Action, Buy, Cleanup - Dominion Strategy and Chat Thread

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StashAugustine: Mar 24, 2013; Do not trust in hope- it will betray you! Only faith and hatred sustain.

Elysium posted:

Weird daily game today. You can have any card you want, as long as it trashes another card. Also you can draw cards, if you want to trash more cards. If you want more actions you can trash a card to get them, so you can play more cards that trash cards. And if you want to automatically play the top card of your deck to trash more cards, that option is available to you.

But also there's Chapel so most of the trashing is irrelevant

(I won with a cheeky provice remodel)

# ? Feb 19, 2024 20:15

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# ? Apr 30, 2024 14:14

Carpator Diei: Feb 26, 2011

Mr. Squishy posted:

Fairgrounds. Maybe I underrate it, but it never struck me as particularly strong alt-vp.

Bit late to the conversation, but I think Fairgrounds is very good as long as it's part of a set that doesn't incentivize you to focus on only a few cards. In my experience, if there's at least one mixed pile or a card that comes with extra cards outside the supply, it's usually almost trivial to have 15 different cards in your final pile. I've rarely played a set with Fairgrounds where it didn't end up being a 6$ Province, and sometimes it can be better; and even in the worst case it's one VP more than a Duchy for only 1$ extra (I can't really see any scenario where you'd end up with less than 10 different cards unless you're actively trying and have very good trashing available).

# ? Feb 20, 2024 16:22

H2Omelon: Aug 31, 2009

Donald X posted:

Cornucopia & Guilds 2E leaked! Jay put up the rulebook accidentally, and well information wants to be free. As a result we'll have the cards playable on digital versions in advance; probably in a day or two on dominion.games and in several days on the Steam app version (since they need their builds approved). This hasn't changed the physical version, which we expect in our US warehouse around March 8.

https://www.riograndegames.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/02/CornucopiaGuilds.pdf

New Cards:

Carnival $5 Action - Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card into your hand and discard the rest.

Farmhands $4 Action - +1 Card, +2 Actions || When you gain this, you may set aside and Action or Treasure from your hand, and play it at the start of your next turn.

Farrier $2* Action - +1 Card, +1 Action, +1 Buy || Overpay: +1 Card at the end of this turn per $1 overpaid

Ferryman $5 Action - +2 Cards, +1 Action, Discard a card || Setup: Choose an unused Kingdom card pile costing $3 or $4. Gain one when you gain a Ferryman

Footpad $5 Action Attack - +2 Coffers, Each other player discards down to 3 cards in hand. || In games using this, when you gain a card in an Action phase, +1 Card

Infirmary $3* Action - +1 Card, You may trash a card from your hand. || Overpay: Play this once per $1 overpaid.

Joust $5 Action - +1 Card, +1 Action, +$1, You may set aside a Province from your hand to gain any Reward to your hand. Discard the Province in Clean-up.

Shop $3 Action - +1 Card, +$1, You may play an Action card from your hand that you don't have a copy of in play

Rewards:

Coronet $0* Action/Treasure/Reward - You may play a non-reward Action from your hand twice. You may play a non--reward Treasure from your hand twice.

Courser $0* Action/Reward - Choose two different options: +2 Cards; +2 Actions; +$2; gain 4 silvers

Demense $0* Action/Victory/Reward - +2 Actions, +2 Buys, Gain a Gold || Worth 1 VP per Gold you have

Housecarl $0* Action/Reward - +1 Card per differently named Action card you have in play

Huge Turnip $0* Treasure/Reward - +2 Coffers, +$1 per Coffers you have

Renown $0* Action/Reward - +1 Buy, This turn Cards cost $2 less

(There is 1 of each Reward in 2 player games, and 2 of each with 3+ players.)

# ? Feb 20, 2024 23:49

panko: Sep 6, 2005; ~honda best man~

# ? Feb 21, 2024 00:50

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

I'm quite surprised at the attack which draws a card when you gain a card - most cards like that have some way to trigger their own effect.
e: there's now a card called Huge Turnip.

