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I think that the long term AFCE futility is due to insidious agents of Belichick himself. Also lol if you think a team was legitimately twice as good as every other team over the course of twenty years
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Jan 17, 2017 20:50
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A Buff Gay Dude posted:It's almost like if the team gets to beat up on guaranteed patsies 6 times a year they will be well rested and healthy for the actual hard games on their schedule. Over the last twenty years... The Dolphins are ranked 9th in non-divisional wins, ahead of the Jets 13th and Bills 24th. The Dolphins and Jets have been above average teams that have been kept down by having to play the Patriots twice a year more then being a patsy. The Dolphins have a near identical record to the Seahawks over that span. One interesting weird thing... the NFC West has the 26th (49'ers), 27th (Cardinals) and 30th (Rams) worst teams. That's just weird. Kalli fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Jan 17, 2017 |
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Jan 17, 2017 20:53
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A Buff Gay Dude posted:It's almost like if the team gets to beat up on guaranteed patsies 6 times a year they will be well rested and healthy for the actual hard games on their schedule. it should be viewed as those teams eating losses to a good team rather than that team being gifted wins.
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Jan 17, 2017 20:56
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I would venture to say that home teams should win 60-70% in the playoffs just by venture of being better on average. That's not much of a home field advantage. In the second round you are probably looking at a 2-3 game win disparity in average, between the home and road team. That works out to 60-70% win rate I bet. First and third rounds are probably much closer because the teams are more evenly matched. First round games are always full of road teams with better records, for example.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:00
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Groovelord Neato posted:the afc east being bad has no effect on the pats. their winrate within division since 2003 is 77.9 percent. outside of the division it drops to...77.2 percent. my bad. The Bills are a good team Kalli posted:Over the last twenty years... The Dolphins are ranked 9th in non-divisional wins, ahead of the Jets 13th and Bills 24th. I'm just not sure how much I trust any analysis that says "no, the Dolphins have actually been good for the last 14 years" Like OK I can buy that they haven't been total garbage, but they've also gone 1-15 over that stretch and been so bad at the QB position that they decided to just spend a year snapping the ball directly to Ricky Williams TheChirurgeon fucked around with this message at 21:08 on Jan 17, 2017 |
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Jan 17, 2017 21:05
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Kalli posted:Over the last twenty years... The Dolphins are ranked 9th in non-divisional wins, ahead of the Jets 13th and Bills 24th. Don't bother Or do bother and prepare for back pedaling Edit lol see above. What kind of straw man sarcasm is that?
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Jan 17, 2017 21:06
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The dismissal of the AFCE as being weak is not as easily brushed off as the Pats hivemind seems to think. How many times has the AFCN sent multiple teams to the playoffs, including a stretch of years where they sent 3. If the AFCE was good, why was the only time they sent 2 or more to the playoffs like 2000, 2008 and 2009?
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Jan 17, 2017 21:07
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MY NIGGA D-LINK posted:The dismissal of the AFCE as being weak is not as easily brushed off as the Pats hivemind seems to think. How many times has the AFCN sent multiple teams to the playoffs, including a stretch of years where they sent 3. If the AFCE was good, why was the only time they sent 2 or more to the playoffs like 2000, 2008 and 2009? The AFC North is probably/certainly the strongest division. I don't think anyone would say the AFC East is a strong division, it's more if they're just middling or actually weak. You can definitely make the case that the AFC South and NFC West are worse. That said, I'd lean more towards calling the rest of the AFC East bad. The dolphins are in that horrible middle zone where they're always good enough to get people's hopes up then be a mirage.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:14
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Again that kinda forgets the point - the AFCEAST is hurt by having to play a team as dominant as NE. Comparing out of division records is the only fair way and it's been done. Guess what - NE hurts the other 3 more than they help. If anything NE helps themselves by forcing these teams to get better by trying to beat them, and they keep rebuilding I'm saying we aren't the best but we're not the absolute worst. It's not like we've got 3 Clevelands running around
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Jan 17, 2017 21:15
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Amy Pole Her posted:I'm saying we aren't the best but we're not the absolute worst. It's not like we've got 3 Clevelands running around Yeah I think the NFC West is the clear winner for worst, it's just they're all terrible so that nobody consistently beats up on the other three. Seattle has been good relatively recently but before that they were the guys winning their division with a losing record.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:19
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Amy Pole Her posted:Again that kinda forgets the point - the AFCEAST is hurt by having to play a team as dominant as NE. Really it's less about "how good are these teams in the AFC East" and more a referendum on the state of Quarterback play I guess--outside of Tannehill, on whom I'll just say "opinions vary," the QB situations in the division have not been great. Comparatively, even the AFC South has done better in that regard.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:21
