Action, Buy, Cleanup - Dominion Strategy and Chat Thread

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Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

thespaceinvader posted:

Nah there are definitely people like that.

I remember one game where the guy introduced himself by saying 'i play my turns as slow as possible'.

I said 'don't', he said 'nah', I resigned because gently caress that noise.

You got Ebdon'd

# ¿ Feb 11, 2017 15:00

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# ¿ May 21, 2024 00:00

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Puts paid to someone's hope for a starting hand of entirely expansion cards though, unless you just decide to throw in Shelters anyway, which is your right.

# ¿ Oct 24, 2017 13:24

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

What's the art on Envy? A fish-man trapped in a bottle giving us side eye as other fish frolic in a storm?

# ¿ Oct 26, 2017 12:16

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Dominion-theme question: is there a fairy-tale I don't know where a goat eats a pixie?

# ¿ Nov 17, 2017 14:34

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

I just had a game with Devil's Workshop, Talisman, and Hamlet for +buy. I had no idea how many cards I was getting until I Scavengered something from my discard pile and was confronted with a terrifying crush of cards. Imps are a lot of fun, I love how you end up buying things you may not otherwise just to have something to play with it for... efficiency?

Mr. Squishy fucked around with this message at 01:43 on Dec 17, 2017

# ¿ Dec 17, 2017 01:40

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Is Nocturn the first set that allows for infinite Madman plays? Necromancer's wording seems to beat a trashed Madman's desire to return to his pile which could lead to some weird games.

# ¿ Dec 21, 2017 12:20

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

I hadn't noticed that the draw was conditional... foiled again!

# ¿ Dec 21, 2017 15:32

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Since we're posting games, i had one where my opponent was buying money when there were Villages and Council Rooms to help me buy multiple Peddlers for free, which helped me buy Expands and Kings Courts. Game ended with me gaining four Colonies in a turn.

# ¿ Jan 3, 2018 10:48

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

I lost a game where I had 2 of the Highways to his 8, and resigned after he had a 7-Province turn.

# ¿ Jan 10, 2018 00:29

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Has anyone had any success in ignoring Sauna/Avantos? I kinda hate when they're in the kingdom because I know what my first... 6 or so turns will be.

# ¿ Jan 27, 2018 11:49

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

I'm not sure how I feel about Nocturne as a whole, but Shepard (paired with Gear) made me happy to draw a hand of five estates. And making things like that possible is a sign of a good card.

# ¿ Feb 5, 2018 17:22

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

To use this thread to brag about a combo I spotted: game w/ Donate, Death Cart and Grand Market, use the first two buys for a Silver and Cart, then Donate to trash down to just those two and the two ruins that come with the Cart. Then keep buying Markets and a ruin to throw to the Cart until I was able to buy Colonies. Cleanest Donate game I ever played.

# ¿ Aug 22, 2018 20:32

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Teaser's up and Dominion Online has preview cards up too. I like this guy

"There's no other trashing on the board, what the hell are you going to do?"

# ¿ Sep 24, 2018 10:36

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Yeah, of the selection that one leapt out at me as being useful. In boards w/ Militia's it's much less good, as you're going to be picking up that copper you could stand to lose. Priest works when you can line it up w/ a throne room, I'm not sure how good it is when you can only play it once though. Village/Priest/[second trasher] leaves not a lot of room left in your hand. I guess Lurker would be a fun combo? Scholar works really well if you've can find payload in the actions, pairs nicely with Festival.
I have no opinions on cards outside of the base set, as it happens.

# ¿ Sep 24, 2018 16:22

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

It turns out that Priest works really well w/ the Ritual event. Spend $4, trash a card to get its cost in VP, gain $[2xPriests in play] immediately and a curse to trash w/ the Priest later on.

# ¿ Sep 24, 2018 16:58

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Flag bearer is an interesting little bit of second player advantage.

# ¿ Sep 27, 2018 09:30

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

That's how DXV gets you. I don't know how reasonable upgrade packs are priced though.

# ¿ Sep 27, 2018 12:51

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Star Charts is obviously very useful. I'd like to play around with Innovation, that one seems odd.

# ¿ Sep 28, 2018 11:39

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

I've mocked the Dominion dot net AI for goofy trashing, but a presumed real person, who talks in chat, just Exorcised a Colony to gain a ghost.

# ¿ Oct 4, 2018 17:11

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

A thought that occurs is that immediately after an expansion w/ a lot of powerful one-shot Treasures (Lamp for Wishes, Mirror for Ghosts), Donald introduces Treasurer, the first thing that can fish Treasures out of the trash.

