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He didn't have much of a choice either way since the West wouldn't even play ball on attacking Germany until the Germans invaded France. At that point he was dumb not to see the writing on the wall but was basically solely focused on building the economy and the military back up after knocking it all down (the military, that is)
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Feb 19, 2017 02:05
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also as part of operarion bobrossa the nazis boggled and mesmerized the russians w paintings of impossibly happy trees no army of any size could have beaten that teutonic trickery
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Feb 19, 2017 02:09
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Fiction posted:He didn't have much of a choice either way since the West wouldn't even play ball on attacking Germany until the Germans invaded France. At that point he was dumb not to see the writing on the wall but was basically solely focused on building the economy and the military back up after knocking it all down (the military, that is) 'until the Germans invaded France' lmao before the germans invaded france stalin was in talks to join the axis
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Feb 19, 2017 02:17
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my boy Stalin was an innocent pure angel who did nothing wrong, also its pretty hosed up how the Germans killed all those polish officers in the woods
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Feb 19, 2017 02:35
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hi I'm josef stalin and here's one of the dudes I thought it was a good idea to put in charge of anything important: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grigory_Kulik
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Feb 19, 2017 02:39
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Fallen Hamprince posted:maybe he should of tried not killing 90% of the officer corps for no reason, but mental illness is tough and i guess you do what u have 2 to cope I'll have you know that that was the only way for the Soviet Union to beat Germany Source: HOI4
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Feb 19, 2017 02:58
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1mpper posted:man, anti-soviets want it both ways: either stalin is bad because he focused on rapid industrialization and militarization to the detriment of other productive/agricultural development; or he's bad because he didn't industrialize or militarize enough to prevent mass causalities in ww2. imo he cut as best of a compromise as he could knowing what he did while making tougher decisions than almost anyone else in history. with four million nazi soldiers bearing down on you, i'm not sure what amount of "preparation" that he wasn't already doing would do to avoid a lot of people dying. yo impper would you do us a solid and dzershinky yourself after you've taken out -troika-, hamprince, etc.? gracias por adelantado
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Feb 19, 2017 03:15
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don't post here effectronica (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Feb 19, 2017 05:17
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hopefully mccaine will drop by and effortpost so i dont have to read the mcdermott bio
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Feb 19, 2017 05:54
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Did anybody blank post yet?
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Feb 19, 2017 05:58
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1mpper posted:stalin wasn't "shocked" or "unprepared" for the nazi attack, the soviets were begging england, france, and poland to unite in an anti-nazi two front war for six years and were prepared to dedicate massive resources to do so, but were shot down by the western representatives. the molotov-ribbentrop non-aggression pact was simply a way to buy time and short-term security while they figured out how to deal with the looming threat without the help of the rest of europe. it was definitely a lot more practical and aware than the munich agreement, which the soviets weren't party to and viewed as the western powers selling out a country to the nazis & put into perspective how much they could count on them. soviet actions in finland, the baltic states, and poland make sense as defensive measures against germany. Um Can we also acknowledge that Russia committed horrible loving atrocities in Eastern Poland
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Feb 19, 2017 08:40
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here is one, returning to earth as Putin to massively cuck the United States so much for American exceptionalism perhaps, it was never real? 
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Feb 19, 2017 09:46
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Yossarian-22 posted:Um no, we cannot. gently caress you
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Feb 19, 2017 13:19
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rudatron posted:Neither Stalin nor anyone else expected France to fall as fast as it did. Considering how ww1 went, the assumption was that Russia would have more time. So you might say that he was just... stalin for time
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Feb 19, 2017 15:03
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lenin them run amok
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Feb 19, 2017 15:23
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he really should have stayed thinner and kept the pompadour speaking of which he seems to have had some p baller pomade e: beaten by weeping wound (apologies) Red Dad Redemption has issued a correction as of 00:29 on Feb 20, 2017 |
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Feb 19, 2017 20:01
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Yossarian-22 posted:Um no. impper is an actual fascist irl so thats actually a positive to him P.s limonov is still poo poo you nazi
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Feb 19, 2017 20:50
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youre thinking of a different impper bro. anyway the only people acknowledging that russia "committed horrible loving atrocities" in eastern poland are operating off of literal nazi propaganda, an actual campaign about these events that goebbels himself orchestrated, that gained traction during the cold war. the most credible account imo is that the soviets did execute some polish officers (military officers themselves guilty of brutal repression of socialists and civilians), then after the nazis invaded they executed many of the polish POWs left behind and blamed it all on the soviets. the evidence is murky enough that i think it'll be impossible to ever know what actually happened, but considering the actual evidence that there is, and the fact that nazis soon invaded and held the territory, i don't think this position is absurd or denialist. unless u think the people who perpetuated the holocaust would be above murdering a few thousand POWs and blame it on their enemies to sow a rift between the allies.
