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Crowsbeak posted:Well not really for I am fine with the employees running their companies for profit, and deciding upon their companies internal hirarchy. Socialism is worker ownership of the means of production. An economy made up entirely of worker co-ops is exactly that.
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Nov 23, 2016 18:56
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Full neo-socialism now Woah
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Nov 23, 2016 18:58
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New law: if it isn't prohibited, it is mandatory
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Nov 23, 2016 19:09
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resar posted:Socialism is worker ownership of the means of production. An economy made up entirely of worker co-ops is exactly that. Well I don't think it would support Hierarchy among the workers.
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Nov 23, 2016 19:26
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Crowsbeak posted:Well I don't think it would support Hierarchy among the workers. Why not? I'd be fine with the hierarchy at my company if I got to vote on the makeup of the board or w/e body dictates the direction of the company effort. E; like there HAS to be management in some form, they just don't have to be paid more than everyone else Car Hater has issued a correction as of 19:52 on Nov 23, 2016 |
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Nov 23, 2016 19:49
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-Proportional representation in the House, IRV for Senate and Presidential elections (by national popular vote, abolish the electoral college). Same idea for state legislatures, governorships, etc. -Voting is mandatory and inalienable. Election day is a national holiday, absentee ballots can be requested without cause. -All ballots are on paper or have a voter-verifiable paper copy. Have a full hand recount of all ballots in each precinct on election night, in public view. -Repeal the Citizens United ruling. Institute a political donation limit of $5000 per donor per year (no more donating hundreds of thousands by giving to a multitude of candidates and state parties), and meanwhile allow every citizen to allocate up to $50 of public funds among the candidates or parties of their choice every year. Make sure that donations by the wealthy get drowned out by donations from everyone else. Give the FEC the funding and the tools to actually enforce election rules. -Institute a UK-style National Health Service. End the insurance model entirely, make healthcare a right and a public good. -Make public universities and vocational schools tuition-free. Redirect excessive spending on sports and administrative costs into academics. -Massive investments in concentrated solar plants, wind turbines, and subsidised rooftop solar. Phase out all coal, oil, and natural gas power plants. -Phase out the internal combustion engine. Subsidize electric and zero-emission vehicles, make them mandatory for new sales by 2030. -Massively increase spending for the NSF, NIH, NASA's science missions, and other avenues for basic research. Give researchers more latitude to spend some time studying the topics that fascinate them and not just the topics that have grant money readily available. That's where we're most likely to see real breakthoughs instead of just incremental improvements in our understanding of known science. -Follow the Portuguese model and decriminalize all drugs. Legalize and regulate marijuana and any others that are relatively harmless. Treat substance abuse as a medical issue. -The rent is too drat high. A big part of the reason is insufficient housing supply in the places people want to live. Encourage high-density walkable mixed-use development everywhere there's demand for it. Discourage surface parking and car-centric development. Levy a big tax on unoccupied housing that isn't the owner's primary residence. -Expand and improve mass transit everywhere. Put separated bikeways along all major roads. -Add more tax brackets at the highest income levels. Tax marginal income above $10 million at 75% or more. Treat capital gains and large inheritances as regular income. Give the IRS more funding and power to go after tax evaders. -Double the minimum wage and index it to inflation. Expand welfare, food assistance, and housing assistance. Instead of hard income limits, have all benefits programs like these ramp out with increasing income so nobody ever gets punished for earning more. Let even high earners be eligible for small amounts so the programs stay popular and destigmatized. -Mandate that half the membership of corporate boards be employee representatives. This is the system in Germany, where workers aren't treated nearly as terribly as in the US. And "contractors" functionally identical to employees must be considered employees. Mental-Rectangle posted:California, New York, Illinois, Virginia, and the other blue states secede and full civil war commences.  at Virginia finally being called a blue state. We did it! (at the last possible moment, right before the republic ends)StateOwned posted:is there a "humanity is doomed" acceptance movement yet? because there should be http://dark-mountain.net/about/manifesto/
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Nov 23, 2016 20:03
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full ... communism?