# ¿ Oct 9, 2018 12:54

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

The wildest card in there is Capitalism. It's a $5 project that gives every Action that pays out money the Treasure type. They can now be played like a Treasure for the money stated, so no more colliding terminal silvers at the most basic interaction. Beyond that, for instance, Bandit becomes a murderer, Forager can outdo Platinum, etc etc etc.

# ¿ Nov 5, 2018 14:16

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Fleet is essentially insurance against someone's tricky three-pile shenanigans. So something I would not be able to take advantage of playing in person where we don't have vp counters or engage in shenanigans.

# ¿ Nov 5, 2018 14:30

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

A lot of the top players (going by the online client's leaderboard) have youtube accounts where they post videos of league matches, most of them w/ audio commentary where they explain their thinking. Checking just now, every single one of the top 5 have active channels. My personal favourite is Mic Qsenoch but I think he's taking a sabbatical, so maybe SamE, RTT or Burning Skull. But like I say, they're all at it, so if you're up for watching 6 games played over 3 hours, you can probably find someone for you.
There's also the Dominion discord where they all hang out and post about which card's the best.

Mr. Squishy fucked around with this message at 17:53 on Dec 10, 2018

# ¿ Dec 10, 2018 17:49

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Amby for me is almost a snap pick to buy 2 for the opening for every game it's in. Its like the one Attack card that's actually fully rude.

# ¿ Jun 23, 2019 00:40

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

The discord is currently taking about "horse tokens", which is presumably a delusion caused by an information starved mind.

# ¿ Jan 8, 2020 15:55

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Previews!

Menagerie Previews 1: 5 Cards posted:

So, it's come to this. Previews. I suppose I have myself to blame.

Menagerie - hey isn't that the name of a card? - has 400 cards, like Adventures. That includes 30 Kingdom cards. There are two major themes: Exile and Horses. There are also two kinds of landscapes: Ways and Events, with 20 of each. I'll do the math for you: 30 kingdom cards is 300 cards, plus 30 randomizers is 330, plus 40 landscapes is 370, and I'll just tell you now that there are 30 Horses. That means no Victory cards, and no other surprise extra piles.

Day 2 of previews will cover Horses, and day 3 Exile; day 4 will have landscapes, and day 5 will have... some more cards. Here on day 1 we have 5 miscellaneous cards, to get you started with a bunch, because as before the cards are immediately try-out-able at dominion.games.

Card images:

Snowy Village gives you a bunch of actions and a buy, but closes the door on even more actions that turn. Some of you may remember this from the holiday joke cards that were on dominionstrategy a few years ago. I wouldn't be expecting those other cards, but this one was worth doing.

Sheepdog gives Dominion another blue dog. You can play it anytime you gain a card. It may not even be your turn. Playing it means you put it into play and get your +2 Cards; it will be discarded in that turn's Clean-up, even if it's not yours. Using the Reaction part doesn't use up an Action; it just leaps into play and draws you cards. If it draws you another Sheepdog, you can use that one right away too; you can keep playing Sheepdogs until you run out of them.

Animal Fair gives you a weird way to pay for it. The card costs $7; the alternate payment just applies when you're buying one. At the point at which you'd pay your $7, you can trash an Action from your hand instead (and can do this when you don't have $7). And then what do you get, you get +$4 and some number of Buys.

Kiln is another in the long line of Explorers. It most easily gains Treasures, but if you can play an Action after it, you can gain a copy of that, and it can even gain Night cards.

And finally Barge is a Duration card with an effect you can have now or later. Handy if you don't want to draw dead cards, or have drawn your deck already. If you take it now, it's just discarded that turn. All the sets seem to squeeze in a few Duration cards these days, and this set has four of them.

Again, those of you on dominion.games, you can probably try the cards right about now.

# ¿ Mar 2, 2020 11:23

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

jivjov posted:

Is Barge the first time we've seen that "Either now or later" effect?

I believe so. It was one of the text fragments posted in the preview preview, so DXV is obviously pretty proud of it.

Roluth posted:

Barge isn't Wharf, but it still seems pretty good. Smithy with a +buy stapled onto it is still fine, and the delay effect could be helpful for smoothing.

There's a joke that there's a missing link between Smithy (+3 Cards) and Margrave (+3 Cards, + Buy, Attack) and Tragic Hero (+3 Cards, + Buy, Treasure gain thingy). Barge adds to this fossil record. It's no Wharf, but it's good, and +3 cards at the start of a turn is really helpful. I've not yet put in in a Throne Room, I wonder if you can set it so on one play it draws, the other it waits. Probably!
Sheepdog is conditionally useful, but w/ a lot more conditions than Faithful Hound. Sometimes it can do nothing but draw dead cards after you buy something in the Buy Phase. Other times it can be a really nice burst of drawing for free. Kiln is neat, I love how finickity it is that it only targets the very next card played. Animal Fair feels like it should be pretty strong accelerant, but having it take two buys (one for the lovely $2 cantrip, the other to trash in exchange) actually makes it less scary than you might think. Also, frequently the + Buy will never trigger.

