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Poil posted:AoE2 is also full of hidden modifiers and multiple projectiles issues. Did you know that a ranged attack bases the damage on what the attacker has when it hits? So if you pack up a trebuchet before the rock lands it'll deal 1 damage because a packed treb has no attack value. This sounds like Oblivion where you'd sneak-attack shoot an arrow at someone and then spam-click tab, open the weapon menu, and pull a sword out right before the arrow hit so it would give you the sweet x6 melee sneak attack multiplier instead of the lame x3 ranged one. But in reverse. And yet still more practical because archery was TERRIBLE in Oblivion.
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Dec 29, 2016 10:30
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Everything is TERRIBLE in Oblivion. Just wanted to say this got me to buy and fire up the Extended Edition with the new expansion pack so thanks. Used to love AoM, the remake and update completely bypassed my attention.
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Dec 29, 2016 11:18
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Magic was fun in Oblivion if you hit an enemy with a weakness to magicka, fire, frost and shock spell and then with a second identical spell which got more effective and then the first again for even more power before using the neat wizard's fury spell which did all three types of damage and just blasted the enemy to bits from stacking up vulnerabilities.Melth posted:This sounds like Oblivion where you'd sneak-attack shoot an arrow at someone and then spam-click tab, open the weapon menu, and pull a sword out right before the arrow hit so it would give you the sweet x6 melee sneak attack multiplier instead of the lame x3 ranged one. But in reverse. And yet still more practical because archery was TERRIBLE in Oblivion.  I really liked hydras in AoM, they're not great from the get go but they work wonderful on maps where the enemy spawns crap infantry from destroyed buildings. Poil fucked around with this message at 12:07 on Dec 29, 2016 |
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Dec 29, 2016 12:04
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Oooh, AoM! And yes, gently caress Thebes and everyone associated with those Medizers.
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Dec 29, 2016 13:34
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Poil posted:I really liked hydras in AoM, they're not great from the get go but they work wonderful on maps where the enemy spawns crap infantry from destroyed buildings. That's Poseidon Greeks. I usually go Zeus, though, mostly so I can go Hera. You might be surprised what size things medusae can turn to stone.
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Dec 29, 2016 13:45
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Poil posted:Magic was fun in Oblivion if you hit an enemy with a weakness to magicka, fire, frost and shock spell and then with a second identical spell which got more effective and then the first again for even more power before using the neat wizard's fury spell which did all three types of damage and just blasted the enemy to bits from stacking up vulnerabilities. I mostly liked to play on max difficulty (it's a surprise to nobody!) as an apprentice birthstone high elf so that everything would instant-kill me and then use custom spells that did 1 second 100 Drain Health (remember, drain was inexpensive temporary damage rather than expensively actually stealing it) and like 3 seconds of 100% weakness to magic. Then I could dart in and out hitting them with that inexpensive spell till the magic weakness stacked up enough to make the 100 drain health kill them. It was actually pretty fun since it meant I had to dodge every single attack all game long or die, but I could also kill the enemy in a reasonable time frame as long as I never missed. Then I'd do things like eat a poison apple and try to run around doing the whole main quest before I died. Or like put on custom gear that set me on fire or something. I liked Oblivion a fair amount for the kind of ridiculous and awesome challenge stunts one could do. As for hydras, yeah they're pretty sweet. You'll see me use them more than a few times. Though I often go manticores instead these days because there re other solid melee myth units to replace hydras but not many good ranged myth units to replace manticores. Cythereal posted:That's Poseidon Greeks. I mostly go Hades so I can get 3 divine archery upgrades (Ares, Apollo, Artemis) on top of his and then used maxed out Gastraphetes and Toxotes to kill everything. The thing about Medusae is that there are a LOT of myth units with instant kills. Even counting only the ones like Medusae that also work on myth units there are Medusae, Mummies, Arguses, Lampades, and I think there might be a Chinese one I'm forgetting. Oh and Frost Giants are pretty close. And Perseus for heroes. A lot of those myth units have shorter cooldowns on their instant kills or have extra range to them or extra perks like how the mummy turns the enemy into little guys who fight for you or the Lampades who make the enemy go crazy and attack their former troops. Medusae (why do we call them that instead of gorgons anyway?) just don't standout too much from that crowd to me. Astroclassicist posted:Oooh, AoM! Just noticed your picture is Alexander the Pretty Good.
