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A Buttery Pastry posted:Can you come up with one or more examples of what these jobs might be, specifically? Like boner confessor
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Dec 1, 2016 19:55
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Monaghan posted:I'm a little surprised by some conservative economists calling for a minimum income in order to combat automation, but then I realise they mean bare minimum, like "just enough so you won't die."
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Dec 1, 2016 20:27
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Raspberry Jam It In Me posted:Can someone criticize my half-baked idea? At least without a complete change in the 'deserving and undeserving poor'/'strivers vs. skivers'/'poverty of aspiration' bullshit that has been going around in some form for at least the last century and a half.
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Dec 2, 2016 12:29
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Cancer and capital investors are both adherents to the growth at any cost ideology.
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Dec 2, 2016 15:17
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Guillotines are still centered around the individual, one at a time, lead them up the steps, etc. There are methods that are both ruthlessly efficient and dehumanizing, but they have connotations. 
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Dec 2, 2016 15:44
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A Buttery Pastry posted:Should probably aim for something with at least a few wins under its belt.
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Dec 3, 2016 13:02
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Raldikuk posted:Personally I never understood why shoppers would even want self checkout. No savings are going to be passed onto the customer for eliminating cashiers. Raldikuk posted:Self checkout is very prone to bottom of the basket theft especially when one employee is meant to watch 4-8 self checkouts.
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Dec 28, 2016 11:55
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If it's meat cooked on a vertical rotisserie, it's a gyro. *opens levantine food  *
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Jan 5, 2017 20:08
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People will accept far higher risks when they have the illusion of control, or can mentally put themselves into the place of the controller. Some experiments show risk perception differs by a factor of 10 or more, for example more people being comfortable with driving after one drink than with flying in a commercial airliner, even though the statistical risk skews hard the other way. Media biases can exacerbate this, like with terrorism. As a species we'd rather have our hands on the wheel when we die than have a lower chance of dying.
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Jan 10, 2017 21:09
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Cicero posted:Yeah, it's not like other car companies have driver assist modes that require the driver to still pay attention right? Oh wait, tons of them do. 
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Jan 11, 2017 13:37
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Animals have been put on trial for crimes such as criminal damage and murder in Europe. The Fourth Circuit in the US used heard an in rem case against a 1985 Nissan, 300ZX, as did the United States v. One Ford Coupe Automobile. So why not just have the car itself the actor whose guilt was to be determined. Or the program running it, then if it's found guilty we can execute it. 
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Jan 12, 2017 15:24
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How 'smart' or 'aware' or 'self learning' or whatever does something have to be before we can charge it directly instead of its creator? How about before the State of Texas can give it the death penalty?
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Jan 12, 2017 16:42
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Who will be allowed to fix 'self driving' cars? All the cars and trucks I've owned have been pre-2000s, so the right to repair is pretty simple. You have a socket set and some screwdrivers? You have the right to do most simple repairs. It help to have the Haynes manual and a general clue what you're doing. Anything more involved your local mechanic or workshop of choice can do. With more modern vehicles they started introducing proprietary tools, which I personally think is bullshit and an attempt to milk mechanics and drive out independent shops, and more recently using license based models that say that nobody except them can fix certain parts of a vehicle and throwing around the DMCA. Personally that says to me that IP law is fundamentally broken, and right to repair outweighs their 'right' to keep you tied in to a specific repair chain after you've already purchased the product. But with the 'self driving' or 'self learning' vehicles that all becomes a lot more iffy. What parts of the vehicle would be safe for you to repair? What changes would be allowable without requiring a complete recertification of the vehicle and who would do it? Who would actually own what?