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Nov 23, 2016 23:20
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HBar posted:-Proportional representation in the House, IRV for Senate and Presidential elections (by national popular vote, abolish the electoral college). Same idea for state legislatures, governorships, etc. Single transferable vote would slot into the existing system better than proportional representation. Plus at means if somebody fucks up but their party continues to try to support them the voters have the ability to get rid of them if they so choose.
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Nov 23, 2016 23:48
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StateOwned posted:is there a "humanity is doomed" acceptance movement yet? because there should be https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8x73UW8Hjk&t=34s
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Nov 24, 2016 00:02
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gulags and re-education camps
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Nov 24, 2016 01:19
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Race Realists posted:
Well yeah this in a reality where the GOP has been scattered to two the winds by a massive defeat ala 2008, but with no blue dogs and a "gently caress republicans forever" president. I don't think it's likely but I also thought Donald goddamn Trump wouldn't be president, so who knows.
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Nov 24, 2016 04:43
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if you think the GOP-lead House and Senate will not write it in a way to completely gently caress over minorites
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Are there any books that detail how a co-op under socialism actually works? I know there is stuff like Mondragon which is pretty big, but how do you run say, a company of 10-20 people cooperatively ? Doing everything democratically in such a scenario would probably lead to business failure, and you'd still need the classic hierarchy for most decision making i.e. some guy at the top makes a final decision, even if the profits are not split that way. EDIT: I should add as whitest management guy, a question I've always had about co-ops was how do you get rid of lazy useless fuckers. Sylink has issued a correction as of 14:29 on Nov 24, 2016 |
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Nov 24, 2016 14:27
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From my limited experience, what ends up happening is that you end up hiring non-co-op members to work certain jobs for the co-operative, and in many cases it becomes a big and contentious deal when new people are allowed in, effectively creating multiple tiers of workers within a nominally egalitarian structure. Hell, if you squint at it just the right way you could argue most law firms are set up as co-operatives of sort, at least for the senior partners. 
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Nov 24, 2016 16:20
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it was such a treat to see my views actually represented in media the first time i watched this
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Nov 24, 2016 16:43
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Put a price ceiling on the rent of all 1 bedroom apartments equal to one 40 hour week's pay at minimum wage.
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Nov 24, 2016 19:00
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Sylink posted:Are there any books that detail how a co-op under socialism actually works? I know there is stuff like Mondragon which is pretty big, but how do you run say, a company of 10-20 people cooperatively ? Elect a CEO? Having "management" isn't necessarily bad if the workers control who management is.
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Nov 24, 2016 21:25
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Full market socialism now op.
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Nov 24, 2016 23:28
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Nov 25, 2016 01:10
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Triple the size of the justice department and go head hunting.
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Nov 25, 2016 02:21
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Overcoming the cultural biases against left wing politics in the United States is the first great hurdle that must be overcome. In that sense, the revolution has to start on a cultural base. We should be holding free concerts featuring local artists, where we can introduce people to our respective parties and the direct services we can offer: food, clothes, shelter, maybe even medical care. A socialist party should be a party. People don't have to believe in it, they just have to see that the project works, that it's fun, and that it's an out from the strict confines of inherited culture. Socialist parties shouldn't seek to rival the church as a locus of community activity, but to create bridges between people of all denominations and creeds so that we can form a real common solidarity. We could create a tangible environment of intersectionality upon which to eventually build a socialist mass movement against capitalism. Listing off appealing policy bullet points won't accomplish anything. If the planks of any particular socialist party actually mattered, then they would be on the ballot in as many states as the Greens. People need an opportunity to live the alternative, even if it's only for one day a week.