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Dec 29, 2016 20:21
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Melth posted:I mostly go Hades so I can get 3 divine archery upgrades (Ares, Apollo, Artemis) on top of his and then used maxed out Gastraphetes and Toxotes to kill everything. Thing is, when I play Age of Mythology I have a penchant for sadism and the gorgons' petrification amuses me more than most instant death attacks. I like kraken, arguses (argi?), mummies, and heka gigantes for the same reason.
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Dec 29, 2016 20:39
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Melth posted:I mostly go Hades so I can get 3 divine archery upgrades (Ares, Apollo, Artemis) on top of his and then used maxed out Gastraphetes and Toxotes to kill everything.
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Dec 29, 2016 21:24
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Melth posted:
 The only person cooler than Alexander is Ptolemy
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Dec 29, 2016 22:26
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Astroclassicist posted:
Hannibal is cooler
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Dec 29, 2016 23:02
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HannibalBarca posted:Hannibal is cooler Boudicca or bust.
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Dec 29, 2016 23:13
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Astroclassicist posted:
To lazily copy/paste from my history/nature photos blog (thesupremeexcellence.tumblr.com) since I was just talking about this guy; Alexander the Better There was this Macedonian king named Alexander who was great, and it’s not the one you’re thinking of. Alexander the Pretty Good mostly just overran the failingest empire in world history using the unstoppable army and alliance with other excellent armies which his father had built out of nothing. Oh and named twenty or thirty cities after his only pretty good self. But HE was named after his great-great-great grandfather Alexander I. Alexander I was a young prince when the Persians sent envoys to his father Amyntas and demanded they surrender to Persia. Amyntas did so because he wasn’t an idiot. In fact, he was pretty smart and decided to wine and dine the envoys so they’d give a favorable report back to Darius. The Persian messengers reciprocated by getting drunk and groping the women at the party. Now Alexander was a cosmopolitan young man and he realized that this was probably just the Persian way of politely asking to be thrown in a shallow grave. So he tells Amyntas, “Hey, Dad, I know being king is hard work and you’re getting on in years and all, so how about you go get some rest and I’ll entertain our charming guests?” Amyntas shows his sense again by warning his son against letting pride and anger on behalf of a few plunge the whole kingdom into a ruinous war, but Alexander reassures him that he’s got a plan which will work as long as Amyntas goes to bed right now and doesn’t ask questions. Amyntas does. These two are a highly successful father-son team, and it’s largely thanks to them that Macedonia was eventually able to become such an important part of the Greek world. So Alexander turns to the Persians and goes, “My father and I want to be good hosts, so you’re going to be not only feasted but bedded as no living man!” “Well this might just be the liquor talking, but that doesn’t sound ominous at all!” So they let Alexander usher the women out to go ‘bathe’, and the party goes on until an equal number of veiled Macedonians appear to lead the Persians off to bed. The other Persians outside are watching this enviously because they don’t know that the bed is a metaphor for getting their loving throats cut by the royal guard in drag. They also don’t know that there’s no need to feel left out, because while they were distracted Alexander got his other men in position to slaughter them all. Come morning, there’s nothing left but a few tired Macedonians whistling while they sweep up leftover dirt. Darius sent a team of investigators, but Amyntas was able to solemnly swear that he didn’t see what happened to the envoys, and Alexander bribed them for good measure. Darius shrugged and decided he was ok with his messengers vanishing into some sort of classical Bermuda Triangle as long as the Macedonians paid their taxes. Big mistake. See Amyntas and then Alexander kept acting like good little vassals, so when Darius finally got around to properly subjugating the region he left them officially in charge of all of it. And since Alexander was their number one Greek ‘ally’ and had carefully cultivated ties to Athens during the intervening years, Xerxes and his general Mardonius made Alexander their main ambassador to the Greeks. He used his position to leak the Persian battle plans to the enemy. Then after Athens defeated Persia at Salamis, the perennially worthless Spartans were thinking about sitting back and letting Athens be overrun alone by the remnants of the Persian army. So Alexander showed up to offer the Athenians incredibly sweet terms that they could gallantly refuse but then threaten to consider if the Spartans didn’t actually help. This made the Spartans decide to help. Alexander again leaked them the Persian plans and the Persians were crushed at the battle of Plataea. The Persian army fled for home through Macedonia, and Alexander’s army finally resolved the forty-year-old cold case by giving almost all of them a vivid demonstration of what had happened to their forebears. Thanks to Alexander I, Macedonia had been left alone during Darius’s rule and was now free from Persia forever. If you ask me, that was a much greater accomplishment than stomping on the broken and crumbling Persian empire and enslaving them in turn could ever be. Back on topic: I'll probably do the final tutorial mission tonight and then in the not-so-distant future it will be on to the actual game. So one more time, is there anything I should be doing differently in terms of the best way to make these videos?