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Jan 13, 2017 15:07
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Cockmaster posted:Even in the absence of IP bullshit, getting trained and equipped to handle new technology can be a pretty big challenge for many independent mechanics. Diagnosing and repairing problems with self-driving systems would probably involve procedures completely alien to the average mechanic. One option would be a simple division of ownership, a bit like the Network Terminating Equipment in telephony, where everything one side belongs to you and everything the other side belongs to the telephone company. That makes intuitive sense for phones/internet, as 'your stuff' is inside the house and 'their stuff' is outside, with a connecting box between, but it's a bit conceptually weird to be driving around with a huge part of the vehicle outside your ownership. It's also a problem if: Solkanar512 posted:manufacturers refused to push out important security updates, crippled hardware due to incompetence or maybe they simply go out of business. Another option is that it just means a move away from personal automobile ownership, you lease it from Google or whoever for a number of years and it never belongs to you, so you never have a right to repair in the first place and it never needs basic maintenance by you because it goes back to them before then. Even outside of IP law and right to repair I'm not sure how that will play with the whole car culture thing, where it's all about owning and caring for your vehicle. From an environmental perspective tackling that culture might be a good thing, but I can't see it playing well outside of metro areas.
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Jan 14, 2017 14:58
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Tei posted:I think the real right that is getting attacked is the right to own things. How companies try to get around this to dick people about will be interesting, but automation will be full of interesting legislation, like who is responsible if highly automated things harm someone. Not sure about right to repair in the EU, but in practice it's a smart cow problem, it only takes one person to figure out how to do it and publish it, which could then lead to a whole host of other issues.
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Jan 16, 2017 18:07
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Rastor posted:One aspect not everyone may have thought about is that if there are fewer car crashes, there are also fewer organ donations.
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Jan 20, 2017 01:39
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If he was there in person he could stop the gang with his 3D printed pistols and hanzo steel.
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Feb 5, 2017 15:58
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Tei posted:A solution for the "unemployable" group of people is to create something like "orphanages for adults": Buildings where these people live. Individually these people can't survive, but if they put all the money in the same pocket, they can buy food (cheap food), maybe even internet and games. They would be able to do some jobs. Government can help the group instead of helping them individually. The building can have a retrain school, so people in the building can learn new jobs / task, in the hours they are not playing videogames. These buildings can be distributed around cities, with the distance to each other limited, to avoid they creating a ghetto or becoming the seed of revolutionary movements. (Except for the owners of course.) I like the thing about becoming the seed of revolutionary movements, we could try that instead.
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Feb 7, 2017 11:57
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Doctor Malaver posted:Unless you go to concerts and plays in a local community center or school, it's not a community bonding experience. Walking the dog is but not everybody has a dog.
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Feb 7, 2017 15:25
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So you'd prefer a Citizen's Dividend to UBI? Sounds good, but how do you get from where we are now to that without passing through UBI?
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Feb 8, 2017 21:15
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It can replace all their advisers and clerks though.
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Feb 26, 2017 01:29
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Especially since sometimes those emotions include stuff like "black guys don't really feel pain as much and are just drug seeking."
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Feb 26, 2017 16:52
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:But most of real medicine is failable doctors trying to vaguely remember symptoms within the limits of human memory then poorly looking up the symptoms they don't remember then giving treatments based on whatever the research said the last time they looked at the research mixed with how they "feel" about it.
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Feb 27, 2017 15:47
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That's something that Kropotkin identified in 1892, that as machines become capable of productive labor themselves and workers are reduced to lever pulling exercises, the only way to truly look after one another is mutual aid in autonomous communes with the benefits of the technology going to all within.
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Mar 2, 2017 15:12
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Tei posted:Another solution can be to create more criminal jobs. We've heard a lot about 'dark web markets' and such over the past couple years, and there's a stereotype that the underground markets are early adopters of tech in the attempt to get an edge, but do they really have the level of infrastructure to implement employment replacing automation without it becoming visible to the state? We've also heard a lot about how technology will eliminate black markets by closing the supply chain to the individual, with 3D printing replacing gun running and microfluidics labs replacing clandestine chemistry, but those usually turn out to be duds or moral panics.
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Mar 4, 2017 14:18
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That really seems to be one of the biggest changes that globalization, neoliberalism, the internet, and automated docks have had on the counter-economy in Western Europe. Traditionally in Europe a lot of black market traffic was run by close knit communities often with ethnic or national ties back to the country of origin, with Pakistani or Turkish groups controlling much of the heroin trade, Caribbean groups controlling much of the cocaine trade etc. with high levels of vertical integration, infiltration of customs services, community enforced high barriers to entry, and not much crossover in trade area. This appears to be changing over the past couple decades to small-medium local enterprises supplying moderate amounts of multiple black commodities on a risk-reward basis per case, without any particular ethnic or national affiliation. Maybe the paleoconservatives were right, and liberalism really did destroy the Family. 