Lifting this from reddit user EphesosX

quote:

Removed cards:

Cornucopia: Fortune Teller, Farming Village, Harvest, Horse Traders, Tournament (plus the 5 prizes).

Guilds: Doctor, Masterpiece, Taxman

I don't see anything to cry over, Horse Traders was the most useful there.

# ? Feb 21, 2024 01:39

Toshimo: Aug 23, 2012; He's outta line...

But he's right!

Horse Traders was dope and I will miss it.

# ? Feb 21, 2024 01:42

panko: Sep 6, 2005; ~honda best man~

horse traders is only good to reliably get a copy of a powerful 5-cost in the early game and sometimes for its +buy, the reaction side of it is almost never relevant and theres a lot of other stuff I�d rather open with on most boards (inc. silver/silver). it was the most interesting of the culled cards (other than tournament lol) so yeah nothing I�ll weep to lose

# ? Feb 21, 2024 01:49

Guy A. Person: May 23, 2003

Mr. Squishy posted:

I'm quite surprised at the attack which draws a card when you gain a card - most cards like that have some way to trigger their own effect.

Yeah will be curious to see the explanation in the secret history, my guess is because it is a passive global effect and doesn�t effect the power of the card itself he was fine leaving it to combo off whatever comes up. I�d imagine if it had its own gain effect it might be in danger of becoming one of those focal point cards that kind of takes over a kingdom.

# ? Feb 21, 2024 03:30

Dr. Video Games 0069: Jan 1, 2006; nice dolphin, nigga

H2Omelon posted:

Farmhands $4 Action - +1 Card, +2 Actions || When you gain this, you may set aside and Action or Treasure from your hand, and play it at the start of your next turn.

Is this the first card to let you play a (non-action) treasure outside of your buy phase?

# ? Feb 21, 2024 03:46

StashAugustine: Mar 24, 2013; Do not trust in hope- it will betray you! Only faith and hatred sustain.

Black Market famously, as well as Storyteller and I think a few others? Isn't there an event that has a similar effect?

# ? Feb 21, 2024 03:51

Doctor Spaceman: Jul 6, 2010; "Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

I liked Doctor :shrug:

# ? Feb 21, 2024 04:00

panko: Sep 6, 2005; ~honda best man~

there wasn't space, man

# ? Feb 21, 2024 04:05

StashAugustine: Mar 24, 2013; Do not trust in hope- it will betray you! Only faith and hatred sustain.

I wanted to like Doctor but it was somehow a worse Lookout

# ? Feb 21, 2024 04:20

Lottery of Babylon: Apr 25, 2012; STRAIGHT TROPIN'

Losing Horse Traders makes me sad. Cool card with a cool reaction, and being a reliable source of 5 gave it a nice niche.

Then again I'm also the idiot who's sad at losing Farming Village even though it is by far the least interesting of the 4-cost Villages-with-upside.

# ? Feb 21, 2024 05:16

Guy A. Person: May 23, 2003

StashAugustine posted:

Black Market famously, as well as Storyteller and I think a few others? Isn't there an event that has a similar effect?

Yeah there have been quite a few more especially in the most recent sets:
Herb Gatherer (one of the Auger pile), Courier and Specialist from Allies
Fortune Hunter and technically Mining Road (if you gained the treasure during your action phase) from Plunder; also Prepare from this set might be the Event you're thinking of since it lets you play cards at the start of your next turn

There's also the category of actions/events that return you to the action phase after being in the buy phase which originated with Villa from Empires and has appeared a few more times. Not technically the same thing but meets the requirement for "gets certain cool treasures into play for action phase shenanigans" if that's what you're after; one of my favorite examples of this is having Collection in play from the Prosperity upgrade, then gaining a bunch of horses or something to literally clear 1000 vp in a game

# ? Feb 21, 2024 05:28

Toshimo: Aug 23, 2012; He's outta line...

But he's right!

Horses are so stupid I love them so much

# ? Feb 21, 2024 05:31

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

DXV has shared the previews he was working on before the leak.

quote:

Monday:

Cornucopia & Guilds are small sets that were later combined into one box. They're getting the 2E treatment, and I'm here through Wednesday to tell you about what left and what got added. As usual the cards can be tried out on dominion.games, and will come out on both dominion.games and the Temple Gates Games version after previews are over. There will just be three days of previews, and I'll show off everything by the end of them.