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Dec 30, 2016 00:27
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Melth posted:To lazily copy/paste from my history/nature photos blog (thesupremeexcellence.tumblr.com) since I was just talking about this guy; The Persian Empire wasn't failing into a general period of decadence under Darius (contra Arrian) before the novel manner of Alexander's invasion, rather Alexander fought a war of a type not seen before by the Achaemenids - a war of total conquest rather than internal rebellion or minor border incursion. The very structures which produced the strength of the empire, its diversity and regional power bases all focused in on one king were revealed by Alexander (who played the political and military game brilliantly up to the conquest of Babylon) to also be weak to a successful military leader - much as Cyrus the Younger had almost proven before his loss at Cunaxa in 401. See Briant's Histoire de l'Empire Perse. De Cyrus à Alexandre (1996) for more. (My thesis will likely be on this exact period, and I'll stop distracting from the LP now)
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Dec 30, 2016 01:20
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Here is the third and final tutorial level: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_Df4h1UM2g This time there is definitely something wrong with the sound. Or several things wrong. For one thing, my mic seems to have picked up a ton of noise from the game this time even though I had the actual volume on minimum. This resulted in kind of an echo is places. I used audacity to try to clean up that noise, but it was imperfect and also seems to have distorted my voice a bit. Any suggestions? Or other tips or problems?
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Dec 30, 2016 07:51
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Melth posted:Theban bullshit. Aside from being an oligarchy how much is known about the government of Thebes? I have some knowledge of the Athenian and Spartan government since they're the two city-states everyone focuses on, but how hosed up was Thebes? Were they just really hostile to the other city-states or was there some really screwed up social organization like the Spartans had?
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Dec 30, 2016 08:35
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White Coke posted:Aside from being an oligarchy how much is known about the government of Thebes? I have some knowledge of the Athenian and Spartan government since they're the two city-states everyone focuses on, but how hosed up was Thebes? Were they just really hostile to the other city-states or was there some really screwed up social organization like the Spartans had? Well nowhere in the universe was as screwed up as Sparta's social organization if you ask me. The short answer to your question is that we really don't know much about the internal oligarchical government of Thebes. We do know a lot about how Thebes governed its neighbors (brutally and with a really paper thin veneer of it being a league rather than just their empire) and what the posts in that government were, but we know much less about the actual titles in Thebes's internal government when it was an oligarchy. There actually was a period after Sparta conquered them when a democracy arose and overthrew both Sparta and the allied oligarchs. This was not coincidentally the only period when the Thebans did decent stuff, and they actually ended up crushing Sparta and freeing many of the helots. And again, I know more about their government and its titles during this period than during the actual oligarchy. However, I'll bet my man Xenophon knew more since he wrote a bunch about them during this time period. As it happens, I got his book Hellenica for Christmas, so I may be able to tell you more in a couple of weeks.
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Dec 30, 2016 18:25
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What were oligarchies like in general in the ancient Greek city-states? If they have enough shared features, can it be safe to assume Thebes had those too, or are they all too different?
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Dec 30, 2016 19:02
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Do people have recommendations about the best kind of microphones for this purpose?