1mpper has issued a correction as of 21:52 on Feb 19, 2017 |
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Feb 19, 2017 21:44
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if stalins so smart why is he dead
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Feb 19, 2017 21:52
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Squizzle posted:if stalins so smart why is he dead I keep saying that he should have kept that haircut!!!
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Feb 19, 2017 22:34
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1mpper posted:youre thinking of a different impper bro. anyway the only people acknowledging that russia "committed horrible loving atrocities" in eastern poland are operating off of literal nazi propaganda, an actual campaign about these events that goebbels himself orchestrated, that gained traction during the cold war. the most credible account imo is that the soviets did execute some polish officers (military officers themselves guilty of brutal repression of socialists and civilians), then after the nazis invaded they executed many of the polish POWs left behind and blamed it all on the soviets. the evidence is murky enough that i think it'll be impossible to ever know what actually happened, but considering the actual evidence that there is, and the fact that nazis soon invaded and held the territory, i don't think this position is absurd or denialist. unless u think the people who perpetuated the holocaust would be above murdering a few thousand POWs and blame it on their enemies to sow a rift between the allies. hmm, I think I will choose to believe ordinary history, rather than revisionist tankie history this is another thing that stalin did wrong: creating idiots like u
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Feb 20, 2017 02:57
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oh wow this thread really took off and a bunch of morons are care mad about stalin. its too bad that he's great and everyone agrees. Stalin's Popularity in Russia Reaches 16-Year High
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Feb 20, 2017 04:28
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Odobenidae posted:oh wow this thread really took off and a bunch of morons are care mad about stalin. its too bad that he's great and everyone agrees. also popular in russia: premature death due to alcoholism
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Feb 20, 2017 04:49
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growin that mustache and hiding those luscious locks behind that ugly hat
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Feb 20, 2017 05:03
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somebody got executed for failing to airbrush great stalin's horrendously hosed up teeth
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Feb 20, 2017 05:05
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Sun Wu Kampf posted:hmm, I think I will choose to believe ordinary history, rather than revisionist tankie history well if by "ordinary history" you mean pop-history books written by robert conquest, anne applebaum, and other cold war warriors using lovely sources; and by "revisionist tankie history" you mean serious peer-reviewed scholarly work that favor primary sources and archival evidence over uncited solzhenitsyn-style anecdotes that treat malicious rumor as fact; then that seems an odd thing to believe and i posit that it may be u who is the idiot, sir.
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Feb 20, 2017 05:24
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1mpper posted:well if by "ordinary history" you mean pop-history books written by robert conquest, anne applebaum, and other cold war warriors using lovely sources; and by "revisionist tankie history" you mean serious peer-reviewed scholarly work that favor primary sources and archival evidence over uncited solzhenitsyn-style anecdotes that treat malicious rumor as fact; then that seems an odd thing to believe and i posit that it may be u who is the idiot, sir. lmao
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Feb 20, 2017 05:34
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Stalin led to today.
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Feb 20, 2017 05:50
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He killed Trotsky and destroyed Lenin's legacy
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Feb 20, 2017 08:43
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The purges.. they were kinda bad :/
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Feb 20, 2017 09:04
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On the level of shear mistakes, I think the thing where he ordered his bodyguards to ignore all signs of distress from his apartments and would test them by screaming and fire them if they broke in to save him was a huge mistake. As prove d by the fact that when he had a stroke it took over 12 hours before anyone dared break in to help him.
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Feb 20, 2017 10:22
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Fallen Hamprince posted:also popular in russia: premature death due to alcoholism Yeah, capitalism is pretty hosed up.
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Feb 20, 2017 10:56
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Stalling wait no he did a p good job of that during Barbarossa nvm
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Feb 20, 2017 11:57
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Big Fat Iguana posted:On the level of shear mistakes, I think the thing where he ordered his bodyguards to ignore all signs of distress from his apartments and would test them by screaming and fire them if they broke in to save him was a huge mistake. As prove d by the fact that when he had a stroke it took over 12 hours before anyone dared break in to help him. lol why would he order them to do that??
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Feb 20, 2017 12:27
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Paranoia The assumption being that anyone who entered his room was an assassin
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Feb 20, 2017 14:25
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He'd still be a top 5 tsar though.
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Feb 20, 2017 14:56
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not enough kulaks imo
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Feb 20, 2017 15:03
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this thread has turned into a perfect example of why the purges were good
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Feb 20, 2017 17:20
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Kurtofan posted:lol why would he order them to do that?? Cause he didn't want them to murder him lol as if being ordered to stay out would somehow prevent that
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Feb 20, 2017 18:08
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Attempting to reconcile the Stalin you see in his writing with the Stalin as he was, I have to think he had some sort of psychological disorder. Or the alcoholism just pickled his brain.
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Feb 20, 2017 19:11
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