# ¿ Mar 2, 2020 17:53

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Menagerie Previews 2: Horses posted:

Horse is a non-supply pile. There are 30 of them. You get one via a card saying "gain a Horse" or something. If the pile is empty you can't gain one, but let's hope that doesn't happen much. Horse looks like this:

So Horse is a one-use Laboratory; it puts you up a card and then is gone. Or, you know, you don't have to play it; you can Remodel it or something. It's there for you. Once in your deck, it's just like Experiment, from Renaissance; it turns out, they were experimenting on Horses. Eight total kingdom cards use Horses, and four landscapes. Here are some of those kingdom cards.

Supplies is an easy one: when you play it, you get a Horse. The Horse goes onto your deck, so normally you'll just start with it next turn.

Scrap gives you a choice of bonuses, with more stuff for trashing a more expensive card. You could for example trash an Estate and get +1 Card and +1 Action, or trash a Horse and get +1 Buy, a Silver, and a Horse.

Livery makes everything that's expensive enough come with a Horse that turn. This works on cards you buy, or cards you get other ways. With two Liveries, everything comes with two Horses. With two Liveries, and you buy Farmland, trashing Remodel to gain a Border Village which comes with a Laboratory, you gain six Horses. Many Horses could be yours.

# ¿ Mar 3, 2020 10:54

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Donald was not afraid of loving w/ tempo this game. Bounty Hunter and Stockpile both easily give you $5 or more on your second shuffle (after which they quickly peter out), and Animal Fair is a +$4 card that you can nab for probably less than $3 (over the course of two buys, which hurts more than a lot of people seem to think).

Mr. Squishy fucked around with this message at 17:17 on Mar 4, 2020

# ¿ Mar 4, 2020 17:15

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Previews day four: Ways and Events posted:

First we have Ways. There are 20 of these. Okay so. They're landscape cards like Events and Landmarks and Projects. You deal them out the same way, except, don't use more than one Way per game (that's my advice anyway). A Way gives an alternate use to all Action cards that game. When you play an Action card, pick, do you want its normal function, or do you want the Way. If you want the Way, you just do what the Way says, that's that. It's like Action cards all say, "Choose one: that Way thing, or what this normally does." We turn the Action card sideways to remember which ones did the Way. Stuff below a dividing line is unaffected; if it's like, "While this is in play, something something," that will still happen.

Ways work any time you play an Action card. This means for example that if you play Sheepdog via its reaction, that can still use a Way if you want. If you Throne Room a card, it could be the Way the first time, not-the-Way the second time, or any combination. As always there's a rulebook, you'll get to see it eventually.

Way of the Ox is a simple one: +2 Actions. In games with this, every Action card can instead be used for +2 Actions. Your hand is nothing but Smithies? Play one for +2 Actions and away you go. Or, what was that thing from two days ago? Horses, that's right. Way of the Ox lets you play a Horse for +2 Actions, and still have it for later. And a Necropolis, well, uh, maybe the next one will be better for Necropolis.

Way of the Mole is also simple, there are a bunch of simple ones.

Way of the Turtle is a trickier one. It lets you play any card to set itself aside and replay it next turn. Way of the Turtle says "this" on it, but that's the card you played, it's not Way of the Turtle itself. You don't want your Moneylender this turn, so you Turtle it, and play it at the start of your next turn. I hear you asking, but wait, when you play it next turn, can't you just use Way of the Turtle again to save it for the turn after that? Yes, of course you can. If you want, it can be Turtles all the way down.

Online, you can click on a button on an Action card to instead do the Way with one click. You can also click on the Way itself, highlighting it, then click on an Action in hand. Cards like Throne Room and Vassal pause to give you a chance to use the Way on the extra play.

Menagerie also has 20 Events. They're just like the ones in Adventures and Empires, only new. In your Buy phase, you can use a Buy and pay the cost to generate the effect. Some of the Events involve Horses or Exile, but many don't, including these three.

Toil gives you a way to turn cash into playing Action cards from your hand. It's a secret village, for certain kinds of things. And if you just have $2 left you can't do anything useful with, you can Toil ironically.

Commerce makes some amount of Gold, depending on the variety of cards you've gained this turn. Scrap an Estate for a Silver and a Horse and you're well on your way.