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Dec 31, 2016 01:26
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Age of Mythology has fond memories in my mind, but also some annoyances like the early bugs that stuck around for months at a time, off the top of my head: Longboats would generate favor faster then Hersirs for Loki, so the instant his Hersirs hit anything they would instantly summon myth units, you basically had to concede if you faced a Loki on mediterranean or other fishing heavy maps. Cancelling your techs at 99.9% would refund the full price and complete the tech, I noticed losing to that a couple times because the guy would have a fat amount of resources to play with after a age up. Set's monkeys summoned by the pharoah cost 1 favor and 1 population a piece but rivaled everyones main 2 pop infantry for strength, you would drown in a swarm of monkeys. What was everyones favorite to play as in multiplayer? for me it was Isis and focusing on a early villager and tech boom maxing out my population before hitting heroic, in the titan expansion being able to build town centers in classical was such a good change, I hated how games didn't really seem to begin until the third age in the age of empires series until then. Isis was a favorite just because of the extra population and economy bonuses I could none-stop spam spearmen at a measly 50 food 20 gold a piece, sure Set had better barracks upgrades, but he couldn't get the economy to really churn them out forever.
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Dec 31, 2016 03:54
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You might wanna turn down the game's audio a bit more. It's an RTS so I doubt there's gonna be anything too interesting being said most of the time while you will still probably comment.
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Dec 31, 2016 07:02
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I thought Isis was a favorite because of her crazy Monument bonus? Anyhow, it was always Odin for me.
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Dec 31, 2016 09:18
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Man, it seems like there could be a lot of micromanagement on the resource-gathering end. I suppose I'll have to see it in operation in actual missions to know for sure.
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Dec 31, 2016 10:32
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The game of my childhood! I was never good enough at this or aoe2 to do the higher difficulties/online stuff on account on picking civs based on how cool their wonder looks and only building fancy looking castles populated by the best units(5 villagers per resource is plenty, right? Gotta save that population for all my minotaurs  )
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Dec 31, 2016 15:04
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Asehujiko posted:The game of my childhood! I was never good enough at this or aoe2 to do the higher difficulties/online stuff on account on picking civs based on how cool their wonder looks and only building fancy looking castles populated by the best units(5 villagers per resource is plenty, right? Gotta save that population for all my minotaurs Kronos or Thor, end of discussion.
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Dec 31, 2016 15:16
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That's a weird way to say Loki or Ra Glazius posted:Man, it seems like there could be a lot of micromanagement on the resource-gathering end. I suppose I'll have to see it in operation in actual missions to know for sure. Its not that bad once you get out of the early ages. Though when you're first starting setting it all up can take a while.
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Dec 31, 2016 15:17
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I always played Egypt because Mummies and the Son of Osiris were cool.
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Dec 31, 2016 15:19
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SSNeoman posted:You might wanna turn down the game's audio a bit more. It's an RTS so I doubt there's gonna be anything too interesting being said most of the time while you will still probably comment. I had the volume set to minimum, but I'm thinking of maybe wearing headphones. The main thing is I want to hear attack alerts and troop trained sounds, so I can't just mute it. Various People posted:Major gods! Of course in the campaign I will never, ever get to choose a major god so I probably won't talk about this much. But I do have a favorite major god for each civilization and a decent argument as to why they're the best for serious play (though all are at least somewhat viable and have their own advantages). Greeks: Hades. Fantastic early power means you can't be rushed, useful technology boosts your gold income all game long (and gold is hard to come by in long games). And gastraphetes are probably the best unique Greek units, plus maximal Hades archer upgrades are usually better than Zeus's maximal infantry or Poseidon's maximal cavalry at least for my playstyle. The best part is that the minor gods you want to pick for upgrades also give you an excellent mix of myth units and good god powers. Norse: Loki. Fast, cheap ox carts are very nice. But of course it's really all about the hersir and myth units. Loki is unique here and can do stuff nobody else can with his spawning myth units mid-battle and so forth. Access to Forseti is a major advantage over Odin (the main rival since Thor's 2 dwarf start and armory focus are problematic), and if you get a randomly spawned Valkyrie (quite likely) then you've got the best healing