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MY NIGGA D-LINK posted:The dismissal of the AFCE as being weak is not as easily brushed off as the Pats hivemind seems to think. How many times has the AFCN sent multiple teams to the playoffs, including a stretch of years where they sent 3. If the AFCE was good, why was the only time they sent 2 or more to the playoffs like 2000, 2008 and 2009? Because the Browns have been the worst team in football by a country mile and the Bengals have been about as good as the Bills overall outside of their division (47% vs 45.8% win rate 22nd & 24th overall). TheChirurgeon posted:I'm just not sure how much I trust any analysis that says "no, the Dolphins have actually been good for the last 14 years" Sure and they also won 8-10 games 6 times since Brady came around, and didn't go to the playoffs any of those years. (twice each at 8,9,10 wins). They did go twice, both requiring 11 wins. A few extra wins against a non-Patriots caliber team over that span and they're not really any different then the Cowboys. TheChirurgeon posted:Really it's less about "how good are these teams in the AFC East" and more a referendum on the state of Quarterback play I guess--outside of Tannehill, on whom I'll just say "opinions vary," the QB situations in the division have not been great. Comparatively, even the AFC South has done better in that regard. Oh yeah, QB play has been pretty bad no doubt. Tannehill's underrated overall, he's a perfectly fine starting franchise QB that people hate because he hasn't gone to the playoffs, but with a better team around him he's indistinguishable from the likes of Andy Dalton or Joe Flacco. Kalli fucked around with this message at 21:23 on Jan 17, 2017 |
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Jan 17, 2017 21:21
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Kalli posted:Because the Browns have been the worst team in football by a country mile and the Bengals have been about as good as the Bills overall outside of their division (47% vs 45.8% win rate 22nd & 24th overall). Yeah sure, if the Dolphins won a few more games every year, they'd be as good as <insert other team that has been more successful> The Bengals have been much better than the Bills Kalli posted:Oh yeah, QB play has been pretty bad no doubt. Tannehill's underrated overall, he's a perfectly fine starting franchise QB that people hate because he hasn't gone to the playoffs, but with a better team around him he's indistinguishable from the likes of Andy Dalton or Joe Flacco. Yeah I didn't realize how good Tannehill has been (or how bad Luck has been, if you want to look at it that way), until I saw his stats side-by-side with Luck. That said, I also think the team built around Luck is basically Browns-quality garbage TheChirurgeon fucked around with this message at 21:26 on Jan 17, 2017 |
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Jan 17, 2017 21:23
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It really seems like you're intentionally missing the point he's making
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Jan 17, 2017 21:27
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evilweasel posted:The AFC North is probably/certainly the strongest division. I don't think anyone would say the AFC East is a strong division, it's more if they're just middling or actually weak. You can definitely make the case that the AFC South and NFC West are worse. That said, I'd lean more towards calling the rest of the AFC East bad. I'm not looking for you to say the AFCN is the best, I'm bringing up the fact that two teams from that division have multiple titles in the same time span as the Pats dynasty, with a third reaching the playoffs 7x as well. Nobody in that division is even challenging the Pats, much less being competitive with them
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Jan 17, 2017 21:27
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Also the Bills haven't lost to TJ Yates, starting QB on three different occasions 
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Jan 17, 2017 21:28
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MY NIGGA D-LINK posted:I'm not looking for you to say the AFCN is the best, I'm bringing up the fact that two teams from that division have multiple titles in the same time span as the Pats dynasty, with a third reaching the playoffs 7x as well. Nobody in that division is even challenging the Pats, much less being competitive with them I'm just saying the AFCN isn't a good comparison because it's literally the best division, so the AFC East will look bad in comparison regardless of if it's medium or bad.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:28
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Kalli posted:Because the Browns have been the worst team in football by a country mile and the Bengals have been about as good as the Bills overall outside of their division (47% vs 45.8% win rate 22nd & 24th overall). The Bengals have been to the playoff 7x since 2004. The Bills? 0
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Jan 17, 2017 21:29
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Intruder posted:It really seems like you're intentionally missing the point he's making No, I just tend to agree with this sentiment: MY NIGGA D-LINK posted:I'm not looking for you to say the AFCN is the best, I'm bringing up the fact that two teams from that division have multiple titles in the same time span as the Pats dynasty, with a third reaching the playoffs 7x as well. Nobody in that division is even challenging the Pats, much less being competitive with them Yeah ok, the Dolphins/Jets/Bills have to face the Pats 2x per year, but it's not like they then go 14-2 or even 11-5 and hit the wildcard spot consistently Intruder posted:Also the Bills haven't lost to TJ Yates, starting QB on three different occasions Hey man don't knock the inscrutable glory of TJ Yates in the wildcard round of the playoffs
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Jan 17, 2017 21:31
