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Maxwell Lord
Dec 12, 2008

I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.


:smith:

Grimey Drawer
What a wonderful movie. This won me over in a way that almost nothing else from 2016 has- the sheer charm offensive of it, the warm colors (Hey, pinks and purples, like movies used to have!), the jazzy tunes, loved it all.

I like that it draws from a good range of musicals in its influence- there's a lot of Jacques Demy as people have noted, but of course it's clear the filmmakers also love the classic Hollywood stuff, and the jazz elements also put me in mind of One From The Heart. Of course it helps that the Drafthouse pre-show contained trailers for Young Girls of Rochefort, Umbrellas of Cherbourg, New York, New York, Pennies From Heaven, etc.

The songs definitely run together a bit, and I think that's deliberate and I'm not sure what I think of the score overall, but there are definitely highlights. It doesn't seem to fully follow the Broadway/Hollywood structure- as said above there's not a clear "I Want" song- but it definitely goes for that in places.

And this, like the Nice Guys, is a good example of filmmakers knowing how to take advantage of Ryan Gosling's charm. Any other actor, the guy might come off as just too elitist and douchey (though the actual plot addresses this and he suffers for it), but he can pull it off.

No, you be trippin'.

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Maxwell Lord
Dec 12, 2008

I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.


:smith:

Grimey Drawer
See I thought the argument was particularly convincing- neither is really trying to be mean to each other but things just pile up.

Maxwell Lord
Dec 12, 2008

I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.


:smith:

Grimey Drawer
I honestly think How Far I'll Go is the weakest song in that film- it feels the most like A Disney Ballad, complete with the turning one syllable into two to show off the vocalist's range etc.

Maxwell Lord
Dec 12, 2008

I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.


:smith:

Grimey Drawer
It just feels generic in a way most of the other songs don't.

Maxwell Lord
Dec 12, 2008

I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.


:smith:

Grimey Drawer

blue squares posted:

it feels generic because it's the I Want song, something literally every musical ever has and will always have.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%22I_Want%22_song

True but the best entries in any genre find new things to do with the formula and repackage the conventions in unusual ways. Like "Somewhere That's Green" is also an I Want song (the composers even drew on it for "Part of That World" in Little Mermaid, even referring to it as "Somewhere That's Dry") but it's subversive in its kitschiness.

Maxwell Lord
Dec 12, 2008

I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.


:smith:

Grimey Drawer
He's kinda wrong, but in the end he's better off being able to do what can satisfy him- take the money for a while, then use it for what you really want to do. Just like Keith isn't wrong for wanting to play jazzy music that's also really popular. "Start A Fire" is a good song, but Sebastian won't be happy playing it over and over and over again for the rest of his career. The film really isn't very judgmental, which is something I like about it.

Maxwell Lord
Dec 12, 2008

I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.


:smith:

Grimey Drawer

i am the bird posted:

With John Legend: Seb doesn't play "real" jazz, doesn't chase his dream, and ignores Mia (the end result being him choosing to miss her play opening for a photoshoot, a plot point that is also unearned by what is depicted on screen)

Without John Legend: Seb and Mia are together, Seb owns a jazz club, everyone is happy (the irony being, of course, that Seb wouldn't probably own that club without the money or status of being in Legend's band, but that's not necessarily supported by the film because we don't see why/how he gets there)


Unless your reading of the film is that Seb and Mia are obnoxious and shouldn't actually be together -- which I think is the best read of the film and makes it worth a second watch -- it's pretty hard to say that John Legend isn't a 'bad guy' in the movie.

He may point Seb in the "wrong" direction for a while, but that doesn't make him a bad guy. He's not in the wrong, he's not malicious, he's not even thinking just "$$$".

And like you said, Seb probably wouldn't get that club without the money. The problem is not so much that he takes the gig in the first place, but that he stays with it so long he starts to neglect what's best for his own artistic development.

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Maxwell Lord
Dec 12, 2008

I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.


:smith:

Grimey Drawer
Yeah I liked La La Land a little better but there's already a backlash against it. Now that it hasn't hogged all the awards and another great movie won BP all that should die down.

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