of any Norse. And sole access to Hel is pretty darned nice if the game goes long. All 3 kinds of giants are great and only Loki can get them all- or have some of the best upgrades for them. Atlantean: Oranos. Hands down. Sky passages are amazing at all levels of play and sped up human soldiers is also great regardless of strategy. Not having access to Atlas for Implode does hurt, but it's no Earthquake or Meteor anyway. Seeing all settlements on the map is also a major perk. Chinese: Nu Wa. Kind of a sucky god power. But having like 30% more favor all game long is huge, as is free +10 population by the end (trumps Isis's pop bonus unless you get more than 3 town centers, which is rare). All human soldiers being cheaper is also a GREAT bonus and saves way more money than many other gods' perks that upgrades or myth units are cheaper since human soldiers are your main expense. Oh and the best minor god choices. Egypt: This is a tough one. I really, REALLY want to say Ra. And vs AI yeah, it's Ra. He's got the best Egyptian economy with his empowering priests and super empowering pharaoh. And super chariots and camels are great because those are THE Egyptian units. But for serious multiplayer it's Isis. Mainly because Isis's monuments that prevent enemy god powers are incredible. But also because Ra is conspicuously missing a bunch of the best god choices. No Anubis? No Nephthys? No Thoth? Now granted Bast is > Anubis for many purposes in theory but her upgrades are bugged and in multiplayer you often really need Anubis just because Anubites are cheaper than Sphinxes and you benefit a lot from defensive serpents. Nephthys is just the best Egyptian heroic age god and losing her screws over Ra's otherwise superior priests and pharaohs. And while Thoth has trash myth units, his god power and upgrades are awesome. I'm not saying you always want to pick Thoth by any means, Osiris is also excellent. But not having Thoth as an option when you need him is painful. Melth fucked around with this message at 19:50 on Dec 31, 2016 |
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Dec 31, 2016 19:46
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Zeus does, however, offer the Bolt power. During my brief experience with multiplayer, I enjoyed using Bolt on Nidhogg and the Son of Osiris far, far too much.
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Dec 31, 2016 20:07
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Cythereal posted:Zeus does, however, offer the Bolt power. During my brief experience with multiplayer, I enjoyed using Bolt on Nidhogg and the Son of Osiris far, far too much. Bolt makes Nidhogg and SoO pretty useless, yeah. 
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Dec 31, 2016 20:10
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Melth posted:I had the volume set to minimum, but I'm thinking of maybe wearing headphones. The main thing is I want to hear attack alerts and troop trained sounds, so I can't just mute it. The worst offender is you fighting with the tutorial voiceover. Presumably the following videos won't have that problem.
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Dec 31, 2016 20:21
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Yeah, I suggest letting the computer voices do their thing first in general before talking, even if what they're saying is rarely important and they're captioned on the screen anyway, the effect of two people talking at the same time makes you a bit hard to understand. And headphones are a good idea to stop echo from happening.
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Dec 31, 2016 20:31
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Xenophon's Hellenika is Cool and Good. Did you get the Landmark Edition? Thing with Xenophon is you have to keep in mind his biases (like: mercs should get paid, helots and poors can suck a dick,  is a bro)
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Dec 31, 2016 20:47
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I cosign Johnny Law's and Asehujiko's recommendations.
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Dec 31, 2016 21:06
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HannibalBarca posted:Bolt makes Nidhogg and SoO pretty useless, yeah. I think I read that the extended edition made it do scratch damage to them instead of instant killing. Which was lame. I mean, it used to do thousands even to a titan. Testing it again now, it deals about 33% damage to each and about 16% to titans. So sucky compared to how it use to be, but not worthless at least. HannibalBarca posted:I cosign Johnny Law's and Asehujiko's recommendations. Thank you, all three of you. I'll be trying the next one with headphones. It's the last one in which Athena talks much, and this time it's just a few lines (albeit at important times) instead of talking incessantly. the JJ posted:Thing with Xenophon is you have to keep in mind his biases (like: mercs should get paid, helots and poors can suck a dick, Yeah, definitely. But I mean you have to watch out for bias in history with any writer ancient or modern. Even if it's unintentional kinds of stuff. Heck, even Thucydides who is proverbially neutral and often criticized for that neutrality has a bit.
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Jan 1, 2017 00:29
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Melth posted:I think I read that the extended edition made it do scratch damage to them instead of instant killing. Which was lame. I mean, it used to do thousands even to a titan. Huh, that's interesting. I guess it's good that Bolt is no longer a *nightmare counter* to super-units, but I can't help but feel that that's a bit underwhelming. Ah well.