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The Bills are the least successful team in the division in that time period though. They should be getting compared to the Browns e: Also I don't get the impression Kalli is arguing the AFCE is actually better than the AFCN, just that the Patriots aren't a product of being in a lovely division and are actually not a good team which I honestly can't tell if people are being ironic or not when they say it anymore
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Jan 17, 2017 21:31
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Intruder posted:The Bills are the least successful team in the division in that time period though. They should be getting compared to the Browns I mean but then you have to mention the Jets went to two consecutive AFC Championships and christ that just feels weird to type.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:32
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Intruder posted:The Bills are the least successful team in the division in that time period though. They should be getting compared to the Browns Actually, the Browns have more playoff appearances in the time frame we're discussing than the Bills
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Jan 17, 2017 21:33
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e: wrong thread
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Jan 17, 2017 21:35
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pats have a better winrate against the nfc than against the afc east since 2003.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:36
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I think the AFCE is bad because Mark Sanchez put his face in that dude's butt.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:36
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Kalli posted:I mean but then you have to mention the Jets went to two consecutive AFC Championships and christ that just feels weird to type. I did. Miami 1x, Jets 2x in 16 years! e: I guess Miami is actually 2x now
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Jan 17, 2017 21:36
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Intruder posted:The Bills are the least successful team in the division in that time period though. They should be getting compared to the Browns No, what I'm reading is that three cities have to not only play great football over a 16 game stretch, an immensely difficult task, they also have to overcome a coach so good that he breaks the nfl. It's just not fair! Groovelord Neato posted:pats have a better winrate against the nfc than against the afc east since 2003. Dolphins, Bills, and Jets literally gameplan all year and sign people just to kill the Patriots. It still doesn't work 
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Jan 17, 2017 21:37
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a new study bible! posted:I think the AFCE is bad because Mark Sanchez put his face in that dude's butt. That game really definitively marked the last time anyone worried about Sanchez or Ryan. Going into it Patriots fans were nervous, by the time that third touchdown was scored everyone had forgotten all about those annoying playoff wins.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:38
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MY NIGGA D-LINK posted:Actually, the Browns have more playoff appearances in the time frame we're discussing than the Bills Since 2001 the Bills have won 104 games and the Browns have won 74.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:49
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TheChirurgeon posted:Hey man don't knock the inscrutable glory of TJ Yates in the wildcard round of the playoffs that's less TJ Yates being inscrutably good and more the Bengals being insanely bad like yeah sure the Bills haven't made the playoffs in 20 years but they still have the same number of playoff wins as Cincinnati in the same timeframe
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Jan 17, 2017 21:54
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Jiminy Christmas! Shoes! posted:Since 2001 the Bills have won 104 games and the Browns have won 74. That counting stat is really cool, but the Browns actually challenged for a divisional title one year.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:55
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lol the browns
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Jan 17, 2017 21:56
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MY NIGGA D-LINK posted:That counting stat is really cool, but the Browns actually challenged for a divisional title one year. That's because there's no Patriots in the division
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Jan 17, 2017 21:57
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Imagine a division that lets the Browns contend for a division championship being called the best
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Jan 17, 2017 21:59
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Imagine actually trying to make a case that the Browns are a team to be reckoned with.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:59
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Intruder posted:That's because there's no Patriots in the division ayyy
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Jan 17, 2017 21:59
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holy poo poo i had no idea that the current-era browns had made it to a playoff game, tmyk
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Jan 17, 2017 22:00
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Jiminy Christmas! Shoes! posted:Imagine actually trying to make a case that the Browns are a team to be reckoned with. That's what got Trump elected
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Jan 17, 2017 22:00
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AFCN is the division that the Ravens usually dominate, right?
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Jan 17, 2017 22:00
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Ravens and Steelers with a smattering of Bengals
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Jan 17, 2017 22:01
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