Today, three replacements for Cornucopia cards.

Harvest -> Carnival

Harvest is the first card you think of when you hear that there will be a Cornucopia & Guilds 2E. It's just not very good.

Carnival shows that all it takes to fix it up is to have it draw cards instead of making $.

Fortune Teller -> Shop

Fortune Teller is both slow and weak. Relic is the fixed version.

Shop puts the idea from Conclave and Imp onto a card in the set that likes variety.

Horse Traders -> Ferryman

Horse Traders has lots of tiny text. That's really what's wrong with it. This kind of thing was done better later, and Guard Dog is basically the replacement for this.

Ferryman is some other thing. It's a card that comes with a card, providing a way to get variety into your deck.

Tuesday:

Here are more previews, this time replacements for Guilds cards. Note that Guilds also got a rules change: Coffers can now be converted whenever (on your turn). It's been like that online for a while.

Doctor -> Infirmary

Doctor has more randomness than I'd like. It's also super wordy.

Infirmary is a straight fixed version. It's less random and much simpler. Yes I'm saying that about a card that has you play itself N times.

Masterpiece -> Farrier

Masterpiece is a model of simplicity, but rarely useful.

Farrier doesn't try to imitate it; instead it's a new overpay card, giving you more cards for next turn. That's Wei-Hwa Huang in the art; this Farrier used to dive for pearls.

Taxman -> Footpad

Taxman is another wordy one, and not great.

Footpad spices up a basic Militia attack with a way to draw cards in games with it.

Wednesday:

The update pack has 100 cards, so we're not done yet.

Farming Village -> Farmhands

Farming Village is inoffensive; how am I replacing it? The thing is, it doesn't actually do anything. It plays very much like a plain village that costs $4. And that's great, so Farming Village seems fine, but man, I could have a card that actually does something.

Farmhands then is a village that also helps you deal with "this turn I sure could have used a village."

Tournament -> Joust

So at last it's come to this. Tournament is crazy complex - giving you a 2x2 grid of pay-offs to grok - and while some people love it, many hate it. I could try to make a version that was less hated and more loved and also simpler.

And that card is Joust. There's no pay-off grid, no blocking; it's less snowbally, though of course still snowbally, and it's more of a commitment to have one in your deck. And there's no Followers. In fact the prizes are all different, though a couple are basically just renamed. Furthermore there are 6 different ones, and you use 2 of each for games with 3+ players.

Princess -> Renown

This one just has the errata Princess was already getting, to not be a while-in-play ability.

Trusty Steed -> Courser

This just drops the Chancellor part for simplicity. (Chancellor?)

Bag of Gold -> Demesne

Bag of Gold gets upgraded by also being a village with +2 Buys, and being worth VP, there, now is it worth taking? Note that now there are three Rewards that are villages and two that give +Buy, rather than one of each from the Prizes.

Diadem -> Huge Turnip

A new treasure, rewarding you for piling up Coffers. Yes Cornucopia & Guilds is now really just one expansion.

Followers -> Housecarl

The replacement has no real connection. Housecarl plays into Cornucopia's variety theme.

[Blank] -> Coronet

And a 6th Reward, since there was space. A super-throne.

# ? Feb 21, 2024 10:13

Elysium: Aug 21, 2003; It is by will alone I set my mind in motion.

Daily app game today has Tournament, random or last tribute?

I got a 5-2 split and won the Tournament race but then got obliterated because I didn�t build Masquerade�

# ? Feb 21, 2024 16:56

panko: Sep 6, 2005; ~honda best man~

opened masquerade / tournament, then courtier/tournament on second shuffle. courtier is fairly strong because of its modality and a reliable +3 for 5 early on and I was able to buy a couple of provinces and start grabbing prizes by turn 6. masquerade is an unskippable opening buy on most boards its present on though

# ? Feb 21, 2024 17:08

H2Omelon: Aug 31, 2009

The secret history of Cornucopia and Guilds 2E: https://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=21897.0

# ? Feb 21, 2024 23:29

Pigma_Micron: Jan 24, 2005; I am putting myself to the fullest possible use, which is all I think that any conscious entity can ever hope to do.