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Jan 1, 2017 01:10
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HannibalBarca posted:Huh, that's interesting. I guess it's good that Bolt is no longer a *nightmare counter* to super-units, but I can't help but feel that that's a bit underwhelming. Ah well. I actually liked Zeus having a hard counter to those things pretty well, but I suppose it's not a big deal either way. You know what IS a big deal either way? Fire Giant damage. It has been known since day 1 of this game that the displayed Fire Giant damage is nonsense. But I've never been able to find the truth anywhere. Even the normally accurate aomheaven tables are garbage on this count. Having tested things extensively, I can now say that the closest anyone came to the real numbers was this one silly fellow claiming that his particular computer was bugged so that Fire Giant normal attacks did triple damage and special attacks only did single damage. He was of course shouted down by even sillier fellows claiming the displayed numbers were right. So Fire Giants are displayed as dealing 15 hack damage and 5 crush damage per attack. No. I, Melth, have painstakingly scienced my way to the truth! The truth is that Fire Giants do TRIPLE this damage to nearly ALL targets. Human soldiers. Buildings. Siege units. Villagers. Animals. Triple damage all the time. But what about heroes and myth units? Well most sites say they do quarter damage to heroes. No. Not even close. They do full damage to heroes, putting them in a very exclusive club with almost no other myth units. Most sites also say they do double damage to myth units. No. They do SEXTUPLE damage. Now what about their special attack? Honestly, the upshot is that it's hard to predict. It's firing 3 projectiles which bounce around and hit or miss fairly unpredictably. Damage varies based on whether the target is moving or not. And how big it is. So tests vs units which were running around kept giving me different results. Testing vs Houses (small buildings), Temples (medium), and Wonders (huge) which all have the exact same armors had it deal 32 to the House and 96 to the Temple and Wonder. Now several sites had said what it did was 25 hack damage each for 3 fireballs. Wrong. But the aomheaven tables say the fireballs also do 15 crush damage. THAT actually fits, so they're right about that part. Now this means that the Fire Giant's special attack is actually inferior to its normal attack in not only DPS but even absolute damage against most targets (Sidenote, it won't even activate vs heroes or for some reason siege units). However, it's actually pretty good against densely packed human soldiers since it deals area damage. It's hard to predict how much each soldier will take, but fairly often guys a step or two BEHIND the primary target get hit by all 3 fireballs and therefore die. The main target usually gets hit by 2 and guys to his sides tend to as well. All in all, the Fire Giant is WAY better than the game says. Which is good, because the game numbers would make it one of the worst of all myth units for its price. It's probably still overpriced and its special splash attack is situationally either quite decent or an outright downgrade, which I don't like. But since the Norse are short on good mythic options anyway and really short on decent siege, it's still definitely going to be part of their armies.
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Jan 1, 2017 02:56
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The first episode of the actual campaign is ready! As one would expect from the first level of the game, it's an easy victory. Still, I point out a couple of really handy tips for winning it elegantly. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRf2RnTQSi8 Melth fucked around with this message at 08:09 on Jan 2, 2017 |
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Jan 2, 2017 08:05
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Oh man. This game and the rest of the series was a big part of my childhood. I loved playing the series. There's so much I remember about the workings of the Campaign. So something I noticed: The Black Sails soldiers started out non-upgraded, but as the mission went on, they turned into their Medium selves, and by the time the Atlantian Army showed up, they were upgraded to heavies. Since I never played Titan Campaign, I assume that enemies quickly upgrading their units becomes a big part of it. Also one curious thing for the cutscenes is that some units use their lower quality in game models, but others, like Hoplites use cutscene only models where they look more detailed and have a universal look, which looks the Heavy version with fully Upgraded Shields. I'm not sure if they made animations for them or not, since I do know one cutscene much later on where they moment they enter a cutscene battle, they swap back to their in-game models.
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Jan 2, 2017 08:57
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You could have showed off the kraken's special ability against normal soldiers. But there will be more chances. I had no idea armor upgrades benefited heroes too.
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Jan 2, 2017 10:50
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Do enemies get one god power per Age, same as you? Or can they just spam out half a dozen of them on later maps?
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Jan 2, 2017 14:19
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