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Nov 25, 2016 04:18
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BeefThief posted:-Guns for everyone, all the time, everywhere the left can do none of these things right now. what a lovely plan for retaking power
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Nov 25, 2016 04:31
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zeal posted:it was such a treat to see my views actually represented in media the first time i watched this rust found spirituality at the end and realized the errors of his ways
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Nov 25, 2016 04:32
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Republicans haven't even actually been sworn into power yet and you guys are already LARPing on what to do when dems take it back. This is kind of delusional thinking is why Trump won
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Nov 25, 2016 04:45
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Terror Sweat posted:the left can do none of these things right now. what a lovely plan for retaking power Yeah sorry, I got halfway through the list and realized the prompt was about goals after retaking power, not the platform to retake it on. I should have just said full communism now.
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Nov 25, 2016 04:49
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Even framing the question in terms of "retaking" power is a misinterpretation of history. Because the Left has never been in power in the United States. Not even the inoffensive social democratic Left.
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Nov 25, 2016 04:53
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the left should hire a bunch of gay hookers to honeypot every single senator and congressman
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Nov 25, 2016 04:55
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:Even framing the question in terms of "retaking" power is a misinterpretation of history. Because the Left has never been in power in the United States. Not even the inoffensive social democratic Left. the primary concern of the left on taking power in the us would be surviving the counterrevolution
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Nov 25, 2016 04:55
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Prav posted:the primary concern of the left on taking power in the us would be surviving the counterrevolution Gotta be able to even take power before you start worrying about keeping it.
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Nov 25, 2016 05:04
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The obvious lesson to learn from the failure of the Democratic party is that you can't fail to fulfill your mandate. If you can't do it because of a partisan gridlock, then that's what you campaign on. Make every Republican senator a kulak, and run a mass campaign to throw the bums out. Target them in their districts by running candidates who can offer better platforms with proven support to realize them.
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Nov 25, 2016 05:07
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The Muppets On PCP posted:gulags and re-education camps I like this idea, plus the guillotines as mentioned.
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Nov 25, 2016 06:03
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none of these plans will take power. you guys are thinking dictatorship when you should be thinking guerilla warfare
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Nov 25, 2016 06:08
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I have some Mosins still covered in jelly I can distribute if needed.
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Nov 25, 2016 06:23
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Terror Sweat posted:none of these plans will take power. you guys are thinking dictatorship when you should be thinking guerilla warfare Taking power requires taking over local dem organizations and the creation of a parallel party structure.
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Nov 25, 2016 07:58
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There was a pretty interesting post in the Jill Stein thread that I would like to share in this thread:Berated Tham posted:Kudos to Jill Stein for getting far more votes in 2016 than 2012 and also for her efforts to demand a recount! I think the lefties in this thread should give some consideration to Berated Tham's ideas regarding leftist efforts to take power. Thanks very much for your consideration, comrades!
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Nov 25, 2016 18:50
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I'm actually pretty curious about what's preventing the Democrats from having something like the '94 Gingrich Revolution and becoming a unified political party rather than a dissociated mess of Blue Dogs, Third Way, etc.
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Nov 25, 2016 18:52
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Nietzschean posted:I'm actually pretty curious about what's preventing the Democrats from having something like the '94 Gingrich Revolution and becoming a unified political party rather than a dissociated mess of Blue Dogs, Third Way, etc. They are all smug retards
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Nov 25, 2016 19:20
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generally you need to formulate your goals and have them be liked by voters in order to be able to take power in any democracy, hope this helps OP
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Nov 26, 2016 01:12
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Bad Hat Meter posted:There was a pretty interesting post in the Jill Stein thread that I would like to share in this thread: Historically, turning left-wing parties or organizations into extensions of Russian foreign policy ended up being quite catastrophic for the left.
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Nov 26, 2016 01:22
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more lena dunham woker brands
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Nov 26, 2016 02:17
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Crowsbeak posted:So in this thread I want some discussion on what we think the left should do on retaking power in America. I have my own thoughts which cover a wide area of possibilities on how evil the GOP and ineffective the liberals of the democrats can be. But I want any and all input in this thread. First of course I should lay out my own thoughts. You're delusional if you think the failed dysfunctional left can retake power at all based on their current assessment on why they utterly failed to begin with lol
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Nov 26, 2016 02:18
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