Ok, I may be late to this but, I just opened the Temple Gates app on an ipad and... it has the log visible all the time. Why on god's green earth is that only on the IOS version? Ok, sure, on a phone the sacrifice may be worth it but, on my PC monitor? It should be there.

Now, maybe I'm an idiot and there's a setting I'm missing (though there doesn't seem to be many settings at all).

Hopefully it's coming to all the versions.

That said, I bit the bullet and grabbed the launch set and I really don't regret it (though, yes, it was a lot of money). The computer oponent is really quite good. I'm hoping to improve, myself.

# ? Feb 26, 2024 01:50

keldon: May 14, 2009

Pigma_Micron posted:

Ok, I may be late to this but, I just opened the Temple Gates app on an ipad and... it has the log visible all the time. Why on god's green earth is that only on the IOS version? Ok, sure, on a phone the sacrifice may be worth it but, on my PC monitor? It should be there.

If you open the log, there's a blue > button in the top left that will make it always visible. Should be available on all versions (which are almost entirely the same as each other).

Glad you're enjoying the AI opponent! Was a long, hard road for sure.

# ? Feb 26, 2024 03:30

Pigma_Micron: Jan 24, 2005; I am putting myself to the fullest possible use, which is all I think that any conscious entity can ever hope to do.

keldon posted:

If you open the log, there's a blue > button in the top left that will make it always visible. Should be available on all versions (which are almost entirely the same as each other).

Glad you're enjoying the AI opponent! Was a long, hard road for sure.

I am extremely pleased to be an idiot! Thank you very much.

# ? Feb 26, 2024 03:44

Toshimo: Aug 23, 2012; He's outta line...

But he's right!

After playing with the Steam app a bit, I find that it's clean, functional, and absolutely impossible to play on. They got a bit too cute with their UI and between making it very difficult to follow pile sizes, the log, what's happening in trash/exile/duration, it's unfortunate that they've taken a step back from the UI of their predecessors.

# ? Feb 26, 2024 03:47

taser rates: Mar 30, 2010

The only thing that really bothers me so far is that you can queue actions during your opponent's turn but it doesn't cancel the queue when you need to make a decision due to something they did.

# ? Feb 26, 2024 04:52

Elysium: Aug 21, 2003; It is by will alone I set my mind in motion.

Won the daily today because the AI decided it REALLY liked Horses, and spent several turns buying double Stampede, then playing Horse x 10 and buying double Stampede again.

# ? Feb 27, 2024 15:21

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

That's called a Golden Deck.

# ? Feb 27, 2024 15:58

zooted heh: Oct 16, 2005; str8 mercin burgers my nigga

Could someone explain how to make the physical copy of the game 5 to 6 players?

I just bought the base game but the wording on the intrigue set says it has base cards to make a 5 or 6 player game but reading the wiki also says the 2nd edition of intrigue lost all the base cards to make that happen.

Should I return the base game and just buy the double box set with the base game and intrigue? Seem like that set comes with the base cards.

# ? Feb 29, 2024 13:32

welcome: Jun 28, 2002; rail slut

There's a Base Cards set that just has the treasures/VP/etc.

# ? Feb 29, 2024 13:41

Toshimo: Aug 23, 2012; He's outta line...

But he's right!

zooted heh posted:

Could someone explain how to make the physical copy of the game 5 to 6 players?

I just bought the base game but the wording on the intrigue set says it has base cards to make a 5 or 6 player game but reading the wiki also says the 2nd edition of intrigue lost all the base cards to make that happen.

Should I return the base game and just buy the double box set with the base game and intrigue? Seem like that set comes with the base cards.

I know this doesn't answer your question but the game plays very poorly with more than 4 players and thats probably why they discontinued support for it.

# ? Feb 29, 2024 13:42

zooted heh: Oct 16, 2005; str8 mercin burgers my nigga

That's what I thought was going on. it seems like 2nd edition kinda walks away from that mechanic. I just will sometimes have a 5th person to play with and was wondering how to do that now.

