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Sir Kodiak posted:Rachel cannot be the mother of a revolution that pre-existed her. The kid is important to the revolution, but is neither the cause of it nor part of it. And the story is primarily about the kid and K's relationship to her. Ok fine it was a bad use of the expression but you understand my point. The revolution is waiting for a true spark and it's presumed that this is going to be it. If you try to take all that out of the movie you'd basically have to write an entirely new one from scratch.
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Jun 15, 2018 01:37
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Sir Kodiak posted:Nah. You'd just need some other way to rescue K and get him back on his way, which is easy enough. That's the only part where it actually drives the story. Back on his way to what?
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Jun 15, 2018 02:06
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Sir Kodiak posted:To rescue the guy he got into trouble and reunite him with his daughter, motivated largely by personal reasons, not the revolution he shows no sign of caring about at all. Why was he even investigating it in the first place? Why does he even know Deckard or his daughter exist?
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Jun 15, 2018 02:14
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I made a very clear post earlier that you disagreed with, which is that the revolution is THE plot, not just some subplot that can be easily deleted from the film. You're the one that disagrees with that. You're saying it's so easy to just lift that aspect of the movie out, but my questions are examples of gigantic holes that would be left in the plot if you did that. Basebf555 fucked around with this message at 02:18 on Jun 15, 2018 |
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Jun 15, 2018 02:15
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Sir Kodiak posted:Because he was ordered to. Because he stumbled upon it in the course of investigating a rogue Nexus 7 and kept pulling the thread. That does not necessitate a band of revolutionaries showing up. But why is everyone in the movie after the child if not for the importance of what she represents? You'd have to rewrite the motivations of half the characters, at least. Sir Kodiak posted:But "the revolution," the specific group of revolutionaries we run into, are poorly developed and just sort of pop up and disappear with relatively little impact on things. They fit less elegantly into the overall story about people rebelling against their owners/makers/nature/etc. than things like Joi, K's own journey, Gaff hiding Deckard from the police, etc. That's not what I've been talking about when I say "the revolution". I'm talking about what everyone in the movie knows would happen if it gets out that replicants can procreate. I wasn't referring to just one specific scene. Basebf555 fucked around with this message at 02:41 on Jun 15, 2018 |
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Jun 15, 2018 02:36
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Yea I mean you did say revolution sub-plot, not that scene with the revolutionaries.
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Jun 15, 2018 03:22
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Sir Kodiak posted:A group mutiny is explicitly an organized rebellion. But, yes, as I said, he didn't start "the revolution" in the way we see in 2049. He's part of the general theme of people rebelling against their makers/owners/natures/etc. that gets made so dully literal with the revolutionary group. Yea I mean there are various degrees of organization that a revolution can have but I think if you say that a group of slaves violently overthrew their masters that's at least a rebellion. And then after a while what starts as a rebellion can become a revolution. Batty wasn't purposely trying to start an organized revolution but that is in fact what his actions caused.
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Jun 15, 2018 13:47
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Sir Kodiak posted:Yeah, in a general sense. But there’s no continuity of organization such that he started “the revolution.” He contributed to the general undercurrent of resistance. It's similar to Cloud Atlas where one slave's struggle ends up inspiring a revolution but she is executed and never gets to see it happen. The fact that Batty didn't anticipate the future doesn't make his actions any less important to that future.
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Jun 15, 2018 13:57
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The girl from Cloud Atlas has no desire to start a revolution either, she simply wants to assert herself as someone deserving of human rights, that she is someone who will no longer "be subject to criminal abuse". It's mostly the same with Batty, he feels he is deserving of life the same as any other person and he decides to take it by force. Batty's importance is just as much due to what he teaches Deckard than anything else, which is also true in Cloud Atlas. After her death, people see what she had done and become inspired to do better, just like Deckard when he is saved by Batty.
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Jun 15, 2018 14:23
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Right, I mean it's not a 1:1 comparison, there are differences. In the Blade Runner films it's really just Deckard and the audience who know the importance of Roy Batty, but he's extremely important regardless. I'm really not concerned with the semantic argument of whether he "started" or "sparked" or "inspired" a revolution, but I don't think you can argue he wasn't a critical piece.
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Jun 15, 2018 14:40
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Sir Kodiak posted:Yeah, I mean, he killed god and saved the father of the miracle baby. I don’t think anyone is arguing he didn’t change the world. Is there some larger point you’re trying to make? Not really, just shootin the poo poo. Bored at work mostly. More specifically though I was responding to this post from last night after I went to bed: Jedit posted:Roy was rebellious, but there's no hint of a replicant revolution in 2019. Quite the reverse; Roy was acting purely for himself and his group. Organised replicant rebellion didn't come along until later. Basebf555 fucked around with this message at 14:55 on Jun 15, 2018 |
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Jun 15, 2018 14:47
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feedmyleg posted:Think about it like this: replicants are a are human beings. The difference is just a class label. Is this something that would make sense for a human being? While that's true thematically and in the context talking about replicants as sentient beings(which they are), if we're just specifically talking only about physical abilities then there are some replicants who are more physically capable then any human being. They were purposely designed that way. But yes that replicant that Wallace sliced is definitely dead.
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Jul 18, 2018 19:17
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Bardeh posted:I went to see this twice in theatres, absolutely loved it, and the soundtrack just popped up in the sidebar of Youtube and I'm falling in love with it all over again. I've got a decent 4k HDR TV, where's the best place to buy/stream it from? Amazon? You can't really stream it properly in HDR unless you go through Apple(I'm not even certain that they have it in 4k but they probably do), so the best option is the blu ray. 4k HDR is really not very useful if you don't have a 4k blu ray player. There's just not enough streaming content yet.
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Jul 20, 2018 13:45
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