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9-Volt Assault
Jan 27, 2007

Beter twee tetten in de hand dan tien op de vlucht.

Doctor Malaver posted:

I work as a project manager and I can't even begin to imagine how my job could be automated. I have to be a psychologist and a product designer and make decisions from marketing to technology. Either I'm deluding myself or the companies that I've been working for are too small and chaotic for that kind of automation.

You wont come into work one day and find yourself be replaced by PROJECT MANAGER 3000, you will gradually see small parts of your job be automated. Or perhaps not even your own job, but the jobs of the people you are managing as part of your own job. Until a moment comes were you really arent that necessary anymore.

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9-Volt Assault
Jan 27, 2007

Beter twee tetten in de hand dan tien op de vlucht.

Owlofcreamcheese posted:

Because the software exists right now? And we have like 5% unemployment.

Yes, but that 5% is anheavily manipulated number. Pretty much every job created during obama's presidency is low-paid and part time. Millions upon millions of people are stuck in poo poo jobs and are pretty much one accident, like losing their job, away from being homeless.

9-Volt Assault
Jan 27, 2007

Beter twee tetten in de hand dan tien op de vlucht.

Owlofcreamcheese posted:

I think this has come up before but is the 2010s the ideal peak of human society or is there any automation technologies from earlier times we should have banned/restricted/made illegal?

Like apparently 350,000 people were employed as AT&T telephone switchboard operators. Should they have had their job protected by law and should we mandate we return that sector to human hands? Or is it only future technology based job loss that is bad and all the ones in the past were good? Are there ones in the future that might be good and are there ones in the past that were bad? What is the metric?

All jobs should be automated so we can live in a society based on fully automated luxury gay space communism. Unfortunately capitalism still lives so all profits get sucked out of the system into the hands of the few, and thus we end up in a situation that job protection might be a good thing.

9-Volt Assault
Jan 27, 2007

Beter twee tetten in de hand dan tien op de vlucht.

A Buttery Pastry posted:


Sure, if you could leverage one into the other eventually then that's great, but UBI seems more like a delaying action while capital gets ready to completely disengage from the public.
But where does capital disengage to? Without a public to buy its stuff it can't make more money. I guess you could have a situation where the rich only trade with each other, either with products or on the stock market?

9-Volt Assault
Jan 27, 2007

Beter twee tetten in de hand dan tien op de vlucht.

ColoradoCleric posted:

How does a currency have any value when you're just giving it away to burn through resources?

According to market forces you're going to end up in a vicious cycle of inflation and then printing/taxing money from the rich to pay for more and more UBI.

This video does a pretty good articulating the problems with a UBI: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxUzTW5dM4o

What a dumb argument. Currently you get currency in exchange for productivity, that wont change with a UBI, you just get part of societies total output as a UBI.

9-Volt Assault
Jan 27, 2007

Beter twee tetten in de hand dan tien op de vlucht.

A Wizard of Goatse posted:

45% of Sweden's GDP is in exports (mostly traditional heavy industry) and they've got a 6.5% unemployment rate; the population as a whole is massively economically productive (that is, they produce things of value, not that they consume a lot, which is not productive) and the welfare state diverts a small percentage of their productivity to maintain them as such. This is completely unlike a situation where welfare is primarily directed towards supporting a large and growing class that produces nothing of value, ever. Rich people have lots of money, but its value ultimately derives from their stake in actual industry making things and providing services, that doesn't mean you can write yourself a check for a billion dollars and become rich too.

It doesnt matter if is 1 person/computer producing everything or 100 million people. Its not about how many people are productive, but about the total amount produced. If that stays the same with less people than yes, you can give those people who now do nothing the same amount of money as they got before without any wealth loss for society (well except for the capitalist i guess). In fact it might be better to give it to those people so they can continue to consume.

9-Volt Assault
Jan 27, 2007

Beter twee tetten in de hand dan tien op de vlucht.

Sethex posted:

That doesn't work in capitalism.
That is true and why it needs to be smashed.

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9-Volt Assault
Jan 27, 2007

Beter twee tetten in de hand dan tien op de vlucht.
Give it 5 years and it will do everything needed to make a burger. Or multiple robots combined will do it all.

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