# ? Feb 29, 2024 13:55

Jabor: Jul 16, 2010; #1 Loser at SpaceChem

You can get a set of just the base cards (intended for if you just want to play expansions without getting the base set), which might be an option.

Or just deal with the supply being a little short on Estates and Coppers, it's not like people are going to be buying them out in most games.

# ? Feb 29, 2024 14:03

Poopy Palpy: Jun 10, 2000; Im da fwiggin Poopy Palpy XD

1. Make absolutely sure there's not something else to play with 5 players.
2. Have you considered playing a 3 and a 2? Hey, Dominion is good at those counts and you've got the base cards for two games at once.
3. Ok, fine. Set up as normal, but with twice the normal amount of treasure and 3 Provinces per player.
4. In theory you should set up extra curses (10 * one less than the number of players) but it's not going to be relevant because
5. Don't play with attack cards. You want this to end at some point. You might want to veto cantrips too.
6. The game ends when the provinces are depleted or any four supply piles are empty.

# ? Feb 29, 2024 14:12

Aston: Nov 19, 2007; Okay
Okay
Okay
Okay
Okay

3 and 2 is good (or with 6, 2 v 2 v 2) because after the game you can swap kingdoms and play again straight away

# ? Feb 29, 2024 14:26

panko: Sep 6, 2005; ~honda best man~

45% winrate for my first month of daily dominion :unsmith:

I�m impressed by the AI�s ability to build towards a cohesive deck on kingdoms with good sources of +action and +buy that looks like it�s durdling until turn 13-15 and then goes off with consecutive multi-province turns. on boards where I can�t readily spot the big combo I tend to buy green a little earlier than it does and as such need a bit of luck to get the w. I�ve been looking forward to playing against it every day so it was well worth the cost

keldon posted:

Glad you're enjoying the AI opponent! Was a long, hard road for sure.

excellent work!

# ? Feb 29, 2024 17:39

distortion park: Apr 25, 2011

One of the best things about the mobile app is how fast it starts. Like Slice and Dice it makes it so easy to pick up for a couple of minutes

# ? Feb 29, 2024 17:46

panko: Sep 6, 2005; ~honda best man~

one of the funniest things in the game is when I build a huge early lead on the AI that makes winning impossible for it and it �gives up� and starts doing things like buying three copper every turn

# ? Feb 29, 2024 17:49

Doctor Spaceman: Jul 6, 2010; "Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

It seems like purchases aren't just tied to accounts. If I log into my account on my daughter's computer I can play with all of the expansions we own combined, not just mine (and the same happens if she logs into her account on my computer). Doesn't work on my phone though.

# ? Mar 7, 2024 11:13

jivjov: Sep 13, 2007; But how does it taste? Yummy!; Dinosaur Gum

At this rate, dark ages 2e is all but an inevitability. I really hope we get an alchemy 2e too though because why not? Revisit the premise and make more people love Alchemy

# ? Mar 9, 2024 23:58

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# ? Apr 30, 2024 14:14

Guy A. Person: May 23, 2003

jivjov posted:

At this rate, dark ages 2e is all but an inevitability. I really hope we get an alchemy 2e too though because why not? Revisit the premise and make more people love Alchemy

Alchemy 2e/a set with more potion stuff is the one thing he has pushed back on repeatedly due to the issues with the potion mechanic in general, so I would be curious if he would consider it, since it sounds like it may need a full ground up re-write of the mechanics and cards and not just a few fixed cards and some minor rules adjustments. The secondary hurdle is that Alchemy was a smaller set and doesn't have a partner small set to pair it with like Guilds and Corn had.

On the other hand it kind of doesn't make sense to have multiple Dominion apps where you now have the polished, updated versions of these sets sitting alongside an old set even the creator himself hates, so it might make sense for him to say "gently caress it" and redo the set so you no longer have degenerate cards sneaking in alongside much more balanced and fun ones.

# ? Mar 10, 2024 00:45

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Action, Buy, Cleanup - Dominion Strategy and Chat Thread

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