Populate is a big one. You gain one card from each Action supply pile. Foosh! That's potentially 10 cards in a game without Ruins or Young Witch, though some piles may not be Actions, and if a good pile ran out, tough luck. And you can't say, "no I don't want that Beggar and that Ruined Library." You get to pick the order they show up, or online can click on a "random order" button when you don't care.

# ¿ Mar 5, 2020 09:26

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

More tunnel enabling. Also, I have no clue how Populate is good.
e: or Commerce. When are you gaining multiple cards and suddenly want a bunch of Gold flooding your deck?

Mr. Squishy fucked around with this message at 09:34 on Mar 5, 2020

# ¿ Mar 5, 2020 09:29

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Many Horses can be yours

I did this a few times in the game and ended w/ an 80+ card deck and I think all of the horses.

# ¿ Mar 5, 2020 11:58

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Yeah, my initial reaction was thinking about the many sloggy games with no villages or decent cantrips, and you're spending ten to get a lot of terminals of questionable usefulness.

# ¿ Mar 5, 2020 15:45

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

"Menagerie Previews Day 5: More Cards posted:

And here we are with... more cards.

I warned you that there were more Duration cards. Here's Mastermind, which is like King's Court but slower. You can King's Court a King's Court in one turn; with Mastermind that's play Mastermind, next turn Mastermind a Mastermind, next turn actually play three things three times.

Menagerie has two minor themes I didn't mention yet. Surprise! The first one is reaction cards; there are five of them. Five! Four of them do the trick Sheepdog did of letting you play them at an unusual time; Black Cat is one of those. It's a Witch they have to activate for you. I will just point out now: when they gain a Province and that lets you use Black Cat, the other players gain Curses and that lets them use Sheepdogs.

The other minor theme is cards with weird costs; there are four of these, including Animal Fair. Wayfarer's weird cost is whatever the previous card cost. You could play Bureaucrat, gain a Silver, then Wayfarer costs $3. Or with two Buys, buy a Copper, now Wayfarer costs $0. Or buy an Engineer for 4 Debt and well now Wayfarer costs 4 Debt.

That's all the previews you were expecting! The cards will continue to be playable online through the weekend, then vanish, then come out properly online when the physical version is out. We still expect it around March 18.

This time for no special reason I am going to keep previewing cards until the set comes out or the rulebook is posted. These cards won't be playable online (until the whole set comes out), they will just be images to look at and ponder. I'll do one a day, and if people request stuff they'd like to see, I'll try to pick one of those things. They can be kingdom cards or sideways ones.

# ¿ Mar 6, 2020 10:13

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

That doesn't work, as it's still your turn.

# ¿ Mar 6, 2020 10:57

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Black cat seems inconsequential in 2p but I'm imagining it in 3p Ambassador games where it seems awful. I think in most games if your opponent is greening they won't mind getting a curse, at least compared to how much you mind having stuffed your own deck with awful terminal draw.

# ¿ Mar 6, 2020 11:58

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

All of the Throne Room variants have that though. That it happens at the absolute start of your turn makes it a little less flexible I'll grant you. But spending the action in the previous turn has advantages too. Compare drawing Throne Room and Smithy on the same hand, where you're likely to draw 6 dead cards, to drawing Mastermind and subsequently drawing Smithy. If anything it's the second most reliable variant yet (after Royal Carriage) because you'll be looking at five cards to maybe be a useful action, as opposed to only four.

# ¿ Mar 6, 2020 15:31

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Those are all good points I had failed to consider. Just play enough games that fluking a loss is averaged out into nothingness.

# ¿ Mar 6, 2020 15:53

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Bonus Preview 1 posted:

People asked for various things, but the big one was Ways, everyone wants to see more. Someone wanted the "vice-versa" card and someone wanted the most rule-bending things, so here's all three of those, and the most exotic thing in the set.

Durations are tricky. It only applies to this turn; if you play Merchant Ship using Way of the Chameleon, you get +2 Cards this turn and +$2 next turn. Also some things get you cards but aren't "+Cards"; Way of the Chameleon doesn't apply to them. There will be a rulebook eventually!

# ¿ Mar 7, 2020 17:34

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# ¿ May 21, 2024 00:00

Mr. Squishy: Mar 22, 2010; A country where you can always get richer.

Bonus Preview 2 posted:

Here's another Way, for you people hungry for Ways. Despite Way of the Chameleon, they are mostly very simple, whether vanilla like Way of the Ox, or just, you know, simple, like Way of the Rat.

In games with Way of the Rat, everything can gain copies of itself. There you have it.

# ¿ Mar 8, 2020 09:55

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Action, Buy, Cleanup - Dominion Strategy and Chat Thread

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