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SkyTalon2314
Aug 8, 2013

pumpinglemma posted:

Now that I've watched the video: the Helix can actually be a pretty decent boss killer. As long as both bullets hit you have reasonably high damage, and most of the bosses are large enough that they always will despite the helical firing pattern.

That's what it looked like to me too. It's definitely a lovely gun for outside bosses, though. But I don't know the game enough to know if the Helix was better or worse than the other things he had vs Bosses.

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SkyTalon2314
Aug 8, 2013

dscruffy1 posted:

Uggggh this year is the absolute loving worst. On the bright side my relationship issues are over, on the downside that is because I am now single. Merry loving Christmas.

Here's a video!

The Convict/Polsy

Cast in the name of Gun, ye not guilty.


Also, jesus christ the Barrel. I had to pause the video because of that one.

I am considering picking up this game now. I am not particularly great at action roguelikes, but it looks fun and has charm I like to it, unlike another action roguelike where you cry at poop. Also, this latest run shows just how much the RNG gods can hate you or love you. Been playing a turnbased RL, Guild of Dungeoneering, and it's amazing how much RNG can either completely save your run, or completely ruin it. Both in equal amounts, really.

SkyTalon2314
Aug 8, 2013

The Door Frame posted:

I don't think that there's much else that you can do to make the LP more informative or helpful towards newer players, you're already explaining mechanics and strategies that the game itself is completely mum on, which is extremely helpful. The only real question I still have about the game is about the mechanics of coolness, but after the first couple of runs, most other things need to be practiced and the boss fights definitely help


I think a good deal of the frustration being expressed in the thread is because when we see the video, it looks much, much easier than it actually is. This second one may not be true for everyone, but we have also learned optimal play strategies, like avoiding brown chests and purchasing keys before picking up drops, which can take a bit of the joy out of the game.
Like, my biggest gripe in learning this game was about money and the shop. However, I'm upset at the shopkeeper because he basically only sells me keys on my runs, not because he's actually unhelpful. I know that it's better to use him to get a key and gamble on higher level chests rather than to buy most items he has for sale on the first or second levels, so finding him isn't exciting like I know that it should be

This is very true. There's another roguelike-ish game that got LP'd recently, Darkest Dungeon. Tried to load that back up, and... well... yeah. I uninstalled it shortly thereafter. Like, I could LP Guild of Dungeoneering and make the game look far easier than it is, just simply because I know the mechanics well enough. In fact, I sort of experienced that when I convinced one of my friends who streams to do the game one week. He was not thrilled at that.


That said, I'm still probably going to grab Gungeon. It looks to be an action game I can enjoy, even if some of the mechanics are bullshit. Or should I say bullshot?

SkyTalon2314
Aug 8, 2013

Dominicius posted:

People are complaining about how the game handles difficulty but it is actually one of the things that I absolutely endorse. What you need to understand about difficulty first and foremost that it is always relative to player skill, a beginner might have trouble with the most basic things while a pro will just breeze through the game. The second thing to keep in mind is that player skill is not static, players will be getting better and better as they play, making the game feel easier with time. By rewarding players that are doing well and giving them more resource what you are doing is amplifying the learning curve effect. Not only is the game easier because the player goes up in skill but the game also gets easier itself in response to that. This creates a much bigger sense of progression, creating a breaking point where the player is suddenly making tons of progress with each run where as before he would barely be making it to the second floor.

The fact that scruffy mentioned a "click"moment in one of his videos is no coincidence, Gungeon was designed for it.

These are good points, but I have some qualms with how this game handles it. I do like the idea of a reward for high-skilled players, much like Devil Deals in BoI, but I don't think they should be health, and is the only real way to gain health outside of very RNG dependent things (ie, chests). The bosses in this game can be brutally painful for newer players, and to tell them, 'The only way to get more health is to not need it'... does the game no favors in the end. Other types of rewards, maybe a second gun or passive/active item would be better. With the knowledge that the only way I can get more HP is to not get hit in bosses, it makes it incredibly demoralizing to get hit by an errant attack during some of the more technical bosses. I've even just flat-out ended a run because I got hit on the first boss because I'm not at the skill level where I can breeze through the second floor, and not having that extra two hits because of a slight miscalculation is crushing.


I've also been having a frustratingly difficult time unlocking the shop in the Breech, because that also feels like a Luck Dependent Mission. I've had a couple runs now where either the key isn't spawning (or doesn't show on the map?), or in my latest rage-quit, found out once I got the Cell Key that they were behind a NORMAL locked door, and I had just used my last key on a decent-quality chest. Not to mention just the numerous runs I don't get to the second floor, but that I can chalk up to player skill. I have a very hard time right now judging how long my invulnerability frames last, and I keep juking myself in a way that I get clipped by overlapping bullets.

SkyTalon2314
Aug 8, 2013

I think my biggest issue in the game right now is that I can't really progress.

I can't even unlock the first shop to spend my Credits, because I keep dying on the second floor, making what I do moot. :sigh:


Also: Do you need to specifically take the Bounty Hunter through the tutorial to get that mission from the guy? I did it first with the Convict I think, and I didn't have the conversation Scruffy had in Episode 1.

SkyTalon2314
Aug 8, 2013

dscruffy1 posted:

What kills you on the second floor? Seems like it's probably regular enemies, is there one in particular that is causing issues?

Usually attrition. Lead Maidens for certain. But just a series of mistakes.

My biggest issue is I still am not completely 100% with the dodge roll's i-frames, and frequently juke myself into getting hit when bullets are coming in multiple waves. I'm wondering if I end up perhaps taking a break between floors with the new Save and Quit mechanic, I can do better. Take a break, relax my muscles and return. The Floor One bosses that I've face haven't been too bad. Though fatigue is my biggest enemy there. Just before making that post I ended up eating two hits from Gatling Gull that I can just attribute to fatigue.

SkyTalon2314
Aug 8, 2013

Xarn posted:

I decided to try blessed run. The RNG was taunting me the whole game, with the first chest dropping Unity and then getting Blank companion ring from boss, but not a single active use item in shop or from chests :v:

Even so, it went pretty well until Dragun (ok, at one point I got that light square gun against boss, but I got through that), where I got klobbe, squirt gun, klobbe and then a loving alien engine :suicide:

I have sort of noticed this game isn't really as heavy on the emphasis on the Active Use items, which i kind of appreciate. ONe less thing to worry about.

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SkyTalon2314
Aug 8, 2013

mandatory lesbian posted:

while im sure scruffy is a fine actor i don't think he could play reese whitherspoon convincingly

I dunno. Given that I mentally picture Scruffy as, well, Scruffy like his avatar, I would be rather amused by this.

I mean, heck, back in Shakespear's times they DID have dudes playing the ladies. Romeo and Juliet was a guy and another guy who was in drag smoochin'.

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