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Mar 6, 2017 14:38
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:Why wasn't the peak in bakers in Paleolithic times when it required the absolute most labor to bake? It'd be interesting to graph the number of bakers per capita between then and now.
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Apr 12, 2017 21:00
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Interior design has now been successfully automated.
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May 22, 2017 00:12
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Main Paineframe posted:If you wanted a hundred flyers for your lost cat or something in the days before home printers, you had to either individually write out all one hundred flyers or go to a print shop and work with them to design and print those flyers.
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May 25, 2017 00:08
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Xae posted:Keynes was wrong because he failed to realize that people have an infinite desire for consumption. Nfcknblvbl posted:Everyone's gonna be a vlogger or play the synth. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVmmYMwFj1I
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Jun 26, 2017 16:01
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Dead Reckoning posted:Also, how would people not be spending their UBI on housing and food?
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Jun 27, 2017 23:01
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With common land all of it's everyone's, with a series of bylaws to stop someone coming in and being King rear end in a top hat. For built up areas an LVT administered by the municipality would probably be the modern equivalent.
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Jun 27, 2017 23:07
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Dead Reckoning posted:as the increasing population continues to outstrip the shrinking number of jobs, that's exactly the end game you're describing. Of course, much like with pollution controls, it only works if everyone is willing to play along, but it's a possible solution. Guavanaut fucked around with this message at 16:58 on Jun 28, 2017 |
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Jun 28, 2017 16:56
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Tei posted:The other option is?
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Jun 28, 2017 18:43
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Call Me Charlie posted:Alexa and Hue bulbs are one of those things that sounds stupid at first but, once you integrate them into your life, you can't imagine going back. People that adapt that technology will be much more open to other smart devices throughout their house.
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Jul 9, 2017 17:18
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Fortunately it's pretty easy to spin an induction motor at the right speed regardless of what state malware programs are doing.
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Jul 10, 2017 02:18
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A Buttery Pastry posted:Not saying bank security is necessarily as good as it should be, but I've read stuff about how a lot of these IoT devices have basically no security at all, which might warrant some concern? Like, could an easily hackable refrigerator be a backdoor into more sensitive stuff, if all your poo poo was part of some integrated network?
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Jul 10, 2017 16:37
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What's the use of IoT devices that can't be told to do things remotely? Or are we talking pure telemetry, like I put the toaster on manually and it sends me an app push when my toast is almost done?
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Jul 10, 2017 20:32
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There is no hardware voltage regulator in a toaster, the element just has a resistance designed not to draw more than a certain current, like an electric fire. So if it could be kept on for more than the designed time, pumping heat into the toaster space at a constant rate, it's feasible that it could overheat the toaster beyond the materials spec. Hopefully whoever designed one would keep the bimetallic strip as a hardware trip on the element power supply and spring latch, which is the current workaround for that. If they tried getting fancy and replacing it entirely with a solenoid controlled by the on/off chip then it would open up other control loop issues not even needing malicious remote toast actors. Why do we want bidirectional control of a toaster over the internet again? One that makes something else beep so I can tell when it's done from another room would be cool enough.
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Jul 10, 2017 21:16
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ElCondemn posted:Because the two devices are inherently different, they run different software and are designed totally differently. Again this is just a fundamental misunderstanding of how these systems work. Stuxnet worked as an exploit for any system that was running windows, the centrifuges just happened to have their control software running on windows. That kind of thing could start becoming an issue if/when IoT controllers start using more powerful control units, but only if they had some sort of crossover that is also present in something that these state level actors are likely to want to target. So it's not like someone would deliberately target all the light bulbs, but there could be something that inadvertently bricks them if updated from a compromised machine. It's going to be interesting to see what inadvertent effects things like that have.
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Jul 10, 2017 22:55
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