, 2017 00:14

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Yeah I don't think his argument was that effective in the end it felt like most of the old reasons why you go out if you're good still are valid. And yeah 60 K isn't gonna get someone rich but it's a solid wage right out of college, and the bleak life on the road that Woj tried to portray would probably actually be decently fun if you were in your early 20s (oh no, you're just taking a regular tour bus to a three star hotel in your all-expenses-paid travel around the country) and you just wouldn't know what you were missing by not having the NBA five star life style.

# ¿ Mar 18, 2017 19:23

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

PotatoJudge posted:

It's worked out for Caleb Swanigan, he came back from last year's combine with solid pointers on what he needed to work on, fixed those areas (except turnovers goddammit) and now he went from pre-season projects as a 2nd round guy to a mid-late 1st rounder.

I guess we'll see on the draft, but he wasn't even ranked in the top 60 a month ago which makes me think he could take another dip back into the second after the combine.

# ¿ Mar 19, 2017 06:13

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Click my post history for thousand posts trying to talk myself out of believing Josh Jackson being the best player in college basketball.

# ¿ Mar 20, 2017 01:30

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Miles Bridges only took six months to take his headband off, it took Lebron ten years.

E: in seriousness though I agree that was an important matchup as it was a nice way to show how he is different from the usual modern college wing prospect

Rick fucked around with this message at 02:30 on Mar 20, 2017

# ¿ Mar 20, 2017 02:26

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Markkanen is at least pretending his t-shirt is a shoulder protector. Lonzo is just wearing a plain white Hanes shirt under his jersey.

# ¿ Mar 20, 2017 04:43

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Ty1990 posted:

Robert Williams is reportedly staying in school and that seems like an awful idea.

Yeah. I feel like he had a pretty good chance of being picked top 10 by wowing people with his athleticism in the combine and workouts. Dude is huge, and gets up, and moves well enough to make me think his quickness can be developed. He has very few actual basketball skills but the place to get those is with professional development, not in college.

Plus, in a draft where there might be only three centers who aren't considered long term projects, I don't see him slipping very far, and if next year is as big-centric as people are predicting he might have given up quite a few draft spots.

# ¿ Mar 21, 2017 23:12

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

https://theringer.com/lonzo-ball-ucla-shooting-mechanics-6eeda2ef3e41#.iqyqppq8y

A good article about Ball and ball.

I'd never really considered that using a different brand of basketball could affect shooting with NBA players, but it's certainly something I've experienced. The article points out that actual great shooters but does make a difference with others.

# ¿ Mar 22, 2017 11:53

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

I wouldn't be shocked if Justin Jackson is like the MCW of the next draft (guy who has one of the better seasons among drafted rookies but probaly hits his ceiling there).

Rick fucked around with this message at 19:27 on Mar 23, 2017

# ¿ Mar 23, 2017 19:24

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

WhyteRyce posted:

As a Kings fan, should be I happy if we get Miles Bridges with the Pelicans pick?

I honestly don't know. I thought early his game had too much post play, but he's picked up playing the wing pretty effectively. He's not as quick or as crafty around the basket as Tatum and Josh Jackson and maybe that might take a lot of what he does off the table in the NBA. But it's hard to draw that line firmly when he's playing against college players.

# ¿ Mar 23, 2017 21:04

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

IcePhoenix posted:

I feel like this description needs the qualifier that the rookie class is poo poo which doesn't (in theory) describe this class at all

It's not but it's still pretty young and likely to struggle next year. Justin J. might contribute modestly fairly quickly. Like I won't be shocked if Fultz comes out the gate great but he's likely going to Boston who might have a short leash on him.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2017 00:58

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Man more and more mocks putting Fox ahead of Dennis Smith. That's nuts.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2017 02:12

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Yeah it's a solid comp, Iguodala and Jackson. I feel like Jackson is more athletic but that might be recency bias.

And yeah, just not a lot of question to me about Tatum vs Jackson. Jackson's a lot better. Maybe Tatum can adapt a little better to being a small ball PF, maybe. But everything else is in Jackson's favor.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2017 04:06

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Dejan Bimble posted:

Only prospect that matters

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Dejan-Todorovic-48923/

I wish your brother, in this culture where surnames come first, the best of luck.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2017 05:43

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

EvanTH posted:

Iggy used to be like Mini-LeBron out there, one of the most athletic dudes on the planet, but he's not anymore as of a few years now. Is that what you mean recency? Or you mean Jackson is sticking out because you viewed him recent?

Sticking out because viewing recently.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2017 18:29

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

It's not really that I'm putting much stock in it tonight, it's just that it's been the general pattern as you pointed out. Arizona doesn't really have NBA talent at guards and were able to mostly do the same to him.

# ¿ Mar 25, 2017 06:01

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

This is like the draft of guys who would've had a lot easier time in the league ten years ago. Fox has like this amazing hand speed which makes him do some pretty crazy defensive things, but the NBA is a pick or screen league right now and there's just no way someone that size can fight through them. He's going to be one of the worst defenders in the league, and throw in bad shooting, and as fun as he is, poo poo is bleak for him.

I dunno, maybe the fact that there's so many throwbacks entering the league, in a few years things will shift back in their direction out of necessity.

# ¿ Mar 25, 2017 18:32

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

I honestly have no idea who the Sixers should draft if they don't get #1.

Also, Dejan I have found myself super on the Dennis Smith bandwagon lately as well. It's like the lower people slot him in the media the higher I put him on my board.

Rick fucked around with this message at 01:25 on Mar 26, 2017

# ¿ Mar 26, 2017 01:21

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

2020 Sixers are great and Magic can't destroy the Lakers. Everyone wins.

More specifically though, it's probably easier for the Sixers to draft someone like Monk who might have a pretty low ceiling but will probably be a decent reserve.

# ¿ Mar 26, 2017 20:50

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Someone in the NBA_Draft reddit is looking up Synergy stats if you have questions. He starts by detailing Lonzo Trier is the #2 P&R guy in the country. Which is cool but all the top pick and roll guys are not NBA prospects, hahah. So maybe the college P&R doesn't translate?

# ¿ Mar 28, 2017 03:47

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Which makes sense since it's not a dramatically different mechanic.

It might be a moot point in Trier's case since at least today he seems to be strongly leaning towards coming back for his junior year, with the idea that a solid season and a draft that might be a bit weaker for wings next season will get him to the first round guaranteed money.

There's even some chatter that Markkanen might stay, which seems insane. It's what his family at least is strongly pushing for.

# ¿ Mar 28, 2017 09:54

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# ¿ May 9, 2024 20:42

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Ty1990 posted:

Somebody tell me I'm not crazy to think that a lot of Dennis Smith's issues can be fixed by nba coaching/a better supporting cast/giving a poo poo.

Or is this me talking myself into him in case Philly doesn't get a top 3 pick?

I tend to think so. You wouldn't be able to put so much pressure on him if you had shooters for him to pass to. The defense might take a long time I don't think it's hopeless.

ButtWolf posted:

Staying in school is stupid unless you are a proj 25+ pick with a weaker class next year. "But education!" You can pay for school with millions of $ if you flame out or when uou retire.

I think the reason that Markkanen's family wanted him to stay was to establish life in this country which they were worried about. His family isn't poor which is part of the reason he went the college route instead of going European pro, so money wasn't the issue.

But by most accounts he's been fine at assimilation and it was time for him to go out. Although man Arizona would have been loving stacked next season had his family prevailed.

# ¿ Mar 30, 2017 23:39

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Sports Argument Stadium > NBA Draft 2017: It's not "my pick."

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